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On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea.  just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic.
yeah I'm so confused right now. I've been bitchslapped left and right. People called my case on sandroba retarded and I think I was the first one who said he might be scum although I was not the first who did the job to build a case although I think my case is the best :3
And now out of nowhere protact wants to lynch sandroba and BC / foolish follow him? I have no idea what's going on.
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On January 21 2012 05:10 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 04:41 Protactinium wrote:On January 21 2012 04:35 p4NDemik wrote:
Proact I trust your judgment based upon your actions so far this game, why is supersoft a non-sensical lynch? I have already kept an open mind and told myself I would switch (most likely to kingjames if someone could really convince me I am in error) but I have seen some of the most respected TL mafia players step to the plate in you and BC and do nothing to dissuade me. Please tell me where I have gone wrong and why this vote wouldn't be extremely beneficial to town. No time to think about it, but supersoft is CURRENTLY nonsensical. Lets lynch sandroba first. I'll look over it later when I have time although I do recall supersoft being quite useless this game. The thing is, there's no reason to deviate from my list right now. We'll take care of the rest later. Lets just consolidate our votes. This day seems to have produced some interesting information. But right now is the time to lynch, not the time to insist on getting information. I'll sort through all this later if I'm not dead by that time. I am taking your judgement on this. The only reason I am ok with lynching sandroba is because of a comparison of this game and two others he has been in. First off everyone look at sandros filter from this game. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=253716&user=21688Now compare it to a game he was town which was Mafia XLVII http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=285690&user=21688and a game he was mafia which is pick your power interesting http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=269956&user=21688The level he has contributed this game is near non existent and aside from being slightly active day 1 he has fucked the dog completely. Much like he did in pick your power interesting. As such I am opting to lynch him over BM. This is because the general read on BM is hard as hell. BM is always hard to read and could very well be a hatter. With that in mind, I don't want to lose protrac and will opt to off sandroba instead as to keep one of the core analyzer alive longer.
I was in PYPI, it had PM's so everybody's filter is worse than it could have been.
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On January 21 2012 05:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea. just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic. his day 1 play had me convinced he was town. I had to read his filter from this game and compare it to a known scum him and a known town -_- His scum habit seems to be "solidify a townie read" day 1 then do near nothing to avoid being offed.
quick question: Why did sandroba vote you d1 to be mayor?
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Ok, Im over it. 
Everyone that is voting BM should switch to Sandroba. We Double lynch scum today!
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I'm going with KJ as my second vote. BC has really put himself out there on this one and he's done so in what I feel is a protown manner. Like his whole mason discussion, he's not shying away from the spotlight and he correctly pointed out he's going to be under intense scrutiny if KJ flips town.
Besides these somewhat ethereal reasons, BC's case on KJ is good and KJ's defense of himself and his choice of lynch target I feel are scummy. At the time KJ went after p4ndemik I felt like it was a scum motivated move because p4n hadn't done much and would not be a controversial lynch target. P4ndemik started posting more and while I haven't noticed supersoft as an obviscum, p4n's case was made in a town fashion which makes KJ's choice of him as someone who's "scummy" even worse.
Also BC, did you find my posts defending protact/sandroba or do you want me to c/p them for you?
A word on BM, like I said earlier, I don't think he's a good lynch for today. L's accusations felt too genuine. I also don't want to run the risk of losing protact if BM really is telling the truth about being a hatter.
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On January 21 2012 05:28 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea. just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic. his day 1 play had me convinced he was town. I had to read his filter from this game and compare it to a known scum him and a known town -_- His scum habit seems to be "solidify a townie read" day 1 then do near nothing to avoid being offed. quick question: Why did sandroba vote you d1 to be mayor?
How is he supposed to know? Ask Sandroba...
This is why it's hard to 'gain traction' with whatever lynches you have going, every 5 posts someone asks the leading townies a question and puts their decisions back into the spotlight.
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United States13896 Posts
On January 21 2012 05:20 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:15 p4NDemik wrote:
I'm going to have to agree to disagree with your view of the game in that respect Proact, Foolish, and BC.
I stand firm that my logic is solid and that it can carry weight, and most importantly that a supersoft lynch looks to get a red as well as a sure tell on our mayor which is valuable. Join me town.
