• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:17
CEST 16:17
KST 23:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview16Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL46Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, Zoun, Solar, Creator4[ASL19] Finals Preview: Daunting Task30
Community News
GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th10Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0EWC 2025 Regional Qualifier Results26Code S RO12 Results + RO8 Groups (2025 Season 2)3Weekly Cups (May 19-25): Hindsight is 20/20?0
StarCraft 2
General
BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th Serious Question: Mech
Tourneys
Bellum Gens Elite: Stara Zagora 2025 $25,000+ WardiTV 2025 Series Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SOOP Starcraft Global #21 $5,100+ SEL Season 2 Championship (SC: Evo)
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance Mutation # 473 Cold is the Void
Brood War
General
FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans? BW General Discussion BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Battle.net is not working
Tourneys
[ASL19] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL20] GosuLeague RO16 - Tue & Wed 20:00+CET
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Monster Hunter Wilds Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Mechabellum
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Plays: Diplomacy TL Mafia: Generative Agents Showdown Survivor II: The Amazon
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Cleaning My Mechanical Keyboard
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
Research study on team perfo…
TrAiDoS
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Poker
Nebuchad
Info SLEgma_12
SLEgma_12
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 17850 users

Ladder Report 1.2

Blogs > Dromar
Post a Reply
Dromar
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States2145 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-12-11 19:11:44
December 11 2010 16:51 GMT
#1
So, I've been pretty busy this last month, but class is finally over, and all I have left is to grade the final exams for my College Algebra class and I'm done. I have to work on my thesis over winter break, but other than that I have the month off, so I plan on brushing off the dust on my hands and getting going.

So the PTR came out pretty recently, and chat rooms are awesome. I've wanted to get a 1v1play/obs group going for so long, but it's practically impossible without chat rooms. In fact, as soon as I logged onto the PTR, that's what I did. In fact, I eventually played a Bo5 against a Terran named Sultanico that was great practice, and the 5th game may be the best game of SC2 I've played thus far. I've posted it below in the replays section.

Onto the analysis:

1v1 analysis:

Zerg(56 games)
(16)ZvZ: 7- 9 43.8%
(17)ZvP:11- 6 64.7%
(23)ZvT:10-13 43.5%

28-28 50.0%

This Season:
Zerg(200 games)
(74)ZvZ: 36-38 48.6%
(59)ZvP: 36-23 61.0%
(67)ZvT: 37-30 55.2%

109-91 54.5%

So I went 50/50 this session over 56 games. I'm starting to match up against players that are really close to my skill level. I have to say the auto-matchmaking is awesome.

ZvZ:
In ZvZ I've been a bit too greedy, and I've also been a bit lax in keeping up scouting for tech switches to muta. Other than that, my play still hasn't been too great. As I said I've been too greedy. The problem is when my opponent gets their first larva inject, are they making ling/baneling? roaches? or are they making drones? I've been making drones, and this creates a specific timing window where my opponent could potentially have a much larger army than myself. If maps were larger I don't think this would be a problem, but on smaller maps/closer positions I think I need to learn to be the aggressive one, because that timing window can often be game.

ZvP:
ZvP is certainly my best matchup, and the matchup I'm most comfortable in. My general build order is the same:
+ Show Spoiler +

Hatch-Pool
Ling Speed
Lair
Hydra Den-2 evos
Roach Warren-carapace/range ups
once 2/2 ups start, get Infestor Mound-Hive
once Hive done, Ultra/Crack +3carapace +1melee

I've actually played a few really close ZvPs this month, oddly enough, all on Steppes of War. I've also noticed a general trend away from colossus and toward psi storm, which I think is a great idea for struggling Protosses. Colossus isn't bad by any means, but I think Zergs are getting a lot better at dealing with colossus-based armies, and also scouting colossus tech generally means you aren't moving out for a while (who attacks with one colossus? I mean other than some 1base colossus rush build), which gives the Zerg ample time to prepare a countering unit composition. Well placed psi storms are brutal.

