• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 12:02
CET 18:02
KST 02:02
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT28Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8
Community News
Weekly Cups (Feb 16-22): MaxPax doubles0Weekly Cups (Feb 9-15): herO doubles up2ACS replaced by "ASL Season Open" - Starts 21/0258LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals (Feb 10-16)46Weekly Cups (Feb 2-8): Classic, Solar, MaxPax win2
StarCraft 2
General
How do you think the 5.0.15 balance patch (Oct 2025) for StarCraft II has affected the game? Terran AddOns placement Nexon's StarCraft game could be FPS, led by UMS maker ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued
Tourneys
PIG STY FESTIVAL 7.0! (19 Feb - 1 Mar) SEL Doubles (SC Evo Bimonthly) WardiTV Team League Season 10 RSL Season 4 announced for March-April The Dave Testa Open #11
Strategy
Custom Maps
Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026] Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 514 Ulnar New Year The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 513 Attrition Warfare Mutation # 512 Overclocked
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Telegram @nuglink Buy THC Vape,Weed in Ho Chi Minh Telegram @nuglink Buy THC Vape,Weed in Hanoi Soma Explains: JD's Unrelenting Aggro vs FlaSh ACS replaced by "ASL Season Open" - Starts 21/02
Tourneys
[LIVE] [S:21] ASL Season Open Day 1 ASL Season 21 Qualifiers March 7-8 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0
Strategy
Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Zealot bombing is no longer popular?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Battle Aces/David Kim RTS Megathread Path of Exile Beyond All Reason New broswer game : STG-World
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine UK Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread Mexico's Drug War
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TL MMA Pick'em Pool 2013
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
YOUTUBE VIDEO
XenOsky
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Inside the Communication of …
TrAiDoS
My 2025 Magic: The Gathering…
DARKING
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1950 users

SC2 Leagues, Re-imagined

Blogs > Deleted User 135096
Post a Reply
Deleted User 135096
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
3624 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-12 16:39:55
February 12 2011 16:36 GMT
#1
So a few weeks back when the Master League was launched I got to see the master league icon up close and really had a strong reaction to it (see negative), so I decided to go and fabricate my own to see what it would look like being more in tandem (albeit loosely) with Blizzards current design scheme. This was the result. Not the greatest of renditions, but hey, I was curious.

In working on it I got some feedback and starting thinking about this myself, but what would it look like if I took the leagues and reworked them into a more consistent representation overall. My main thought was that I wondered why Blizzard hadn't taken point from so many military organizations on the planet, as their design aesthetic seemed sporadic. In one sense it was somewhat unique (what they were likely looking for), but in most ways it was merely a homogenization of many different 'levels' (some sport, some military), and had no real core trajectory. This was my starting point.

When I began to think about how to divide the leagues appropriately, I looked at ELO and how their distribution worked. The first thing I noticed was that there were far more divisions of skill. Oddly enough, this mirrored my own thoughts about the leagues in sc2, in that there either weren't enough of them, or at least not enough clear enough divisions of skill (1000's of divisions on the other hand I feel is a little ridiculous, but beside the point). So I took the ELO and played around with the relative levels and tried to work around a system that I felt was concise enough without being too confusing, but still with enough tiers that skills would be more accurately represented.

Eventually I divided the system into 3 tiers: beginners (0-840), moderately skilled players (841-1960), and very skilled players (1961-2800). I then further divided them into 3, 4 (or 2 and 2), and 3 parts so that there would be a total of 10 divisions, housed within the overall three. Once completed, I then tried to see if I could correlate these tiers with the global percentages, following sc2ranks as a base so that I could try to show the distribution so that they could be somewhat compared with the current rankings. Here is the end result:

Full League Distribution (note: click on each image for a larger view)
[image loading]


DISCLAIMER: I should state plainly that all of the following numbers/calculations are an approximation and are in no way accurate (some choices were arbitrary, others educated guesswork), it's just to show what an approximate distribution might look like. I should also note that I don't know if the ELO distribution and the approximate percentages are remotely accurate to one another. If someone more qualified than I would be willing to do a more accurate calculation for this (if possible), that would be awesome.


