• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 14:22
CET 20:22
KST 04:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview8RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12
Community News
ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career !4Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win4Weekly Cups (Dec 1-7): Clem doubles, Solar gets over the hump1Weekly Cups (Nov 24-30): MaxPax, Clem, herO win2BGE Stara Zagora 2026 announced15
StarCraft 2
General
ComeBackTV's documentary on Byun's Career ! When will we find out if there are more tournament Weekly Cups (Dec 8-14): MaxPax, Clem, Cure win Did they add GM to 2v2? RSL Revival - 2025 Season Finals Preview
Tourneys
RSL Offline Finals Info - Dec 13 and 14! Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Winter Warp Gate Amateur Showdown #1: Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 504 Retribution Mutation # 503 Fowl Play Mutation # 502 Negative Reinforcement Mutation # 501 Price of Progress
Brood War
General
How Rain Became ProGamer in Just 3 Months FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [BSL21] RO8 Bracket & Prediction Contest BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] WB SEMIFINALS - Saturday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO8 - Day 2 - Sunday 21:00 CET [ASL20] Grand Finals
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers Fighting Spirit mining rates
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Survivor II: The Amazon Sengoku Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI Russo-Ukrainian War Thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TL+ Announced Where to ask questions and add stream?
Blogs
The (Hidden) Drug Problem in…
TrAiDoS
I decided to write a webnov…
DjKniteX
James Bond movies ranking - pa…
Topin
Thanks for the RSL
Hildegard
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1823 users

The Ultimate Mouse Thread - Page 175

Forum Index > Tech Support
Post a Reply
Prev 1 173 174 175 176 177 246 Next
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20322 Posts
July 03 2014 00:46 GMT
#3481
You might be interested in CM Storm Spawn. I say that a lot though cause it's one of my favorite mouse shells >.>

the cable is 2 meters
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Thalandros
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
Netherlands1151 Posts
July 03 2014 04:46 GMT
#3482
On July 03 2014 09:06 aax5 wrote:
Hi there, I'm very used to cheap desktop mice that are meant for everyday use, but I would like to upgrade to a middle tier gamer mouse.
1. What's your grip style?
Claw/Palm where I have a claw on the first two buttons, but my palm doesn't contact the mouse. I'm used to cheap mice though, so I can adjust if need be.
2. What's your sensitivity?
Low to medium, though that's mainly since I've only used very cheap mice ($5-20 max)
3. What's your maximum budget?
$30-40, though it can be stretched
4. Do you want additional buttons?
No, I've never used them before, I don't think they will be useful.
5. What games do you play?
League of Legends mainly
6. Do you mind angle snapping?
Doesn't really matter
7. Other relevant information: Needs at least a 5 ft cord if not cordless, preferably longer since my setup has an overly sized desk with computer pretty far from the mouse.



G400s is an amazing pickup. It's quite large though but feels amazing, claw grip is great on it (palm even more but I don't palm grip it at all.) Max DPI is 4000, and is rated to have a perfect optical sensor. No jitter or acceleration or anything.

The CM storm spawn is good if you're in the US, and for the price that they're offering you can't really go wrong with it I suppose!
|| ''I think we have all experienced passion that is not in any sense reasonable.'' ||
wptlzkwjd
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada1240 Posts
July 03 2014 05:37 GMT
#3483
CM Xornet is a cheaper alternative to the Spawn if you're really concerned with cost.
Feel free to add me on steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/MagnusAskeland/
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20322 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-03 06:38:16
July 03 2014 06:37 GMT
#3484
On July 03 2014 14:37 wptlzkwjd wrote:
CM Xornet is a cheaper alternative to the Spawn if you're really concerned with cost.


