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Are corsairs viable in a PvT build or are they only useful as a surprise/weirdo build?
the only time i have seen them is in the OSL Ro16 in a  Pusan vs gogo in a game where they were already blocked from advancing, but the corsairs
A) blocked dropship use (useful on maps like outsider and el nino)
B) Disruption Web on tanks can severely limit their use
my argument for why these could be used is that since in most PvT games heavy arbiter use is what is being used but stasis field is limited because as seen in many games most notably best vs  Flash when so many tanks are in stasis it is hard to kill them after they are out and they can be rescued and put to use again
however if disruption web is used for some of the tanks they can be killed with goons no prob and then only half the number of tanks remain to be killed/stasised
basically even though the arbitrer production would be slowed by corsairs the corsairs using their own energy would allow the lower number of arbs to do even more damage as well as leaving possibly even enough energy for recalls
in addition this would mean science vessels would be under attack by the corsairs harassing the Terran even more
but as always this is pure theorycrafting please comment especially those who know Protoss build orders and can add intelligence to this topic
also i dont know why gogo and best did not TLPDise sorry maybe someone can PM me and tell me why 
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theyre not used cos fleet beacon is fucking expensive, you need research, and you need the actual corsair. wtf use is a corsair when a terran army is shelling your natural expansion? you cast a web and then the terran lols and moves his tanks 3 matrixes to the right and its useless. theyre a joke in pvt
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On January 27 2010 21:36 lazz wrote:
theyre not used cos fleet beacon is fucking expensive, you need research, and you need the actual corsair. wtf use is a corsair when a terran army is shelling your natural expansion? you cast a web and then the terran lols and moves his tanks 3 matrixes to the right and its useless. theyre a joke in pvt
Do you know how much it annoys me to unsiege tanks, move them and siege them again? So many ways to get slaughtered while doing that.
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Corsairs are not viable in PvT.
If you don't belive me try using them with someone in your skill range. (above D-)
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On January 27 2010 21:43 disco wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2010 21:36 lazz wrote:
theyre not used cos fleet beacon is fucking expensive, you need research, and you need the actual corsair. wtf use is a corsair when a terran army is shelling your natural expansion? you cast a web and then the terran lols and moves his tanks 3 matrixes to the right and its useless. theyre a joke in pvt Do you know how much it annoys me to unsiege tanks, move them and siege them again? So many ways to get slaughtered while doing that.
Yes, that's all they are, an annoyance. there is no danger of being "slaughtered" if the protoss user has built corsairs. by building corsairs it means hes missing about 20 supply worth of units because resources have been spent in the fleet beacon sairs stargate(s) research etc. instead
fleet beacon : 300m/200g
stargate: 150/150
corsair: 150/100 each
web research: 150/100
say you build 5 corsairs off of one stargate. that's 1350 minerals and 950 gas. Fuck that. Id rather have 6 zealots 6 goons and gas left over for actually useful tech (arbiter/carrier/templar)
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also its very useful to have more energy as a fully energised sair can put down 2 webs.
So add to the cost analysis the argus jewel 100 min 100 gas.
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What you need is to build the fleet bacon really early - so you can have 125 in energy when its needed. This can mean that you wont have observers when you want them and observers is a must in pvt due to mines which can just crush your army like one big tsunami.
I would say the biggest no-go to corsairs is that it can screw up the observer timing.
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Also in the "try your ideas..." thread made by random korean or something, there he made a corsair build in a pvt and he won with it.
useful link (project 2):
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=108490
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I've won with this build before. It's more micro intensive and I haven't tested it but if your on 3 bases u could probably support storm as well with this build which would be incredible. This build is viable, just not used most likely due to cost effectiveness, the extra amount of micro required, and later tech.
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It can work in the early-midgame, but you have to deny the Terran scouting it or else he'll just add 8 gols to his army and your 'Sairs will instantly die. If he scans your Fleet Beacon, he will assume Carriers most likely and add Goliaths to his army anyways.
