EPT
Written by Saro, this is an accumulation of the thoughts discussed in the admin lounge. It is not the opinion of all the staff, and there are numerous people who disagree.
For the last week there has been a heated debate in our staff forum regarding whether or not we should permanently ban Chibi. Understandably, there are a wide variety of opinions on this matter, some more fervent than others, some in agreement and others in disagreement about what the outcome should be. As the site staff, we strive to make these types of decisions as a team, reach an agreement, and then present a united front of solidarity behind it - or at least that's the goal. We're all human though, obviously, and sometimes there are strong disagreements - we really do have a diverse group of people with different backgrounds and different views, and often all sides of an argument are well represented. But ultimately, we do need to reach decisions, and we try to do so in a democratic fashion, where all opinions are weighed, and an decision is made by the majority.
The debate was wide-ranging, from the issue of allowing an admitted pedophile to post here, and whether that meant we as staff were condoning and thus endorsing pedophilia, and consequently what our duties were as moderators of this site - versus the idea of freedom of speech and "thought-policing" or telling people what they should think, and how that could be seen as projecting our own moral views on others, and whether someone's level of intelligence or articulacy in presenting their views actually matters to other people's perception and comfort level when listening. However, the issue that no one was arguing or debating against, was the fact that we've been having problems with Chibi on a regular basis.
This was the 8th time Chibi has been banned - at least since we've been keeping track (there's a thread in the staff forum that is similar and predates this public ban-list thread). And five of those bans happened in the last 3 months (Admins do have a rarely-used method of banning that doesn't show up in this thread). He's been a long-time regular here and has deservedly gotten way more leniency than some random new user, who would've probably been perm-banned on the spot, in any of those instances. But at some point, this leniency has to end, it can't just go on and on indefinitely. In fact, Chibi has been temp-banned more than any other user in TL history. Apparently that method of punishment wasn't having any effect.
We've had three discussions in our staff forum in as many months, totaling over 200 posts, each with several staff members calling for Chibi to finally be banned once and for all. But each of the previous times, we continued being lenient, and allowed him to return. About a month and a half ago, he went on a drunken posting spree ending with this thread, and was effectively banned for an entire month afterward. At that point he was already on thin ice, and we were at the end of the rope with him. After a long chat with Nazgul, he was given a final last chance, on the agreement he would stop causing problems, and stop talking about anything pedo-related.
Chibi returned from his month-long ban, and after posting at the site for roughly two weeks, problems have once again arisen, and once again we're having another long discussion in the staff forum.
I'm going to quote some of these posts he's made in the last two weeks. I'll admit it isn't very fair to look at these posts completely out of their original context like this. All I've done is quickly scan through his recent posts, grabbing anything that looks remotely pedo-related. The point isn't to prove anything, it's only to see if he has held up his end of the agreement, after being given his last chance.
+ Show Spoiler +
On February 23 2007 18:55 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
Posted this on LP, wondering if there are any alternative standpoints on this, whether you should treat it as simply a non-issue or is something altogether wrong.
What: Teenagers taking risque photos of themselves are prosecuted for violating child pornography laws.
Outcome: A 2-1 majority upholds conviction on grounds the girl produced a photograph featuring the sexual conduct of a child.
http://news.com.com/Police blotter Teens prosecuted for racy photos/2100-1030_3-6157857.html
(2 pages + comments)
When will we know what punishments they'll get?
Posted this on LP, wondering if there are any alternative standpoints on this, whether you should treat it as simply a non-issue or is something altogether wrong.
What: Teenagers taking risque photos of themselves are prosecuted for violating child pornography laws.
Outcome: A 2-1 majority upholds conviction on grounds the girl produced a photograph featuring the sexual conduct of a child.
http://news.com.com/Police blotter Teens prosecuted for racy photos/2100-1030_3-6157857.html
(2 pages + comments)
When will we know what punishments they'll get?
On February 24 2007 17:27 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
pm me if you want some of cute girls
pm me if you want some of cute girls
On February 26 2007 17:01 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
i dont like porn very much . white girls are annoying and fake as fuck
i dont like porn very much . white girls are annoying and fake as fuck
On March 02 2007 22:11 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
you can also get convicted of producing and distrubuting child pornography if you video or photo yourself/girlfriend under age of 18 (even if you are under 18 yourself). see my thread that was closed
you can also get convicted of producing and distrubuting child pornography if you video or photo yourself/girlfriend under age of 18 (even if you are under 18 yourself). see my thread that was closed
On March 02 2007 22:19 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
in england it is illegal for anyone under 16 to have sexual intimacy in any way with anyone else, underage or not. if the parents want to end their child's relationship with another child they can prosecute the 'offender' with the law.
