Also this stuff needs to stop. Too much butthurtment all over the world. Just grow some common sense and decency for crying out loud..
Teacher in trouble for reading Ender's Game - Page 12
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CryMeAReaper
Denmark1135 Posts
Also this stuff needs to stop. Too much butthurtment all over the world. Just grow some common sense and decency for crying out loud.. | ||
Quintum_
United States669 Posts
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Geisterkarle
Germany3256 Posts
http://www.unifr.ch/oeffrecht/SVVOR/assets/files/Dienstrecht/Das Magazin Nr. 9.pdf (.pdf, German!) He read some "high literature" with some things in it, that could be pornographic. Because it was also before kids of ~14 he was suspected of being a pedophile and got a full search of his home! They found some "artistic nude" (nude meaning not totally nude, but "posing" in a "sexual context" ... whatever this means...) pictures and a court found him guilt of possession of child pornography. Lost his job and got on the "black list" so he can never ever teach again... Don't know if I should mention, that all children, he taught, all colleagues, friends and people that knew him were saying that any accusation of him being a pedophile are crap ... | ||
Denis Lachance
Canada162 Posts
On March 16 2012 22:37 Geisterkarle wrote: Just a few days ago I read something similar about a teacher in Switzerland: http://www.unifr.ch/oeffrecht/SVVOR/assets/files/Dienstrecht/Das Magazin Nr. 9.pdf (.pdf, German!) He read some "high literature" with some things in it, that could be pornographic. Because it was also before kids of ~14 he was suspected of being a pedophile and got a full search of his home! They found some "artistic nude" (nude meaning not totally nude, but "posing" in a "sexual context" ... whatever this means...) pictures and a court found him guilt of possession of child pornography. Lost his job and got on the "black list" so he can never ever teach again... Don't know if I should mention, that all children, he taught, all colleagues, friends and people that knew him were saying that any accusation of him being a pedophile are crap ... Were they pictures of "Artistic nude" children? In which case, it points heavily in that direction... As for the topic, it frustrates me to no end to see parents trying to protect their children to the ends of the earth from anything and everything they themselves don't fully understand. What frustrates me even more is that anyone can just articulate that anything is "Borderline" or "Controversial" and masses or parents will just choose to shut out whatever was mentionned bordeline or controvertial out of fear without really understanding what it is. People who are unable to think for themselves, or that force their children to be unable to think for themselves, are the plague of today's modern society. | ||
Metak
296 Posts
On March 16 2012 07:18 oBlade wrote: Fahrenheit 451 should be required reading for everyone involved in this "story." I could not agree more. In fact, Fahrenheit should be required reading for everyone. | ||
Geisterkarle
Germany3256 Posts
On March 16 2012 22:47 Denis Lachance wrote: Were they pictures of "Artistic nude" children? In which case, it points heavily in that direction... They were pictures by David Hamilton (and others with the "same" style): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hamilton_(photographer) It's your call if this is child pornography! | ||
Deleuze
United Kingdom2102 Posts
On March 16 2012 07:10 Requizen wrote: Source: http://www.aikenstandard.com/story/0315Followup-with-school--3862406 tl:dr - Teacher reads Ender's Game to her class as part of an attempt to get kids more interested in reading. 14 year old kid tells his mom, she complains to the school, teacher is put on "leave". I read Ender's Game (and indeed most of the series) around that age or younger, and it didn't scar me in any lasting way, in fact, it made me more interested in reading in general. However, I suppose I'm not indicative of every child that age. I also read Animorphs (which was actually really violent, reflecting back on it), and I don't know if those would pass the test either. Do you think Orson Scott Card's books are too "pornographic" or offensive? How about other books that are written for that age range? It's a while since I read Ender's Game, but wasn't it basically a childhood fantasy from the perspective a the bullied school yard nerd - and thus highly appropriate for school time reading? Very disappinting. The book's I studied at secondary school and then at Uni would have made these parents crazy. Christ the comics I'm currently writing a paper on would positively give them an aneurysm. This is so sadly anti-intellectual it's not funny. | ||
Fyrewolf
United States1533 Posts
On March 16 2012 08:41 TheWestWind wrote: Sorry my friends, but if you read this book in your early or mid adolescence, your critical capacity to understand the kind of violence porn that it really is was not fully functional, especially if you are identifying strongly with Ender. Which is the way the character was designed after all. Did you know Ender's Game is required reading for US Marine Corps and Officers, as an exercise in how to justify violence? Additionally, OSC has many personal views that many on this forum would find disgusting, including advocating the use of violence against consenting homosexual adults and denying evolution and climate change. Not to be surprised though, nerds love their Ender's Game. What? Required reading for Marine Corps and Officers.... for how to justify violence? The book is a giant statement AGAINST how military training brainwashes people. That's why Ender becomes the Speaker for the Dead. Just lol at that analysis calling it "pornography"... what a crock of bullshit by someone that completely missed the point of the novel, and bashes the plot as a result of his own inability to comprehend it. That was probably one of the worst analysis I've seen of anything. This book is an Adult book, not a "Young Adult" book. It is about young adults, but the book is intended for adults. Common mistake of publishers. | ||
DarkPlasmaBall
United States42237 Posts
If there is a district/ school policy that every book must be reviewed/ passed before being taught in class, then the teacher screwed up by not going through the proper protocol. As a future teacher, I realize all of the annoying regulations that must be recognized and hoops that must be jumped through, but Ender's Game could have been passed through anyway. The problem isn't with the book as much as the fact that the teacher didn't okay it ahead of time. That's all there is to it. And the protocol exists just in case a teacher really does bring in a shitty book for the class to read. The school and district certainly doesn't want to be put through a shitstorm of their kids actually viewing or reading something that is inappropriate (whatever that may be). So Ender's Game isn't the problem; not following the protocol just to be safe is. | ||