Recently, the spawn has been even cheaper at times than the xornet in US, ~17.99 shipped after rebate IIRC. It's 30-something now on newegg so less of a deal but hey, it'd be worth a lot more if you've tried the shell and know that you like it, with the price of some mice these days
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
c0ldfusion
Profile Joined October 2010
United States8293 Posts
July 03 2014 14:25 GMT
#3485
Hey I have a question. I have the death adder but it's a little too big for my hand. Aside from the size, I like the fit in terms of its shape and feel. Is there a good accurate, cheap gaming mouse that's smaller than the death adder but has a similar shape? Thanks!
c0ldfusion
Profile Joined October 2010
United States8293 Posts
July 03 2014 14:28 GMT
#3486
On June 21 2014 08:10 ZeromuS wrote:
My razer Deathadder just died.

The thing I didn't like about my deathadder was the fact I couldn't set it to 800dpi without opening the razer software.

Claw grip style, 800dpi is what I am most comfortable with mostly playing sc2, some shooters on the side.

What mouse would you guys recommend to me? I am hoping to grab it in a couple hours if possible because I wanted to play some tonight as its the only time I actually have free for the next little while.

Thanks!

Oh god, I've had 3 razer mice die on me now. WTF is up with the quality of their construction?
My decade old microsoft optical mouse still works.
Nimix
Profile Joined October 2011
France1809 Posts
July 03 2014 14:48 GMT
#3487
On July 03 2014 23:25 c0ldfusion wrote:
Hey I have a question. I have the death adder but it's a little too big for my hand. Aside from the size, I like the fit in terms of its shape and feel. Is there a good accurate, cheap gaming mouse that's smaller than the death adder but has a similar shape? Thanks!


The Steelseries Rival is lower in terms of profile but is pretty long too. It's not too expensive (around 50 euros IIRC), maybe see if a store near you has it available to try the shape.
aax5
Profile Joined August 2011
United States54 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-03 21:04:11
July 03 2014 20:55 GMT
#3488
On July 03 2014 13:46 Thalandros wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 03 2014 09:06 aax5 wrote:
Hi there, I'm very used to cheap desktop mice that are meant for everyday use, but I would like to upgrade to a middle tier gamer mouse.
1. What's your grip style?
Claw/Palm where I have a claw on the first two buttons, but my palm doesn't contact the mouse. I'm used to cheap mice though, so I can adjust if need be.
2. What's your sensitivity?
Low to medium, though that's mainly since I've only used very cheap mice ($5-20 max)
3. What's your maximum budget?
$30-40, though it can be stretched
4. Do you want additional buttons?
No, I've never used them before, I don't think they will be useful.
5. What games do you play?
League of Legends mainly
6. Do you mind angle snapping?
Doesn't really matter
7. Other relevant information: Needs at least a 5 ft cord if not cordless, preferably longer since my setup has an overly sized desk with computer pretty far from the mouse.



G400s is an amazing pickup. It's quite large though but feels amazing, claw grip is great on it (palm even more but I don't palm grip it at all.) Max DPI is 4000, and is rated to have a perfect optical sensor. No jitter or acceleration or anything.

The CM storm spawn is good if you're in the US, and for the price that they're offering you can't really go wrong with it I suppose!


I'm thinking about picking up the CM Storm Xornet, but I have three questions:

1. What's the difference between the storm and the spawn? I'm used to around 500-1000 dpi (shitty mice) so that isn't too much of an issue for me.

2. Is a mouse pad important when using them? So far I've been playing without one on a wood table. It seems to work out fine for now, but I get dust sticking to the bottom of my mouse.

3. How durable are these gaming mice? I want to get a mouse that will last at least two or so years under pretty heavy abuse.

Thanks for the help, I really have no clue about mice that don't come with the computer/dollar store.
Tossim111
Profile Joined October 2009
United States246 Posts
July 03 2014 22:36 GMT
#3489
On July 04 2014 05:55 aax5 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 03 2014 13:46 Thalandros wrote:
On July 03 2014 09:06 aax5 wrote:
Hi there, I'm very used to cheap desktop mice that are meant for everyday use, but I would like to upgrade to a middle tier gamer mouse.
1. What's your grip style?
Claw/Palm where I have a claw on the first two buttons, but my palm doesn't contact the mouse. I'm used to cheap mice though, so I can adjust if need be.
2. What's your sensitivity?
Low to medium, though that's mainly since I've only used very cheap mice ($5-20 max)
3. What's your maximum budget?
$30-40, though it can be stretched
4. Do you want additional buttons?
No, I've never used them before, I don't think they will be useful.
5. What games do you play?
League of Legends mainly
6. Do you mind angle snapping?
Doesn't really matter
7. Other relevant information: Needs at least a 5 ft cord if not cordless, preferably longer since my setup has an overly sized desk with computer pretty far from the mouse.



