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On November 15 2011 07:11 Myrmidon wrote:The L3 cache does matter. See Phenom II vs. Athlon II, but also note that the architecture has a lot to do with how quickly the cache can be accessed, how likely it is for there to be a branch prediction miss, and so on. See ( here for memory/cache access latencies. But the other thing to keep in mind is that some results are just not very repeatable and suspect. AnandTech SC2 benches don't make sense at all if you take them literally. The same will go for other review sites. http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/129i5-2500k ahead of i7-2600k by a few fps, Pentium G850 ahead of i3-2100 by a few fps, difference between Phenom II X6 1100T compared to 1075T vs. X4 980 compared to X4 970, etc.
While you don't need to take it down to the exact FPS, seeing them within a few frames of each other *is* enough to know they perform relatively similar, while seeing 20%+ differences is enough to know there is a noticeable difference, which is the point I was attempting to make.
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On November 15 2011 07:11 Myrmidon wrote:The L3 cache does matter. See Phenom II vs. Athlon II, but also note that the architecture has a lot to do with how quickly the cache can be accessed, how likely it is for there to be a branch prediction miss, and so on. See ( here for memory/cache access latencies. But the other thing to keep in mind is that some results are just not very repeatable and suspect. AnandTech SC2 benches don't make sense at all if you take them literally. The same will go for other review sites. http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/129i5-2500k ahead of i7-2600k by a few fps, Pentium G850 ahead of i3-2100 by a few fps, difference between Phenom II X6 1100T compared to 1075T vs. X4 980 compared to X4 970, etc.
Ah, so it actually seems like it's some kind of a weird testing error / variance thingy with the i3 2100 bench. That makes more sense.
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On November 15 2011 08:04 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 07:11 Myrmidon wrote:The L3 cache does matter. See Phenom II vs. Athlon II, but also note that the architecture has a lot to do with how quickly the cache can be accessed, how likely it is for there to be a branch prediction miss, and so on. See ( here for memory/cache access latencies. But the other thing to keep in mind is that some results are just not very repeatable and suspect. AnandTech SC2 benches don't make sense at all if you take them literally. The same will go for other review sites. http://www.anandtech.com/bench/CPU/129i5-2500k ahead of i7-2600k by a few fps, Pentium G850 ahead of i3-2100 by a few fps, difference between Phenom II X6 1100T compared to 1075T vs. X4 980 compared to X4 970, etc. Ah, so it actually seems like it's some kind of a weird testing error / variance thingy with the i3 2100 bench. That makes more sense.
No... not at all. He's saying there's slight variations in testing between similarly performing CPUs. The one's we're talking about are not just a few frames of variance.... it's like 20% difference....
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but if it's a 10% error it's only a 10% difference then
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On November 15 2011 08:33 Shikyo wrote:
but if it's a 10% error it's only a 10% difference then
That's a large stretch. 10% margin of error is already considered big, and you're not even saying that, but rather that there would be a 10% error in a particular direction, which would actually be 20% margin of error and be at the extremes. Then there's still a 10% difference on top of that if it were only a 20% difference, while the tests yielded 23 and 29% differences, so you're *really* stretching it at this point...
I'm pretty sure more than anything Myrm's post was meant to say don't take the FPS down to the exact numbers, because you have to account for variances. That doesn't mean they aren't useful. Rather, you should infer that those are probably general results that CPU might yield, in that area. 29% difference isn't "in that area" at all.
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On November 14 2011 22:46 GhostOwl wrote:
Ok. Here is the final decision. I'm about to buy the parts asap.
i3-2120 Processor
Sapphire Radeon HD 6850 - 1GB
Ram Corsair 8 GB DDR3-1333
GIGABYTE GA-H61M-DS2
Western Digital 200AAJB (320GB U100 7200) Hard Drive (Is U100 ok?)
Enermax 450W Power Supply
Antec 300 Case
is it looking compatible? Give me the signal and I'll pull the trigger
Thanks guys. I ordered this set last night (changed the HD into WD blue)
Can I run SC2 / Skyrim on max settings? From what I hear Radeon 6850 is a very powerful video card...
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SC2 yes, skyrim not sure, didn't get an occasion to put my hands on the game myself yet, but even if not at max you should be pretty clos to it, it still uses oblivions graphics basicly, so isn't really demanding (like, compared to bf3 or else)
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Well, the i3-2100 being under both the G840 and G850 does indicate that the error is more likely than not to be underestimating the i3-2100's capability.
I'm not a magic mind reader, but I'm pretty sure 10% was just an example. I would expect the reality to be in favor of the i3 but not by as much as 10%.
Hurray for extra L3 cache? That's actually a much bigger difference than I would expect in general. I guess the branch prediction doesn't work so well for this workload, and L3 cache hits really do save a lot of time (and somehow you get a whole lot more hits given 6MB L3 rather than just 3MB L3, which is the shocking part).
