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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On April 24 2013 03:47 Hapahauli wrote: What he said. I finish exams Friday so if it hasn't filled by then I may join.A good portion of us have finals and such around this time. Activity will no doubt kick up again in the summer. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
/in | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
Is the mafia KP still unblockable with only one remaining alive? Is SK KP is blockable? Jailer and RB targeting each other cancel all abilities/will each be informed of roleblock? Also, I'm confused about the role cop revealing roles. The OP says it doesn't reveal alignment, but the roles between town/mafia are not symmetrical so there is no counterpart for SK, medic, parity cop, or vigilante, so wouldn't the role reveal alignment because those roles are only possible in one alignment? Thanks. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
I'll start off by talking about a lurker lynch policy. I think it's beneficial to have a threat to lynch highly inactive players to try and force activity. In several past games lynching into the lurkers gave much better odds of hitting scum than the odds would be otherwise. Having said that, it's just a policy and obviously we should all pressure conversation, pursue reads, and lynch someone a better target if it comes about. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
@espi - Being in a different time zone definitely adds difficulty so just try and do your best, give reads, and be reasonably active. In the end that's all we can really ask for from players. I know in a lot of newbie mini games it really suffers from 2-3 lurkers/replacements who hold back the game so I'd love to be able to avoid that. As far as active lurking goes - that's definitely something to watch out for. Posting without direction and cluttering the thread doesn't accomplish anything useful for town. I don't think it's 100% reliable though, although I guess none of the other 'common tells' such as being wishy-washy, apologizing/avoiding confrontation, sheeping etc. are. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 04 2013 12:44 nobodywonder wrote: Can you explain this post - I'm confused what you mean since you haven't voted? Also for the future, I think avoiding 1-liners is best because they take up a lot of space and clutter filters.just voted a lurker for now, see how Sugarfluff responds @vayne - Most definitely, which is why i used the ' ' marks around common tells. When they become common they don't carry as much weight anymore because scum are very aware of them and can purposely use or not use them. Having said that, I think it's still worth looking at because they all boil down to actions that aren't in the best interest of town. Town never wants to clutter, to ramble without pressuring, or to lack purpose. Town doesn't want to avoid conflicts; they want to create them to get better reads and opinions on people and flush out scum. So they have some use but they aren't a silver bullet is my point. I disagree with your first point - the the lynch definitely isn't down to "pure guess" by any means. It's up to town to look under rocks and dig up solid leads in order to make a solid lynch choice. Don't downplay the power of logic and pressure to reveal scum. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
What bothers me is that you've taken a very non-committal stance. "I would vote for this guy, this other guy seems suspicious, but I don't know what to think really" is how I would paraphrase your attitude. I feel that vayne has taken some heat (rightfully so) for poorly worded statements regarding "not enough information" and you've sidled onto others (me and jampi specifically) who brought it up first. You're sheeping right now, and that's what scum does. On May 04 2013 17:23 Sugarfluff wrote: As far as not lynching goes - it's absolutely terrible and town should never entertain this idea. End of story, no need to discuss something useless like this or hear reasons. I dislike how you're trying to imply uncertainty in your decisions and what you say.For me it's the attitude towards not lynching on the first day. I do think we should lynch, cause as I said I think mafia can use the extra time more, as well as the serial killer. This is my first game though so I'm not sure if not lynching on day 1 is a common strategy, if so I'd love to hear the reasons behind it. On May 04 2013 17:55 Sugarfluff wrote: When jampi pressures you to explain your reads more you give another non-confrontational/non-commital response to him here. If vayne's play has stuck out to you the most, where is your vote?But I was gonna chalk that up to you wanting to get the ball rolling, which I suppose is working, so good job on that. Who are your top scum reads right now? Is it still vayne? Right now you are one of mine and I'm going to vote you as such. @shirokami; @flowcaster - You guys are lurking WAY too much. This is completely unacceptable considering you have pledged your time to the game. If this keeps up you are going to force a lurker lynch. We cannot play when you guys aren't contributing. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