##vote Bill Murray and ##vote supersoft I can respect that but at least vote for kingjames instead of Bill Murray lol
You have my ear, but I'm not sure I'm exactly following. I don't have any familiarity with BM's style of play but his defense is so absurd I cannot see why it is better to vote kingjames over him. kingjames has been overzealous and has been attacking me based on absurd arguments but I still feel BM is the better lynch. I've been trying hard not to come down on him simply because he is so critical of me and that is why I haven't voted for him over the other two yet but maybe I'm overcompensating and he deserves it more than BM. What's the argument for kingjames > BM?
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On January 21 2012 04:53 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 04:50 p4NDemik wrote:
God why do I feel there is a gigantic disconnect in logic between me and the supposedly brilliant players that have gotten us to this point in the game. The fact they keep going to their inner circle of veterans to bolster themselves and not ever speaking to my actual points is killing me. If this means what I think it means it could be incredible but I need town to go with my logic please guys! I feel like I'm putting good logic out and being met with strict rhetoric at every end. Look at the one post I quoted and explain to me why a mafia would make that post; what motivation he would have for doing such a thing. There's disconnect between us as well. I don't think sandroba is a good lynch but BC and Protact like it so I'm going with it. I think Blahz0r is obvious mafia but I'm the only person in the game. We don't agree on everything either but our direction is the same, and that's what is important for a large game like this.
How are you guys all talking to each other?
And what direction are you heading in?
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On January 21 2012 05:28 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea. just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic. his day 1 play had me convinced he was town. I had to read his filter from this game and compare it to a known scum him and a known town -_- His scum habit seems to be "solidify a townie read" day 1 then do near nothing to avoid being offed. quick question: Why did sandroba vote you d1 to be mayor?
He "voted" for me d1. His vote never actually counted. However to appear townie at least me, he would have to have. He was never confrontational in PMs and the only other candidate he openly like was protract but he didnt like that he was going to lynch me as his d1 choice (this later changed by sandro was inactive the rest of that voting period).
Based on the fact he liked my campaign more than protracts based on lynch choice would be why I believe he "voted" for me.
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On January 21 2012 05:31 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:28 Toadesstern wrote:On January 21 2012 05:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea. just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic. his day 1 play had me convinced he was town. I had to read his filter from this game and compare it to a known scum him and a known town -_- His scum habit seems to be "solidify a townie read" day 1 then do near nothing to avoid being offed. quick question: Why did sandroba vote you d1 to be mayor? How is he supposed to know? Ask Sandroba... This is why it's hard to 'gain traction' with whatever lynches you have going, every 5 posts someone asks the leading townies a question and puts their decisions back into the spotlight.
yeah but I'd like to hear bc's opinion on that one. We discussed the post I am referring to a lot and a lot of people said I'm scummy because of that. That's what I'm talking about:
On January 15 2012 06:05 sandroba wrote:
Palmar you need to try harder, you are too easy to spot as scum nowadays. I'd rather not lynch any vets day1 but you make it so hard not to lynch you. Please go die in a corner.
I'll vote BC since we came to a compromise in pms. Gotta roll.
##Vote: BloodyC0bbler
I'd just like to know if BC thinks sandroba will vote a town mayor (as a mafia) just to get palmar lynched when supersoft and wbg already did the half the job. If he's a townie and thinks sandroba would push for a mafia mayor there's no way BC should vote sandroba over BC unless both BC and BM are town.
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On January 21 2012 05:30 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
I'm going with KJ as my second vote. BC has really put himself out there on this one and he's done so in what I feel is a protown manner. Like his whole mason discussion, he's not shying away from the spotlight and he correctly pointed out he's going to be under intense scrutiny if KJ flips town.
Besides these somewhat ethereal reasons, BC's case on KJ is good and KJ's defense of himself and his choice of lynch target I feel are scummy. At the time KJ went after p4ndemik I felt like it was a scum motivated move because p4n hadn't done much and would not be a controversial lynch target. P4ndemik started posting more and while I haven't noticed supersoft as an obviscum, p4n's case was made in a town fashion which makes KJ's choice of him as someone who's "scummy" even worse.