ZvT:
2rax rine-SCV was the flavor of the month, and it honestly hurt my confidence. It got to the point where I stopped going hatch first in this matchup (that lasted about 5 games). I haven't exactly come up with a solution to this attack, but my next idea to try is diligent scouting: my scout drone is gonna stand just outside the Terran base, just out of sight, and if I see marines rallying toward me, I gotta have my drones ready to fight at my nat. I think that's gonna play a big role in fending this off. You can't send down your drones after the rines are already there and there's a bunker or two building; you need to know about it and be ready before they get there.
Again, I dunno if that'll work, but that's what I'm trying next. Oh and one more thing: It seems like every ZvT I watch, when Zerg goes muta/ling/bling and the armies engage, the Zerg player doesn't pull back his banelings after the marines are gone. This is something I've started doing. You need to pull back your banelings and save them for the next encounter rather than blowing them up on marauders which are gonna get mopped up by muta/ling anyway.

Questions:
ZvZ:
1. If you play Zerg, what do you usually make with your first larva inject? If you make lings/roaches, how successful are you with your timing attacks? Any advice?

ZvP:
Nothing I guess. The biggest thing I need to work on in this matchup is dealing with cannon rushes better. I guess I'm not used to the fact that they have a whopping 300 life now. Between that and the fact that you can only get a few drones to attack well placed cannons, this is a much stronger attack than it was in BW.

ZvT:
1. I've had quite a bit of trouble winning against Terran on Xel'Naga Caverns. If the Terran manages to get a PF at the gold, it allows them a safe forward army position that is only 5 seconds from defending or attacking any expo on the map. How can I win from there?
2. What is the best way to fend off a quick blue flame hellion + marauder timing attack? I have quite a bit of trouble with this attack.

Reps:
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/114892-1v1-protoss-zerg-steppes-of-war
41 minute ZvP on Steppes. Pretty good game.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/114893-1v1-protoss-zerg-steppes-of-war

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/114894-1v1-protoss-zerg-steppes-of-war
two aggressive ZvPs on Steppes.

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/114891-1v1-zerg-shakuras-plateau#rd:dna
A ZvZ that seemed one-sided at the time, but was actually much closer than I thought for a minute there. Interesting open by my opponent.

+ Show Spoiler +
http://rapidshare.com/#!download|782l32|436319407|Great_ZvT_on_Metal.SC2Replay|152
game 5 of the Bo5 against Sultanico. Probably the best game I've ever played. Was played on PTR when fungal didn't hit air, but if you double-click the replay, it opens fine. Apparently sc2replayed and star2 can't host PRT replays, so I put it on megaupload. edit: megaupload isn't working either, so I went with rapidshare.

edit2: ok, apparently you can't watch replays of old patches of PTR games. It crashes my computer when I try to watch . Sorry if this crashed any of your computers.


As always, comments and constructive criticism welcome.

Flaunt
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
New Zealand784 Posts
December 11 2010 19:56 GMT
#2
Questions:
ZvZ:
1. If you play Zerg, what do you usually make with your first larva inject? If you make lings/roaches, how successful are you with your timing attacks? Any advice?


What's your opening? Is it 14 hatch or 14 gas 14 pool?


ZvT:
1. I've had quite a bit of trouble winning against Terran on Xel'Naga Caverns. If the Terran manages to get a PF at the gold, it allows them a safe forward army position that is only 5 seconds from defending or attacking any expo on the map. How can I win from there?
2. What is the best way to fend off a quick blue flame hellion + marauder timing attack? I have quite a bit of trouble with this attack.


1. The key is to have creep spread out to the 4th expansion before you decide to take it so that you can quickly defend it and it'll help you flank him a lot better.