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On November 15 2011 09:09 GhostOwl wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2011 22:46 GhostOwl wrote:
Ok. Here is the final decision. I'm about to buy the parts asap.
i3-2120 Processor
Sapphire Radeon HD 6850 - 1GB
Ram Corsair 8 GB DDR3-1333
GIGABYTE GA-H61M-DS2
Western Digital 200AAJB (320GB U100 7200) Hard Drive (Is U100 ok?)
Enermax 450W Power Supply
Antec 300 Case
is it looking compatible? Give me the signal and I'll pull the trigger Thanks guys. I ordered this set last night (changed the HD into WD blue) Can I run SC2 / Skyrim on max settings? From what I hear Radeon 6850 is a very powerful video card...
6850 is a decently powerful card, which should run the graphical settings of those two games on pretty much the top settings. However you're still CPU limited in SC2, I wouldn't be surprised if you experience framerate issues lategame if you have your settings cranked up. Same with Skyrim, which I think is optimized for four cores instead of 2.
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completely ignoring L2 cache, i3 2100 should be 51.2 FPS when I compare to the pentiums but it'd probably be even more because of L2 cache.
On November 15 2011 09:14 FabledIntegral wrote:Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 09:09 GhostOwl wrote:On November 14 2011 22:46 GhostOwl wrote:
Ok. Here is the final decision. I'm about to buy the parts asap.
i3-2120 Processor
Sapphire Radeon HD 6850 - 1GB
Ram Corsair 8 GB DDR3-1333
GIGABYTE GA-H61M-DS2
Western Digital 200AAJB (320GB U100 7200) Hard Drive (Is U100 ok?)
Enermax 450W Power Supply
Antec 300 Case
is it looking compatible? Give me the signal and I'll pull the trigger Thanks guys. I ordered this set last night (changed the HD into WD blue) Can I run SC2 / Skyrim on max settings? From what I hear Radeon 6850 is a very powerful video card... 6850 is a decently powerful card, which should run the graphical settings of those two games on pretty much the top settings. However you're still CPU limited in SC2, I wouldn't be surprised if you experience framerate issues lategame if you have your settings cranked up. Same with Skyrim, which I think is optimized for four cores instead of 2.
Only 2 cores for skyrim
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On November 15 2011 09:23 Shikyo wrote:completely ignoring L2 cache, i3 2100 should be 51.2 FPS when I compare to the pentiums but it'd probably be even more because of L2 cache. Show nested quote +On November 15 2011 09:14 FabledIntegral wrote:On November 15 2011 09:09 GhostOwl wrote:On November 14 2011 22:46 GhostOwl wrote:
Ok. Here is the final decision. I'm about to buy the parts asap.
i3-2120 Processor
Sapphire Radeon HD 6850 - 1GB
Ram Corsair 8 GB DDR3-1333
GIGABYTE GA-H61M-DS2
Western Digital 200AAJB (320GB U100 7200) Hard Drive (Is U100 ok?)
Enermax 450W Power Supply
Antec 300 Case
is it looking compatible? Give me the signal and I'll pull the trigger Thanks guys. I ordered this set last night (changed the HD into WD blue) Can I run SC2 / Skyrim on max settings? From what I hear Radeon 6850 is a very powerful video card... 6850 is a decently powerful card, which should run the graphical settings of those two games on pretty much the top settings. However you're still CPU limited in SC2, I wouldn't be surprised if you experience framerate issues lategame if you have your settings cranked up. Same with Skyrim, which I think is optimized for four cores instead of 2. Only 2 cores for skyrim
Oh, coulda swore I read four somewhere. Maybe it was just that the "system recommendations" include "quad core" which I've never really understood why they say that.
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sweetness. you guys are awesome. The anticipation waiting for your new computer is like waiting for xmas gifts as a little boy. Its 100x better than sex
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On November 15 2011 09:35 GhostOwl wrote:
sweetness. you guys are awesome. The anticipation waiting for your new computer is like waiting for xmas gifts as a little boy. Its 100x better than sex
And then you use it to watch porn when you realize you haven't been laid in months...
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Most likely if you buy the mobo at microcenter you'll get a discount. There was absolutely no advertised discount about motherboards at the Microcenter I went to online OR even when I called and asked, yet when I was actually in the store they gave me one... i5 2400 + some MSI H61 board for a total of $169.98 before tax.
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Hey guys
I have a few hundred bucks to upgrade my computer, mostly just to be able to increase my graphics settings in games like Skyrim and BF3. The problem is I'm not that good at all this stuff so I was hoping somebody could recomend the most cost efficient upgrades to my current system, which is listed below:
CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 820
GPU: ATI Radeon 5770 1gig
Motherboard: Gateway RS780
RAM: DDR2 6gig
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Hey guys, have some questions here.
First off, since it's nearing the holidays (well, black friday and cyber monday), I know there will be some deals here and there. Should I build a custom gaming build or go with a gaming laptop? I've found some nice laptops on sites that fit my budget of ~500.