Also BC, did you find my posts defending protact/sandroba or do you want me to c/p them for you?
A word on BM, like I said earlier, I don't think he's a good lynch for today. L's accusations felt too genuine. I also don't want to run the risk of losing protact if BM really is telling the truth about being a hatter.
I found them. I find they are slightly misrepresented in the way you talk about them as they were not a huge push you made, however you did have them so my major issue with you is at the moment cleared up.
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On January 21 2012 05:32 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 04:53 Foolishness wrote:On January 21 2012 04:50 p4NDemik wrote:
God why do I feel there is a gigantic disconnect in logic between me and the supposedly brilliant players that have gotten us to this point in the game. The fact they keep going to their inner circle of veterans to bolster themselves and not ever speaking to my actual points is killing me. If this means what I think it means it could be incredible but I need town to go with my logic please guys! I feel like I'm putting good logic out and being met with strict rhetoric at every end. Look at the one post I quoted and explain to me why a mafia would make that post; what motivation he would have for doing such a thing. There's disconnect between us as well. I don't think sandroba is a good lynch but BC and Protact like it so I'm going with it. I think Blahz0r is obvious mafia but I'm the only person in the game. We don't agree on everything either but our direction is the same, and that's what is important for a large game like this. How are you guys all talking to each other? And what direction are you heading in?
I'm a mason? The advantages are I can talk to different people every day -_-
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United States13896 Posts
This is so messed up you three have invested all day into BM and Kingjames. I've been like 95-99% sure on these lynches for hours upon hours and now you guys are randomly switching your vote to sandroba.
Whatever trust and goodwill you have been building up, it is quickly evaporating. You need to explain this.
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On January 21 2012 05:34 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:31 Cyber_Cheese wrote:On January 21 2012 05:28 Toadesstern wrote:On January 21 2012 05:24 BloodyC0bbler wrote:On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea. just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic. his day 1 play had me convinced he was town. I had to read his filter from this game and compare it to a known scum him and a known town -_- His scum habit seems to be "solidify a townie read" day 1 then do near nothing to avoid being offed. quick question: Why did sandroba vote you d1 to be mayor? How is he supposed to know? Ask Sandroba... This is why it's hard to 'gain traction' with whatever lynches you have going, every 5 posts someone asks the leading townies a question and puts their decisions back into the spotlight. yeah but I'd like to hear bc's opinion on that one. We discussed the post I am referring to a lot and a lot of people said I'm scummy because of that. That's what I'm talking about: Show nested quote +On January 15 2012 06:05 sandroba wrote:
Palmar you need to try harder, you are too easy to spot as scum nowadays. I'd rather not lynch any vets day1 but you make it so hard not to lynch you. Please go die in a corner.
I'll vote BC since we came to a compromise in pms. Gotta roll.
##Vote: BloodyC0bbler I'd just like to know if BC thinks sandroba will vote a town mayor (as a mafia) just to get palmar lynched when supersoft and wbg already did the half the job. If he's a townie and thinks sandroba would push for a mafia mayor there's no way BC should vote sandroba over BC unless both BC and BM are town.
Derp, I forgot about the day 1 mason :/
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
On January 21 2012 05:32 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 04:53 Foolishness wrote:On January 21 2012 04:50 p4NDemik wrote:
God why do I feel there is a gigantic disconnect in logic between me and the supposedly brilliant players that have gotten us to this point in the game. The fact they keep going to their inner circle of veterans to bolster themselves and not ever speaking to my actual points is killing me. If this means what I think it means it could be incredible but I need town to go with my logic please guys! I feel like I'm putting good logic out and being met with strict rhetoric at every end. Look at the one post I quoted and explain to me why a mafia would make that post; what motivation he would have for doing such a thing. There's disconnect between us as well. I don't think sandroba is a good lynch but BC and Protact like it so I'm going with it. I think Blahz0r is obvious mafia but I'm the only person in the game. We don't agree on everything either but our direction is the same, and that's what is important for a large game like this. How are you guys all talking to each other? And what direction are you heading in?
the thread?
