• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 23:41
CEST 05:41
KST 12:41
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting10[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3[ASL20] Ro8 Preview Pt2: Holding On9Maestros of the Game: Live Finals Preview (RO4)5
Community News
Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou20Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four3BSL Team A vs Koreans - Sat-Sun 16:00 CET7Weekly Cups (Oct 6-12): Four star herO85.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8)81
StarCraft 2
General
Chinese SC2 server to reopen; live all-star event in Hangzhou The New Patch Killed Mech! RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four 5.0.15 Patch Balance Hotfix (2025-10-8)
Tourneys
Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest Lost Recovery Master -Bitcoin Recovery Experts Tenacious Turtle Tussle RSL Season 3 Qualifier Links and Dates $1,200 WardiTV October (Oct 21st-31st)
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment Mutation # 493 Quick Killers
Brood War
General
OGN to release AI-upscaled StarLeague from Feb 24 BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Is there anyway to get a private coach? SnOw's Awful Building Placements vs barracks BW General Discussion
Tourneys
ASL final tickets help [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Semifinal B 300$ 3D!Community Brood War Super Cup #4
Strategy
[I] TvP Marine Usage Current Meta Roaring Currents ASL final BW - ajfirecracker Strategy & Training
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV ZeroSpace Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion Anime Discussion Thread Series you have seen recently... [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023 Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The Benefits Of Limited Comm…
TrAiDoS
Sabrina was soooo lame on S…
Peanutsc
Our Last Hope in th…
KrillinFromwales
Certified Crazy
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1732 users

I HATE 4 GATE - Page 4

Blogs > GenesisX
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 All
Wolf
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Korea (South)3290 Posts
March 24 2011 02:02 GMT
#61
On March 24 2011 10:32 101toss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 24 2011 10:31 Wolf wrote:
People really need to learn what cheese is.

I didn't know standard play was cheese


It isn't. It just annoys me that people think it is.
Commentatorhttp://twitter.com/proxywolf
TL+ Member
Pandain
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States12989 Posts
March 24 2011 02:07 GMT
#62
On March 24 2011 11:02 Wolf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 24 2011 10:32 101toss wrote:
On March 24 2011 10:31 Wolf wrote:
People really need to learn what cheese is.

I didn't know standard play was cheese


It isn't. It just annoys me that people think it is.


Eh it actually is in a way.
Cheese is something which, if discovered, you are way behind, or even lose. I think we can definitely agree that falls to 4 gate. However 4 gate is unique in the regards that even if it fails your not at a 100% losing position, just behind. There are even 4 gate expands you can do if found out.

However I would say for the most part 4 gate is a cheese. If your opponent knows your 4 gating, he will win 90% of the time.. It's about the uncertainty that makes 4 gate so strong.

4 gate is one of those semi cheeses, semi allins. Definitely not equivalent to a dt rush(where what can you fall back on if your opponent has detection) or a two gate proxy.

However, are you saying in the regards that if scouted its still hard to stop? While true somewhat, if scouted early enough and he doesn't cancel( as in just as they're finishing) i would say you still have a good chance of holding it off.

This topic definitely is a noteworthy debate on its own, but keep in mind that what you think is annoying is what others believe is true.

happyft
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States470 Posts
March 24 2011 02:08 GMT
#63
love this rant.

Seriously, don't you guys think it's a little ridiculous that toss in the GSL and other prominent tourneys are STILL winning with 4 gate? It's not like you see 3 rax all-in as a common strategy, or 7 roach rush. But no, the same 4 gate all-in from beta is still here with us today -- BECAUSE IT"S SO RIDICULOUSLY STRONG.

All I want is one change -- make gateway to warpgate transformation take 30-40 seconds. I bet you this will not only fix ZvP but also PvP where going robotics against 4 gate won't be suicide.
101toss
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
3232 Posts
March 24 2011 02:16 GMT
#64
On March 24 2011 11:07 Pandain wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 24 2011 11:02 Wolf wrote:
On March 24 2011 10:32 101toss wrote:
On March 24 2011 10:31 Wolf wrote:
People really need to learn what cheese is.

I didn't know standard play was cheese


It isn't. It just annoys me that people think it is.


4 gate is one of those semi cheeses, semi allins. Definitely not equivalent to a dt rush(where what can you fall back on if your opponent has detection) or a two gate proxy.

If your dt rush fails, you can tech to archons
Math doesn't kill champions and neither do wards
FXOTheoRy
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States519 Posts
March 24 2011 02:27 GMT
#65
Is your character name GenX?
oyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoy
parn
Profile Joined December 2010
France296 Posts
March 24 2011 02:45 GMT
#66
I've always wondered, is it "4 GATE" or "4 GATES"?
We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act, but a habit.
101toss
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
3232 Posts
March 24 2011 02:48 GMT
#67
On March 24 2011 11:45 parn wrote:
I've always wondered, is it "4 GATE" or "4 GATES"?

It is the "4 warpgate rush"; warpgate->gate; therefore, it is the "4 gate"
Math doesn't kill champions and neither do wards
Turgid
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1623 Posts
March 24 2011 03:06 GMT
#68
On March 24 2011 11:08 happyft wrote:
love this rant.

Seriously, don't you guys think it's a little ridiculous that toss in the GSL and other prominent tourneys are STILL winning with 4 gate? It's not like you see 3 rax all-in as a common strategy, or 7 roach rush. But no, the same 4 gate all-in from beta is still here with us today -- BECAUSE IT"S SO RIDICULOUSLY STRONG.

All I want is one change -- make gateway to warpgate transformation take 30-40 seconds. I bet you this will not only fix ZvP but also PvP where going robotics against 4 gate won't be suicide.


