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Hey, so I was perusing youtube and saw HD had Root vs EG from the SGL semi-finals up on his page. I thought this was interesting, as he is basically casting games that are free to watch (you just have to know where to go).
So my thing is this, those games were from a tournament that had sponsors, during the actual SGL broadcast those sponsors would get mentions and probably an overlay. When HD et al re-cast these games they are basically taking away these mentions and re-packaging the games as their own, granted HD always notes where his replays come from, so SGL get credit and some of his viewers might search to find out more..... but he casts all 7 games, which means there is no incentive for them to do this.
I understand that HD, husky etc are a gateway for many people in to SC2, but I feel that when they cast an entire series from a tournament that they are essentially hurting as well. If they cast only the first game from a series and then said if you want to see more follow this link, and then you can watch the rest of the games via the youtube/streaming service the official tourney VODs, this means that HD both serves as the gateway for new SC2 fans but then uses that gateway to promote the tournaments.
Sponsors must care about how many viewers the live stream gets and how many views the VODs get, because this lets them know how many potential customers they reached. When a youtuber re-casts the games they often don't mention even the website for the tourney they got them from, they don't mention that you can see more from the tourney if you visit their website etc.
I guess if I were running a big league or tourney I would be very wary of releasing the replays for this reason, I would want people to watch my VODs, not VODs from someone unrelated to the organisation. So if this trend continues, where by youtubers don't use their massive pulpit to bring more people in to watching live SC2 and promoting sponsors, will tournaments begin to more often not release replays? Would NASL/GSL ask youtube to take down casts that use games from their tourneys?
tl;dr
I think youtubers should respect tournaments and leagues, and their sponsors, a little more. Cast one game from a series, great, then tell your viewers where to find the rest of the series rather than cast it all yourself.... that way you get your hits and your fans support the organisations who orangise these great games for us.
My .02
edit: i should clarify, I dont mean the little $20 weekly tourneys like craftcup, i mean like IEM, NASL, GCPL, SGL etc.... the big boys who have other "professional" casters doing the casts and lots of sponsor money behind it
 
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If I can find a link I'll generally always put them in my casts - sometimes I'll put them on a more "standard" rep site if I found them deep within the abyss of a Korean rep site just so people have an easier time getting the rep.
It's not just a courtesy to the "tournament" itself - also to the players 
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On March 24 2011 04:24 Duckvillelol wrote:If I can find a link I'll generally always put them in my casts - sometimes I'll put them on a more "standard" rep site if I found them deep within the abyss of a Korean rep site just so people have an easier time getting the rep. It's not just a courtesy to the "tournament" itself - also to the players
hehe well yeah, I don't think that argument needs to be made though. The guys who put up money and time to make it happen deserve as much credit, but people too often forget about the people who make the tourney go.....
I am also not saying that every caster does this stuff, its just something I've noticed a few of them doing, casting multiple series from IEM for instance...... some of us paid for cebit from ESL..... then randoms get most of the tourney for free in HD on youtube...... thats just not on. I get casting a few games, but not multiple series.
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Makes sense that casters give credit to the organizations and sponsors.
The problem is that many viewers prefer certain casters so they will probably see a cast from them and not from others . I would sugest that in the beggining of each cast they should mention the sponsors since they already mention the tournament/ event.
This way a sponsor will know that his name will reach a far bigger number of people and improving the chance that they spend more money in more events.
Everybody wins: more tournaments, bigger prize pools, more great games to see/cast, more money generated, more tournaments (Goto Everybody wins). ^^
But I only see this happening if the 'bigger' casters join up to discuss this point and making some kind of agreement.
edit - typos
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On March 24 2011 04:27 EdSlyB wrote:
Makes sense that casters give credit to the organizations and sponsors.
The problem is that many viewers prefer certain casters so they will probably see a cast from them and not from others . I would sugest that in the beggining of each cast they should mention the sponsors since they already mention the tournament/ event.
This way a sponsor will know that his name will reach a far bigger number of people and improving the chance that they spend more money in more events.
Everybody wins: more tournaments, bigger prize pools, more great games to see/cast, more money generated, more tournaments (Goto Everybody wins). ^^
But I only see this if caster join up to discuss this point and making some kind of agreement.
I an one of those people who only really listen to certain casters on youtube, but I'll listen to whomever when a big tourney is on... they are usually better than youtubers anyways, and not in the "they know more" sense, they are just better.
I would be ok with the youtubers providing a link to the tourney/league website and or TL thread and mention their sponsors and give a link....... everyone is happy, including the viewers.
It wouldn't be an ideal situation, but it would be better. And ofc this is one of those things that we can't really do anything about, I just thought if people are discussing it, then the youtubers might take it upon themselves to do the right thing and help promote sponsors and tourneys, not just their own youtube channel. I know some of them do that already, and often that makes me respect them enough to listen to more of their casts
edit:
basically, if i saw the VOD for GCPL with my logo on it and plugs within the casts only had 20k views and then saw the same games were re-casted by a youtuber and they got 50-100k views, I would be pissed that my name (as a sponsor) wasn't mentioned once. I would also think twice about sponsoring another event, since the larger audience will never hear about my product.
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basically, if i saw the VOD for GCPL with my logo on it and plugs within the casts only had 20k views and then saw the same games were re-casted by a youtuber and they got 50-100k views, I would be pissed that my name (as a sponsor) wasn't mentioned once. I would also think twice about sponsoring another event, since the larger audience will never hear about my product.