G400s is an amazing pickup. It's quite large though but feels amazing, claw grip is great on it (palm even more but I don't palm grip it at all.) Max DPI is 4000, and is rated to have a perfect optical sensor. No jitter or acceleration or anything.

The CM storm spawn is good if you're in the US, and for the price that they're offering you can't really go wrong with it I suppose!


I'm thinking about picking up the CM Storm Xornet, but I have three questions:

1. What's the difference between the storm and the spawn? I'm used to around 500-1000 dpi (shitty mice) so that isn't too much of an issue for me.

2. Is a mouse pad important when using them? So far I've been playing without one on a wood table. It seems to work out fine for now, but I get dust sticking to the bottom of my mouse.

3. How durable are these gaming mice? I want to get a mouse that will last at least two or so years under pretty heavy abuse.

Thanks for the help, I really have no clue about mice that don't come with the computer/dollar store.


To answer #2, it doesn't even track on my wooden desk.

To #3 it has a really compact shape with durable material IMO.
Ropid
Profile Joined March 2009
Germany3557 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-03 23:43:56
July 03 2014 23:41 GMT
#3490
On July 04 2014 05:55 aax5 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 03 2014 13:46 Thalandros wrote:
On July 03 2014 09:06 aax5 wrote:
Hi there, I'm very used to cheap desktop mice that are meant for everyday use, but I would like to upgrade to a middle tier gamer mouse.
1. What's your grip style?
Claw/Palm where I have a claw on the first two buttons, but my palm doesn't contact the mouse. I'm used to cheap mice though, so I can adjust if need be.
2. What's your sensitivity?
Low to medium, though that's mainly since I've only used very cheap mice ($5-20 max)
3. What's your maximum budget?
$30-40, though it can be stretched
4. Do you want additional buttons?
No, I've never used them before, I don't think they will be useful.
5. What games do you play?
League of Legends mainly
6. Do you mind angle snapping?
Doesn't really matter
7. Other relevant information: Needs at least a 5 ft cord if not cordless, preferably longer since my setup has an overly sized desk with computer pretty far from the mouse.



G400s is an amazing pickup. It's quite large though but feels amazing, claw grip is great on it (palm even more but I don't palm grip it at all.) Max DPI is 4000, and is rated to have a perfect optical sensor. No jitter or acceleration or anything.

The CM storm spawn is good if you're in the US, and for the price that they're offering you can't really go wrong with it I suppose!


I'm thinking about picking up the CM Storm Xornet, but I have three questions:

1. What's the difference between the storm and the spawn? I'm used to around 500-1000 dpi (shitty mice) so that isn't too much of an issue for me.

2. Is a mouse pad important when using them? So far I've been playing without one on a wood table. It seems to work out fine for now, but I get dust sticking to the bottom of my mouse.

3. How durable are these gaming mice? I want to get a mouse that will last at least two or so years under pretty heavy abuse.

Thanks for the help, I really have no clue about mice that don't come with the computer/dollar store.

1. It seems it's the exact same shell and buttons and wheel. The sensor is different. If you are used to 1000 DPI, the Xornet was fine for that as far as I remember, but it wasn't perfect I think. It was a bit hard to navigate to individual pixels, often jumped over pixels when trying to do that. The Spawn won't have that, its sensor should be super good at its 800 DPI setting and probably still great at 1800 DPI, and 3500 DPI will probably be bad (that's just a guess from what I've seen of mice with the same sensor).

