1 GK Iker Casillas (c) - Real Madrid 2 DF Raúl Albiol - Madrid 3 DF Gerard Piqué - Barcelona 4 MF Javi Martínez - Athletic Bilbao 5 DF Juanfran Torres - Atlético Madrid 6 MF Andrés Iniesta - Barcelona 7 FW Pedro Rodríguez - Barcelona 8 MF Xavi Hernández - Barcelona 9 FW Fernando Torres - Chelsea 10 MF Cesc Fàbregas - Barcelona 11 FW Álvaro Negredo - Sevilla 12 GK Víctor Valdés - Barcelona 13 MF Juan Mata - Chelsea 14 MF Xabi Alonso - Real Madrid 15 DF Sergio Ramos - Real Madrid 16 MF Sergio Busquets - Barcelona 17 DF Álvaro Arbeloa - Real Madrid 18 DF Jordi Alba - Valencia 19 FW Fernando Llorente - Athletic Bilbao 20 MF Santi Cazorla - Málaga 21 MF David Silva - Manchester City 22 MF Jesús Navas - Sevilla 23 GK Pepe Reina - Liverpool
Coach: Vicente del Bosque Vicente del Bosque named a squad to play in a set of warm-up matches on 15 May 2012, but it did not include any Barcelona, Athletic Bilbao, or Chelsea players as the two Spanish sides were preparing for the Copa del Rey final on 25 May, while Chelsea were to take on Bayern Munich in the Champions League final on 19 May. On 21 May 2012, del Bosque called-up Chelsea players Fernando Torres and Juan Mata for the friendly matches. On 27 May, del Bosque gave the final squad list, complete with Barcelona and Athletic Bilbao players.
1 GK Gianluigi Buffon (c) - Juventus 2 DF Christian Maggio - Napoli 3 DF Giorgio Chiellini - Juventus 4 DF Angelo Ogbonna - Torino 5 MF Thiago Motta - Paris Saint-Germain 6 DF Federico Balzaretti - Palermo 7 DF Ignazio Abate - Milan 8 MF Claudio Marchisio - Juventus 9 FW Mario Balotelli - Manchester City 10 FW Antonio Cassano - Milan 11 FW Antonio Di Natale - Udinese 12 GK Salvatore Sirigu - Paris Saint-Germain 13 MF Emanuele Giaccherini - Juventus 14 GK Morgan De Sanctis - Napoli 15 DF Andrea Barzagli - Juventus 16 MF Daniele De Rossi - Roma 17 FW Fabio Borini - Roma 18 MF Riccardo Montolivo - Fiorentina 19 DF Leonardo Bonucci - Juventus 20 FW Sebastian Giovinco - Parma 21 MF Andrea Pirlo - Juventus 22 MF Alessandro Diamanti - Bologna 23 MF Antonio Nocerino - Milan
Coach: Cesare Prandelli Cesare Prandelli named a provisional 32-man squad on 13 May 2012, the final day of the 2011–12 Serie A season. On 29 May 2012, Prandelli announced his final squad list, with defender Domenico Criscito not considered due to match-fixing charges.
Italy's Chiellini is a major doubt for this game with a hamstring injury and Bonucci looks set to deputise.
So hard to predict this game , too many loose factors like balotely and spains ability to actually score. I think it will come to who and what strategy delbosce decides to play. If balotely plays as good as in the semi vs germany , i'd go with italy.
Also this is the first time i actually like italy's playstyle. The old generation brought new measurements to the turtle style.
As much as I love seeing Fabregas play, Spain really need an out-and-out striker. I also hope Del Bosque considers using Pedro on the left and putting Iniesta back in the middle, dropping Alonso. He's a great player and all, but what he does is pretty much already covered by Xavi and Busquets. I get why Del Bosque would want some extra presence & defence in the middle of the park, but that can also hurt you going forward.
Anyways, I'm just hoping for a good game. It would be a shame to see this end in penalties.
Anyways, I'm just hoping for a good game. It would be a shame to see this end in penalties.
I'm hoping for something like that
Greek cup final 3 years ago, Olympiakos vs Aek, 3-3 in 90mins, 4-4 in 120mins with a ridiculous amount of penalties and to top it all off, nikopolidis saved the last(well duh) penalty and then scored himself to win it all. Now if only I could decide who to support today, Q_Q.
Having a Portuguese ref seems like it would be a conflict of interest considering Spain knocked Portugal out in the semis. I'm not saying bias will be a factor, but it appears to be an odd choice. In any case, I think Spain has got this in the bag. I'll put my vote in for a clean Spanish victory, 2-0.
This is going to be really awesome, if both teams go out and go for the win the game is going to be amazing, as long as Italy doesn't stay and defend, it's gonna be awesome.
On July 01 2012 12:01 Teence wrote: Having a Portuguese ref seems like it would be a conflict of interest considering Spain knocked Portugal out in the semis. I'm not saying bias will be a factor, but it appears to be an odd choice. In any case, I think Spain has got this in the bag. I'll put my vote in for a clean Spanish victory, 2-0.
Meh, I think balotelli got this, and I would rather have howard webb as the ref.
Italy knows how to play football without possessing the ball, that's a huge bonus when playing Spain, since they pretty much get the ball and never give it back, it's gonna be really interesting
I have to admit, Italy's play during this championship came as a pleasant surprise to me. I hope they get rewarded for their efforts and win the whole thing.
Criscito out as well as Chiellini will really hurt Italy. And I know and this is quite old, and no disrespect to Balotelli, but with Rossi the Azzurri might as well take the trophy home.
On July 01 2012 17:50 BlitzerSC wrote: So, I see that most of the people here on TL changed their opinions about Italy, huh ?
I just want to quote myself here from before the tournament:
On May 03 2012 19:33 Malaz wrote: I think it's funny how few people consider Italy a threat, they are a team that shines in big tournaments similar to Germany.
I even betted on Italy as champion because I don't bet on Germany and betting on Spain is boring. I'm such a football-hipster! :p
I want good football, Italy provided much more entertaining games than Spain at the moment so I'm rooting for them but Spain still can make me change my mind
I atually think that Italy will take this, they've been playing really well this whole tournament, and they play very entertaining offensive football imo. And on the other side, Spain need Villa, they dont have other players like him who can just score goals all the time, so I dont think that they'll score any goals against italy tbh.
So Italy it is, even though I'm cheering for Spain, since they play football the way that its supposed to be played.
On July 01 2012 21:45 sc4k wrote: Seeing as Spain already beat Italy, I'll go with SPain. Though I hate their football style I can't deny their dominance.
hehe, when did they beat them? the group match ended in a draw and the match itself was one of the better in the group stage if you ask me I think Italy will win it in 90 minutes 1-0
On July 01 2012 21:45 sc4k wrote: Seeing as Spain already beat Italy, I'll go with SPain. Though I hate their football style I can't deny their dominance.
hehe, when did they beat them? the group match ended in a draw and the match itself was one of the better in the group stage if you ask me I think Italy will win it in 90 minutes 1-0
Oops my mistake I thought it was a 1-0 for Spain. In that case I guess it makes sense to predict a 0-0 penalties, Spain win on penalties.
Italy ran out of gas in the last 10 min in their group game which led Spain to have 3 or 4 chances to win, all of which were wasted. Even though Spain is lacking the finishing touch, if Italy doesn't win in 90 min, I'd say Spain is favorable to win, even in penalties (Casillas is beast in penalties)
If Italy plays like they did against Germany I think they have a decent shot to take this. It will be very hard to score on Spain though. I'm guessing 1-1 after full time and then Spain wins in overtime/penalties.
On July 01 2012 22:24 don_kyuhote wrote: Italy ran out of gas in the last 10 min in their group game which led Spain to have 3 or 4 chances to win, all of which were wasted. Even though Spain is lacking the finishing touch, if Italy doesn't win in 90 min, I'd say Spain is favorable to win, even in penalties (Casillas is beast in penalties)
I'd say that unless they are like 2-0 or 3-0 min 70, Spain got this. So much deep in the bench compared to Italy.
On July 01 2012 22:46 nam nam wrote: If Italy plays like they did against Germany I think they have a decent shot to take this. It will be very hard to score on Spain though. I'm guessing 1-1 after full time and then Spain wins in overtime/penalties.
If both play at full potential (which is impossible) there is no way Italy beats Spain, in this decade. However some players have played like 80+ games so far, it will come down to which team is more tired or manages better the nerves.
On July 01 2012 22:55 -Kato- wrote: Why are people hating on 4-6-0? Its not like Spain has a choice.
Wat
They have Torres (haters gonna hate) and Llorente as strikers. Both could be complimented by competent wingers (Navas, Cazorla, Pedro). Play one of Alonso and Busquets, preferably Alonso, and Iniesta as well as Xavi or Silva.
They absolutely have the ability to play with at least one striker (lol Negredo last game), but choose their possession based 4-6-0. It's not bad, per se, it's just really fucking boring to watch (imo, obviously).
I think biggest problem is playing with two defensive midfielders:
I would love to see this setup (and maybe even substitute Xavi since he has been bad this EC, but perhaps its because of the 2 DM)
Goalie: Casillas
Defenders: Arbeloa, Ramos, Pique and Alba
Midfield: Iniesta, Busquets (or Alonso) and Xavi (or Fabregas)
Attack: Silva (Navas) - Llorente (or Torres) - Pedro
Obviously lots of changes are possible here because basically the midfielders can play many positions. But Xavi is not as good because Alonso takes up a lot of space, and Iniesta is best in the midfield, not as an attacking winger (although he is really good at that too).
Basically drop on of the defensive midfielders and put Llorente as a center. Similar to how Barcelona plays.
On July 01 2012 22:55 -Kato- wrote: Why are people hating on 4-6-0? Its not like Spain has a choice.
Wat
They have Torres (haters gonna hate) and Llorente as strikers. Both could be complimented by competent wingers (Navas, Cazorla, Pedro). Play one of Alonso and Busquets, preferably Alonso, and Iniesta as well as Xavi or Silva.
They absolutely have the ability to play with at least one striker (lol Negredo last game), but choose their possession based 4-6-0. It's not bad, per se, it's just really fucking boring to watch (imo, obviously).
It's not really the 4-6-0 that makes them boring (at times) to watch imo, it's the lack of variaty. I love their passing game and if they only would mix it up with different ways to attack they would without a doubt the the most entertaining team to watch for me. They can do that without playing with an dedicated scorer/forward.
On July 01 2012 22:46 nam nam wrote: If Italy plays like they did against Germany I think they have a decent shot to take this. It will be very hard to score on Spain though. I'm guessing 1-1 after full time and then Spain wins in overtime/penalties.
If both play at full potential (which is impossible) there is no way Italy beats Spain, in this decade. However some players have played like 80+ games so far, it will come down to which team is more tired or manages better the nerves.
I don't see what that have to do with my post... but ok.
It depends how both teams go out and play the match, if it's something similar to the group stage match, it should be really interesting, and if Spain decides to be the Spain that played the last few minutes vs Portugal, I think they can win. But of Italy pressures Spain and gets possession of the ball the match should be pretty open. The Ballotelli-Cassano vs Ramos-Pique battle will be rather awesome.
On July 01 2012 22:46 nam nam wrote: If Italy plays like they did against Germany I think they have a decent shot to take this. It will be very hard to score on Spain though. I'm guessing 1-1 after full time and then Spain wins in overtime/penalties.
If both play at full potential (which is impossible) there is no way Italy beats Spain, in this decade. However some players have played like 80+ games so far, it will come down to which team is more tired or manages better the nerves.
I don't see what that have to do with my post... but ok.
Guessing how they are going to play (based on the past) is Fiction-Football. Who wins if Spain plays like vs Ireland, and Italy as vs Croatia? Or Spain vs Switzerland (WC) vs any Italy?
Yes, many things can happen depending on how they play, LOL.
When they played in the group stage, I was cheering for Spain, and I saw them as favorites.
Tonight, I would probably say the opposite on both those things. Italy have lookes soooo good in the last two games, whereas Spain hasn't really been impressing me that much this tournament. I mean they've played really well, but I'd say Italy > Germany > Spain so far.
I had a dream last night it was Spain 4 - 2 Italy. Then again in the dream I was also walking around on the field while they were playing. I wish for Italy to win because they defeated my Germans and I always wish well for the team that beat my team.
Im liking the strategy Italy is using to defend against spain. Clog up the midfield with like 4 midfielders and 3 CBs coming forward. Definitely one of the best ways to thwart the zero-forward offence.