@nobodywonder, spicydinosaur, jarjardrinks, targe, shirokami - I'd like to hear your thoughts on this because you all have specifically agreed with the policy. I'm keeping my vote on sugarfluff for now because he has read scummy to me so far but the fact that flowcaster has lurked so much is definitely bad. I'm willing to switch my vote to enforce the lurker lynch policy closer to the deadline if flowcaster doesn't drop some serious content. @shiro - Glad to see you're posting content now. I understand you'd like more content from me; right back at you. I noticed you've jumped onto a player who has already received heat after joining late. Seems like an easy way to sheep a D1 vote, would you not agree? @vayne On May 06 2013 05:05 VayneAuthority wrote:Also his push for lynching lurkers is something mafia tend to do early to gain an early foothold and town usually goes along with it, a common rookie mistake. I would rather just no lynch this day as theres almost nothing to go off of, but if I have to vote for now its going to be him I strongly disagree with you here. There's a reason to pressure lurkers - it's to get them to talk. If they don't talk you don't get any information from them and you can't play the game. You're assuming that all lurkers are town here and that just doesn't follow. Town gains nothing from lurking. Your stance here doesn't make sense; the way you see it if scum lurks they are given a free pass for the game. And again, please don't bring up a no-lynch. It's an utter waste of time D1.@sugarfluff On May 05 2013 16:46 Sugarfluff wrote: I'm still not impressed with your posting sugarfluff. I understand you may or may not have known but that kind of tactic is something mafia like to do in order to be less threatening and noticed. I'd like to see you be more committed in taking a stand and outlining your reads. You haven't really built a case on anyone - why is that? You've outlined a small amount jarjar - is he really your top scumread right now? What do you think about shirokami lurking hard and then popping in?I get you logic except this part. I specifically stated that I didn't know if it was useless. What if it wasn't useless, should I not learn it? And you should always get reasons for everything. Which is why Vaynes vote for Targe is just another suspicious move on his part, however right it may be the logic needs to be there and the reasons need to be known. Anyway, all of JarJarDrinks posts so far have been concerning policy lynching. No attempts at anything else, and if he really felt so strongly about the policy he would have voted, not spent all his posts discussing whether or not we should. My vote is for him. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 06 2013 06:41 nobodywonder wrote: I'll be able to type something longer before lynch but very quickly: it's hard to make any decision on jarjar because he's posted very little but I don't really like it because I read him as town. I think he has better logic and critical points than other people in the thread. I think vayne has said some really scummy stuff and been scummy as hell in general continuing to bring up no-lynch. I would rather lynch vayne or sugar over jarjar as of now.@calgar, what do you think of the Jarjar lynch? who are your top reads other than sugarfluff? | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
@jrkirby - who would you lynch right now instead of jarjar since you think he is town? Can we potentially swing the vote here? I'd say sugar or vayne over jarjar so we seem to disagree there since you say nobody? | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 06 2013 09:42 jrkirby wrote: Mehh, I think everyone should try to be around for the lynch times. It can only ever help. I'll keep an eye to see if anyone else jumps in before 10 and something crazy happens.I would say swing the vote, but jarjar already has 5 votes and there aren't 5 active guys here. And the next voted guy is targe, who I have a null read on. Since you appear to be leaving us as of now in about an hour jarjar, can you give us any reads that you haven't mentioned or insights? | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 06 2013 10:40 JarJarDrinks wrote: Well it really depends on the timing for me. Before you started defending yourself I probably would have said you were both lower on my radar but you more than him. Now that you've done some explaining, I'd say him, but the fact that this has turned into a "switch to the guy who has said goodnight" instead of someone like vayne makes me much more reluctant to switch. Do you think I'm scummier then him though? That's really all that matters right now. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
@jampi - I see you asking a lot of questions of other people but I'm not as clear on your reads. You've said there are a lot of scummy people running around so who's bugging you the most? | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
@shirokami - I think shiro has flown under the radar for way too long now and a couple people have noticed but I'd like to draw more attention to his play. He stalled for a long time at the beginning of the game and promised a big analysis, and a very small post was what resulted: On May 06 2013 03:53 shirokami wrote: Really, this is all you have to say after you claim loving to go through filters and implying you're going to do a ton of analysis? You've made the most one-liners by far and have only given one read for the entire game, which was on vayne being scummy. I think you're a contender for having contributed the least as far as content goes and I don't like that you've gone back to very short, vague, contentless posts since your 'big analysis'.Im voting vayne for obvious scumslip: THERE ARE NO FRICKIN REASON TO NOT TELL YOU WHY SOMEONE IS SCUM IN A THREAD-ONLY GAME. It only looks bad and I think the reason in his vote against targe was because he has no reason. My logs are saying that targe