To be honest with you I don't think that's a good change. It hurts Protoss more than it helps Zerg. If we couldn't produce any gateway units for 30-40 seconds I think we'd die to a lot more stupid one base timings which I thought we were trying to get rid of. zerg would even have some stupid stuff that would work on Protoss and while a lot of disgruntled zerg players will look at that and go "yeah that sounds great, a stupid all-in that will work ON THEIR safe play!" for revenge reasons it just isn't good for the game and is the kind of thing we want to eliminate.

As for it fixing PvP, maybe, but I can see it working the other way too. Warpgates literally make stuff faster than gateways so I can see it being possible that the 4gater would be able to do his timing attack and disallow the roboing player to make his warpgates, meaning the 4gater would be producing them much much more quickly. Or worse the rush could hit while the gates were still transforming.
(╬ ಠ益ಠ)
Roe
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Canada6002 Posts
March 24 2011 04:23 GMT
#69
aw no one liked my rap? :\
GenesisX
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Canada4267 Posts
March 24 2011 05:25 GMT
#70
On March 24 2011 11:27 tekushikume wrote:
Is your character name GenX?


Yes it is.
133 221 333 123 111
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
March 24 2011 06:24 GMT
#71
People who argue that 4gate is standard are friggin' retarded. It's not standard by any means.
Bub
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States3518 Posts
March 24 2011 06:33 GMT
#72
On March 24 2011 09:10 da_head wrote:
try massing lings and squeezing in +1.


that usually works vs me haha but the I don't do it often.
XK ßubonic
Dhalphir
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Australia1305 Posts
March 24 2011 07:50 GMT
#73
They need to buff normal gateway production and push warpgate further back in the tech tree. Put it in the Twilight Council. That provides added incentive to go something other than robo-tech, and instantly makes the 4gate impossible.
Supporting TypeII Gaming - www.typeii.net - TypeReaL, TypePhoeNix, TypeSuN, TypeDBS!!
Dfgj
Profile Joined May 2008
Singapore5922 Posts
March 24 2011 08:17 GMT
#74
On March 24 2011 11:08 happyft wrote:
love this rant.

Seriously, don't you guys think it's a little ridiculous that toss in the GSL and other prominent tourneys are STILL winning with 4 gate? It's not like you see 3 rax all-in as a common strategy, or 7 roach rush. But no, the same 4 gate all-in from beta is still here with us today -- BECAUSE IT"S SO RIDICULOUSLY STRONG.

All I want is one change -- make gateway to warpgate transformation take 30-40 seconds. I bet you this will not only fix ZvP but also PvP where going robotics against 4 gate won't be suicide.

You do realize that games that get won with 4gate are (in non PvP matchups) never blind 4gates and rely on mindgames in some what, and (in PvP) are part of mindgames and implied aggression?

It's not 'hurrr attack' by any means if you want it to work.
FXOTheoRy
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States519 Posts
March 24 2011 19:14 GMT
#75
On March 24 2011 14:25 GenesisX wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 24 2011 11:27 tekushikume wrote:
Is your character name GenX?


Yes it is.


I apologize for 4 gating you.
oyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoyoy
nullmind
Profile Blog Joined April 2003
1303 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-03-24 19:26:59
March 24 2011 19:26 GMT
#76
4 Gate is easy to execute and it's an effective strategy at lower levels so why stop? All 4 gates are not the same. I played about 100 4 gate rush in a row and I realized not only my 4 gate timing was better and I was executing it much better, it improved my game overall. I started noticing build times and opponent timings. I personally think it's a great way to improve toss players mechanics. Now that I mastered 4 gating and noticing it not working too well at higher levels, I usually 2 gate expand against zerg and I'm much more comfortable with zerg's timings that I learned from all the 4 gates. I think every toss should master 4 gate until they can hit about 3500 master and then when they are comfortable with the build order, they can start new build orders like 2 gate expand against P and Z. The transition worked really well for me.
GenesisX
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Canada4267 Posts
March 24 2011 19:56 GMT
#77
On March 25 2011 04:14 tekushikume wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 24 2011 14:25 GenesisX wrote:
On March 24 2011 11:27 tekushikume wrote:
Is your character name GenX?


Yes it is.


I apologize for 4 gating you.


Its fine.
133 221 333 123 111
ryndaris
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
263 Posts
March 24 2011 20:23 GMT
#78
Funny, I play P and hate 4gate too. Especially in PvZ... I get raped by ling roach pretty bad whenever I attempt it (which is not often, but still.)
Prev 1 2 3 4 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 7h 19m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 98
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 2418
Noble 82
NaDa 54
Purpose 14
Icarus 8
KwarK 7
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm78
League of Legends
JimRising 678
Trikslyr46
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K564
Other Games
summit1g7212
C9.Mang0163
Skadoodle158
ViBE141
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick875
Counter-Strike
PGL165
Other Games
BasetradeTV62
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH94
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota2826
League of Legends
• Doublelift4003
• Lourlo525
• Stunt292
Other Games
• Scarra733
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Invitational
7h 19m
Online Event
12h 19m
RSL Revival
22h 19m
RSL Revival
1d 6h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 7h
OSC
1d 11h
SKillous vs goblin
Spirit vs GgMaChine
ByuN vs MaxPax
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Snow vs Soma
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
CrankTV Team League
2 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
2 days
Wardi Open
3 days
CrankTV Team League
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
WardiTV Invitational
4 days
CrankTV Team League
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
CrankTV Team League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS2
WardiTV TLMC #15
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
EC S1
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025

Upcoming

SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
RSL Offline Finals
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
CranK Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.