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On May 17 2012 04:18 Myrmidon wrote:
Most people asking for advice aren't interested in all the extra small perks and tweaking options or a 100 MHz higher overclock. Hence the worse motherboard and PSU make sense.
As for the rest, there tends to be a lot of group think, undeserved reputations (both ways), and so on. The typical so-called enthusiast has been exposed to more marketing as well. I really wouldn't look too hard at what people are buying for themselves.
btw out of Corsair's current lineup, only TX V2 and AX below 1200W are Seasonics. Usually Corsairs and Seasonics are overpriced.
Ok fair enough.
I definitely see what you mean about the group thinking thing.
Reading those forums made me think the temjin tj-08e is the only mATX case in the world.
On the heatsink side, at least there's finally some restaint in recommending cooler master 212 evo. It's no longer the go-to cpu cooler.
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Well, usually when people ask for recommendations, they want the cheapest stuff with the best performance. That's why you see high end graphics and cpu mixed with shit chassis, shit psu and shit motherboard. When you are more of a tech expert, you become concerned with what capacitors your motherboard use, the phases and other things that might ensure extended lifespan, stuff like that - so obviously you'd try to go for a more "even" build. People even go so far as to worry about aesthetics, if someone spends time picking components with similar color schemes, he probably wouldn't go for the cheapest components anyway.
With that said, many of of the cheaper motherboards are actually not that bad in terms of components anymore, MSI had some really bad components before on their lower end boards, ASRock too, but both of them have improved. Asus has over 80% of the motherboard market, so obviously you'll see mostly Sabertooth and RoG. Sniper is usually not picked due to Gigabytes 3D bios and some other issues with those boards, they are usually not worth the premium price.
It's a bit difficult measuring how effective a cx430 will be in regards to a seasonic x in terms of lifespan, or an asrock p67pro3 vs asus rog. Some of the cheaper things you can get is actually pretty reliable, so a lot of the times it's just a sense of security and paying for something you can invest more time into and be proud of. An expensive motherboard have more BIOS/UEFI functions, board functions and ports. There is also a belief that more expensive motherboards overclock better.
Also, the reason tj08e/ps07b is such a popular chassis is because you can crank in almost anything there / you can also remove almost everything. The top, the motherboard plate, the sides, the front, both hdd cages. It scales really well with what you want to put into it. It's also relatively silent, very good ventilation and sleek look. There isn't really much competition for the chassis in the same price range. Fractal design and antecs mini chassis aren't as well thought out and often not as small either.
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Thanks for the reply 
Small constraint i would like to add: i want at least a 1 TB HDD in my system
I noticed that you adviced me a case + motherboard that are fairly prizy. I suspect because they offer USB 3.0/hi-speed USB support. Is this the reason they are more expensive or do i miss other features that boost the prize?
I would like to make clear that i don't really care much about USB 3.0. The only time i really use USB is for printing/transfering small documents and charging of my ipod. Would it be unreasonable to choose for cheaper components that don't offer native USB 3.0 support if i don't really mind waiting a little longer?
About the Antec 100. I heard some rumors that the cable management of that case is not the best, and that with the coming of the Bitfenix Merc there was no real reason to choose for the 'outdated' antec 100. Is there any truth to this?
Would it still be a good choice to buy this case, even though i don't really care about it's hi-speed usb support, or can i go with a case like the Bitfenix Alpha?.
Basically i need to know
- which relative simple motherboard could i buy for my rig , that would not bottleneck my gaming performance?
- would the bitfenix alpha be a good case? or which similar prized case would you recommend?
As monitor i will probably end up with the samsung S22A350H since the reviews are pretty positive, and it has a HDMI connection as well. Would it be a good choice for someone like me who wants to spend around 150 euro on a monitor?
Sorry for the list of questions, but there are so many people here with more knowledge about this then me ^_^
Thanks for answering anyway
For other people: my original build can be found in the spoilertag
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On May 17 2012 04:35 Shauni wrote:
Well, usually when people ask for recommendations, they want the cheapest stuff with the best performance. That's why you see high end graphics and cpu mixed with shit chassis, shit psu and shit motherboard. When you are more of a tech expert, you become concerned with what capacitors your motherboard use, the phases and other things that might ensure extended lifespan, stuff like that - so obviously you'd try to go for a more "even" build. People even go so far as to worry about aesthetics, if someone spends time picking components with similar color schemes, he probably wouldn't go for the cheapest components anyway.
With that said, many of of the cheaper motherboards are actually not that bad in terms of components anymore, MSI had some really bad components before on their lower end boards, ASRock too, but both of them have improved. Asus has over 80% of the motherboard market, so obviously you'll see mostly Sabertooth and RoG. Sniper is usually not picked due to Gigabytes 3D bios and some other issues with those boards, they are usually not worth the premium price.