That's not how that works, you would sponsor another event with the guy who does have 50-100k views cast it for you. It's not the youtuber's fault that he wasn't approached to cast the games.
That being said, youtubers should respect sponsors that give money to put together tournaments and bring good players together and should definitely link the sites/mention them a few times in the cast. It kinda sucks that sponsors have to protect their 'product' but that happens in most aspects of business and as great as it would be to get an honor system going.
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On March 24 2011 04:53 Count9 wrote:Show nested quote +basically, if i saw the VOD for GCPL with my logo on it and plugs within the casts only had 20k views and then saw the same games were re-casted by a youtuber and they got 50-100k views, I would be pissed that my name (as a sponsor) wasn't mentioned once. I would also think twice about sponsoring another event, since the larger audience will never hear about my product. That's not how that works, you would sponsor another event with the guy who does have 50-100k views cast it for you. It's not the youtuber's fault that he wasn't approached to cast the games. That being said, youtubers should respect sponsors that give money to put together tournaments and bring good players together and should definitely link the sites/mention them a few times in the cast. It kinda sucks that sponsors have to protect their 'product' but that happens in most aspects of business and as great as it would be to get an honor system going.
I'm not saying its anything to do with the caster, however there's usually a reason why youtubers aren't casting the actual tourney. HD's casts are quite good, hes a fairly good player, but other youtubers dont have either the game knowledge or casting skill HD has and if they get 100k views from casuals but the casts suck compared with the original, the sponsor isn't going to get that caster just to get more views.... they will want protection next time. If they get a mention however, this issue goes away.
I guess this is all just me saying, respect the guys who are putting the money up... without them we don't have an esport.
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Oh, definitely. SGL will look into this matter.
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There are so many tournaments these days that I doubt people will bother to sit through it if it isn't casted by one of their favorite casters, unless a particular game is absurdly recommended and epic.
As long as HD mentioned the tournament and its sponsors in every video, I don't see a problem. Yeah it's a little shady and it'd probably be best if he asked permission first, but at the end of the day the league and sponsors get more exposure out of it, and most of the people who watched it on HD's channel probably would not have watched it on the SGL channel.
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On March 24 2011 04:13 emythrel wrote:+ Show Spoiler +
Hey, so I was perusing youtube and saw HD had Root vs EG from the SGL semi-finals up on his page. I thought this was interesting, as he is basically casting games that are free to watch (you just have to know where to go).
So my thing is this, those games were from a tournament that had sponsors, during the actual SGL broadcast those sponsors would get mentions and probably an overlay. When HD et al re-cast these games they are basically taking away these mentions and re-packaging the games as their own, granted HD always notes where his replays come from, so SGL get credit and some of his viewers might search to find out more..... but he casts all 7 games, which means there is no incentive for them to do this.
I understand that HD, husky, TB etc are a gateway for many people in to SC2, but I feel that when they cast an entire series from a tournament that they are essentially hurting as well. If they cast only the first game from a series and then said if you want to see more follow this link, and then you can watch the rest of the games via the youtube/streaming service the official tourney VODs, this means that HD both serves as the gateway for new SC2 fans but then uses that gateway to promote the tournaments.
Sponsors must care about how many viewers the live stream gets and how many views the VODs get, because this lets them know how many potential customers they reached. When a youtuber re-casts the games they often don't mention even the website for the tourney they got them from, they don't mention that you can see more from the tourney if you visit their website etc.
I guess if I were running a big league or tourney I would be very wary of releasing the replays for this reason, I would want people to watch my VODs, not VODs from someone unrelated to the organisation. So if this trend continues, where by youtubers don't use their massive pulpit to bring more people in to watching live SC2 and promoting sponsors, will tournaments begin to more often not release replays? Would NASL/GSL ask youtube to take down casts that use games from their tourneys?
tl;dr
I think youtubers should respect tournaments and leagues, and their sponsors, a little more. Cast one game from a series, great, then tell your viewers where to find the rest of the series rather than cast it all yourself.... that way you get your hits and your fans support the organisations who orangise these great games for us.
My .02
edit: i should clarify, I dont mean the little $20 weekly tourneys like craftcup, i mean like IEM, NASL, GCPL, SGL etc.... the big boys who have other "professional" casters doing the casts and lots of sponsor money behind it
I'd like to respond to this if I may, since I've been named on that list for some reason. I'm fairly sure you just put me in there as an example of a gateway caster, but since some people have a tendency to jump to conclusions without properly considering the context, best to address it anyway.
There is no situation where I've ever put a game on Youtube without the correct sponsorship information. An overlay will be used, the sponsor will be mentioned at some point during every VoD, the introduction to each video will have a custom 'welcome' message which will tell people which tournament it came from and the description of the video will provide the tournament and where relevant, URL. All of my Youtube VoDs come from actual tournaments I've been contracted to cast and the sponsors very much appreciate the extra 30-50,000 views their sponsorship message gets. It's very rarely stipulated in the agreement that this has to be done in VoDs rather than just on the stream but it's extremely important to respect the sponsors and show them excellent ROI, to fuel further investment into eSports.
I can't speak for any of the other Youtube casters but I'd like to take the opportunity to clear up any potential misunderstanding coming from naming me as someone who does not respect sponsors and tournament organisers, since this is not based in fact.
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hey TB, long time since i made this blog, just saw that you posted.... wanted to say, I wasn't including you on the list of people who do not respect sponsors. I was indeed using you as an example of a gateway caster.
I have also edited out your name, as looking at it, I wasn't clear with my meaning and I can't be assed to edit a month old blog lol
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EPT