2. I like simple cloth mouse pads, so I don't really know how stuff behaves without one. If you want to try one, the cheapest don't work as the cloth can come off the base and the base can be crappy foam instead of rubber foam. Those will break fast and are wasted money. The ones with rubber foam base where base and cloth are vulcanized (?) together instead of glued, those can last for a decade. Most importantly, for bad cloth mouse pads there might be different friction moving the mouse in different directions (I mean the same as what you see when vacuuming a carpet and there's that one direction where you have to push a lot stronger). The Allsop Raindrop is something like $5 but might be a bit small for 800-1000 DPI. It will survive going through the washing machine as the materials used are great. There was some large, good cloth mouse pad in the US that was cheap but I forgot the name (perhaps "supermat"?).

3. I don't abuse my stuff at all, so no idea, but I literally had no mouse break down ever. That said, the mice I feel are bad, I don't keep them, and I don't know what happened to those.

The Xornet I tried felt great regarding quality, felt like it was built very well. The wheel was great, clear steps (but light? I don't remember). The buttons need only very light pressure to trigger, which I personally liked a lot about the mouse, but I often clicked by mistake until getting accustomed to that.
"My goal is to replace my soul with coffee and become immortal."
wptlzkwjd
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada1240 Posts
July 04 2014 03:12 GMT
#3491
On July 03 2014 15:37 Cyro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 03 2014 14:37 wptlzkwjd wrote:
CM Xornet is a cheaper alternative to the Spawn if you're really concerned with cost.


Recently, the spawn has been even cheaper at times than the xornet in US, ~17.99 shipped after rebate IIRC. It's 30-something now on newegg so less of a deal but hey, it'd be worth a lot more if you've tried the shell and know that you like it, with the price of some mice these days


Sigh...this is why we Canadians drive past our own Targets and Walmarts to go across the border for U.S Targets and Walmarts.
Feel free to add me on steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/MagnusAskeland/
aax5
Profile Joined August 2011
United States54 Posts
July 04 2014 17:03 GMT
#3492
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826570012

It looks like it is 14.99 with a rebate card, but what exactly does that rebate card entail? Is it the same as a regular mail in rebate?
wptlzkwjd
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada1240 Posts
July 05 2014 03:09 GMT
#3493
On July 05 2014 02:03 aax5 wrote:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826570012

It looks like it is 14.99 with a rebate card, but what exactly does that rebate card entail? Is it the same as a regular mail in rebate?


The bottom of the price says this:

"Receive a USD $20 prepaid card by mail from Cooler Master! Expires on 7/17/14. Limit 1 per household "

So maybe some sort of gift card for CM stuff? o.O
Feel free to add me on steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/MagnusAskeland/
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20322 Posts
July 05 2014 07:59 GMT
#3494
$38-40 shipped is still pretty mean price for a spawn, when they were sold in europe they were going for about 1.5-1.7x as much as that.

#1 upside/downside: unique shell, love or hate. I can't get enough of it for osu/sc2/league etc, but found it weird to use for my 0.3 meters moved on mouse = 180 degree turn for FPS play

aside from that my only complaint is the mouse cord. I do this for playing osu:

[image loading]

and replace tape like every week or so, because the cord is thicker/stiffer than some others and since the cord weighs half as much as the mouse does, it can be problematic at times otherwise

It's one of the best fingertip mice out there, and if it was priced $70 cut down to $40 then everyone would think it was a great deal lol, just a bonus they get those weird $20 rebates and prepaid cards off the $36/€36 price
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Nimix
Profile Joined October 2011
France1809 Posts
July 05 2014 12:02 GMT
#3495
Yeah I've been playing a lot of CS:GO lately and the spawn's shell isn't too great, but still it's not bad either. I don't have your problems with the cord though, the spawn's isn't too stiff, I just put down one piece of tape with some slack to be able to go from one end of the pad to another and it's fine.
Also I finally put a tape fix to lower LOD, and it's great xD Their last firmware reduced it too, but it ruined the max tracking speed, so nope.
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20322 Posts
July 05 2014 13:32 GMT
#3496
On July 05 2014 21:02 Nimix wrote:
Yeah I've been playing a lot of CS:GO lately and the spawn's shell isn't too great, but still it's not bad either. I don't have your problems with the cord though, the spawn's isn't too stiff, I just put down one piece of tape with some slack to be able to go from one end of the pad to another and it's fine.
Also I finally put a tape fix to lower LOD, and it's great xD Their last firmware reduced it too, but it ruined the max tracking speed, so nope.