It's a bit difficult measuring how effective a cx430 will be in regards to a seasonic x in terms of lifespan, or an asrock p67pro3 vs asus rog. Some of the cheaper things you can get is actually pretty reliable, so a lot of the times it's just a sense of security and paying for something you can invest more time into and be proud of. Expensive motherboard have more bios functions, board functions and ports. There is also a belief that more expensive motherboards overclock better.
Wow thanks, I was wondering why I didn't see many Sniper boards.
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On May 17 2012 04:37 1ManArmy wrote:Thanks for the reply Small constraint i would like to add: i want at least a 1 TB HDD in my system I noticed that you adviced me a case + motherboard that are fairly prizy. I suspect because they offer USB 3.0/hi-speed USB support. Is this the reason they are more expensive or do i miss other features that boost the prize? I would like to make clear that i don't really care much about USB 3.0. The only time i really use USB is for printing/transfering small documents and charging of my ipod. Would it be unreasonable to choose for cheaper components that don't offer native USB 3.0 support if i don't really mind waiting a little longer? About the Antec 100. I heard some rumors that the cable management of that case is not the best, and that with the coming of the Bitfenix Merc there was no real reason to choose for the 'outdated' antec 100. Is there any truth to this? Would it still be a good choice to buy this case, even though i don't really care about it's hi-speed usb support, or can i go with a case like the Bitfenix Alpha?. Basically i need to know - which relative simple motherboard could i buy for my rig , that would not bottleneck my gaming performance? - would the bitfenix alpha be a good case? or which similar prized case would you recommend? As monitor i will probably end up with the samsung S22A350H since the reviews are pretty positive, and it has a HDMI connection as well. Would it be a good choice for someone like me who wants to spend around 150 euro on a monitor? Sorry for the list of questions, but there are so many people here with more knowledge about this then me ^_^ Thanks for answering anyway For other people: my original build can be found in the spoilertag
The motherboard I posted is the cheapest you can get that is compatible with a 3450 unless you want to bios flash a H67.
As for cases it doesn't really matter which one you get as long as you like it and its compatible with your Motherboard as you can't put a full ATX mobo with a micro ATX case.
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Even 1 reply after my post, we can already see a perfect example. iTzSnypah picks the cheapest H77 board, 1ManArmy asks if there is any way to get a cheaper motherboard. How do you think they'd react if we recommended Asus RoG boards to everyone (trust me, that Intel NIC is NECESSARY for your budget!!! YOU NEED 8 phases for your CPU!).
And for a change, bitfenix alpha/beta isn't recommended for a slightly better quality chassis, and it's EXPENSIVE. A 50€ chassis is considered expensive here. Look what skyr has done...
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This thread is just plain good for learning. I finished my build yesterday (took me forever to finish up from other obligations taking up time) but I keep reading this thread and picking stuff up. I felt pretty clueless starting off and didn't like it ^^
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On May 17 2012 05:19 iTzSnypah wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 04:37 1ManArmy wrote:Thanks for the reply Small constraint i would like to add: i want at least a 1 TB HDD in my system I noticed that you adviced me a case + motherboard that are fairly prizy. I suspect because they offer USB 3.0/hi-speed USB support. Is this the reason they are more expensive or do i miss other features that boost the prize? I would like to make clear that i don't really care much about USB 3.0. The only time i really use USB is for printing/transfering small documents and charging of my ipod. Would it be unreasonable to choose for cheaper components that don't offer native USB 3.0 support if i don't really mind waiting a little longer? About the Antec 100. I heard some rumors that the cable management of that case is not the best, and that with the coming of the Bitfenix Merc there was no real reason to choose for the 'outdated' antec 100. Is there any truth to this? Would it still be a good choice to buy this case, even though i don't really care about it's hi-speed usb support, or can i go with a case like the Bitfenix Alpha?. Basically i need to know - which relative simple motherboard could i buy for my rig , that would not bottleneck my gaming performance? - would the bitfenix alpha be a good case? or which similar prized case would you recommend? As monitor i will probably end up with the samsung S22A350H since the reviews are pretty positive, and it has a HDMI connection as well. Would it be a good choice for someone like me who wants to spend around 150 euro on a monitor? Sorry for the list of questions, but there are so many people here with more knowledge about this then me ^_^ Thanks for answering anyway For other people: my original build can be found in the spoilertag The motherboard I posted is the cheapest you can get that is compatible with a 3450 unless you want to bios flash a H67. As for cases it doesn't really matter which one you get as long as you like it and its compatible with your Motherboard as you can't put a full ATX mobo with a micro ATX case.