On July 02 2012 03:48 FeUerFlieGe wrote: I had a dream last night it was Spain 4 - 2 Italy. Then again in the dream I was also walking around on the field while they were playing. I wish for Italy to win because they defeated my Germans and I always wish well for the team that beat my team.
you're the complete opposite of me, i always wish the team that defeats my team the worst then again, i like the spanish football even less so i hope Italy wins :p
For those in the UK watching on BBC, I urge you to use the red button, there's a list of different commentators you can pick from. One is CBBC, they're brilliant.
They just cut to their reporter at the ground. It was a talking dog. It spoke more sense than Lawro and was easier to understand than Alan Shearer.
Italians are pressing very well. Spain are struggling to keep the ball. I wonder how long they can keep it up though. They need a goal soon. It's going to get harder as the game goes on.
Much better shot that time by Cassano, nice save by Cassilas again though. Italy seems to be getting back into this, Spain looked so dominant first ~15min
On July 02 2012 04:22 Steveling wrote: It's absolutely horrifying for the opponent teams when spain gets on the roll and they start passing around inside your box. Ridiculously good.
That passing around inside the box is actually their weakness.
On July 02 2012 04:22 Steveling wrote: It's absolutely horrifying for the opponent teams when spain gets on the roll and they start passing around inside your box. Ridiculously good.
That passing around inside the box is actually their weakness.
No it's not. It's not like they have a Batistuta in there, capable of scoring from anywhere on the field. And I love them for that.
My heart beats for Italy and I've to say both are playing a good game, but those passes from Spain and how they scored, beautiful. Still I don't think 2-0 isn't what the game looks like.
On July 02 2012 04:22 Steveling wrote: It's absolutely horrifying for the opponent teams when spain gets on the roll and they start passing around inside your box. Ridiculously good.
That passing around inside the box is actually their weakness.
No it's not. It's not like they have a Batistuta in there, capable of scoring from anywhere on the field. And I love them for that.
Yes it is. They would win games way more easily if they had people who dare to shoot at the goal.
On July 02 2012 04:22 Steveling wrote: It's absolutely horrifying for the opponent teams when spain gets on the roll and they start passing around inside your box. Ridiculously good.
That passing around inside the box is actually their weakness.
No it's not. It's not like they have a Batistuta in there, capable of scoring from anywhere on the field. And I love them for that.
Yes it is. They would win games way more easily if they had people who dare to shoot at the goal.
Yes and I'm saying that they can't shoot. Their only good distance shooter is alonso, all the others pale in comparison. So they prefer passing it around till their left back gets into striker position, rofl.
Also I feel sad for all the teams that will face barca in the CL next year. Dani Alves on one side and Jordi Alba on the other. rly, dafaq
Take Balotelli off... he is actually not very good, just overrated now. Vs Germany he gets two goals handed to him on a silver platter and suddenly he's a star for being able to put a ball in an open net.
On July 02 2012 04:35 sickoota wrote: Take Balotelli off... he is actually not very good, just overrated now. Vs Germany he gets two goals handed to him on a silver platter and suddenly he's a star for being able to put a ball in an open net.
balotelli is good. di natale is overrated, if anyone.
God damn, this is just pure rape. Spain can win this 4-0. At least they are attacking so it's not so boring to watch. Sometimes when I watch Barca play I find it boring even if they score 5 goals because they slow the tempo down so much in between the goals. Tempo of this match has been good, and Spain's passing is just on another level compared to Italy's, who keep making mistakes and missing. They are also pressuring Pirlo properly.
On July 02 2012 04:35 sickoota wrote: Take Balotelli off... he is actually not very good, just overrated now. Vs Germany he gets two goals handed to him on a silver platter and suddenly he's a star for being able to put a ball in an open net.
He looks bad today, and has stopped several pushes with his decisions. I agree.
Was hoping for Italy because i hate the takatkiki(?whatever...) style of play. But man they are really be best soccer nation in the world. Sad they are so dominant it results in boring onesided matches.
spain dominatating. it's like italy can't figure out how to counter it. Good shots on target tho, sadly they're sitting right in casillas hands. c'mon balotelli
On July 02 2012 04:35 sickoota wrote: Take Balotelli off... he is actually not very good, just overrated now. Vs Germany he gets two goals handed to him on a silver platter and suddenly he's a star for being able to put a ball in an open net.
But who will put them back in contention? Cassano's probably getting subbed out before 65' and they need every man forward they can afford. If they keep allowing Spain the ball it'll be over.
edit: and I'd be the first to see him taken out if he wasn't needed.
I feel like Italy haven't presented enough attacking options when they go forward. It's usually Pirlo or Balotelli that gets the ball and looks for a pass, but few makes good runs.
Pretty even first half. Spain dominated first 15, and the goal was deserved. THen the Italians took over but couldn't capitalise on their play. Then in comes Alba. The dude's in fucking imba-mode. Sick form and he'll be great for Barca. Both Spanish goals are amazing, honestly.
Game is far from over. Italy needs to push harder. Nothing to lose, everything to gain. Time for Super Mario.
Spain look incredibly sharp today which seemed to be lacking in a few of their previous games. Their closing down is incredible (and incredibly frustrating to opposition).
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
Indeed, Spain is The Team, too bad no VIlla, they forced to play with false 9, Cesc in this case, anyway style and team spirit ofm this generation is just superb.
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
All time? Not even close. This has been a sort of weak tournament.
Tell me another team to win three major international tournaments in a row.
Italy did in the 30s, but it doesn't matter. The "greatest team of all time" has nothing to do with winning consecutive tournaments especially since this team is substantially different than euro2008. Maybe Spain is the most consistently strong team of all time. But in terms of one-time performances, the time to be saying what you're saying would have been after WC2010, not now.
Spain playing beautifully as Italy's been overwhelmed most of the game; I wouldn't be surprised if Barcelona (-_-) wins CL again this year (they won season after 2008 EURO and 2010 WC) and it wouldn't be hard with a great signing in Alba and Villa coming back.
Italy is playing really great. But Spain are just deadly and can score from the smallest of mistakes made.
I'm really impressed by Italy. They deserved at least one goal that half. Haven't seen a team stand up like this against Spain since... Italy in the group stages =)
I really enjoy the fact that Italy's midfield and defence are confident enough to pass their way out of the Spanish pressure. This is probably the best game I've seen, quality wise, thus far in Euro 2012. Both teams deserve 100% to be where they are and are playing great football.
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
All time? Not even close. This has been a sort of weak tournament.
Tell me another team to win three major international tournaments in a row.
Italy did in the 30s, but it doesn't matter. The "greatest team of all time" has nothing to do with winning consecutive tournaments especially since this team is substantially different than euro2008. Maybe Spain is the most consistently strong team of all time. But in terms of one-time performances, the time to be saying what you're saying would have been after WC2010, not now.
I'm not sure the olympics count as a major tournament. Perhaps it did back then, who knows.
On July 02 2012 04:41 LaLuSh wrote: Italy is playing really great. But Spain are just deadly and can score from the smallest of mistakes made.
I'm really impressed by Italy. They deserved at least one goal that half. Haven't seen a team stand up like this against Spain since... Italy in the group stages =)
I really enjoy the fact that Italy's midfield and defence are confident enough to pass their way out of the Spanish pressure. This is probably the best game I've seen, quality wise, thus far in Euro 2012. Both teams deserve 100% to be where they are and are playing great football.
I feel portugal did a much much better job to reduce the passing midfield than italy.
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
All time? Not even close. This has been a sort of weak tournament.
Tell me another team to win three major international tournaments in a row.
Italy did in the 30s, but it doesn't matter. The "greatest team of all time" has nothing to do with winning consecutive tournaments especially since this team is substantially different than euro2008. Maybe Spain is the most consistently strong team of all time. But in terms of one-time performances, the time to be saying what you're saying would have been after WC2010, not now.
No they didn't. There wasn't even a European Championship until the 50s and all World Cup's pre 1945 were a bit of a joke as most of the countries from other continents didn't attend.
The Olympics is not a serious football tournament.
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
All time? Not even close. This has been a sort of weak tournament.
Tell me another team to win three major international tournaments in a row.
Italy did in the 30s, but it doesn't matter. The "greatest team of all time" has nothing to do with winning consecutive tournaments especially since this team is substantially different than euro2008. Maybe Spain is the most consistently strong team of all time. But in terms of one-time performances, the time to be saying what you're saying would have been after WC2010, not now.
No they didn't. There wasn't even a European Championship until the 50s and all World Cup's pre 1945 were a bit of a joke as most of the countries from other continents didn't attend.
The Olympics is not a serious football tournament.
It was all there was back then. What I'm saying is that teams have dominated for stretches of time before. Either way, it doesn't matter, like I said, because being the best of all time is about being the best, not about winning for a long period of time. There are teams that won the WC once and nothing else that I'd put in the running for best national team ever.
On July 02 2012 04:40 Steveling wrote: I also agree, this spain from the last 4-5 years is propably one of the top 3 best nationals ever. Maybe the best.
On July 02 2012 04:41 sc4k wrote: I wouldn't disagree with top 3, might be going a little far to say best ever.
I'd probably say this. I'd say that Pele and Maradona or Ronaldo era teams are probably the most fantastic.
1970 Brazil might be a competition.
Maradona's Argentina certainly weren't, they were carried by Maradona and had nothing like the depth of this Spain side. Not to mention they only won one World Cup and one Copa America.
On July 02 2012 04:41 sc4k wrote: I wouldn't disagree with top 3, might be going a little far to say best ever.
I'd probably say this. I'd say that Pele and Maradona or Ronaldo era teams are probably the most fantastic.
1970 Brazil might be a competition.
Maradona's Argentina certainly weren't, they were carried by Maradona and had nothing like the depth of this Spain side. Not to mention they only won one World Cup and one Copa America.
I think you're underestimating how much having Maradona adds to your team, lol. I'd say 1970 Brazil is easily more legendary than this Spain team, though. They dominated everything, and convincingly. Spain hasn't been convincing outside of this game, lol.
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
All time? Not even close. This has been a sort of weak tournament.
Tell me another team to win three major international tournaments in a row.
Italy did in the 30s, but it doesn't matter. The "greatest team of all time" has nothing to do with winning consecutive tournaments especially since this team is substantially different than euro2008. Maybe Spain is the most consistently strong team of all time. But in terms of one-time performances, the time to be saying what you're saying would have been after WC2010, not now.
No they didn't. There wasn't even a European Championship until the 50s and all World Cup's pre 1945 were a bit of a joke as most of the countries from other continents didn't attend.
The Olympics is not a serious football tournament.
It was all there was back then. What I'm saying is that teams have dominated for stretches of time before. Either way, it doesn't matter, like I said, because being the best of all time is about being the best, not about winning for a long period of time. There are teams that won the WC once and nothing else that I'd put in the running for best national team ever.
Every team that wins a World Cup plays great football.
Winning 2 European Championships and a World Cup in a row is completely unprecedented.
As good as Pele's Brazil and Maradona's Argentina were, they would lose horribly to this Spanish team of the past 4 years. Football is a different and a harder game now than it was before. The players are better, and the strategy & tactics are more evolved. In terms of pure ability, this has got to be the greatest side in international setting. If they win 3 majors in a row, they'll also have the achievement to back that claim. Sometimes, you have to set aside nostalgia and really look at things.
On July 02 2012 04:41 sc4k wrote: I wouldn't disagree with top 3, might be going a little far to say best ever.
I'd probably say this. I'd say that Pele and Maradona or Ronaldo era teams are probably the most fantastic.
1970 Brazil might be a competition.
Maradona's Argentina certainly weren't, they were carried by Maradona and had nothing like the depth of this Spain side. Not to mention they only won one World Cup and one Copa America.
I think you're underestimating how much having Maradona adds to your team, lol. I'd say 1970 Brazil is easily more legendary than this Spain team, though. They dominated everything, and convincingly. Spain hasn't been convincing outside of this game, lol.
They haven't even conceded a goal in the knock outs since 2006. They are dominant as it gets. Brazil didn't even win the 74 or 66 World Cup, in fact they didn't even make the final.
On July 02 2012 04:41 sc4k wrote: I wouldn't disagree with top 3, might be going a little far to say best ever.
I'd probably say this. I'd say that Pele and Maradona or Ronaldo era teams are probably the most fantastic.
'78s argentina was a much much much better team than '86s argentina. Maradona didn't have the garrinchas and the rivaldos that Pele and Ronaldo had. That's why he's the best ever was until Messi.
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
All time? Not even close. This has been a sort of weak tournament.
Tell me another team to win three major international tournaments in a row.
Italy did in the 30s, but it doesn't matter. The "greatest team of all time" has nothing to do with winning consecutive tournaments especially since this team is substantially different than euro2008. Maybe Spain is the most consistently strong team of all time. But in terms of one-time performances, the time to be saying what you're saying would have been after WC2010, not now.