Eschaton
United States1245 Posts
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DeepElemBlues
United States5076 Posts
There's a homoerotic subtext to Ender and Bonzo's conflict!! If you want to see it, otherwise it's not there. There's an incest subtext with Valentine and Ender! (and a bit more than subtext with Valentine and Peter, at least from Pter's end) Yeah that one's there whether you want to see it or not. There's... Xenocide! In other words, it's about 300 times more tame than your typical Marvel comic these days. How could anyone think that that is appropriate for children!?!?!? I used to think that the people who flabbled about what is or isn't "appropriate for children" would eventually die early from heart attacks or strokes... but apparently not, medical science lets them live to a ripe old age. Public shaming doesn't seem to work either, the stultification of society seems impossible to stop. =/ | ||
TheWestWind
Canada87 Posts
On March 16 2012 23:01 Fyrewolf wrote: What? Required reading for Marine Corps and Officers.... for how to justify violence? The book is a giant statement AGAINST how military training brainwashes people. That's why Ender becomes the Speaker for the Dead. Just lol at that analysis calling it "pornography"... what a crock of bullshit by someone that completely missed the point of the novel, and bashes the plot as a result of his own inability to comprehend it. That was probably one of the worst analysis I've seen of anything. This book is an Adult book, not a "Young Adult" book. It is about young adults, but the book is intended for adults. Common mistake of publishers. Well, lets see your analysis of that analysis where you show how it missed the point. Or perhaps this one. http://www4.ncsu.edu/~tenshi/Killer_000.htm "The result is a character who exterminates an entire race and yet remains fundamentally innocent. The purpose of this paper is to examine the methods Card uses to construct this story of a guiltless genocide, to point out some contradictions inherent in this scenario, and to raise questions about the intention-based morality advocated by Ender’s Game and Speaker for the Dead." Also, your message is pretty worthless. Just LOL at Ender's Game. It is such a 'crock of bullshit' by a fundamentalist asshole who 'completely misses' the point of morality and uses clever writing to take advantage of his target audiences emotions. Ender is one of the worst written characters I've read of anywhere. ^^See how easy that is? Not to mention annoying. Actual adults don't argue like that. When they disagree with another argument they use reason and evidence to either disprove it or present a counter-argument. John Kessel (see above) also has some thoughts on why Ender's Game is so popular. "I would suggest that the methods of evasion that I have delineated in the text, and their congruency with the psychology of adolescence, offer an explanation for the novel’s deep and broad popularity." But if you love Ender's Game you should really read that paper. | ||
Grettin
42379 Posts
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nam nam
Sweden4672 Posts
On March 16 2012 23:01 Fyrewolf wrote: What? Required reading for Marine Corps and Officers.... for how to justify violence? The book is a giant statement AGAINST how military training brainwashes people. That's why Ender becomes the Speaker for the Dead. Just lol at that analysis calling it "pornography"... what a crock of bullshit by someone that completely missed the point of the novel, and bashes the plot as a result of his own inability to comprehend it. That was probably one of the worst analysis I've seen of anything. This book is an Adult book, not a "Young Adult" book. It is about young adults, but the book is intended for adults. Common mistake of publishers. I'm not sure what you want to say with your last paragraph, most books are "intended" for adults, that doesn't mean a 14 year old can't read it. I would have bashed my head in at that age if I was forced to read the "young adult" category of books. | ||
micronesia
United States24345 Posts
By the way, this type of stuff is pretty typical in schools. Anything the teacher does is like walking on a minefield. If a teacher does something minor like this (if it counts as a >0 offense) and doesn't have tenure then the district can just get rid of them instantly with no need for due process to sort out this bullshit. Imagine that. | ||
RxDamitol
United States83 Posts
Hunger Games...? eh.... | ||
Ysellian
Netherlands9029 Posts
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Klyberess
Sweden345 Posts
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KillerSOS
United States4207 Posts
On March 17 2012 02:42 TheWestWind wrote: Well, lets see your analysis of that analysis where you show how it missed the point. Or perhaps this one. http://www4.ncsu.edu/~tenshi/Killer_000.htm "The result is a character who exterminates an entire race and yet remains fundamentally innocent. The purpose of this paper is to examine the methods Card uses to construct this story of a guiltless genocide, to point out some contradictions inherent in this scenario, and to raise questions about the intention-based morality advocated by Ender’s Game and Speaker for the Dead." Also, your message is pretty worthless. Just LOL at Ender's Game. It is such a 'crock of bullshit' by a fundamentalist asshole who 'completely misses' the point of morality and uses clever writing to take advantage of his target audiences emotions. Ender is one of the worst written characters I've read of anywhere. ^^See how easy that is? Not to mention annoying. Actual adults don't argue like that. When they disagree with another argument they use reason and evidence to either disprove it or present a counter-argument. John Kessel (see above) also has some thoughts on why Ender's Game is so popular. "I would suggest that the methods of evasion that I have delineated in the text, and their congruency with the psychology of adolescence, offer an explanation for the novel’s deep and broad popularity." But if you love Ender's Game you should really read that paper. I've taken Kessel's class at NCSU. Pretty sure he just hates OSC tbh. | ||
KillerSOS
United States4207 Posts
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