Asus P8B75-M LE is cheaper and in stock?
http://azerty.nl/8-2528-496929/asus-p8b75-m-le-moederbord-.html
btw, on a side note, it's perfectly valid for different people to have different needs and expectations. And TJ08-E pretty much is the only microATX case out there for performance users who don't need both (1) multiple 3.5" hard drives and (2) a large CPU cooler, so that might be the only valid tidbit picked up.
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On May 17 2012 05:19 Shauni wrote:
Even 1 reply after my post, we can already see a perfect example. iTzSnypah picks the cheapest H77 board, 1ManArmy asks if there is any way to get a cheaper motherboard. How do you think they'd react if we recommended Asus RoG boards to everyone (trust me, that Intel NIC is NECESSARY for your budget!!! YOU NEED 8 phases for your CPU!).
And for a change, bitfenix alpha/beta isn't recommended for a slightly better quality chassis, and it's EXPENSIVE. A 50€ chassis is considered expensive here. Look what skyr has done...
hahaha I see your point.
Well, I for one, will be going seasonic x series 650W and RoG.
I need to read up on a good undervolt/overclocking guide, do you have any recommendations?
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I was also interested in undervolting Ivy Bridge (I'm assuming you're talking that platform), but I haven't found that much info apart from the anandtech article. I'll get my (ivy) build next week, so I haven't read into that much about specific UEFI functions yet. One thing that alarmed be a bit was a guy who got a few chips a couple of months ago, and he told me that the Ivy chips were far more fragile than Sandy Bridge despite what Intel did with TIM and higher TJmax. Something about the voltage being more effective with the 3D transistors, which also degenerates the chips faster when overvolting or running high temperatures.
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On May 17 2012 06:02 Shauni wrote:I was also interested in undervolting Ivy Bridge (I'm assuming you're talking that platform), but I haven't found that much info apart from the anandtech article. I'll get my (ivy) build next week, so I haven't read into that much about specific UEFI functions yet. One thing that alarmed be a bit was a guy who got a few chips a couple of months ago, and he told me that the Ivy chips were far more fragile than Sandy Bridge despite what Intel did with TIM and higher TJmax. Something about the voltage being more effective with the 3D transistors, which also degenerates the chips faster when overvolting or running high temperatures.
Yes, I was referring to ivy bridge.
From what I've read so far, as long as we don't overvolt I think we'll be fine.
Oh, one more thing, it's not clear from looking around the internet if 3570k is the better overclocker. Intuitively, I would think that it would be, since 3770k has hyperthreading. Although, stock clock is higher on the 3770k, so maybe the binning from intel will make a bigger difference than the extra heat from hyperthreading.
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On May 17 2012 05:33 Myrmidon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 05:19 iTzSnypah wrote:On May 17 2012 04:37 1ManArmy wrote:Thanks for the reply Small constraint i would like to add: i want at least a 1 TB HDD in my system I noticed that you adviced me a case + motherboard that are fairly prizy. I suspect because they offer USB 3.0/hi-speed USB support. Is this the reason they are more expensive or do i miss other features that boost the prize? I would like to make clear that i don't really care much about USB 3.0. The only time i really use USB is for printing/transfering small documents and charging of my ipod. Would it be unreasonable to choose for cheaper components that don't offer native USB 3.0 support if i don't really mind waiting a little longer? About the Antec 100. I heard some rumors that the cable management of that case is not the best, and that with the coming of the Bitfenix Merc there was no real reason to choose for the 'outdated' antec 100. Is there any truth to this? Would it still be a good choice to buy this case, even though i don't really care about it's hi-speed usb support, or can i go with a case like the Bitfenix Alpha?. Basically i need to know - which relative simple motherboard could i buy for my rig , that would not bottleneck my gaming performance? - would the bitfenix alpha be a good case? or which similar prized case would you recommend? As monitor i will probably end up with the samsung S22A350H since the reviews are pretty positive, and it has a HDMI connection as well. Would it be a good choice for someone like me who wants to spend around 150 euro on a monitor? Sorry for the list of questions, but there are so many people here with more knowledge about this then me ^_^ Thanks for answering anyway For other people: my original build can be found in the spoilertag The motherboard I posted is the cheapest you can get that is compatible with a 3450 unless you want to bios flash a H67. As for cases it doesn't really matter which one you get as long as you like it and its compatible with your Motherboard as you can't put a full ATX mobo with a micro ATX case. Asus P8B75-M LE is cheaper and in stock? http://azerty.nl/8-2528-496929/asus-p8b75-m-le-moederbord-.htmlbtw, on a side note, it's perfectly valid for different people to have different needs and expectations. And TJ08-E pretty much is the only microATX case out there for performance users who don't need both (1) multiple 3.5" hard drives and (2) a large CPU cooler, so that might be the only valid tidbit picked up.
I decided to go against the grain here and I'm gonna go with a full alumnium Lian Li case - am willing to sacrifice a little bit of performance for the "look-and-feel".