No they didn't. There wasn't even a European Championship until the 50s and all World Cup's pre 1945 were a bit of a joke as most of the countries from other continents didn't attend.
The Olympics is not a serious football tournament.
It was all there was back then. What I'm saying is that teams have dominated for stretches of time before. Either way, it doesn't matter, like I said, because being the best of all time is about being the best, not about winning for a long period of time. There are teams that won the WC once and nothing else that I'd put in the running for best national team ever.
Every team that wins a World Cup plays great football.
Winning 2 European Championships and a World Cup in a row is completely unprecedented.
Yeah, it is, but this isn't the same team as Euro 2008. So while there may be a few Spanish players, like Iniesta, who can be called true legends, the team itself has changed greatly.
Forgot about Brazil 2002. I don't think this Spain team would be able to handle Ronaldo.
On July 02 2012 04:37 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Greatest football team of all time. No side has ever won 3 tournaments in a row.
All time? Not even close. This has been a sort of weak tournament.
Tell me another team to win three major international tournaments in a row.
Italy did in the 30s, but it doesn't matter. The "greatest team of all time" has nothing to do with winning consecutive tournaments especially since this team is substantially different than euro2008. Maybe Spain is the most consistently strong team of all time. But in terms of one-time performances, the time to be saying what you're saying would have been after WC2010, not now.
No they didn't. There wasn't even a European Championship until the 50s and all World Cup's pre 1945 were a bit of a joke as most of the countries from other continents didn't attend.
The Olympics is not a serious football tournament.
It was all there was back then. What I'm saying is that teams have dominated for stretches of time before. Either way, it doesn't matter, like I said, because being the best of all time is about being the best, not about winning for a long period of time. There are teams that won the WC once and nothing else that I'd put in the running for best national team ever.
Every team that wins a World Cup plays great football.
Winning 2 European Championships and a World Cup in a row is completely unprecedented.
Yeah, it is, but this isn't the same team as Euro 2008. So while there may be a few Spanish players, like Iniesta, who can be called true legends, the team itself has changed greatly.
Forgot about Brazil 2002. I don't think this Spain team would be able to handle Ronaldo.
Ramos, Casillas, Xavi, Iniesta, Silva, Torres and Fabregas all played in 2008. That's still the majority of the team.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
On July 02 2012 04:41 LaLuSh wrote: Italy is playing really great. But Spain are just deadly and can score from the smallest of mistakes made.
I'm really impressed by Italy. They deserved at least one goal that half. Haven't seen a team stand up like this against Spain since... Italy in the group stages =)
I really enjoy the fact that Italy's midfield and defence are confident enough to pass their way out of the Spanish pressure. This is probably the best game I've seen, quality wise, thus far in Euro 2012. Both teams deserve 100% to be where they are and are playing great football.
I feel portugal did a much much better job to reduce the passing midfield than italy.
Sure, in the first half and beginning of the second half of their match I absolutely agree with you. But the problem in my opinion with that game was Portugals complete inability to produce quality chances (as with any team who have closed down Spain's midfield, they practically created nothing worthwhile offensively).
The difference when compared to Italy's play, is that Italy is actually keeping possession of the ball, Passing their way calmly out of situations. Their players also have great movement without the ball when they are on the offensive.
Italy would probably have done an equally good job of closing down Spain hadn't that first goal been scored so early. But now that they're behind, they have to attack. And I must say I'm impressed by the quality with which they're doing it. No team thus far in the tournament have created this much offensively, or had such such an amount of consecutive passes within the team against Spain.
I'm impressed because they're obviously forced into playing the game the way Spain likes it. But they're doing it really well. Anyway, I'm back to watching the game.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
What are you meant to do, jump with your arms behind your back?
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
how do you usually jump? with your hands down? cause usually when I jump my hands come up for better stability/power
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
Should have been Cassano getting the ball there. He would have assisted Balotelli instead of shooting. ; _ ; Which is easy to say after he shot and missed, of course.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
That was a bullshit penalty as well. It was probably given out of pity for Germany. No, it should not have been a penalty. Go read the rules.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
That was a bullshit penalty as well. It was probably given out of pity for Germany. No, it should not have been a penalty. Go read the rules.
Are you seriously saying refs only give penalities when someone clearly intentionallly handles it? There's a reason why that area of the rule is murky. In any league, you'll see refs give that as a pen more often than not.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
That was a bullshit penalty as well. It was probably given out of pity for Germany. No, it should not have been a penalty. Go read the rules.
Are you seriously saying refs only give penalities when someone clearly intentionallly handles it? There's a reason why that area of the rule is murky. In any league, you'll see refs give that as a pen more often than not.
I'm not even sure what your argument is any more. It was quite clearly not deliberate, ergo it wasn't a penalty.
You know Arbeloa is the least gifted player of Spain and every team/media/"expert" has labeled him as Spanish weakness, but imo he has done one hell of a job all tournament.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
What are you meant to do, jump with your arms behind your back?
< Yes.
Just like you're not supposed to jump with your elbows out either.
On July 02 2012 05:00 sharkie wrote: You know Arbeloa is the least gifted player of Spain and every team/media/"expert" has labeled him as Spanish weakness, but imo he has done one hell of a job all tournament.
He's damn good at what he does. Opens up soo much space.
Damn Casillas is fucking OP. Saving those crosses all day.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
That was a bullshit penalty as well. It was probably given out of pity for Germany. No, it should not have been a penalty. Go read the rules.
Are you seriously saying refs only give penalities when someone clearly intentionallly handles it? There's a reason why that area of the rule is murky. In any league, you'll see refs give that as a pen more often than not.
I'm not even sure what your argument is any more. It was quite clearly not deliberate, ergo it wasn't a penalty.
And I'm saying that's not how it actually works on the pitch. Refs don't follow all of the rules to the letter. I've seen plenty of refs give those sort 'point blank' handles as pens, and I agree with it. If you use an illegal part of your body to block a potential goal/assist in the box, it should be penalised, whether or not it was intentional.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
That was a bullshit penalty as well. It was probably given out of pity for Germany. No, it should not have been a penalty. Go read the rules.
Are you seriously saying refs only give penalities when someone clearly intentionallly handles it? There's a reason why that area of the rule is murky. In any league, you'll see refs give that as a pen more often than not.
I'm not even sure what your argument is any more. It was quite clearly not deliberate, ergo it wasn't a penalty.
And I'm saying that's not how it actually works on the pitch. Refs don't follow all of the rules to the letter. I've seen plenty of refs give those sort 'point blank' handles as pens, and I agree with it. If you use an illegal part of your body to block a potential goal/assist in the box, it should be penalised, whether or not it was intentional.
Well obviously this referee thinks the letter of law should be enforced. The point is that the Italian player didn't intentionally block anything. It was deflected off of a Spanish player into his arm; it was literally impossible for him to get out of the way.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
That was a bullshit penalty as well. It was probably given out of pity for Germany. No, it should not have been a penalty. Go read the rules.
Are you seriously saying refs only give penalities when someone clearly intentionallly handles it? There's a reason why that area of the rule is murky. In any league, you'll see refs give that as a pen more often than not.
I'm not even sure what your argument is any more. It was quite clearly not deliberate, ergo it wasn't a penalty.
And I'm saying that's not how it actually works on the pitch. Refs don't follow all of the rules to the letter. I've seen plenty of refs give those sort 'point blank' handles as pens, and I agree with it. If you use an illegal part of your body to block a potential goal/assist in the box, it should be penalised, whether or not it was intentional.
You're right, refs often make the wrong decision. What they or you might think, while interesting, is irrelevant, it's absolutely against the laws of the game.
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
That's the natural position when you're jumping. Why do you think there are so many elbows?
It still blocked a shot on goal. If the ricochet onto the hand in the germany game was a pen, how is this not? The scoreline, I guess. Spain should be 3 up.
That was a bullshit penalty as well. It was probably given out of pity for Germany. No, it should not have been a penalty. Go read the rules.
Are you seriously saying refs only give penalities when someone clearly intentionallly handles it? There's a reason why that area of the rule is murky. In any league, you'll see refs give that as a pen more often than not.
I'm not even sure what your argument is any more. It was quite clearly not deliberate, ergo it wasn't a penalty.
And I'm saying that's not how it actually works on the pitch. Refs don't follow all of the rules to the letter. I've seen plenty of refs give those sort 'point blank' handles as pens, and I agree with it. If you use an illegal part of your body to block a potential goal/assist in the box, it should be penalised, whether or not it was intentional.
Well obviously this referee thinks the letter of law should be enforced. The point is that the Italian player didn't intentionally block anything. It was deflected off of a Spanish player into his arm; it was literally impossible for him to get out of the way.
Yeah "Ball to hand" not "Hand to ball" or something to that effect
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
What are you meant to do, jump with your arms behind your back?
< Yes.
Just like you're not supposed to jump with your elbows out either.
Do you run with your arms behind your back too?
If you're running and have to jump you're not going to deliberately put your arms behind - which mind you impairs your jumping potential - so that you can avoid possible misunderstandings. You jump period.
You can't expect everyone to be worried about possible misunderstandings when they have a job to do.
On July 02 2012 05:07 Tur wrote: Spain is so fucking good lately, this is scary. I really want to see my country win the world cup here, but can't see how to win over Spain.
Dunga's Brazil in 2010 could have beaten Spain, but you fired him.
It really is kinda over for Italy - really bad luck, two players injured and ending with 10 v 11 is kinda harsh. They do well in keeping up some pressure though..
On July 02 2012 04:54 Anonymous_Coward wrote: There's no way to get your hand out of the way of that, would have been ridiculously harsh to give it, no way it was deliberate.
Yeah, but your hands shouldn't haven't been up like that in the first place. It wasn't like he was covering his face or balls. He had it sticking out.
What are you meant to do, jump with your arms behind your back?
< Yes.
Just like you're not supposed to jump with your elbows out either.
Do you run with your arms behind your back too?
If you're running and have to jump you're not going to deliberately put your arms behind - which mind you impairs your jumping potential - so that you can avoid possible misunderstandings. You jump period.
You can't expect everyone to be worried about possible misunderstandings when they have a job to do.
All those elbow injuries are accidental, too. Still the refs are supposed to hand out yellow cards to remind the players to watch their elbows. Same goes for your hands in the penalty box.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Monsen wrote: I wonder if Germany would have stood a better chance (probably not). The Italian system seems to play into Spains hands so much.
10v11 GGwellplayed. :/
The Germans are even more attacking than Italy and unlike Italy Germany are awful defensively. Spain would have raped them.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
On July 02 2012 05:10 Monsen wrote: I wonder if Germany would have stood a better chance (probably not). The Italian system seems to play into Spains hands so much.
10v11 GGwellplayed. :/
Germany, LOLWUT? Germany's defence v. Italy was awful, this Spain would have dismantled Italy.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Spain gets the job done whenever it's needed, that's why they are the champions.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
You really do enjoy living in the past. Spain of 2010/2008 played much better than Spain of 2012.
10v11 due to an injury, bad/missed calls on both sides of the ball. Disappointing and tainted final, just like the 2010 WC final. Oh, and of course, Spain, no matter how incredibly good they are, are incredibly boring to watch.
On July 02 2012 05:11 Steveling wrote: Argentina has started playing finally good lately. Because Messi started playing like he does on barca. 2014 will be a boss year!
two good games and Argentina playing good again? lol
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
On July 02 2012 05:11 Steveling wrote: Argentina has started playing finally good lately. Because Messi started playing like he does on barca. 2014 will be a boss year!
They really need to get their defence sorted out though. They leak goals like crazy. As good as their players are going forward, you don't (usually) win tournaments without a solid defence.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Apparently you are only as good as your last game.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Apparently you are only as good as your last game.
I give Spain full credit for their win here, because they played great in the first half. But they should consider themselves very lucky to have made it that far.
On July 02 2012 05:11 Steveling wrote: Argentina has started playing finally good lately. Because Messi started playing like he does on barca. 2014 will be a boss year!
They really need to get their defence sorted out though. They leak goals like crazy. As good as their players are going forward, you don't (usually) win tournaments without a solid defence.
On July 02 2012 05:13 Stratos_speAr wrote: 10v11 due to an injury, bad/missed calls on both sides of the ball. Disappointing and tainted final, just like the 2010 WC final. Oh, and of course, Spain, no matter how incredibly good they are, are incredibly boring to watch.
Can't remember what was wrong with the 2010 final, but now this has turned into some bullshit. A pity that one team just can't say 'gg', now we have to watch this bullshit for 15 more minutes...