2. Roach ling, don't go for a quick spire against cheesy 1 base play. You want to always buy a roach warren if you think something fishy is going on. Let the roaches go in first and the lings can flank.
What? You seek something? You wish to multiply yourself tenfold, a hundredfold? You seek followers? Seek zeros!
Dromar
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States2145 Posts
December 11 2010 23:10 GMT
#3
On December 12 2010 04:56 Flaunt wrote:
Questions:
ZvZ:
1. If you play Zerg, what do you usually make with your first larva inject? If you make lings/roaches, how successful are you with your timing attacks? Any advice?


What's your opening? Is it 14 hatch or 14 gas 14 pool?


Dependent on scouting, but my standard is hatch first.


ZvT:
1. I've had quite a bit of trouble winning against Terran on Xel'Naga Caverns. If the Terran manages to get a PF at the gold, it allows them a safe forward army position that is only 5 seconds from defending or attacking any expo on the map. How can I win from there?
2. What is the best way to fend off a quick blue flame hellion + marauder timing attack? I have quite a bit of trouble with this attack.


1. The key is to have creep spread out to the 4th expansion before you decide to take it so that you can quickly defend it and it'll help you flank him a lot better.

2. Roach ling, don't go for a quick spire against cheesy 1 base play. You want to always buy a roach warren if you think something fishy is going on. Let the roaches go in first and the lings can flank.


Thanks, I'll keep that in mind. It just seems that, after they get a PF at the gold, I can't attack or even harass anywhere, and then I get picked apart by drops and small squads of marine/marauder sniping my expos.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Bellum Gens Elite
12:00
Stara Zagora 2025 Day 1
Reynor vs FuturELIVE!
TriGGeR vs SKillous
Ryung vs Gerald
Zoun vs Krystianer
Serral vs Lambo
ShoWTimE vs YoungYakov
Bellum Gens Elite1292
ComeBackTV 542
TaKeTV 296
IndyStarCraft 231
Rex192
3DClanTV 141
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Bellum Gens Elite1292
IndyStarCraft 231
Rex 192
ProTech85
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 8574
Bisu 3688
Shuttle 1781
Horang2 1572
Jaedong 648
ggaemo 477
Mini 423
ZerO 393
Stork 388
Soulkey 371
[ Show more ]
Snow 349
Light 296
Hyuk 289
Rush 231
Zeus 188
Pusan 164
hero 152
Dewaltoss 120
Sharp 96
Leta 79
Hyun 69
JYJ60
sSak 44
sas.Sziky 44
ToSsGirL 37
Mong 36
HiyA 29
Movie 24
Backho 20
Free 15
GoRush 15
ajuk12(nOOB) 13
Shine 12
SilentControl 12
Terrorterran 9
Rock 6
Noble 5
Hm[arnc] 4
Dota 2
Gorgc5725
qojqva3068
XcaliburYe393
BabyKnight50
syndereN32
Counter-Strike
olofmeister2924
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King77
Heroes of the Storm
XaKoH 134
Other Games
singsing2239
B2W.Neo1046
hiko615
DeMusliM522
Happy393
crisheroes252
Lowko169
QueenE34
KnowMe24
ZerO(Twitch)16
Has15
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream3762
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream76
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 6
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• HeavenSC 9
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis4777
• Jankos2155
• TFBlade973
Upcoming Events
OSC
1h 43m
The PondCast
19h 43m
Bellum Gens Elite
20h 43m
WardiTV Invitational
20h 43m
Replay Cast
1d 9h
OSC
1d 9h
Bellum Gens Elite
1d 20h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 23h
Replay Cast
2 days
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
[ Show More ]
SC Evo League
2 days
Bellum Gens Elite
2 days
Fire Grow Cup
3 days
CSO Contender
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
SOOP Global
3 days
Creator vs Rogue
Cure vs Classic
SOOP
3 days
SHIN vs GuMiho
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
AllThingsProtoss
3 days
Fire Grow Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
GSL Code S
6 days
Rogue vs GuMiho
Maru vs Solar
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 1
DreamHack Dallas 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
2025 GSL S2
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2025
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLAN 2025
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.