bullshit laws like this are commonplace and are growing in number and frequency of use. in 10, 20, 40 years how do you see things to be different? USE YOUR BRAIN. THINK FOR A MOMENT. SHIT IS BAD AND IS GETTING WORSE. IT MATTERS. in not so many years the internet will be regulated. america already admitted to secretly recording internet useage. people are having their phones tapped. things like this are happening more frequently than you can imagine.
in england it is illegal for anyone under 16 to have sexual intimacy in any way with anyone else, underage or not. if the parents want to end their child's relationship with another child they can prosecute the 'offender' with the law.
bullshit laws like this are commonplace and are growing in number and frequency of use. in 10, 20, 40 years how do you see things to be different? USE YOUR BRAIN. THINK FOR A MOMENT. SHIT IS BAD AND IS GETTING WORSE. IT MATTERS. in not so many years the internet will be regulated. america already admitted to secretly recording internet useage. people are having their phones tapped. things like this are happening more frequently than you can imagine.
On March 03 2007 02:07 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
![[image loading]](http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/8396/lololololqu2.jpg)
On March 04 2007 06:15 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
![[image loading]](http://park18.wakwak.com/~zip/img/40_040222_003.jpg)
On March 05 2007 09:23 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
You might say it's a biological thing, but biology is not limited to base genetics but instead a lifetime of nurtured psychological (read: brain) development. It is entirely possible for a person to find shoes attractive, if he is shown a picture of a shoe before a picture of a naked woman everyday. It is equally possible for a person to block out an otherwise powerful sexual attraction by simple force of will. he needn't even know the attraction exists for it to be repressed, so a homophobic gay person is not necessarily someone living in misery.
You might say it's a biological thing, but biology is not limited to base genetics but instead a lifetime of nurtured psychological (read: brain) development. It is entirely possible for a person to find shoes attractive, if he is shown a picture of a shoe before a picture of a naked woman everyday. It is equally possible for a person to block out an otherwise powerful sexual attraction by simple force of will. he needn't even know the attraction exists for it to be repressed, so a homophobic gay person is not necessarily someone living in misery.
On March 05 2007 09:46 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
I think it's important to consider for what reasons someone might be attracted to the same sex: Most pedophiles claim to have realised their orientation from a young age, but there are many 'reasons' that can still be used to explain against it being genetic. For example, do they like to be dominant? Are they immature and relate better to immaturity? Did they 'miss out' on an important part of their childhood that they are trying to relive?
So, similarly, what reasons can be used to explain homosexuality as a personal psychological attraction rather than genetic? What particular attributes attract a man to another man? For example, do they like the idea of their partner being strong instead of a weak woman (lame example)? And, perhaps, we might find THESE preferences are hereditary. (actually that last line is probably bullshit but I have no idea)
I think it's important to consider for what reasons someone might be attracted to the same sex: Most pedophiles claim to have realised their orientation from a young age, but there are many 'reasons' that can still be used to explain against it being genetic. For example, do they like to be dominant? Are they immature and relate better to immaturity? Did they 'miss out' on an important part of their childhood that they are trying to relive?
So, similarly, what reasons can be used to explain homosexuality as a personal psychological attraction rather than genetic? What particular attributes attract a man to another man? For example, do they like the idea of their partner being strong instead of a weak woman (lame example)? And, perhaps, we might find THESE preferences are hereditary. (actually that last line is probably bullshit but I have no idea)
On March 05 2007 10:39 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/klu/aseb/2005/00000034/00000004/00004344
http://www.narth.com/docs/lefthand.html
It seems that left-handedness occurs 3 times more likely in pedophiles and in gays. These rates "are comparable to the rates observed in pervasive developmental disorders, such as autism, suggesting a neurological component to the development of pedophilia [and homosexuality]" Ie genetic (either inherited genes affecting development of the brain, or an abnormal condition of the mother's womb due to her genes).
http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/klu/aseb/2005/00000034/00000004/00004344
http://www.narth.com/docs/lefthand.html
It seems that left-handedness occurs 3 times more likely in pedophiles and in gays. These rates "are comparable to the rates observed in pervasive developmental disorders, such as autism, suggesting a neurological component to the development of pedophilia [and homosexuality]" Ie genetic (either inherited genes affecting development of the brain, or an abnormal condition of the mother's womb due to her genes).
On March 05 2007 10:46 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
Man I just totally raped the thread. And yes I'm a raging pedo, give me some more attention why don't you, that's all I'm here for after all.