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Apparently you are only as good as your last game.
I give Spain full credit for their win here, because they played great in the first half. But they should consider themselves very lucky to have made it that far.
totally agree with you. in the end everybody will only remember you are world / euro champion, not that you barely made it out of group stages / quarter / semis anyway though
On July 02 2012 05:13 Stratos_speAr wrote: 10v11 due to an injury, bad/missed calls on both sides of the ball. Disappointing and tainted final, just like the 2010 WC final. Oh, and of course, Spain, no matter how incredibly good they are, are incredibly boring to watch.
Can't remember what was wrong with the 2010 final, but now this has turned into some bullshit. A pity that one team just can't say 'gg', now we have to watch this bullshit for 15 more minutes...
There were a number of terrible calls that significantly affected the game and the quality of the game was rather poor.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
Consider yourself ignored. I'd considered doing it for your mind numbingly stupid opinions on Sc2, and now I'll be doing it because you think Spain's Euro 2012 was impressive. Peace kiddo.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Apparently you are only as good as your last game.
I give Spain full credit for their win here, because they played great in the first half. But they should consider themselves very lucky to have made it that far.
totally agree with you. in the end everybody will only remember you are world / euro champion, not that you barely made it out of group stages / quarter / semis anyway though
Barely made it out? They got 7 points in the groups. They beat France easily 2-0, the only lucky thing was the penalties vs Portugal but penalties are definitely not pure luck.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
2 games, Chelsea 3 - 2 Barcelona
therefore, Chelsea was a better team than Barcelona last season.
Germany was in the group of death, not a group with the whipping boys RoI.
I applaud Spain for a beautiful game. I was cheering for Italy, but its totally deserved Spain wins (or does win in a few minutes). Congratulations to all Spanish people out there !
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Apparently you are only as good as your last game.
I give Spain full credit for their win here, because they played great in the first half. But they should consider themselves very lucky to have made it that far.
totally agree with you. in the end everybody will only remember you are world / euro champion, not that you barely made it out of group stages / quarter / semis anyway though
Barely made it out? They got 7 points in the groups. They beat France easily 2-0, the only lucky thing was the penalties vs Portugal but penalties are definitely not pure luck.
okay and now point me to where i was specifically talking about spains 2012 euro performance? you like arguing for the sake of arguing too much
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
2 games, Chelsea 3 - 2 Barcelona
therefore, Chelsea was a better team than Barcelona last season.
Germany was in the group of death, not a group with the whipping boys RoI.
Let's just accept that Germany made a handful of critical mistakes vs. Italy that resulted in their loss. I blame that on the line-up.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
On July 02 2012 05:27 leo23 wrote: underwhelming finals
To say the least. I really don't get it. As incredible of a game as football is, finals (mostly just for FIFA/UEFA tournaments) seem to be very disappointing, questionable (concerning the refereeing), and underwhelming.
On July 02 2012 05:10 Telcontar wrote: I honestly thought Spain would struggle more without Villa in this tournament, but they have done what they needed to do. Sign of a true champion.
Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
On July 02 2012 05:11 Shiori wrote: [quote] Spain did struggle. This is the first time they've looked dominant. I don't think Spain would have been able to handle Germany in the semi-final, even as poorly as Germany played (if Spain put in the same performance as they did against Croatia/Portugal, for example).
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Well, Italy did not deserve this score really, and their luck with the injuries has been... abysmal . Don't know how vital was the 3rd substitution but it's always a huge risk to be out of subs for more than half an hour.
On July 02 2012 05:12 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: [quote]
Can't handle Germany? Clueless people make me laugh. You do know they knocked Germany out of the last two tournaments?
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
On July 02 2012 05:30 Asvhald wrote: Well, Italy did not deserve this score really, and their luck with the injuries has been... abysmal . Don't know how vital was the 3rd substitution but it's always a huge risk to be out of subs for more than half an hour.
I don't think it should be 3-0, but Spain was the better team and I don't think Italy does care if they lose 0-1 or 0-4 like it is now. Spain played beautiful soccer and its just too damn hard to play against them if they score first. If Italy scores first, the whole game can look different.
i still wonder how they could organize a tournament on such a short period. you can clearly notice how exhausted italy is, worn out after so few days between each game in the second turn. i am no way calling this our only weakness, but you can clearly see it. i guess our next game is going to be played in the hospital :D
He clearly holds a grudge against Spain and always tryes to underrate them. Don't mind about him.
I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
LOL the Chelsea boys scoring the goals.
They lost in 2010 and 2008 though to Spain in fact.
You know that team that Germany got raped by on Thursday?
Well Spain are currently up 4-0 against them in the most one sided final I've ever seen having watched every tournament since 1992.
On July 02 2012 05:32 Shellshock1122 wrote: Lol so now Torres and Gomez 3 goals 1 assist
Then its Torres who wins, because he has less play time.
wasn't it the player who's younger gets the award the last time? (Müller back then) i could be wrong of course, and i dont know if Torres or Gomez is younger, lol :p (edit: looked it up, Gomez is younger, if it matters even...)
On July 02 2012 05:32 Shellshock1122 wrote: Lol so now Torres and Gomez 3 goals 1 assist
Then its Torres who wins, because he has less play time.
wasn't it the player who's younger gets the award the last time? (Müller back then) i could be wrong of course, and i dont know if Torres or Gomez is younger, lol :p
On July 02 2012 05:32 Shellshock1122 wrote: Lol so now Torres and Gomez 3 goals 1 assist
Then its Torres who wins, because he has less play time.
wasn't it the player who's younger gets the award the last time? (Müller back then) i could be wrong of course, and i dont know if Torres or Gomez is younger, lol :p
'Die Rangfolge entspricht den offiziellen Regeln der UEFA.[32] Bei gleicher Anzahl Tore und Vorlagen ist die geringere Anzahl der Spielminuten ausschlaggebend.'
"........ on equal goals and assists the lesser playtime is taken into consideration"
On July 02 2012 05:15 Shiori wrote: [quote] I don't know why people assume this. Spain hasn't looked good until this game in this tournament. It's common knowledge. Germany looked good in most of their games, but not against Italy. It's like the inverse, honestly.
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
LOL the Chelsea boys scoring the goals.
They lost in 2010 and 2008 though to Spain in fact.
You know that team that Germany got raped by on Thursday?
Well Spain are currently up 4-0 against them in the most one sided final I've ever seen having watched every tournament since 1992.
A > B B > C therefore A > C??
Is that how football works? I've been doing this wrong for years. Chelsea > Barcelona.
On July 02 2012 05:32 Shellshock1122 wrote: Lol so now Torres and Gomez 3 goals 1 assist
Then its Torres who wins, because he has less play time.
wasn't it the player who's younger gets the award the last time? (Müller back then) i could be wrong of course, and i dont know if Torres or Gomez is younger, lol :p
On July 02 2012 05:35 Steveling wrote: And apparently spain has made a new goal scoring record in the final after the western germany 3-0 like 40 years ago. Really the elite.
On July 02 2012 05:30 Asvhald wrote: Well, Italy did not deserve this score really, and their luck with the injuries has been... abysmal . Don't know how vital was the 3rd substitution but it's always a huge risk to be out of subs for more than half an hour.
I don't think it should be 3-0, but Spain was the better team and I don't think Italy does care if they lose 0-1 or 0-4 like it is now. Spain played beautiful soccer and its just too damn hard to play against them if they score first. If Italy scores first, the whole game can look different.
Congratulations to Spain !
You are right. The score is deceptive, the game snowballed out of control. Italy has been a great contender and a rival as worthy as they come. I am bursting with happiness now for Spain, but I also feel a bit sad, can sympathize with the Italian fans right now.
On July 02 2012 05:20 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: [quote]
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
LOL the Chelsea boys scoring the goals.
They lost in 2010 and 2008 though to Spain in fact.
You know that team that Germany got raped by on Thursday?
Well Spain are currently up 4-0 against them in the most one sided final I've ever seen having watched every tournament since 1992.
A > B B > C therefore A > C??
Is that how football works? I've been doing this wrong for years. Chelsea > Barcelona.
There are no words to describe this stupidity. I'm sure Spain will be happy with their World Cup and 2x Euros even if some nutter from South Africa thinks Germany would have beaten them.
On July 02 2012 05:32 Shellshock1122 wrote: Lol so now Torres and Gomez 3 goals 1 assist
Then its Torres who wins, because he has less play time.
wasn't it the player who's younger gets the award the last time? (Müller back then) i could be wrong of course, and i dont know if Torres or Gomez is younger, lol :p
'Die Rangfolge entspricht den offiziellen Regeln der UEFA.[32] Bei gleicher Anzahl Tore und Vorlagen ist die geringere Anzahl der Spielminuten ausschlaggebend.'
"........ on equal goals and assists the lesser playtime is taken into consideration"
alrighty thanks for clearing that up
GGs spain ... i always root for the losing team, meh
So, who's the player of the tournament? Pirlo? Does he deserve it without winning the tournament? A lot of the spanish players have performed as well though they received less spotlight.
On July 02 2012 05:35 Steveling wrote: And apparently spain has made a new goal scoring record in the final after the western germany 3-0 like 40 years ago. Really the elite.
On July 02 2012 05:20 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: [quote]
Awww, you must be new to football or have no idea how it works. That's cute.
I'll give you a tip: The team that plays the prettiest football in your personal opinion isn't always the best team. A team that concedes 6 goals in 5 game is definitely not ever in any universe better than one that concedes 1 goal in 6 games.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
LOL the Chelsea boys scoring the goals.
They lost in 2010 and 2008 though to Spain in fact.
You know that team that Germany got raped by on Thursday?
Well Spain are currently up 4-0 against them in the most one sided final I've ever seen having watched every tournament since 1992.
A > B B > C therefore A > C??
Is that how football works? I've been doing this wrong for years. Chelsea > Barcelona.
I don't understand how anyone's brain can justify Spain not being the best team right now and Germany off all countries, who got slaughtered in the semi's, being better.
On July 02 2012 05:38 Telcontar wrote: So, who's the player of the tournament? Pirlo? Does he deserve it without winning the tournament? A lot of the spanish players have performed as well though they received less spotlight.
On July 02 2012 05:38 Telcontar wrote: So, who's the player of the tournament? Pirlo? Does he deserve it without winning the tournament? A lot of the spanish players have performed as well though they received less spotlight.
On July 02 2012 05:38 Telcontar wrote: So, who's the player of the tournament? Pirlo? Does he deserve it without winning the tournament? A lot of the spanish players have performed as well though they received less spotlight.
I would go Casillas, he is always performing, 100% of the time; such a fantastic keeper, either that or Andres Iniesta.
Pirlo played really fucking well though, but not today.
So New Zealand was better than Spain in 2010? I like your football logic.
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
LOL the Chelsea boys scoring the goals.
They lost in 2010 and 2008 though to Spain in fact.
You know that team that Germany got raped by on Thursday?
Well Spain are currently up 4-0 against them in the most one sided final I've ever seen having watched every tournament since 1992.
A > B B > C therefore A > C??
Is that how football works? I've been doing this wrong for years. Chelsea > Barcelona.
There are no words to describe this stupidity. I'm sure Spain will be happy with their World Cup and 2x Euros even if some nutter from South Africa thinks Germany would have beaten them.
I aint saying that, I'm saying your reasons for saying spain would dominate germany is pure speculation, bringing in past results as if record books has had any effect on a 90 minute game of football.
But continue living vicariously through spain because your national team can't really do anything.
On July 02 2012 05:24 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: [quote]
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
LOL the Chelsea boys scoring the goals.
They lost in 2010 and 2008 though to Spain in fact.
You know that team that Germany got raped by on Thursday?
Well Spain are currently up 4-0 against them in the most one sided final I've ever seen having watched every tournament since 1992.
A > B B > C therefore A > C??
Is that how football works? I've been doing this wrong for years. Chelsea > Barcelona.
There are no words to describe this stupidity. I'm sure Spain will be happy with their World Cup and 2x Euros even if some nutter from South Africa thinks Germany would have beaten them.
But continue living vicariously through spain because your national team can't really do anything.
Good job Spain!!! You fully deserved it! Congratulations!!! I doubt this record of winning 3 major tournaments in a row + 10 clean sheet streak in knockout stage will be beaten. Not anytime soon
On July 02 2012 05:42 ratbert wrote: so does that mean if Löw did't let Gomez play in the semis, he would have won the golden boot? kinda ironic if you ask me
On July 02 2012 05:24 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: [quote]
New Zealand didn't win any games. Spain won all their games except one.
Germany has won more games than Spain this Euro. So Germany > Spain? God damn, could you decide your way of rating teams please?