Breakdown by Tier:

Tier 3 (~82.6% of the population)
[image loading]
[45.3% = 3,225,017]: ~0-280 ELO
[20.2% = 1,438,087]: ~281-560 ELO
[16.9% = 1,203,152]: ~561-840 ELO

Tier 2 (~17.28%)
[image loading]
[6.48% = 461,327]: ~841-1120 ELO
[5.4% = 384,439]: ~1121-1400 ELO
[3.24% = 230,664]: ~1401-1680 ELO
[2.16% = 153,776]: ~1681-1960 ELO

Tier 1 (~.32%, Master Tier)
[image loading]
Master [.2% = 14,238]: ~1961-2240 ELO
Senior Master [.1% = 7,119]: ~2241-2520 ELO
Grand Master [.02% = 1,439 - approx. top 200 in each region]: ~2521-2800 ELO

So this was far more than what I originally set out to do, simply re-imagine the visualization of the ranks, though I did find it interesting to try to see how the two systems might compare with one another. Unfortunately, I couldn't come up with a good nomenclature for the system save for the top tier, which seemed somewhat obvious. I wanted to stay away from iCCup rankings to avoid confusion, but perhaps something along those lines would function best (G-A, then Maser Tier). Finally I should mention that this was simply an idea of mine, I don't expect that the status quo will change anytime soon (or ever) as that's not how Blizzard generally operates, but hey, one can wish right?


**
Administrator
QuixoticO
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Netherlands810 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-12 16:56:55
February 12 2011 16:55 GMT
#2
We can wish indeed tho considering Blizzard is currently using 2%/18%/20%/20%/20% I doubt they'll ever go with a ranking system like this :'[. They should add a system like this for Master League only so all the "casual" players don't get effected and all the "elite" players can enjoy their own extra layer of rankings.

Hopefully Blizzard will release their new icons soon since they said they would change em up to reflect your rank in the division. Still waiting for these Master League icons.

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]
"Suum Cuique" - Cicero
ReketSomething
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States6012 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-12 16:59:51
February 12 2011 16:57 GMT
#3
Stop doing things that make sense. We would rather have a random system with random materials (except masters) Maybe they will get rid of bronze league and add grand masters league or something who knows.

And having something based on ELO makes a lot of sense but at the same time, it shows how good a player is. The point of blizzards system is to make players feel good. Seeing their ELO go up and down can negatively influence a player whereas having a 2K bonus pool and constantly increasing in points (and the fact that the lowest league is "bronze" which is a medal...and therefore something noteworthy).

Apparently blizzard believes people want to see their rating go up, not a ELO system where numbers mean something, that is a 1500 elo vs. a 1200 elo mathematically has a X% chance of winning vs. the other whereas in Blizzards system you have no clue. Having no clue makes people feel less inferior.

I think your icons look really baller by the way. One can wish.

edit: the other problem is that since previous data is stored in the system, the fact is that blizzards fuck up is hard to fix. they would have to publicly announce that they fucked up and revamp the whole thing. Also, when one looks at a players "past seasons" record, everyone will get confused

"why is this guy platinum and now grand masters?"
Jaedong :3
Whiplash
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States2929 Posts
February 12 2011 17:00 GMT
#4
Honestly the first thing I thought of when I saw that was Call of Duty, I don't think that people want that much of a change into the system. The icons look real nice though.
Cinematographer / Steadicam Operator. Former Starcraft commentator/player
Rotodyne
Profile Blog Joined July 2005
United States2263 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-12 17:07:15
February 12 2011 17:06 GMT
#5
On February 13 2011 02:00 Whiplash wrote:
Honestly the first thing I thought of when I saw that was Call of Duty, I don't think that people want that much of a change into the system. The icons look real nice though.