In 1989 Briere and Runtz conducted a study on 193 male undergraduate students concerning pedophilia. Of the sample, 21% acknowledged sexual attraction to some small children
A study by Hall et al. of Kent State University found that, of their sample of 80 adult male volunteers, 26.25 % exhibited sexual arousal to heterosexual pedophilic stimuli that equaled or exceeded their arousal to the adult stimuli.
I nicked the alias Chibi when I saw it on an FF mailing list back when I was like 14. Don't think I knew what it meant or anything. And most hentai chicks don't look nine, I dunno what the hell you're watching unless it's from deadfrog in which case I do lol.
Man I just totally raped the thread. And yes I'm a raging pedo, give me some more attention why don't you, that's all I'm here for after all.
In 1989 Briere and Runtz conducted a study on 193 male undergraduate students concerning pedophilia. Of the sample, 21% acknowledged sexual attraction to some small children
A study by Hall et al. of Kent State University found that, of their sample of 80 adult male volunteers, 26.25 % exhibited sexual arousal to heterosexual pedophilic stimuli that equaled or exceeded their arousal to the adult stimuli.
I nicked the alias Chibi when I saw it on an FF mailing list back when I was like 14. Don't think I knew what it meant or anything. And most hentai chicks don't look nine, I dunno what the hell you're watching unless it's from deadfrog in which case I do lol.
On March 05 2007 11:08 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
you need fucks like me or you'll just wallow in your own frightened closedminded uninformed arrogant unthinking retardedness and will suck as a teacher because you won't be able to answer simple questions like 'is homosexuality hereditary?'
you need fucks like me or you'll just wallow in your own frightened closedminded uninformed arrogant unthinking retardedness and will suck as a teacher because you won't be able to answer simple questions like 'is homosexuality hereditary?'
On March 05 2007 21:25 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
i found this recently http://www.asexuality.org/home/
i found this recently http://www.asexuality.org/home/
On March 05 2007 23:34 Chibi[OWNS] wrote:
i dont DO anything though, i just see some fact that relates and apply it. and i dont honestly see how anyone can possibly be offended by facts. my presentation is totally nonprovokative. it came up in that thread coz it offered another and very good way to relate to the question, and then i stumbled across some more research. i go and answer a question using references to other sexual behavior and factual evidence and suddenly ppl are like HOLY SHIT HE SAID THE P WORD THATS DISGUSTING. wtf is wrong with you people. its not like ive ever even SAID something like 'i want to fuck 8 year olds' let alone implied it. what i have said is that very young people can be psychologically and physically mature and i have no qualms about finding them attractive. the only poorly-presented post was when i made a thread asking if people found certain pictures attractive, after the 2 other 'do you find this woman hot?' threads, and THAT'S not even 'bad' because child models are widespread and far from disgusting, i stuck it in spoilers and added a warning. the only reason people like beyonder and j0e make such a fuss, and give the impression that the entire forum is making a fuss, is because theyre IDIOTS
i dont DO anything though, i just see some fact that relates and apply it. and i dont honestly see how anyone can possibly be offended by facts. my presentation is totally nonprovokative. it came up in that thread coz it offered another and very good way to relate to the question, and then i stumbled across some more research. i go and answer a question using references to other sexual behavior and factual evidence and suddenly ppl are like HOLY SHIT HE SAID THE P WORD THATS DISGUSTING. wtf is wrong with you people. its not like ive ever even SAID something like 'i want to fuck 8 year olds' let alone implied it. what i have said is that very young people can be psychologically and physically mature and i have no qualms about finding them attractive. the only poorly-presented post was when i made a thread asking if people found certain pictures attractive, after the 2 other 'do you find this woman hot?' threads, and THAT'S not even 'bad' because child models are widespread and far from disgusting, i stuck it in spoilers and added a warning. the only reason people like beyonder and j0e make such a fuss, and give the impression that the entire forum is making a fuss, is because theyre IDIOTS
Again, these aren't meant prove anything other to affirm that he likes to talk about his attraction young girls. However - that's exactly what he was not supposed to be talking about, given his agreement and last chance. Some users here, and some staff included, are understandably quite disgusted to see someone who's admitted to being a pedophile, openly talk about this kind of stuff publicly. Several users voiced their disgust in multiple threads, and once again Chibi has created a problem that we have to deal with.
To be clear, Chibi isn't being banned for anything quoted above - he's being banned because he keeps causing trouble over and over again. This has become a consistently recurring issue, we've temp-banned him time and again and it hasn't helped, he was given a last chance under strict guidelines, and he blew it. Chibi is responsible for the reputation he has created for himself here, which has become disruptive to the community, and the monthly discussions about him in the staff forum have become disruptive there too. We've come to the point where enough is enough.
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