Is it about games won, goals conceded or what?
Okay for people in the cheap seats.
A team that wins 3 major tournaments in a row, an unprecedented level of success and didn't concede a single goal in the knockout stages of any of those three tournaments is by far the best team in the world. Far, far superior to a team they've knocked out of two of those tournaments and who can't defend even against the likes of Greece and Denmark.
Spain lost to switzerland.
And?
You wanna knock a team for conceding against greeze and denmark. They never lost. Spain lost.
LOL the Chelsea boys scoring the goals.
They lost in 2010 and 2008 though to Spain in fact.
You know that team that Germany got raped by on Thursday?
Well Spain are currently up 4-0 against them in the most one sided final I've ever seen having watched every tournament since 1992.
A > B B > C therefore A > C??
Is that how football works? I've been doing this wrong for years. Chelsea > Barcelona.
There are no words to describe this stupidity. I'm sure Spain will be happy with their World Cup and 2x Euros even if some nutter from South Africa thinks Germany would have beaten them.
I aint saying that, I'm saying your reasons for saying spain would dominate germany is pure speculation, bringing in past results as if record books has had any effect on a 90 minute game of football.
But continue living vicariously through spain because your national team can't really do anything.
My local club side is one of the greatest football teams of all time. I have plenty of success without bandwagoning on other teams.
On July 02 2012 05:46 -IeZaeL- wrote: haha people talking about injuries from Italy....when Spain played the whole tournament withouth Puyol & Villa xDDDDDDDD!!!
SPAIN-POWER-HOUSE.
gg NO re. EAT THIS.
It's a difference when you lose players in a game or before a tournament...........
On July 02 2012 05:46 -IeZaeL- wrote: haha people talking about injuries from Italy....when Spain played the whole tournament withouth Puyol & Villa xDDDDDDDD!!!
SPAIN-POWER-HOUSE.
gg NO re. EAT THIS.
It's a difference when you lose players in a game or before a tournament...........
On July 02 2012 05:46 -IeZaeL- wrote: haha people talking about injuries from Italy....when Spain played the whole tournament withouth Puyol & Villa xDDDDDDDD!!!
SPAIN-POWER-HOUSE.
gg NO re. EAT THIS.
Haha that is pretty scary. I for one thought, Spain was done when Villa was ruled out. But SPAIN TOO STRONK!!!!
On July 02 2012 05:41 Telcontar wrote: It's Alba or Iniesta for me. Hard to choose, but I'll edge it to Alba.
Yep, what a player barca have just bought, so cheap too.
Right? It's pretty absurd considering players like Carroll go for £35m in England.
He was on the radar way before this tournament even started. Hes always been good and Valencia is a seller club unfortunately.
Yeah, I heard good things about him before, but didn't realise he was this good. Barca certainly got a bargain to get their son back. Maybe the small physique put foreign teams off.
On July 02 2012 05:40 Ermac wrote: LOL Italy.... seriously?
Guess they blew all their luck against Germany...
there we go butthurt?
More like poetic justice =)
If you look at the whole tournament, Italy just didn't deserve to be in the finals. The best game they played was vs Germany, and it was mainly considered as such because they scored for a change. Coincidentally it was probably Germany's worst game in this EURO. Italy was just way overrated imho and Spain made that clear today.
It's like the wise Reiner "Calli" Calmund recently said: "If every team had to play every other team and those with the most points would have to face each other in the finals it would be Spain vs Germany hands down. In a knockout style tournament like this however, everything can happen."(rough translation)
On July 02 2012 05:40 Ermac wrote: LOL Italy.... seriously?
Guess they blew all their luck against Germany...
there we go butthurt?
More like poetic justice =)
If you look at the whole tournament, Italy just didn't deserve to be in the finals. The only good game they played was vs Germany, and it was mainly considered as such because they scored for a change. Italy was just way overrated imho and Spain made that clear today.
It's like the wise Reiner "Calli" Calmund recently said: "If every team had to play every other team and those with the most points would have to face each other in the finals it would be Spain vs Germany hands down. In a knockout style tournament like this however, everything can happen."(rough translation)
But that's football.
Italy played good vs Spain, Croatia in the group stage. Dominated England and Germany in the knockout stage.
On July 02 2012 05:41 Telcontar wrote: It's Alba or Iniesta for me. Hard to choose, but I'll edge it to Alba.
Yep, what a player barca have just bought, so cheap too.
Right? It's pretty absurd considering players like Carroll go for £35m in England.
I've always been puzzled by the sums English clubs are paying, especially for English players. I feel like the English really want their players to be better than they really are.
Crazy to think that Iniesta and Xavi will probably be playing in the next world cup, man, they are just the gods of this sport right now. AFAIK 3/4 or 4/4 of those goals were ultimately set up by through balls provided by those two players?
I still commend Italy for getting to the finals - Especially considdering the way they did it.
I think for many years, Italy had become one of the more hated teams because of their defensive play - They really played beautyfully and entertaining. I have gained a ton of respect for italian football after this tournament
Not only did Spain win 3rd straight major tournament, they also beat France and Italy in 90min for the 1st time in major tournaments in their history, so mad props to them!
On July 02 2012 05:40 Ermac wrote: LOL Italy.... seriously?
Guess they blew all their luck against Germany...
there we go butthurt?
More like poetic justice =)
If you look at the whole tournament, Italy just didn't deserve to be in the finals. The best game they played was vs Germany, and it was mainly considered as such because they scored for a change. Coincidentally it was probably Germany's worst game in this EURO. Italy was just way overrated imho and Spain made that clear today.
It's like the wise Reiner "Calli" Calmund recently said: "If every team had to play every other team and those with the most points would have to face each other in the finals it would be Spain vs Germany hands down. In a knockout style tournament like this however, everything can happen."(rough translation)
But that's football.
If there is one side that was overrated it was the German one. Germany didn't play a single good game all tournament. Narrowly beating Portugal whom should have equalized in the final minutes, Denmark should have had a penalty and this Dutch side was pathetic. They even conceded two goals against Greece.
Italy had horrible luck on the night and you just cannot have that kind of luck against possibly the greatest national side ever.
On July 02 2012 05:40 Ermac wrote: LOL Italy.... seriously?
Guess they blew all their luck against Germany...
there we go butthurt?
More like poetic justice =)
If you look at the whole tournament, Italy just didn't deserve to be in the finals. The only good game they played was vs Germany, and it was mainly considered as such because they scored for a change. Italy was just way overrated imho and Spain made that clear today.
It's like the wise Reiner "Calli" Calmund recently said: "If every team had to play every other team and those with the most points would have to face each other in the finals it would be Spain vs Germany hands down. In a knockout style tournament like this however, everything can happen."(rough translation)
But that's football.
Italy played good vs Spain, Croatia in the group stage. Dominated England and Germany in the knockout stage.
Wth?
I corrected my post a bit in that regard. Italy did play quite well vs Spain. They did not play well vs Croatia however, hell they can be glad they didn't lose that game iirc.
Concerning England, playing 120 minutes without scoring a single goal despite domination hard is just weak. And Germany? Certainly not what I'd call "domination". That game could've went either way.
On July 02 2012 05:41 Telcontar wrote: It's Alba or Iniesta for me. Hard to choose, but I'll edge it to Alba.
Yep, what a player barca have just bought, so cheap too.
Right? It's pretty absurd considering players like Carroll go for £35m in England.
I've always been puzzled by the sums English clubs are paying, especially for English players. I feel like the English really want their players to be better than they really are.
I don't exactly know either. It's probably a mixture of that and the fact that good english players are hard to come by in england.
On July 02 2012 05:52 stichtom wrote: WTF, Prandelli... Are u kidding me? No Giovinco or Diamanti, Cassano out and Thiago Motta in? really?
Anyway we played bad and spain played better
Motta came on for Montolivo which was a straight-swap. Putting Giovinco or Diamanti wouldn't have changed anything (well in hindsight it would have since Motta got injured) since they wouldn't have received any service.
On July 02 2012 05:54 ELA wrote: I still commend Italy for getting to the finals - Especially considdering the way they did it.
I think for many years, Italy had become one of the more hated teams because of their defensive play - They really played beautyfully and entertaining. I have gained a ton of respect for italian football after this tournament
you have to consider tho that this playstyle it's quite different from the typical italian, built around what Prandelli wanted - and everyone can see how well the new idea worked out (all clearly stated it it but some few blind ones )
------------------Casillas---------------- -Selassie-Ramos-Bonucci-Alba- ----Pirlo--------Alonso---De Rossi- ----Iniesta---------------------Pilar---- -----------------Balotelli----------------- Or something like that for my dream 11. Coma at me, bros. Shame about the rather underwhelming final. Congrats to Spain. While I don't agree with the way they've played for most of this tourney (4-6-0 makes me destroy furniture, but they did play pretty entertaining in the final to be honest), there's no discussion that this is one of the best teams in history. Let's see if they can extend their maddening run into the WC for 4 major tourneys in a row.
On July 02 2012 05:59 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote: Xavi and Iniesta are the greatest midfield duo of all time.
There is no doubt in my mind whatsoever that this is true.
Hard to argue with that. I'd probably put Busquets in there as well for the greatest trio. He gets a lot of stick for his theatrics (and rightly so), but he's a great player. They have telepathic understanding of one another.
On July 02 2012 06:01 sharkie wrote: Zidane + Makelele is imo better than Xavi and Iniesta, but thats me.
No way they played better as a duo though. Zidane was a better individual than Xavi or iniesta, but the spaniards have an unbelievable understanding as a pair, they're almost telepathic.
This team is the best the world have ever seen. Other countries have a lot of catching up to do. I cant say I'm a fan of the tikitaki-style. However, this have brought them a lot of success and more to come. In the earlier matches i felt like they didn't live up to their full potential and wondered if the Spanish team had lost it's touch the last years. Today the showed how good they really are when everyone is putting in 100% efffort. Too bad Italy had to be so unlucky and get 2 injuries. I dont think Italy would have stood any chance even if they didn't have their players injured, Spain was too good today, no one could have beaten them. However, I'm quite sure the score wouldn't have been 4 - 0.
On July 02 2012 06:01 sharkie wrote: Zidane + Makelele is imo better than Xavi and Iniesta, but thats me.
No way they played better as a duo though. Zidane was a better individual than Xavi or iniesta, but the spaniards have an unbelievable understanding as a pair, they're almost telepathic.
Agreed. I think I would take Zidane over Iniesta (he would go on the bench) but there is no way I would exclude Xavi from an all-time dream team, wouldn't compare Zidane to Xavi
On July 02 2012 06:01 sharkie wrote: Zidane + Makelele is imo better than Xavi and Iniesta, but thats me.
No way they played better as a duo though. Zidane was a better individual than Xavi or iniesta, but the spaniards have an unbelievable understanding as a pair, they're almost telepathic.
Plus, Makelele wasn't in either of the two French winning campaigns in 1998 or 2000. They were both great individually, but they weren't a 'duo' in the sense that Xaviesta is.
The game was superb until Motta got injured. That sucks. Congrats Spain. They might have the greatest national team of all time. At least it's definitely the most impressive national team I've ever seen in my life.
Great game until 60 minutes in when Motta got injured. Despite 4-0 I wouldn't call the game one sided (though admittedly the last 30 minutes were one sided).
Italy played beautiful, matched Spain for 60 minutes from a pure quality of play stand point. Just that Spain are madly efficient. It's like playing against Flash. Even if you play your heart out, 1 mistake or unlucky moment is enough to lose.
On July 02 2012 06:01 sharkie wrote: Zidane + Makelele is imo better than Xavi and Iniesta, but thats me.
No way they played better as a duo though. Zidane was a better individual than Xavi or iniesta, but the spaniards have an unbelievable understanding as a pair, they're almost telepathic.
Agreed. I think I would take Zidane over Iniesta (he would go on the bench) but there is no way I would exclude Xavi from an all-time dream team, wouldn't compare Zidane to Xavi
Zidane wasn't really a central midfielder at all once he left Juventus
Haha Spain should've played like this the rest of the tournament, finally making use of the fact that they have good enough players who can handle 2 v 5 situations and still score.
On July 02 2012 06:01 sharkie wrote: Zidane + Makelele is imo better than Xavi and Iniesta, but thats me.
No way they played better as a duo though. Zidane was a better individual than Xavi or iniesta, but the spaniards have an unbelievable understanding as a pair, they're almost telepathic.
Agreed. I think I would take Zidane over Iniesta (he would go on the bench) but there is no way I would exclude Xavi from an all-time dream team, wouldn't compare Zidane to Xavi
Zidane wasn't really a central midfielder at all once he left Juventus
Yeah that's my point, but Iniesta plays pretty much the same position as Zidane although he moves around a lot so I'm happy to compare Zidane to Iniesta but not Xavi.