Well we definitely want masters league separated into at least like 5 divisions. maybe based on MMR ?
I can only play starcraft when I am shit canned. IPXZERG is a god.
limonovich
Profile Joined September 2010
England226 Posts
February 12 2011 17:26 GMT
#6
Don't care about icons, just want to see MMR.
trololo
Deleted User 135096
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
3624 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-13 04:28:26
February 12 2011 18:21 GMT
#7
On February 13 2011 01:57 ReketSomething wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

Stop doing things that make sense. We would rather have a random system with random materials (except masters) Maybe they will get rid of bronze league and add grand masters league or something who knows.

And having something based on ELO makes a lot of sense but at the same time, it shows how good a player is. The point of blizzards system is to make players feel good. Seeing their ELO go up and down can negatively influence a player whereas having a 2K bonus pool and constantly increasing in points (and the fact that the lowest league is "bronze" which is a medal...and therefore something noteworthy).

Apparently blizzard believes people want to see their rating go up, not a ELO system where numbers mean something, that is a 1500 elo vs. a 1200 elo mathematically has a X% chance of winning vs. the other whereas in Blizzards system you have no clue. Having no clue makes people feel less inferior.

I think your icons look really baller by the way. One can wish.

edit: the other problem is that since previous data is stored in the system, the fact is that blizzards fuck up is hard to fix. they would have to publicly announce that they fucked up and revamp the whole thing. Also, when one looks at a players "past seasons" record, everyone will get confused

"why is this guy platinum and now grand masters?"

I applaud your use of sarcasm sir. I do agree however that fixing the inherent problem would be tricky. My feeling though would be, well, SC:BW lasted 12+ years, so assuming the SC2 lasts this long then changing the design even a year into it's release is relatively ok..

On February 13 2011 Rotodyne wrote:Well we definitely want masters league separated into at least like 5 divisions. maybe based on MMR ?

I originally had Masters broken into 4 tiers but for some reason decided to remove this first one
+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]


On February 13 2011 02:26 limonovich wrote: Don't care about icons, just want to see MMR.

Man do I wish they would just show us our actual rating, I just think that it was also kind of silly that the visualizations are somewhat meaningless right now.
Administrator
loving it
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada271 Posts
February 12 2011 19:20 GMT
#8
Its a great idea. However they hide MMR for a reason. They're trying to not make this game seem intimidating with ELOs and all that.

I'd gladly support this, maybe some colour into those icons will be make it better?
Stay gold.
HwangjaeTerran
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
Finland5967 Posts
February 12 2011 20:46 GMT
#9
Uhh, This reminds me of the Duty Calls system.

I'd like a more simple approach:
1. 99.5 % = "Lolnoob"
2. 99.5% - 99.98% = "Noob"
3. 99.98% - 99.999% = "Can Play"
4. 99.999% + = "Pretty good"

Icons could be little L,N,C and P with colors and glitter.
https://steamcommunity.com/id/*tlusernamehere*/
Deleted User 135096
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
3624 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-12 21:51:30
February 12 2011 21:46 GMT
#10
On February 13 2011 05:46 HwangjaeTerran wrote:
Uhh, This reminds me of the Duty Calls system...

Yes, that would probably be because CoD follows the American military (Marines/Army) in it's rank divisions. A sergeant will always have 3 chevrons. You can't really get away from the variations on theme either, if you look at a USA sergeant vs. a British sergeant, they share the same 3 chevrons.

Also lol's, I'm assuming you mean percentiles instead of %.
Administrator
RyanRushia
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States2748 Posts
February 12 2011 22:32 GMT
#11
pretty flippin cool icons... and yea i think a base elo would be better system to go through
I saw the angel in the marble and carved until I set him free. | coL.Ryan | www.twitter.com/coL_RyanR
Kinky
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States4126 Posts
February 12 2011 23:29 GMT
#12
I really agree that there's more levels of skills than leagues. In the old iccup system there were 14 ranks if I'm counting correctly, from E all the way to the olympic rank. Blizzard's system is so muddled that it's hard to take anything from it.
eviltomahawk
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States11135 Posts
February 13 2011 02:29 GMT
#13
Although I do agree about this approach, I think there should be a greater number of divisions in the upper tiers, especially considering that it is where the majority of D level and upwards of people from iCCup usually reside. The approach would be nice for the lower leagues, though the opinion that Plat and lower is usually considered "casual" probably means that they won't really care about the changes as much as the Diamond and Masters players.