It's about lynching the people with the common themes. Apathetic behavior while exhibiting interest in the town, purposely dodging lynch candidates (who turn up to be mafia), etc. The three of us have come to the same conclusion about most players, and the fact that we've nailed 3 mafia (and mostly independently too) should show that we are on the right track (clearly the votes don't indicate that though).
The three of us all realize this, hence it's easy for us to tell what each other is thinking just by reading posts.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
On January 21 2012 05:36 p4NDemik wrote:
This is so messed up you three have invested all day into BM and Kingjames. I've been like 95-99% sure on these lynches for hours upon hours and now you guys are randomly switching your vote to sandroba.
Whatever trust and goodwill you have been building up, it is quickly evaporating. You need to explain this.
Well I'm sorry that we don't want Incog to die when he has caught 3 mafia already. Do ya blame me?
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On January 21 2012 05:26 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea. just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic. yeah I'm so confused right now. I've been bitchslapped left and right. People called my case on sandroba retarded and I think I was the first one who said he might be scum although I was not the first who did the job to build a case although I think my case is the best :3 And now out of nowhere protact wants to lynch sandroba and BC / foolish follow him? I have no idea what's going on.
I'm gonna take this post as a good opportunity to talk about sandroba as well.
So I defended him a lot yesterday. I felt like he was an extremely poor lynch choice especially with the other options at hand (GGQ  ). People like Toad who were pushing for sand's death (yes toad I know you're not the only one) did not have a very strong case (I felt) and it seemed to me like scum trying to run a mislynch with protact/sandroba rather than the obviscum GGQ. Later in the day, there was a shift to macpo and the three previous candidates were largely forgotten. Now since macpo flipped red I can't fault this shift as scum.
Fast forward to today. The big three (protact/foolishness/BC) now think that sandroba is scum. Similarly they've exonerated GGQ. Quite frankly I'm baffled. There was one brief dismissive post made by foolishness(?) about how GGQ was cleared and that was never revisited. Meanwhile, the case made on sandroba is extremely unclear, at some point he just switches to being scum in their eyes. When I do see them make a case, like Toad said, it really just rehashes the stuff that was said yesterday. It's not like something new happened that made them think sandroba was scum, they just suddenly changed their mind.
So here's where I stand. I independantly was becoming suspicious of sandroba because of how he's lurked when the pressure was off of him. However the shift towards him by the three, seemingly without any new information, gave me pause. So I'd like to take this oppertunity to clear some things up
BC/Foolishness/Incog: Why is Sandroba scum? Why is GGQ not? Where along the line did these things change? You guys have collectively delivered three scum and that's great, but you can't fault me for being a little weary when your positions change seemingly out of the blue. I'm gonna echo P4ndemik a little here and I'm going to ask you to fully explain why you're thinking what you're thinking.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
On January 21 2012 05:43 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 05:26 Toadesstern wrote:On January 21 2012 05:21 hiro protagonist wrote:Hey BC, Protac, remember when I made this great post detailing why Sandro was scum? BC called me an idiot for wanting to lynch sand, and protac thought my case was weak at best? I could not get any traction for my case without you guys, and now BC paraphrases my exact points in regard to sandroba, and protac comes in like it was his idea. just... you know ... Its just a bit ironic. yeah I'm so confused right now. I've been bitchslapped left and right. People called my case on sandroba retarded and I think I was the first one who said he might be scum although I was not the first who did the job to build a case although I think my case is the best :3 And now out of nowhere protact wants to lynch sandroba and BC / foolish follow him? I have no idea what's going on. I'm gonna take this post as a good opportunity to talk about sandroba as well. So I defended him a lot yesterday. I felt like he was an extremely poor lynch choice especially with the other options at hand (GGQ ). People like Toad who were pushing for sand's death (yes toad I know you're not the only one) did not have a very strong case (I felt) and it seemed to me like scum trying to run a mislynch with protact/sandroba rather than the obviscum GGQ. Later in the day, there was a shift to macpo and the three previous candidates were largely forgotten. Now since macpo flipped red I can't fault this shift as scum. Fast forward to today. The big three (protact/foolishness/BC) now think that sandroba is scum. Similarly they've exonerated GGQ. Quite frankly I'm baffled. There was one brief dismissive post made by foolishness(?) about how GGQ was cleared and that was never revisited. Meanwhile, the case made on sandroba is extremely unclear, at some point he just switches to being scum in their eyes. When I do see them make a case, like Toad said, it really just rehashes the stuff that was said yesterday. It's not like something new happened that made them think sandroba was scum, they just suddenly changed their mind. So here's where I stand. I independantly was becoming suspicious of sandroba because of how he's lurked when the pressure was off of him. However the shift towards him by the three, seemingly without any new information, gave me pause. So I'd like to take this oppertunity to clear some things up BC/Foolishness/Incog: Why is Sandroba scum? Why is GGQ not? Where along the line did these things change? You guys have collectively delivered three scum and that's great, but you can't fault me for being a little weary when your positions change seemingly out of the blue. I'm gonna echo P4ndemik a little here and I'm going to ask you to fully explain why you're thinking what you're thinking.