Congrats España! Without a doubt the best country and they really showed it in this finaly. Supreme attacking and defending. Legendary team. After the first 2 goals it looked like Italy lost their breath and Spain just kept outplaying them more and more. Gotta give spain executed it perfect.
On July 02 2012 06:10 sharkie wrote: Someone tell me again how Messi could have played for Spain?
He lived in Spain from 12 years old, he has a Spanish passport.
Thiago for example was born in Italy to Brazilian parents but he plays for Spain.
Not to mention of course Motta, Cameronesi, Podolski, Klose, Eduardo, Deco and countless others playing for countries they and their parents weren't born in.
On July 02 2012 06:10 sharkie wrote: Someone tell me again how Messi could have played for Spain?
He lived in Spain from 12 years old, he has a Spanish passport.
Thiago for example was born in Italy to Brazilian parents but he plays for Spain.
Not to mention of course Motta, Cameronesi, Podolski, Klose, Eduardo, Deco and countless others playing for countries they and their parents weren't born in.
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
Now go back to previous threads, you will see that this is the common prediction (Spain getting stomped). So congratulations on staying strong against the wind
On July 02 2012 07:51 Vaelone wrote: Well that was a boring and one sided end to the tournament, Italy just had to play their worst match in the final didn't they.
They play just looked bad becasue Spain was on another level.... Completely different fro group play.... they can out so strong.
I enjoyed the whole game, even if it was very saddening at the 60minute point! Both teams player excellent football and if it was 11v11, now that would have been amazing. None the lease, each team played wonder.
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. FACT: Italy is the only team in the world who has lost against North Korea in a world cup. In fact, Italy is the only team to have never beaten North Korea in a world cup.
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. FACT: Italy is the only team in the world who has lost against North Korea in a world cup. In fact, Italy is the only team to have never beaten North Korea in a world cup.
Chile tied them in 66, the world cup you're referring to. North Korea got out of the group. Has Chile beaten them since?
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. FACT: Italy is the only team in the world who has lost against North Korea in a world cup. In fact, Italy is the only team to have never beaten North Korea in a world cup.
Overall, they played as a team. Everyone has a bad day, and if it's vs Spain, you pay for it. Torres scored when game was over.
On July 02 2012 09:39 ecstatica wrote: Amazing. Absolutely on another level. But overall national teams have declined so much recently, no comparison to elite club football.
I don't think its so much that national teams have declined as the fact that elite clubs have improved alot. Spain and Germany would give any elite club team a significant challenge though - but they would have deficiencies in their preparation since national teams have such little time together.
Another reason why elite clubs perform at a higher standard is because they can go out into the transfer market and fix deficiencies within their teams or to get players to fit a specific playing style. The implications of the Bosman ruling have made top European club sides better and better while national teams remain relatively the same.
On July 02 2012 09:39 ecstatica wrote: Amazing. Absolutely on another level. But overall national teams have declined so much recently, no comparison to elite club football.
I don't think its so much that national teams have declined as the fact that elite clubs have improved alot. Spain and Germany would give any elite club team a significant challenge though - but they would have deficiencies in their preparation since national teams have such little time together.
Another reason why elite clubs perform at a higher standard is because they can go out into the transfer market and fix deficiencies within their teams or to get players to fit a specific playing style. The implications of the Bosman ruling have made top European club sides better and better while national teams remain relatively the same.
I do agree with this to an extent, we can probably meet in the middle. I see clear lack of elite forwards and not many high quality defenders. This new era does suck. Think of not too long ago when every top nation had some world class forwards there - del piero, indzaghi, vieri etc for Italy, raul and morientes for spain, kluivert and bergkamp for holland, owen and shearer and sheringham for england, anelka and henry for france, klinsmann and bierhoff for germany, even damn norway had flo and solskjaer. Defense was just as stacked... Cannavaro, nesta maldini costacurta turam southgate campbell neville brothers de boer stam nadal matthaeus blanc etc etc.
I dont see any of this today. Spains midfield is the most talented group of players past 4-5 years that truly outmatches anything they face. Its been rather bland.
On July 02 2012 09:39 ecstatica wrote: Amazing. Absolutely on another level. But overall national teams have declined so much recently, no comparison to elite club football.
I don't think its so much that national teams have declined as the fact that elite clubs have improved alot. Spain and Germany would give any elite club team a significant challenge though - but they would have deficiencies in their preparation since national teams have such little time together.
Another reason why elite clubs perform at a higher standard is because they can go out into the transfer market and fix deficiencies within their teams or to get players to fit a specific playing style. The implications of the Bosman ruling have made top European club sides better and better while national teams remain relatively the same.
I do agree with this to an extent, we can probably meet in the middle. I see clear lack of elite forwards and not many high quality defenders. This new era does suck. Think of not too long ago when every top nation had some world class forwards there - del piero, indzaghi, vieri etc for Italy, raul and morientes for spain, kluivert and bergkamp for holland, owen and shearer and sheringham for england, anelka and henry for france, klinsmann and bierhoff for germany, even damn norway had flo and solskjaer. Defense was just as stacked... Cannavaro, nesta maldini costacurta turam southgate campbell neville brothers de boer stam nadal matthaeus blanc etc etc.
I dont see any of this today. Spains midfield is the most talented group of players past 4-5 years that truly outmatches anything they face. Its been rather bland.
I think it has more to do with rising parity between elite players all over the world than it does with lesser "great" players. To be truly great you have to do more than ever before, as well as be born with the right body, be seen by the right coaches and so on. Every player at the high levels has multiple trainers and coaches, a dietician etc.
On July 02 2012 09:39 ecstatica wrote: Amazing. Absolutely on another level. But overall national teams have declined so much recently, no comparison to elite club football.
I don't think its so much that national teams have declined as the fact that elite clubs have improved alot. Spain and Germany would give any elite club team a significant challenge though - but they would have deficiencies in their preparation since national teams have such little time together.
Another reason why elite clubs perform at a higher standard is because they can go out into the transfer market and fix deficiencies within their teams or to get players to fit a specific playing style. The implications of the Bosman ruling have made top European club sides better and better while national teams remain relatively the same.
I do agree with this to an extent, we can probably meet in the middle. I see clear lack of elite forwards and not many high quality defenders. This new era does suck. Think of not too long ago when every top nation had some world class forwards there - del piero, indzaghi, vieri etc for Italy, raul and morientes for spain, kluivert and bergkamp for holland, owen and shearer and sheringham for england, anelka and henry for france, klinsmann and bierhoff for germany, even damn norway had flo and solskjaer. Defense was just as stacked... Cannavaro, nesta maldini costacurta turam southgate campbell neville brothers de boer stam nadal matthaeus blanc etc etc.
I dont see any of this today. Spains midfield is the most talented group of players past 4-5 years that truly outmatches anything they face. Its been rather bland.
Central defenders maybe not, but the old fashioned defender hasgone out of fashion for a large part.
Strikers are just as good as they used to be for most national teams. And actually Anelka wasnt much of a national teamer, It was mostly the midfield (Zidane) that won France 98 and Trezeguet, Henry upfront in 2000. They havent been much since then.
You also have to realise that these players developed their legacies over time. Most teams are in a bit of flux right now with most defenders generally very young. Some of them will have their names alongside those guys others wont.
Its not like those greats were infallible unstoppable forces either. They had bad periods and got criticized just like the players today. Just maybe not on the internet.
Now, win the 2014 WC for a 4th major in a row! I think this spanish squad will stay intact, for the most part, and they seem to have no problem staying motivated to win. That would truly be something to behold. Still, many challenges ahead before that can happen. Brazil have a very good, youthful squad (and home advantage), Germany will be looking to finally come good, Italy will always be a threat (unless they pull a 2010), and Argentina can be a real threat if they sort out their defence, and learn to get their superstar attackers to click. Many other good teams will be there as well, I'm sure. All in all, I'm super psyched! 2014 can't come soon enough.
Just because it finished 4-0 does not mean Italy did nothing. They actually played pretty good even at 0-2 but couldn't get the ball in the net. Then they were terribly unlucky that thiago motta got injured, while previously chiellini has been injured as well, and that's when they stopped playing and only wanted the match to end. The last two goals were easy because Italy didn't do anything anymore, they were completely down.
I really didn't expect this outcome at all. Spain wasn't what they used to be and made it to the finals with mediocre play, while Italy performed very well in the last two games, even soundly beating tournament favorite Germany. My guess was ITA 2:1 ESP. It just felt like Italy deserved the title more. Then, suddenly, Spain turned it up. They were their former unbeatable selves who stomped all over the last two major tournaments and brought on the ownage. There was no stopping Spain, they were clearly not gonna be beaten yesterday. Still, I think 4:0 was too much. 2:0 would have sufficed. Also, the Golden Boot for Torres of all people is funny.
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
I will say this, I dont know how many chances Netherlands had where they could have had a better opportunity for goal, but when Robben decides to go for it himself. Their last game, where Robben passes instead of trying himself, instantly goal. Same goes for Ronaldo. The games pretty much narrows down to if their star had a good day at work. 2-0 for italy, Balotelli shines, 3-2 for Portugal Ronaldo shines. All the 0 games, they had plenty of chances, but blew all of them. And many of the chances could have been goal if it wasnt for their ego. (though I admit it is easy to say when watching the everything from TV)
On July 02 2012 16:26 Scorch wrote: I really didn't expect this outcome at all. Spain wasn't what they used to be and made it to the finals with mediocre play, while Italy performed very well in the last two games, even soundly beating tournament favorite Germany. My guess was ITA 2:1 ESP. It just felt like Italy deserved the title more. Then, suddenly, Spain turned it up. They were their former unbeatable selves who stomped all over the last two major tournaments and brought on the ownage. There was no stopping Spain, they were clearly not gonna be beaten yesterday. Still, I think 4:0 was too much. 2:0 would have sufficed. Also, the Golden Boot for Torres of all people is funny.
It was not mediocre play. They played enough to win the other games and then passed the ball, saving strenght and avoiding giving chances against. Still most games they were looking for openings without forcing that much after a goal but you also need to factor in that most other teams went defense heavy against them.
I really fail to see why people call spanish play this tournament mediocre. Not super fast from 0 to 90 every game in favour of a more mature possession and safe chances? Sure. Mediocre? I dont see it.
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. FACT: Italy is the only team in the world who has lost against North Korea in a world cup. In fact, Italy is the only team to have never beaten North Korea in a world cup.
Fact: Italy are four time world champions. Fact as well: It was the worst result of a final in a Euro. And a world cup if you think 4-0 is worse than 5-2. Fact for Brazil 2014: No european team has ever been able to win a world cup in America.
On July 02 2012 21:27 Mephiztopheles1 wrote: Fact for Brazil 2014: No european team has ever been able to win a world cup in America.
True, Europeans are 0 for 7 in WC held in Americas, but it's not like South Americans are that much better either. They are 1 for 10 in WC held in Europe.
On July 02 2012 21:27 Mephiztopheles1 wrote: Fact for Brazil 2014: No european team has ever been able to win a world cup in America.
True, Europeans are 0 for 7 in WC held in Americas, but it's not like South Americans are that much better either. They are 1 for 10 in WC held in Europe.
If spain get a few young players through of equal skill to jordi alba then they will defend their world cup
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. FACT: Italy is the only team in the world who has lost against North Korea in a world cup. In fact, Italy is the only team to have never beaten North Korea in a world cup.
Fact: Italy are four time world champions. Fact as well: It was the worst result of a final in a Euro. And a world cup if you think 4-0 is worse than 5-2. Fact for Brazil 2014: No european team has ever been able to win a world cup in America.
FACT: Torres scored against Italy. It only shows how pathetic they preformed compared to three weeks ago. Fact: You are mad as hell.
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. FACT: Italy is the only team in the world who has lost against North Korea in a world cup. In fact, Italy is the only team to have never beaten North Korea in a world cup.
Fact: Italy are four time world champions. Fact as well: It was the worst result of a final in a Euro. And a world cup if you think 4-0 is worse than 5-2. Fact for Brazil 2014: No european team has ever been able to win a world cup in America.