IMO, it would be great to add an iCCup-style rating to the upper tiers since currently it's quite ambiguous what true skill a player is based on their points and ranking in a league. A grueling iCCup system would be a solid, though stark, reminder of a player's true skill inside the upper league.
ㅇㅅㅌㅅ
vnlegend
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States1389 Posts
February 13 2011 03:44 GMT
#14
Nice graphics on the icons, they look very realistic and sharp. I also liked the previous version that they had with more decor.

[image loading]
Marines > everything
Deleted User 135096
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
3624 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-13 04:09:42
February 13 2011 04:07 GMT
#15
On February 13 2011 11:29 eviltomahawk wrote:
Although I do agree about this approach, I think there should be a greater number of divisions in the upper tiers, especially considering that it is where the majority of D level and upwards of people from iCCup usually reside. The approach would be nice for the lower leagues, though the opinion that Plat and lower is usually considered "casual" probably means that they won't really care about the changes as much as the Diamond and Masters players.

IMO, it would be great to add an iCCup-style rating to the upper tiers since currently it's quite ambiguous what true skill a player is based on their points and ranking in a league. A grueling iCCup system would be a solid, though stark, reminder of a player's true skill inside the upper league.

I tend to agree. I really do feel that 14 levels is a good number for a more accurate representation of skill, and both ELO and iCCup do this. My initial problem was that I couldn't figure out a concise visual way to represent the levels, the 3rd tier and 1st tier would be no problem in making 1 addition, but I had a lot of trouble with tier 2. Below is what I played around with originally, but never really felt that it worked quite well enough.

E, D-, D, D+
[image loading]

C-, C, C+
[image loading]

B-, B, B+
[image loading]

A-, A, A+, Olympic
[image loading]
Administrator
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
16:55
FSL s10 TeamLeague: ASH vs PTB
Freeedom2
Liquipedia
SC Evo Complete
13:30
SEL Doubles #1
SteadfastSC473
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SteadfastSC 473
ProTech131
Vindicta 51
MindelVK 35
gerald23 16
JuggernautJason0
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 31999
Sea 2940
Rain 2013
BeSt 293
Dewaltoss 149
ggaemo 90
Hyun 82
Mind 75
Aegong 63
Snow 49
[ Show more ]
JYJ 21
IntoTheRainbow 18
Dota 2
Gorgc5195
qojqva1511
Counter-Strike
fl0m1525
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor539
Liquid`Hasu298
Other Games
gofns13587
tarik_tv7085
singsing3027
B2W.Neo812
Beastyqt499
crisheroes136
ToD131
QueenE121
KnowMe87
Mew2King77
Trikslyr46
Liquid`VortiX0
Organizations
StarCraft 2
WardiTV1182
Counter-Strike
PGL351
Other Games
BasetradeTV123
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Airneanach5
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• lizZardDota260
League of Legends
• Jankos2638
• Shiphtur179
Upcoming Events
DaveTesta Events
1h 13m
AI Arena Tournament
2h 58m
Replay Cast
6h 58m
PiG Sty Festival
15h 58m
Clem vs Serral
Maru vs ShoWTimE
Sparkling Tuna Cup
16h 58m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
21h 58m
Replay Cast
1d 15h
Wardi Open
1d 18h
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 23h
Replay Cast
2 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
The PondCast
4 days
KCM Race Survival
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-02-26
LiuLi Cup: 2025 Grand Finals
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Acropolis #4 - TS5
Jeongseon Sooper Cup
Spring Cup 2026
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 2nd Round
[S:21] ASL SEASON OPEN 2nd Round Qualifier
WardiTV Winter 2026
PiG Sty Festival 7.0
Nations Cup 2026
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
eXTREMESLAND 2025

Upcoming

ASL Season 21: Qualifier #1
ASL Season 21: Qualifier #2
ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
CSLAN 4
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
RSL Revival: Season 4
NationLESS Cup
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
FISSURE Playground #3
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.