It's more about choosing who's the best to lynch given the circumstances, and less about who has the highest/lowest chance to be mafia, if that makes any sense.
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On January 21 2012 05:36 p4NDemik wrote:
This is so messed up you three have invested all day into BM and Kingjames. I've been like 95-99% sure on these lynches for hours upon hours and now you guys are randomly switching your vote to sandroba.
Whatever trust and goodwill you have been building up, it is quickly evaporating. You need to explain this.
I think what is happening behind the seanes is that there seemed to be vary little in opposition to lynching BM, where as Kingjames01 still does not have many votes. Also, if your scum suspects are voting for BM, then you might rethink who would be the best lynch. I would be suspicious too, in your shoes, but for me, BC,Protac, and Foolishness reads are similar to my own, so its easy for me to except this.
Sandroba is today's best lynch along with Kingjames01.
Cyber_Cheese and Jackal, sense your here, wanna help lynch Sandroba?
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On January 21 2012 05:00 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On January 21 2012 02:46 Jitsu wrote:On January 20 2012 22:22 Jackal58 wrote:On January 20 2012 22:21 Jitsu wrote:
The reasoning behind asking for the bodyguard's was a choice that I weighed for awhile. In the end, I decided to go along with it. If on the off chance BM flips town I'd have no problem hanging you. On January 20 2012 22:41 Cyber_Cheese wrote:On January 20 2012 22:21 Jitsu wrote:
The reasoning behind asking for the bodyguard's was a choice that I weighed for awhile. In the end, I decided to go along with it. Wait, you specifically asked him to? If so, can you prove all logs between you two? Use logic, bro's. Yes, I asked him. There was reasoning behind it. Saying you want to hang me before even hearing any part of the idea is pretty stupid, I feel. On January 21 2012 02:13 glurio wrote:I didn't mason anyone on day 1, was busy reading the thread. Tried to mason with BC on day 2 he never answered. + Show Spoiler +To: BloodyC0bbler [ Profile | Buddy | Report ]
Subject: Mason
Date: 1/17/12 19:31
Hey so what do you think is our best course of action right now? So there really isn't anything i can post yet. Did anyone else think "Mafia Mason" at this post? So why did you not provide the reasoning yet exactly? If it was good reasoning, you would have shared it by now.
Ok.
Initially, BC and BM would be the only two people to know the identities of the Bodyguards. If the Mafia had replaced both Bodyguard's and killed BC and BM in the same night, the identities of the two Mafia Bodyguard's would remain a secret, and it would have died with our Mayor/Sheriff.
I asked to have the names of the Bodyguard's revealed to me so that, if that were the case, I would be able to identify the names of the two mafia bodyguards, essentially trading two-for-two. At the same token, it would be fairly obvious to deduce if I were mafia, since, more than likely, the Bodyguard's would be killed the following nights, and BM would be able to identify me, as well as have evidence to that fact. I would be pretty screwed.
I was hoping to keep this fact under wraps, so that I wouldn't be targeted for having extra knowledge, and would be able to bring it out as a simple back-up if the whole chain of events worked in order.
I think the benefit's out-weighed the negatives. Also, I thought it would be effective since I wouldn't be known to the general group to have this special knowledge, since this was done in means beyond the thread. Obviously, this isn't the case anymore.
Can we end the bullshit now?
Foolishness, you are here. I think BC agrees with me. What do you think of Glurio?
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