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On May 17 2012 05:19 iTzSnypah wrote:Show nested quote +On May 17 2012 04:37 1ManArmy wrote:Thanks for the reply Small constraint i would like to add: i want at least a 1 TB HDD in my system I noticed that you adviced me a case + motherboard that are fairly prizy. I suspect because they offer USB 3.0/hi-speed USB support. Is this the reason they are more expensive or do i miss other features that boost the prize? I would like to make clear that i don't really care much about USB 3.0. The only time i really use USB is for printing/transfering small documents and charging of my ipod. Would it be unreasonable to choose for cheaper components that don't offer native USB 3.0 support if i don't really mind waiting a little longer? About the Antec 100. I heard some rumors that the cable management of that case is not the best, and that with the coming of the Bitfenix Merc there was no real reason to choose for the 'outdated' antec 100. Is there any truth to this? Would it still be a good choice to buy this case, even though i don't really care about it's hi-speed usb support, or can i go with a case like the Bitfenix Alpha?. Basically i need to know - which relative simple motherboard could i buy for my rig , that would not bottleneck my gaming performance? - would the bitfenix alpha be a good case? or which similar prized case would you recommend? As monitor i will probably end up with the samsung S22A350H since the reviews are pretty positive, and it has a HDMI connection as well. Would it be a good choice for someone like me who wants to spend around 150 euro on a monitor? Sorry for the list of questions, but there are so many people here with more knowledge about this then me ^_^ Thanks for answering anyway For other people: my original build can be found in the spoilertag The motherboard I posted is the cheapest you can get that is compatible with a 3450 unless you want to bios flash a H67. As for cases it doesn't really matter which one you get as long as you like it and its compatible with your Motherboard as you can't put a full ATX mobo with a micro ATX case.
Yeah i understand the mobo-case relation. Thanks for pointing it out though
I took your advice in consideration and came up with this build.
Sorry for not changing the Merc alpha, but i quite like it, and its compatible with the micro-atx mobo myrmidion suggested.
I also feel that i should take the i5-3550 for only 15,- more then the i5-3450. To be honest i couldn't find much info about the 3450, but i feel 15,- for 0,2 ghz extra would be a shame to dismiss. It probably doesn't really matter much, but it just feels better to get it.
Thanks for the help, and excuse me for firing so many questions + being quite noobish about assembling a good system
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Should I pirate windows for my build or buy it?
User was warned for this post
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up to you... they're like the same thing either way so it comes down to a question of morality and monetary asset/willingness to spend.
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Thanks so much guys (the 2 guys) that replied. I'm not sure I'm understanding some of it though.
The 3820, is quad instead of dual channel, 10mb L3 Cache instead of 8, 3.6 Ghz instead of 3.5.. All for like 20 bucks cheaper. It seems like such a better deal.
Yes its mainly for computer gaming but also what to do some HD streaming of even games like battlefield3. So its going to need to be stocked.
Im thinking the dual cards in SLI so their isnt as much work on just 1 card. Also I want tri monitor set up. I saw the 590 has 3 dvi out's on it but I dont want to pay 700 for it.
Thanks for explaining that the bench marks are pretty much worthless.
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Can someone reply to my request as well  (
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On May 17 2012 10:27 Nizzy wrote:
Thanks so much guys (the 2 guys) that replied. I'm not sure I'm understanding some of it though.
The 3820, is quad instead of dual channel, 10mb L3 Cache instead of 8, 3.6 Ghz instead of 3.5.. All for like 20 bucks cheaper. It seems like such a better deal.
Yes its mainly for computer gaming but also what to do some HD streaming of even games like battlefield3. So its going to need to be stocked.
Im thinking the dual cards in SLI so their isnt as much work on just 1 card. Also I want tri monitor set up. I saw the 590 has 3 dvi out's on it but I dont want to pay 700 for it.
Thanks for explaining that the bench marks are pretty much worthless.
X79 motherboards are twice as expensive as Z77...
Stock clock is irrelevant since you are overclocking lol.
You're getting a 3820 yet you're complaining about the cost of a shitty GTX 590 being $700...
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Hi, I will be posting here before long when I get ready to bite the bullet and make my build (it wont be anything too fancy- mostly just for gaming).
But scrolling through slickdeals today I saw this deal
http://slickdeals.net/permadeal/74180/newegg-antec-high-current-gamer-series-hcg400-400w-80-plus-bronze-power-supply
Antec High Current Gamer Series HCG-400 400W 80 Plus Bronze Power Supply $19.50 after $40 rebate + Free Shipping
Just wondering if this was a good power supply to grab while its cheap- as its not like power supplies technology is changing so I figured it would be an ok component to purchase and have on the shelf for 1-4 months before I make my build.
Thanks for any help/opinions
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EPT