FACT: Torres scored against Italy. It only shows how pathetic they preformed compared to three weeks ago. Fact: You are mad as hell.
yeah...he scored against a demoralized italy with only 10 players left due to injury. You can't just ignore the loss of a player like that
On July 02 2012 07:36 ThePhan2m wrote: as predicted
On June 21 2012 01:14 ThePhan2m wrote: Spain will win this whole championship
Yesterday this italian dude in my gym was so psyched about Italy was going to own spain. He was like Italy 3 - 0 Spain, and I was laughing inside. Most of the others were like, its gonna be tough but 1-0 or 2-0 to Spain. I predicted 3-0 to Spain. They're on a different league tbh. (when Torres plays ofc ;D) They are a true team! not a one man ego show (Ronaldo / Balotelli / Rooney / Robben)
You seriously believe Portugal, Italy and Netherlands are one man ego shows?
Only Italy performed as a real team. Rest relied on their superstars.
LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. FACT: Italy is the only team in the world who has lost against North Korea in a world cup. In fact, Italy is the only team to have never beaten North Korea in a world cup.
Fact: Italy are four time world champions. Fact as well: It was the worst result of a final in a Euro. And a world cup if you think 4-0 is worse than 5-2. Fact for Brazil 2014: No european team has ever been able to win a world cup in America.
FACT: Torres scored against Italy. It only shows how pathetic they preformed compared to three weeks ago. Fact: You are mad as hell.
yeah...he scored against a demoralized italy with only 10 players left due to injury. You can't just ignore the loss of a player like that
On July 02 2012 16:26 Scorch wrote: I really didn't expect this outcome at all. Spain wasn't what they used to be and made it to the finals with mediocre play, while Italy performed very well in the last two games, even soundly beating tournament favorite Germany. My guess was ITA 2:1 ESP. It just felt like Italy deserved the title more. Then, suddenly, Spain turned it up. They were their former unbeatable selves who stomped all over the last two major tournaments and brought on the ownage. There was no stopping Spain, they were clearly not gonna be beaten yesterday. Still, I think 4:0 was too much. 2:0 would have sufficed.
LOL 4-0 was too hurtful to you? How are Spain not the favourites?
Obligatory lol video (that doesn't involve Italy)
hahaha all the Torres reverse Italy bashing is sooo funny
I don't get why people are like spain sucked this tournament, fact is they sucked at the world cup as well played very sub par most games and still won due to moments of magical brilliance, the did not dominate that tournament at all, same happened again and in the final they played to the potential they showed in 2008 and totally dominated a very good italian side, same probably would of happened to Germany as their defence is horrible.
like I said if spain have more players coming through like jordi alba they will win the world cup again and be the first euro nation to win a cup in america and defend it
On July 03 2012 01:38 Fleuria wrote: I don't get why people are like spain sucked this tournament, fact is they sucked at the world cup as well played very sub par most games and still won due to moments of magical brilliance, the did not dominate that tournament at all, same happened again and in the final they played to the potential they showed in 2008 and totally dominated a very good italian side, same probably would of happened to Germany as their defence is horrible.
like I said if spain have more players coming through like jordi alba they will win the world cup again and be the first euro nation to win a cup in america and defend it
a team that sucks for the most part of the tournaments doesn't win 3 tournaments in a row unless they are the luckiest team in the history. And if that's the case why would you predict them to win next world cup? Makes no sense to me.
On July 02 2012 09:39 ecstatica wrote: Amazing. Absolutely on another level. But overall national teams have declined so much recently, no comparison to elite club football.
I don't think its so much that national teams have declined as the fact that elite clubs have improved alot. Spain and Germany would give any elite club team a significant challenge though - but they would have deficiencies in their preparation since national teams have such little time together.
Another reason why elite clubs perform at a higher standard is because they can go out into the transfer market and fix deficiencies within their teams or to get players to fit a specific playing style. The implications of the Bosman ruling have made top European club sides better and better while national teams remain relatively the same.
I do agree with this to an extent, we can probably meet in the middle. I see clear lack of elite forwards and not many high quality defenders. This new era does suck. Think of not too long ago when every top nation had some world class forwards there - del piero, indzaghi, vieri etc for Italy, raul and morientes for spain, kluivert and bergkamp for holland, owen and shearer and sheringham for england, anelka and henry for france, klinsmann and bierhoff for germany, even damn norway had flo and solskjaer. Defense was just as stacked... Cannavaro, nesta maldini costacurta turam southgate campbell neville brothers de boer stam nadal matthaeus blanc etc etc.
I dont see any of this today. Spains midfield is the most talented group of players past 4-5 years that truly outmatches anything they face. Its been rather bland.
Central defenders maybe not, but the old fashioned defender hasgone out of fashion for a large part.
Strikers are just as good as they used to be for most national teams. And actually Anelka wasnt much of a national teamer, It was mostly the midfield (Zidane) that won France 98 and Trezeguet, Henry upfront in 2000. They havent been much since then.
You also have to realise that these players developed their legacies over time. Most teams are in a bit of flux right now with most defenders generally very young. Some of them will have their names alongside those guys others wont.
Its not like those greats were infallible unstoppable forces either. They had bad periods and got criticized just like the players today. Just maybe not on the internet.
Yeah I'm willing to accept this POV if you list those strikers for Euro teams here, you cant list Shevchenko either since he's way oldschool. Can Gomez go to toughest national league and become a top scorer like Sheva or Bierhoff did? Can Balotelli be compared to even second-tier Italian forwards from even 10 years ago? Where are those good strikers you talk about, you can argue for Rooney but is that really it?
You're saying many players are young and they need time, but where did older players go that are supposed to be in the primes? Look at this: http://www.planetworldcup.com/CUPS/1998/squad_hol98.html - EVERY player was a star, both for their club and internationally. And they weren't always favored to win, because other teams were just as ridiculous. I don't see anything remotely close to this, maybe, undeservedly, I have no respect for those "up-and-coming" players, but it is looking sooo bleak versus what it used to be.
Spain doesn't suck for christs sake. Are you people blind or mad or both? It's just that they are so much better than the rest, that they can win without even trying, so that's what they do(games vs france and portugal). They recognised a worthy opponent in italy and stepped up a notch and it wasn't pretty for the italians.
On July 02 2012 16:08 Telcontar wrote: Now, win the 2014 WC for a 4th major in a row! I think this spanish squad will stay intact, for the most part, and they seem to have no problem staying motivated to win. That would truly be something to behold. Still, many challenges ahead before that can happen. Brazil have a very good, youthful squad (and home advantage), Germany will be looking to finally come good, Italy will always be a threat (unless they pull a 2010), and Argentina can be a real threat if they sort out their defence, and learn to get their superstar attackers to click. Many other good teams will be there as well, I'm sure. All in all, I'm super psyched! 2014 can't come soon enough.
For the most part I see no reason they can't win again.
Xavi - 34 Puyol - 36 Villa - 32 Torres - 30.
I think only really Puyol is going to miss out on the World Cup but given they just won this without him and have the wonderful Javi Martinez (who's surely moving to a top club sooner rather than later).
Xavi is more touch and go but he's not exactly a player who needs pace and Pirlo just showed a player of his ilk can do just fine.
If Xavi does decline they've got Thiago, Ander Herrera, Fabregas, Itturaspe and others all lying in wait to take his place.
Spain won the last World Youth Cup too and word from the Le Masia is that the Iniesta/Busquets/Fabregas/Pedro/Alba generation are pretty good, but the next generation coming through is even better.
Brazil don't have the same talent they once had and the pressure on them will be phenomenal. Argentina can't defend so it's likely to be another Messi solo effort. Germany should be there or there about's if they learn to defend. Italy need to replace Pirlo who looks set to retire. There's a long time to go but Spain look really fucking good to take it again.
On July 02 2012 09:39 ecstatica wrote: Amazing. Absolutely on another level. But overall national teams have declined so much recently, no comparison to elite club football.
I don't think its so much that national teams have declined as the fact that elite clubs have improved alot. Spain and Germany would give any elite club team a significant challenge though - but they would have deficiencies in their preparation since national teams have such little time together.
Another reason why elite clubs perform at a higher standard is because they can go out into the transfer market and fix deficiencies within their teams or to get players to fit a specific playing style. The implications of the Bosman ruling have made top European club sides better and better while national teams remain relatively the same.
I do agree with this to an extent, we can probably meet in the middle. I see clear lack of elite forwards and not many high quality defenders. This new era does suck. Think of not too long ago when every top nation had some world class forwards there - del piero, indzaghi, vieri etc for Italy, raul and morientes for spain, kluivert and bergkamp for holland, owen and shearer and sheringham for england, anelka and henry for france, klinsmann and bierhoff for germany, even damn norway had flo and solskjaer. Defense was just as stacked... Cannavaro, nesta maldini costacurta turam southgate campbell neville brothers de boer stam nadal matthaeus blanc etc etc.
I dont see any of this today. Spains midfield is the most talented group of players past 4-5 years that truly outmatches anything they face. Its been rather bland.
Central defenders maybe not, but the old fashioned defender hasgone out of fashion for a large part.
Strikers are just as good as they used to be for most national teams. And actually Anelka wasnt much of a national teamer, It was mostly the midfield (Zidane) that won France 98 and Trezeguet, Henry upfront in 2000. They havent been much since then.
You also have to realise that these players developed their legacies over time. Most teams are in a bit of flux right now with most defenders generally very young. Some of them will have their names alongside those guys others wont.
Its not like those greats were infallible unstoppable forces either. They had bad periods and got criticized just like the players today. Just maybe not on the internet.
Yeah I'm willing to accept this POV if you list those strikers for Euro teams here, you cant list Shevchenko either since he's way oldschool. Can Gomez go to toughest national league and become a top scorer like Sheva or Bierhoff did? Can Balotelli be compared to even second-tier Italian forwards from even 10 years ago? Where are those good strikers you talk about, you can argue for Rooney but is that really it?
You're saying many players are young and they need time, but where did older players go that are supposed to be in the primes? Look at this: http://www.planetworldcup.com/CUPS/1998/squad_hol98.html - EVERY player was a star, both for their club and internationally. And they weren't always favored to win, because other teams were just as ridiculous. I don't see anything remotely close to this, maybe, undeservedly, I have no respect for those "up-and-coming" players, but it is looking sooo bleak versus what it used to be.
Rose tinted glasses all i can say. Im pretty sure i can safely say ive seen those guys play and ive seen these guys play, the game just within the last decade has become harder mechanically, tactically and fitness wise. Its harder to stand out especially with those 2 hammering records out like its nobodies business. I get th feeling you havent seen to many of those guys on the roster you just linked day in day out and are running more on thier names and records. Cant argue with that.
Tell you what though. Ill play. Its funny you pointed out that dutch team because that was my favourite team back then and heaviliy influenced Van Gaals Barca, just like all of Van Gaals teams. Which he then proceeds to become unhappy with and fucks up.. anyway...
Van Der Sar. Didnt really have much of a billing till he went to United late in his career and the start when he was at Ajax. Got thrown out when Gigi came in at Juve. Wasnt much of a "legend" till his time at United. National steam mainstay only by virtue of no real competition. He aged better than any keeper I can think of though.
Haah Reizeiger. Mediocre defender played for Barca for a bit nothing special.
Staam. Better than your average central defender round about the Laurent Blancs but not as good. Had a miserable time at United, bobbled around in Italy to the end of his career. Again got a lot of fanfare because Dutch football domestically was solid in the early 90s when he came up.
The De Boer brothers were no stars anywhere they were again average plays. I dont even know what would make them stars on any team and again Barcelona with their dutch heavy input had seen quite a fair bit of them. They are respected for their high IQ and great service to their teams. But they never "starred" or were considered superb players. Just solid.
Cocu, solid holding midfielder, again nothing special or star worthy about him either. Another 1 who gave Barca some good years. Achieved very little because the team was terrible most of the time.
Kluivert. Decent at Barca, another one whose career fizzled out doing pretty much nothing at places like Newcastle and Valencia. Another one who benefitted from Ajax being the shit. No more of a star than Gomez although Ill give you he was probably a better player, I dont think Gomez is that good. But thats not saying much for Kluivert. Had some star billing for a while nothing explosive.
Overmars, Zenden. Hopped around different clubs Arsenal Barca for Overmars after Ajax, flopped miserably. Old fashioned winger I liked him. Didnt do much. Same for Zender different clubs.
Ooijer was just mediocrish to average.. not much to say. Big, strong thats about it.
Van Hooijdonk, never left an impression outside Feyenoord. (I liked him) but again if your a star in that setup woo kudos.
Hasselbank actually had a great career but never got it on for the dutch. Again never won anything but pretty good striker for his time. Kinda like Kevin Philips in the EPL. Score lots of goals, teams get nowhere.
Van Bronckhorst didnt even start for that 98 team. But yeah he was great. But again nothing star worthy (one of my personal favourites again) but realistically he was an above average left back with a bullet foot.
Bergamp Davidz and Seedorf are legends for me yeah, achieved great things with great teams and were always integral to the success of their league sides. So theres your "every player was a star".