The mouse cord was like 3x as thick as deathadder.. but meanwhile, mouse weight dropped a ton too. It doesn't bend very well and if you don't have the right amount of slack, it can take as much as 1.2x force (pressing against the cable) or more in order to move the mouse same distance one way, vs another, and that's not really acceptable, so i'm quite careful with it
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
Sub40APM
Profile Joined August 2010
6336 Posts
July 05 2014 18:10 GMT
#3497
the left button is no longer functioning on my mouse but the right is, should i just get a new one or is there something I can do that would restore functionality?
chocorush
Profile Joined June 2009
694 Posts
July 06 2014 07:40 GMT
#3498
What's the closest mouse in size and shape to the zowie mico or logitech mini-optical? The scroll wheel seems to wear out really fast on the mico (replacing my second one), but I love the shape too much to get something that feels different.
Nimix
Profile Joined October 2011
France1809 Posts
July 06 2014 11:03 GMT
#3499
A g100s I guess?
wptlzkwjd
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada1240 Posts
July 06 2014 22:52 GMT
#3500
On July 06 2014 16:40 chocorush wrote:
What's the closest mouse in size and shape to the zowie mico or logitech mini-optical? The scroll wheel seems to wear out really fast on the mico (replacing my second one), but I love the shape too much to get something that feels different.


CM Storm Spawn or Xornet.
Feel free to add me on steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/MagnusAskeland/
Prev 1 173 174 175 176 177 246 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV 2025
13:00
Playoffs
Nice vs CreatorLIVE!
WardiTV1663
TaKeTV 427
IndyStarCraft 248
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
IndyStarCraft 248
UpATreeSC 100
BRAT_OK 82
JuggernautJason48
MindelVK 21
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 17720
Calm 1891
EffOrt 382
Dewaltoss 124
actioN 98
Hyun 57
ggaemo 30
Aegong 18
soO 16
Sacsri 9
[ Show more ]
Mong 4
Dota 2
Gorgc5948
qojqva3261
singsing3052
Counter-Strike
fl0m1304
chrisJcsgo87
Other Games
FrodaN1938
Beastyqt795
ceh9395
DeMusliM130
RotterdaM122
KnowMe119
C9.Mang0118
QueenE99
Trikslyr74
rGuardiaN63
Mew2King37
nookyyy 26
OptimusSC22
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• HappyZerGling 70
• StrangeGG 54
• Reevou 15
• Kozan
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 30
• Michael_bg 2
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV685
League of Legends
• TFBlade989
Other Games
• imaqtpie1386
• Shiphtur238
Upcoming Events
WardiTV 2025
15h 38m
ByuN vs TBD
Clem vs TBD
OSC
18h 38m
CranKy Ducklings
1d 14h
WardiTV 2025
1d 15h
SC Evo League
1d 17h
Ladder Legends
1d 23h
BSL 21
2 days
Sziky vs Dewalt
eOnzErG vs Cross
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Ladder Legends
2 days
BSL 21
3 days
StRyKeR vs TBD
Bonyth vs TBD
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
3 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
ByuN vs Solar
Clem vs Classic
Cure vs herO
Reynor vs MaxPax
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Acropolis #4 - TS3
RSL Offline Finals
Kuram Kup

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
Slon Tour Season 2
CSL Season 19: Qualifier 1
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
eXTREMESLAND 2025
SL Budapest Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22

Upcoming

CSL Season 19: Qualifier 2
CSL 2025 WINTER (S19)
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
HSC XXVIII
Big Gabe Cup #3
OSC Championship Season 13
ESL Pro League Season 23
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.