is not scummy so thats it. I bet all my monnies that vayne flips scum. Also about people voting JarJar, I like how he roasted jampidampi but they are both null for me right now, but they are definitely not scumbuddies, because only pro-scum even DARE do that kind of moves and this is not a pro-game. scum don't like attention. Oh and people who sheep someone, Please say why. If you dont say why, thats useless and makes you look like a woolly babylonian. @Calgar Dude. you started the game with good discussion about LaL, but please contribute more, I want to see you post, because your filter is not fun. @everyone Feel free to ask anything. Where are your reads? When have scum hunted? It doesn't seem like you're contributing at all to the thread. @targe - You had good logic D1 in advising against the policy lynch and hydra has been much more active than the last guy. I'm looking forward to seeing your promised response and I'll sheep vayne in saying that it is scummy that you mention jamp being town and regretting the lynch. @sugarfluff - I guess it's fair to say I've tunneled you but you really haven't given me any reason to stop. Part of the reason I have been is to prompt you to talk more. Instead you've ignored my questions to date and that adds to my feeling of unease about you. I also really dislike your case for some of the same reasons spicydinosaur does. It seems like you've made a lot of stretches and built it on poor premises. You've factored prominently a connection (or lack therof) between me and kirby, but I fail to see the relevance here. You mention that we haven't really interacted, but naturally I'm not going to be able to interact with everyone substantially or at all in the first few days. I haven't really had much to say to several other players such as spicy and shirokami - why no case built between us then? Even if we were both mafia, we might decide to interact a whole lot. You've imagined this master plan that we have where we plan when to interact and that just doesn't make any sense to me - you can build a 'case' on anyone based on this strategy. So yeah, give me a reason to back off and I will. Until then I really don't like your play at all, and I'm surprised more people haven't been on your case for it. Are you ever going to respond to my questions? @nobody - You've been quite active and shown good logic so far. I'm feeling town on you although I didn't like your "fuck bad lynch" and "i'm lost now" posts as a reaction to the lynch. They seemed overly emotional/a little fake but whatever, maybe that's just me. @casey - I'll agree that he looks bad now. I think his posting started very weak but he seems to be improving some and making more of an effort to push his reads. I have a null read and I'm very hesitant here because in my last game there was a very similar player who I (as town) tried to push as a lynch candidate most of the game, and he ended up town. While I realize that past games have no direct relevance, I see a lot of similarities in play so that's how I'm personally inclined to lean now. I'm on the fence between bad towny play and scummy play. Definitely would like to see him explain his thoughts more thoroughly push reads. I can see either targe or casey being scum but I have my doubts as to whether they both are. vayne mentions about a red herring and I agree with him. On May 08 2013 01:59 VayneAuthority wrote: I feel that there is potential for the night kill victim's reads to be used to help pave the wave for a mislynch. Another reason that I have my doubts about them both being scum is that my potential scum team right now is looking like sugarfluff, shirokami, and one other.Jampi suspected both Targe and Espi.casey before he died, so we have to wonder if this a red herring or are these 2 really mafia? it's hard to tell. Targe was on the Jarjar lynch since the beginning, while espi jumped to it last second. This could be Targe being a sneaky mafia and carefully leading a wrong lynch, or it simply could be a townie that got a wrong read. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 08 2013 05:12 Sugarfluff wrote: As far as I'm concerned, shirokami's filter is the one that is frekishly devoid of actual content right now. Why aren't you more concerned about him as a lurker than jrkirby? shiro has given vague excuses and one read all game, way less than kirby has done. If I had briefly mentioned kirby initially instead of shiro, would you be suspicious of us two instead? As far as me "completely skip"ing kirby, you're just as guilty of completely skipping over casey and shiro.Picked consciously as in he was very anti lurking/bad content posts and he brings that up but completely skips jrkirbys, whos big post doesn't come until later at which point Calgars reaction is nothing more than asking a short question to this lurker who up until that post has done nothing (I had not done much, but kirbys filter at that point is freakishly devoid of actual content). | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 08 2013 10:22 shirokami wrote: Really shiro?! Are you us kidding here? You started the game saying you wouldn't be able to post temporarily but promised you would provide some solid analysis when you got back to your computer. What you produce is null-reads on two? people and one very short scumread on vayne. All I see is a pattern of stall tactics promising future content and no delivery.Im going to catch up in 12 hours or so. I still want to lynch vayne tho. On May 04 2013 21:25 shirokami wrote: Zero reasons to lurk in a thread-only game you say, so why exactly are you lurking? For now you've earned my vote for the aforementioned reasons.Yo yo. So about the LAL. It's good for the reason that there are zero reasons to lurk in a thread-only game. Also I will only have my phone until tomorrow, so my posts today may lack some. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 08 2013 19:12 AllHailHydraGod wrote: As far as I know, a lurker lynch policy is a common place to begin D1 discussion. I don't really see how you could read that one way or another as a result. It quickly transitions from the 'hi i'm xx, not much to talk about..." to something of substance, which can only be a good thing.Just wanted to post my thoughts on Calgar after reading his filter. but then I saw this. Calgar, seems unaffected by me having a townread on some people and him not being among them. I also don't like how he chose to steer discussion towards a lurker lynch policy so early on (first post of the game). I feel like as a townie you'd want to see how people introduce themselves and what they choose to start talking about because that gives more info than if they agree on policy lynching lurkers or not. I feel like he shut a very important opportunity for reading players by doing that so early and practically inviting scum to post about a rather easy topic, or better yet ask others to post about it to seem implicated, like nobodywonders did Spicy for example. Let me get this straight - you're suggesting I stifled discussion by suggesting a topic of conversation? How is that possible because it seems to be a direct contradiction. I see it as giving people something to talk about and voice their opinion on. At the very least it shows that someone either ignores the topic if they don't reply to it. If they do, you get their opinions and more posting as a result. I don't see how I'm "practically inviting" active lurking, either, and even if it were to occur then they could be called out for doing so. As in something of substance to be analyzed. I think you're demonstrating poor logic here. So upon reading his filter I think a Calgar, nobodywonders, Targe scumteam is possible, meaning that he might be satisfied with my initial attempt at a read of a pool of townie looking players because his two scumbuddies are in that pool. And I've said that it's a superficial read so I figure maybe that's why he doesn't ask me anything about it. You've just pulled a 'sugarfluff' here and concocted a theory about my true motivations without basing it on anything. You're putting words in my mouth here. I think your case is a weak read with questionable logic because of the aforementioned reasons so I don't really have anything to further ask about.@sugarfluff On May 08 2013 19:56 Sugarfluff wrote: Well kirby has been gone for basically 2 days now so he's basically lurking as hard as shiro is, except he was more useful before and had a decent post speculating on a team. I think I read town because I understand how he was bothered by the late bandwagon switch. Switching to no lynch was a weird way to go about it but I think the meta from their previous games may have affected his views in a way which looks odd to us. Having said that, I don't really understand why he has disappeared for so long and I don't really see scum disappearing for 2 straight days, though who knows with WIFOM and all. So I'll say slight town but very confused as to why he has vanished.Casey hasn't been that bad, although I don't have townread on him either. Shiros filter is indeed a very sad thing, and his continued delays are getting more and more suspicious. But people were already pointing out his lurking and voicing suspicions about it. I wanted to hear kirby speak up, and I wanted to see how you'd react. Quite frankly I thought you reacted poorly, but reading through my posts I realized that I never outright asked you, what do you think of kirby? You still have not given an opinion on him. | ||
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calgar
United States1277 Posts
On May 09 2013 07:04 AllHailHydraGod wrote: I honestly think it can help. The way it helps though is if everyone agrees and then backs it up which didn't happen here. So in this case I'll agree with you that it was useless, but I think it has potential if used correctly. We've got a lot of lurkers running around and because it's clear they aren't going to be lynched there's no reason to ever stop. That's what its supposed to do, and how it can help town, by stopping play like kirby disappearing for 2 days and shiro apparently trolling like this. @calgar It might be just me but I don't consider talking about lurker lynch policy useful at all. If I was mafia I'd be glad to have something like this to talk about because there's no way I'd give myself away, blending in is just too easy. So I'm not exactly sure why you think that you needed to force discussion on such a topic, it looks like you honestly think that it helps town so either you're townie who just doesn't think like me or you're scum. If someone ignores the topic or not what does that tell you about them? I just don't see any way how you could interpret any reaction or input on the matter with regard to alignment, so in my view it's a surrogate for any real discussion. Even the lack of a clear theme for discussion would've been better than this one, because it would've kept scum (and I'm not implying you're not scum, on a contrary) guessing about what to talk about, because not talking about anything would make them look bad. If you did want to start something a RVS for example would've been way better. | ||
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