Maybe you shouldve picked France or Brazil from that rosters. Outside of those two teams none of them were "stacked" with stars. (and most of those french guys went on to be stars post world cup mind you, and alot of them didnt (Duggary et al).
I dont like Balotelli much but if your telling me that Pipo Inzaghi was a better "overall" talent for all his greatness then I dont really know what to say.
On July 03 2012 01:38 Fleuria wrote: I don't get why people are like spain sucked this tournament, fact is they sucked at the world cup as well played very sub par most games and still won due to moments of magical brilliance, the did not dominate that tournament at all, same happened again and in the final they played to the potential they showed in 2008 and totally dominated a very good italian side, same probably would of happened to Germany as their defence is horrible.
like I said if spain have more players coming through like jordi alba they will win the world cup again and be the first euro nation to win a cup in america and defend it
a team that sucks for the most part of the tournaments doesn't win 3 tournaments in a row unless they are the luckiest team in the history. And if that's the case why would you predict them to win next world cup? Makes no sense to me.
Didn't mean it like that at all, just saying that they didn't perform up to par with the performance in 2008 in both of the last 2 tournaments, they are still better than the rest of the world even if they don't perform and thus thats the reason why they have the titles
as for predicting them to win the world cup, they have the players that can perform brilliantly but they just need a few more younger players to edge out the old guard.
It's amazing how much "changes" in football in retrospect.
Suddenly Italy is the shit because they played a decent game against an unlucky German side who had a weak game.
Suddenly Germany's defense sucks because they received 2 unnecessary goals in their last game.
Suddenly Spain played a perfect tournament because they won 4-0 in the finals.
Just some fun facts to put things into perspective again:
Italy played a rather poor group stage. They had a strong game vs Spain but failed to live up to the same quality against Croatia and Ireland. Versus England they had to resort to penalties because they were unable to score a single goal in 120 minutes despite dominating huge parts of the match. You do not want that. Anything can happen in penalties, even against England.
Germany played a very strong group stage. They won all their games against strong opposition with a goal difference of 5-2. Yes, even an admittedly out of shape looking Netherlands is no pushover, while Denmark's strength was shown when they pushed Portugal to their limits.
The German team went on to score 4, in letters f-o-u-r, goals against Greece in the quarter finals. Now you can say what you want against Greece, but those guys sure aren't prone to receiving goals. If they lose it's usually 1-0 or 2-1 max. Germany themselves only received one goal which was caused by a mistake up front, not by a poor defense. The other goal Greek side scored that game was from a questionable handball penalty.
In beating Greece the Germans set a world record for the longest winning streak in competitive games. All the more reason they had to lose at some point. To make a long story short: You don't achieve all that if your defense is worthless.
Spain played a rather mediocre tournament up the finals. They almost lost tt Italy and barely won against Croatia in the group stages. Did they curbstomp Ireland? Yes. An achievement? Hardly. In the quarterfinals the Spaniards simply outclassed France at every corner. A strong showing and well deserved win.
In the semi finals however, things were looking a little different when a strong Portuguese side gave Spain loads of trouble. After 120 minutes of a hard fought battle I don't think anyone would have considered it unfair if Portugal had won that match. In the end the game was decided penalties and again: You do not want to take that chance if you can avoid it. Thus any arguments that Spain only played as good as they had to up to that point are not really making sense.
After all is said and done, Spain is the well deserved winner of this tournament after a furious final match. However what I wanted to point out with this post is that people tend to put too much weight on the last few or even the last game of a team and lose track of the bigger picture. Looking at said picture it is with good reason that so many people dreamed of a final between Spain and Germany.
On July 02 2012 09:39 ecstatica wrote: Amazing. Absolutely on another level. But overall national teams have declined so much recently, no comparison to elite club football.
I don't think its so much that national teams have declined as the fact that elite clubs have improved alot. Spain and Germany would give any elite club team a significant challenge though - but they would have deficiencies in their preparation since national teams have such little time together.
Another reason why elite clubs perform at a higher standard is because they can go out into the transfer market and fix deficiencies within their teams or to get players to fit a specific playing style. The implications of the Bosman ruling have made top European club sides better and better while national teams remain relatively the same.
I do agree with this to an extent, we can probably meet in the middle. I see clear lack of elite forwards and not many high quality defenders. This new era does suck. Think of not too long ago when every top nation had some world class forwards there - del piero, indzaghi, vieri etc for Italy, raul and morientes for spain, kluivert and bergkamp for holland, owen and shearer and sheringham for england, anelka and henry for france, klinsmann and bierhoff for germany, even damn norway had flo and solskjaer. Defense was just as stacked... Cannavaro, nesta maldini costacurta turam southgate campbell neville brothers de boer stam nadal matthaeus blanc etc etc.
I dont see any of this today. Spains midfield is the most talented group of players past 4-5 years that truly outmatches anything they face. Its been rather bland.
Central defenders maybe not, but the old fashioned defender hasgone out of fashion for a large part.
Strikers are just as good as they used to be for most national teams. And actually Anelka wasnt much of a national teamer, It was mostly the midfield (Zidane) that won France 98 and Trezeguet, Henry upfront in 2000. They havent been much since then.
You also have to realise that these players developed their legacies over time. Most teams are in a bit of flux right now with most defenders generally very young. Some of them will have their names alongside those guys others wont.
Its not like those greats were infallible unstoppable forces either. They had bad periods and got criticized just like the players today. Just maybe not on the internet.
Yeah I'm willing to accept this POV if you list those strikers for Euro teams here, you cant list Shevchenko either since he's way oldschool. Can Gomez go to toughest national league and become a top scorer like Sheva or Bierhoff did? Can Balotelli be compared to even second-tier Italian forwards from even 10 years ago? Where are those good strikers you talk about, you can argue for Rooney but is that really it?
You're saying many players are young and they need time, but where did older players go that are supposed to be in the primes? Look at this: http://www.planetworldcup.com/CUPS/1998/squad_hol98.html - EVERY player was a star, both for their club and internationally. And they weren't always favored to win, because other teams were just as ridiculous. I don't see anything remotely close to this, maybe, undeservedly, I have no respect for those "up-and-coming" players, but it is looking sooo bleak versus what it used to be.
Rose tinted glasses all i can say. Im pretty sure i can safely say ive seen those guys play and ive seen these guys play, the game just within the last decade has become harder mechanically, tactically and fitness wise. Its harder to stand out especially with those 2 hammering records out like its nobodies business. I get th feeling you havent seen to many of those guys on the roster you just linked day in day out and are running more on thier names and records. Cant argue with that.
Tell you what though. Ill play. Its funny you pointed out that dutch team because that was my favourite team back then and heaviliy influenced Van Gaals Barca, just like all of Van Gaals teams. Which he then proceeds to become unhappy with and fucks up.. anyway...
Van Der Sar. Didnt really have much of a billing till he went to United late in his career and the start when he was at Ajax. Got thrown out when Gigi came in at Juve. Wasnt much of a "legend" till his time at United. National steam mainstay only by virtue of no real competition. He aged better than any keeper I can think of though.
Haah Reizeiger. Mediocre defender played for Barca for a bit nothing special.
Staam. Better than your average central defender round about the Laurent Blancs but not as good. Had a miserable time at United, bobbled around in Italy to the end of his career. Again got a lot of fanfare because Dutch football domestically was solid in the early 90s when he came up.
The De Boer brothers were no stars anywhere they were again average plays. I dont even know what would make them stars on any team and again Barcelona with their dutch heavy input had seen quite a fair bit of them. They are respected for their high IQ and great service to their teams. But they never "starred" or were considered superb players. Just solid.
Cocu, solid holding midfielder, again nothing special or star worthy about him either. Another 1 who gave Barca some good years. Achieved very little because the team was terrible most of the time.
Kluivert. Decent at Barca, another one whose career fizzled out doing pretty much nothing at places like Newcastle and Valencia. Another one who benefitted from Ajax being the shit. No more of a star than Gomez although Ill give you he was probably a better player, I dont think Gomez is that good. But thats not saying much for Kluivert. Had some star billing for a while nothing explosive.
Overmars, Zenden. Hopped around different clubs Arsenal Barca for Overmars after Ajax, flopped miserably. Old fashioned winger I liked him. Didnt do much. Same for Zender different clubs.
Ooijer was just mediocrish to average.. not much to say. Big, strong thats about it.
Van Hooijdonk, never left an impression outside Feyenoord. (I liked him) but again if your a star in that setup woo kudos.
Hasselbank actually had a great career but never got it on for the dutch. Again never won anything but pretty good striker for his time. Kinda like Kevin Philips in the EPL. Score lots of goals, teams get nowhere.
Van Bronckhorst didnt even start for that 98 team. But yeah he was great. But again nothing star worthy (one of my personal favourites again) but realistically he was an above average left back with a bullet foot.
Bergamp Davidz and Seedorf are legends for me yeah, achieved great things with great teams and were always integral to the success of their league sides. So theres your "every player was a star".
Maybe you shouldve picked France or Brazil from that rosters. Outside of those two teams none of them were "stacked" with stars. (and most of those french guys went on to be stars post world cup mind you, and alot of them didnt (Duggary et al).
I dont like Balotelli much but if your telling me that Pipo Inzaghi was a better "overall" talent for all his greatness then I dont really know what to say.
Perfect assessment aside from Stam who was phenomenal for us at United, he just fell out with SAF but it's not at all uncommon for United fans rate Stam above Ferdinand such is the regard we hold him in.
Also Frank De Boer was a brilliant centre back. If he were playing today he'd be one of the worlds best (such is the total lack of great centre backs in the current game). Ronald was a jobber though.
You can 100% bet this kid wasn't actually an adult in 98 watching those teams. Holland were very poor after the Van Basten/Rijkaard era fizzled out by Euro 96 until Euro 2000 when the Davids/Seedorf/Bergkamp era came of age.
Fact: we lost. Spain won and played much better than we did. Get over it broskis. Lets console ourselves with the fact that we got to the final match, beating England and Germany. GG Spain.
Italy has nothing to be ashamed of. They were in a difficult spot coming in, but not only did they get to the final, they were never behind up until the final, not to mention they were the only team to score against Spain.
I don't particularly care for Spain and wanted Italy to win just for the underdog upset, but in the end Italy was just dominated in the finals and that's that. Italy played a great tournament but in the end Spain took them out. gg.
On July 02 2012 08:46 carloselcoco wrote: LOL a real team that loses 4-0 in the finals... Italy's defense was made up by 11 year old kids who were just learning how to defend. You know that your defense sucks when Torres scores against you. .
Spain played better than any rival they were up against, they deserve to be Eurocup Champions, playing without their best defender, best striker and with their best midfielder in a terrible shape.
Brazil don't have the same talent they once had and the pressure on them will be phenomenal. Argentina can't defend so it's likely to be another Messi solo effort. Germany should be there or there about's if they learn to defend. Italy need to replace Pirlo who looks set to retire. There's a long time to go but Spain look really fucking good to take it again.
Brazil still has more than enough talent, they just don't get as much exposure because they are staying in Brazil instead of getting traded to the european clubs where they are hyped to legendary status.
EPT
![[image loading]](http://www.indiastudychannel.com/attachments/Resources/147419-141121-euro_2012.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img.uefa.com/imgml/flags/50x50/ESP.png)
![[image loading]](http://img.uefa.com/imgml/flags/50x50/ITA.png)
![[image loading]](http://img.skysports.com/football/badges/64/1066.png)
![[image loading]](http://img.skysports.com/football/badges/64/881.png)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/R3quC.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img.uefa.com/imgml//MC/common/comparison/ball30.png)
Silva 13min
please
butthurt?![[image loading]](http://i.minus.com/i1YNv0SJSASsM.gif)
![[image loading]](http://s018.radikal.ru/i513/1206/2f/41d45d08cacf.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6du9lU23y1rr7t27o1_500.gif)
![[image loading]](http://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/full/609438673.png?key=559326&Expires=1341183101&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIYVGSUJFNRFZBBTA&Signature=OvpROBUzMwVw9OhpBb3eTAnfvGNzLFRA6ZcwWHdfrEa1zV5SNIzFAdDoJruYvj8kpVjb7UjjFTc0~WJUyqbK7FrXfM6rLkQ37SwJE3~Qn2D7QlIlUrkKVe8zaKjjszbSNliA8Xv8jgG0e2j~hEJOA2-IHKks19ornK~CDSMX8wo_)
![[image loading]](https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/s720x720/532309_4161295149850_1633728106_n.jpg)
![[image loading]](https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/557195_391624174229837_1762273522_n.jpg)
