P players question please

BeMannerDuPenner

Germany5638 Posts

February 18 2011 08:56 GMT

Just a quick question i wanna throw out and since i dont think its worth opening a thread for it ill put it here.

so P players, can you kill a thor + ~8 marines (in bunkers?) + several scvs repairing/fighting at the ~7 minute mark?

im talking about killing that force at the enemys base, not defending in your base so reinforcements might take a bit time to get there and probes are not an option.

im playing around with a build but dont have enough quality testing or replays against decent masters players to open a thread yet so i jsut want some input.

thx for your help :>

AirbladeOrange

United States2574 Posts

February 18 2011 09:03 GMT

I don't really know how to answer this. Are you looking for an opening that you can do blindly to punish a Terran who goes for that exact build? Why do you need to kill that? So many questions left unanswered!

Either way, I'm pretty sure a 4 warpgate could take that out.

relyt

United States1073 Posts

February 18 2011 09:06 GMT

Maybe 4 gate or a voidray build.

BeMannerDuPenner

Germany5638 Posts

February 18 2011 09:10 GMT

On February 18 2011 18:03 AirbladeOrange wrote:
I don't really know how to answer this. Are you looking for an opening that you can do blindly to punish a Terran who goes for that exact build? Why do you need to kill that? So many questions left unanswered!

Either way, I'm pretty sure a 4 warpgate could take that out.

edited my op a bit. im doing a build where i end up with that force at around 7 minutes in and try to expand.

my question is if a P that scouts that (either with a obs abit earlier or when he sees the actual units) will be able to just go kill it or not after a normal opening.

vs something allinish like a 4gate its about if i can stay alive and defend my main/ramp, vs a more normal build if i can hold my expo.

i basicly just want some thoughts of what a P thinks and how he reacts when he scouts this with his first observer or later a unit. for example if you do a 4gate and see this, do you think "great! im just gonna go kill him up his ramp!" or are you hesitant? if you do a 2gate robo would you think " k i boost immortals out and bust his expo in 2 minutes" or do you expand after you see it with a observer?

Macavenger

United States1132 Posts

February 18 2011 09:17 GMT

Can't speak for all Protoss by any means, but if I see Bunkers at a Terran expo that early in the game, I'm thinking "yay I'm not getting 1-base allined" and go expo.

Jumbled

1543 Posts

February 18 2011 09:34 GMT

On February 18 2011 18:10 BeMannerDuPenner wrote:
edited my op a bit. im doing a build where i end up with that force at around 7 minutes in and try to expand.

my question is if a P that scouts that (either with a obs abit earlier or when he sees the actual units) will be able to just go kill it or not after a normal opening.

vs something allinish like a 4gate its about if i can stay alive and defend my main/ramp, vs a more normal build if i can hold my expo.

i basicly just want some thoughts of what a P thinks and how he reacts when he scouts this with his first observer or later a unit. for example if you do a 4gate and see this, do you think "great! im just gonna go kill him up his ramp!" or are you hesitant? if you do a 2gate robo would you think " k i boost immortals out and bust his expo in 2 minutes" or do you expand after you see it with a observer?

If it's a proper 4-gate, the protoss won't be scouting with anything other than a probe, and the attack will hit before the 7 minute mark. A protoss opening with 2gate robo is unlikely to go after you either, since relying on a few immortals to be able to handle your thors is very risky due to strike cannons and marine snipes. I would think the most likely response would be to expand, produce a couple of immortals, and tech zealot legs or DTs.

In answer to your main question, the protoss probably won't have the forces to deny your expansion unless they were planning for a timing attack that hits around then.

TekKpriest

308 Posts

February 18 2011 12:15 GMT

Jumbled's answer is the best.

You can in most cases safely expand with your build, there are a few exceptions, but they are not noteworthy.

Though a 4 Gate that hits around 5.30 might hurt ya, but since i dont know your exact BO i can't help ya there :D

If i'd scout that, i'd most likely take a fast 3rd with trying to harass (depending on map though) since your "deathball" will take some time to be effective vs a normal Protoss build and is fairly immobile (except Hellion but you can't deny all harass with it, and counter agression vs P is easily hold off when P looks @ minimap).

Oh well i think we answered your question fairly well :D

OmniEulogy

Canada6600 Posts

February 18 2011 12:22 GMT

as said above, depends on the build but it also depends on what the shape of your nat is. if it's a choke like LT or Tal'Darim (just as an example of what the choke looks like guys) it'll be much harder to get a nice position without you being able to just move backwards and micro the thor away, as opposed to metal which has a bigger area of attack.

Just things to consider for which maps you decide to try it on.

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