Generally speaking, it's a weaker alternative to the other tech options the Protoss has (at the time they would be viable). As mentioned, you need things like Observers and eventually some kind of 'real' air tech like Arbs or Carriers.
Pre-nerf D-web made it a lot more usable, but today's version is too short duration to be of much use, especially if the Terran is patient and micros his army well.
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Aotearoa39261 Posts
It's a fun build imo, it has its moments and can catch unsuspecting terrans off guard. Steve and GTR should have some more reps of corsair vs terran (since i played them with it). Here are two games anyway
http://www.teamliquid.net/staff/Plexa/corsair.rar
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United Arab Emirates5090 Posts
its a fun build, thats about it. not viable in competitive play
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Its not viable because u will be down by 30 supply and average skilled terran will know it. He'll just carry on building tanks and vults and move forward without sieging. Not to mention an early push will kill u. When they scan stargates they will push.
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Why would they delay observers? Thats like saying hey, you shouldnt go arbiters, because that delays observers.
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I'm all for protoss to stop using arbiters for more observers.
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On January 28 2010 01:29 Catch]22 wrote:
Why would they delay observers? Thats like saying hey, you shouldnt go arbiters, because that delays observers.
I guess it doesn't have too, but it's a tech you'd really want to rush to make the most of. It's really gas heavy and takes a long time to build, so unless you're on 3 bases (which imo it's too late, you would have been scouted)- I can't see how you afford both Obs and Corsairs + tech.
For example when I go DT rush into 2 base Arbiter, my obs come out wayyyyyyyyyyy later than any standard build. I would imagine it's the same kind of thing, just a different tech tree.
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Once the lockdown revolution comes, this will be a suitable counter strat. You heard it here first!
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If you are ahead i have to say that even with the use of all those minerals, they become very useful as stasis just stops their army while Web forces them to micro instead of macro to try and dance between webs to do damage in which your army is stronger. If you are not ahead of the terran in minerals, dont do it. But also getting corsairs is with D web is a good excuse to transition into carrier late game. So let's say that your first four dragoons really delay their nat, and you are ahead by a minute or two.... a corsair might e pretty viable here because you are so ahead. Also corsairs can be used to take down buildings like barracks and e bays that extend vision for tanks. They also move pretty fast making them fairly good against Science vessels because they can catchup. The Corsairs are not necessary, but using them can be a huge advantage and a surprise because they are not used so much. But do keep in mind that Web costs 100 energy. An EMP would be deadly...although EMP is deadly to just about every protoss unit. I geuss corsairs when out of energy can also be used as tanks for turrets while sneaking your arbiter in.
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One plus with corsair that I don't think anyone mentioned is that they're not bad at dealing with vessels. They also make great scouts for places your obs are not already at. I guess my point is that it's not JUST d-web. In fact, the d-web costs 125 mp, so you'd have to have quite a few corsair and rotate their use for their d web to be effective more than once or twice in a game.
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I won vs some b- who was using sair/goon. That should say enough
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On January 28 2010 02:09 Sgt.StOiC wrote:
One plus with corsair that I don't think anyone mentioned is that they're not bad at dealing with vessels. They also make great scouts for places your obs are not already at. I guess my point is that it's not JUST d-web. In fact, the d-web costs 125 mp, so you'd have to have quite a few corsair and rotate their use for their d web to be effective more than once or twice in a game.
i did mention about Sci vessels....... sorry if it was a bit long to read =D
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First of all, they are a hella lot of fun to use. I've been using them from time to time in up to D+ level PvT, and you dont even have to be that superior a player to pull it off. (but you sure feel like one after a d-web pushbreak^^)
But I have to think on decent play levels they might only be good for one han-bang-ish surprise timing attack, otherwise you're better off teching to arbs with the same resources and time. (the fleet beacon and web research are pretty costly, and you need to invest into several sairs, actually probably even into energy upgrade if you're serious about it.)
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EPT