I want to use my machine for gaming on SC2 and more graphic intensive games like BF3 or MW3 (Obviously upgrades are possible). I want SC2 to run on higher settings and other games slightly high without lagging.
I also need it for video editing classes, streaming, etc. I might think of overclocking, but as of now, probably not.
If I were to go a desktop build, here would be my plan:
Intel Pentium G840 - 85$
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116398&Tpk=Intel Pentium G840
BIOSTAR H61MLC - 55$
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138340
Sapphire Radeon HD 6770 1GB DDR5 - 120$ (100 after rebate)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102941
Pareema 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 - 22
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820576003
Xigmatek ASGARD- 40$ (30 after rebate)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811815004
CORSAIR Builder Series CX430 V2 430W- 45$ (35 after rebate)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139026&Tpk=corsair 430w
SAMSUNG CD/DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-222AB - OEM -15$
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151233
TOTAL WITHOUT REBATES: About 387 (Not counting the hard drives of course)
TOTAL WITH REBATES: About 347 (Not counting hard drives)
There we go. A few questions though. I haven't picked out a hard drive because of its overpricing. Does anyone know a lower priced at least 500GB hard drive? Also will the power supply handle the 6770? Does everything check out?
And also since the final pricing is a bit low (well you can add on 100 for the hard drives), is there anything I can add to make it better while staying in budget? I have an OS and a monitor by the way.
And by the way as for the gaming laptop I'm looking at one with a GTX 260m, 6gb RAM, and 2.53 dual processor. Which one works better (I want to be mobile with gaming, but desktops work as well). Prices may not be current because of such of the flooding (stupid hard drives -.-) and may drop because of the holidays :D
Thanks for reviewing.
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On November 15 2011 11:11 MicroMarine wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Hey guys, have some questions here. First off, since it's nearing the holidays (well, black friday and cyber monday), I know there will be some deals here and there. Should I build a custom gaming build or go with a gaming laptop? I've found some nice laptops on sites that fit my budget of ~500. I want to use my machine for gaming on SC2 and more graphic intensive games like BF3 or MW3 (Obviously upgrades are possible). I want SC2 to run on higher settings and other games slightly high without lagging. I also need it for video editing classes, streaming, etc. I might think of overclocking, but as of now, probably not. If I were to go a desktop build, here would be my plan: Intel Pentium G840 - 85$ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116398&Tpk=Intel Pentium G840BIOSTAR H61MLC - 55$ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138340Sapphire Radeon HD 6770 1GB DDR5 - 120$ (100 after rebate) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102941Pareema 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 - 22 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820576003Xigmatek ASGARD- 40$ (30 after rebate) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811815004CORSAIR Builder Series CX430 V2 430W- 45$ (35 after rebate) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139026&Tpk=corsair 430wSAMSUNG CD/DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-222AB - OEM -15$ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151233TOTAL WITHOUT REBATES: About 387 (Not counting the hard drives of course) TOTAL WITH REBATES: About 347 (Not counting hard drives) There we go. A few questions though. I haven't picked out a hard drive because of its overpricing. Does anyone know a lower priced at least 500GB hard drive? Also will the power supply handle the 6770? Does everything check out? And also since the final pricing is a bit low (well you can add on 100 for the hard drives), is there anything I can add to make it better while staying in budget? I have an OS and a monitor by the way. And by the way as for the gaming laptop I'm looking at one with a GTX 260m, 6gb RAM, and 2.53 dual processor. Which one works better (I want to be mobile with gaming, but desktops work as well). Prices may not be current because of such of the flooding (stupid hard drives -.-) and may drop because of the holidays :D Thanks for reviewing.
Pentium G840 and H61 is not capable of overclocking. You need to decide whether you are overclocking or not upfront because only P67 / Z68 motherboards allow for overclocking and only K suffix processors such as the core i5 2500k have an unlocked multiplier for overclocking.
You'll need a quad core for a smooth and decent streaming experience since games use two cores (some use more) so... this leaves you no cores for encoding and everything else.
Yes, the power supply is overkill for the listed configuration.
There's not any significant upgrade that will keep you within your budget with 500GB HDDs being ~$100.
There won't be any $60 1TB HDD sales during Black Friday or Cyber Monday - I can guarantee you this.
You also did not specify what resolution you play at. I suggest you save up more.
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On November 15 2011 10:54 HarryHood wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Hey guys
I have a few hundred bucks to upgrade my computer, mostly just to be able to increase my graphics settings in games like Skyrim and BF3. The problem is I'm not that good at all this stuff so I was hoping somebody could recomend the most cost efficient upgrades to my current system, which is listed below:
CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 820
GPU: ATI Radeon 5770 1gig
Motherboard: Gateway RS780
RAM: DDR2 6gig
How much is a few hundred dollars?
If you play at 1080p, you probably want to upgrade to least a Radeon HD6870 (~$170) which most likely requires you to upgrade your power supply as well to something of higher power and higher quality than what's provided with your prebuilt such as the CX500V2 or Antec Neo Eco 520 or XFX Core Edition 450.
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EPT
