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On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players.
Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff.
And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs.
What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8?
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On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8?
When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals.
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France13018 Posts
On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8?
I mean even after those buff for terran / protoss, zerg seems in a good spot. Not as OP as before this 107th hotfix, but still strong
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On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals.
I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead.
If we're talking about ewc 2024 it had some of the most imbalanced maps in the history of the game. Crimson court was 70% TvZ, it was like if delta quadrant and Antiga shipyard had a child.
Not to mention things like the mech/cyclone cheese greatly influencing and dictating what's 'viable' in the metagame.
Clem played insanely well in those series - as anyone who saw the games could tell you. On that particular day he would have won regardless of the maps or patch. It's disingenuous to try and make points about a race or player when there were such large influencing factors on the game at that time.
I'll never be able to remotely consistently replicate what serral Clem or hero do, but I still want the game balanced around their skill level.
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On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals.
When Serral lost 3-0 and 5-0 to Clem, the patch at pro level seems to have been in favor of T, as overall the TvZ score was 85 to 78 maps. The three seasons on the ladder from that patch all were roughly around 50% with a minor Zerg tilt (roughly 51 to 49).
Serral's losses - in my opinion - mainly can be attributed to two factors: his military absence throughout the months leading up to EWC and Clem simply playing absolutely out of his mind. He only lost 2 maps versus Reynor in that entire thing and he was simply on fire (although it needs to be mentioned that he avoided all top Terrans and didn't have to play a single PvT, his weakest match up of that time).
On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. If we're talking about ewc 2024 it had some of the most imbalanced maps in the history of the game. Crimson court was 70% TvZ, it was like if delta quadrant and Antiga shipyard had a child. Not to mention things like the mech/cyclone cheese greatly influencing and dictating what's 'viable' in the metagame. Clem played insanely well in those series - as anyone who saw the games could tell you. On that particular day he would have won regardless of the maps or patch. It's disingenuous to try and make points about a race or player when there were such large influencing factors on the game at that time. I'll never be able to remotely consistently replicate what serral Clem or hero do, but I still want the game balanced around their skill level.
Totally agree.
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On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level.
This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness.
A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea.
This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse.
Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit.
So what do the developers do?
They buff the Ghost.
After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them?
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Gosh, it's almost like wild untested changes aren't a good idea.
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On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them?
For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane.
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On July 21 2026 13:47 tigera6 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them? For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane.
They can’t buff most of the mech units you suggested since ghost / lib combo is literally unloseable in tvp. Any buffs in libs does make sense.
Doesn’t make sense to buff tank or thors since those are already strong in tvz
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If you want to permanently nerf the ghost you probably have to buff the raven in exchange and give it back some of its former power. I'm not talking like 2018 anti-armor missile but more like... PDD and seeker. Although remembering the days of 2015, people actually hated seeing Sky Terran late game.
So maybe the right way to go about nerfing the ghost is to nerf like a dozen other units alongside it so that a late game crutch just isn't needed.
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United States1961 Posts
On July 21 2026 19:18 Elentos wrote:
If you want to permanently nerf the ghost you probably have to buff the raven in exchange and give it back some of its former power. I'm not talking like 2018 anti-armor missile but more like... PDD and seeker. Although remembering the days of 2015, people actually hated seeing Sky Terran late game.
So maybe the right way to go about nerfing the ghost is to nerf like a dozen other units alongside it so that a late game crutch just isn't needed.
#Ravenz
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On July 21 2026 19:18 Elentos wrote:
If you want to permanently nerf the ghost you probably have to buff the raven in exchange and give it back some of its former power. I'm not talking like 2018 anti-armor missile but more like... PDD and seeker. Although remembering the days of 2015, people actually hated seeing Sky Terran late game.
So maybe the right way to go about nerfing the ghost is to nerf like a dozen other units alongside it so that a late game crutch just isn't needed.
PDD and Seeker were pretty lame abilities to be fair. Move EMP to the Raven and buff it so that it removes all energy. Or just bring the science vessel back.
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On July 21 2026 23:06 Athenau wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2026 19:18 Elentos wrote:
If you want to permanently nerf the ghost you probably have to buff the raven in exchange and give it back some of its former power. I'm not talking like 2018 anti-armor missile but more like... PDD and seeker. Although remembering the days of 2015, people actually hated seeing Sky Terran late game.
So maybe the right way to go about nerfing the ghost is to nerf like a dozen other units alongside it so that a late game crutch just isn't needed. PDD and Seeker were pretty lame abilities to be fair. Move EMP to the Raven and buff it so that it removes all energy. Or just bring the science vessel back.
Sure they're pretty lame. It's not like it has to be exactly those spells. They can give Ravens the Yamato Cannon for all I care. Or buff some other units. But as long as Snipe is the only real way to reliably contest hive tech Zerg units, Terran will try massing them if the game goes late. They can change Ghost supply from 2 to 3 and back as many times as they want, that'll just move the winrate without addressing anything.
That said we've just changed the entire economy of the game (and also warpgate) and are still playing maps made for 12-worker-starts, so I think iterating too much right now is probably not ideal.
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On July 21 2026 18:51 TeamMamba wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2026 13:47 tigera6 wrote:On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them? For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane. They can’t buff most of the mech units you suggested since ghost / lib combo is literally unloseable in tvp. Any buffs in libs does make sense. Doesn’t make sense to buff tank or thors since those are already strong in tvz
Not with current Microbial Shroud and Viper if you nerf ghost Snipe, what to stop the Zerg army? It doesnt make sense because you want Zerg to keep wining apparently. Tanks get complete wrecked by Viper or just a couple Lings runby, and Thor is extremely immobile. Zerg will just attack the weak side with their mobility and get more map control. In your mind, Zerg players probably doesnt know how to scout and would charge head first without any spell caster into 10 tanks and 5 Thors wating or something, then saying Tanks and Thors are too strong, lol.
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On July 22 2026 00:39 tigera6 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2026 18:51 TeamMamba wrote:On July 21 2026 13:47 tigera6 wrote:On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them? For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane. They can’t buff most of the mech units you suggested since ghost / lib combo is literally unloseable in tvp. Any buffs in libs does make sense. Doesn’t make sense to buff tank or thors since those are already strong in tvz Not with current Microbial Shroud and Viper if you nerf ghost Snipe, what to stop the Zerg army? It doesnt make sense because you want Zerg to keep wining apparently. Tanks get complete wrecked by Viper or just a couple Lings runby, and Thor is extremely immobile. Zerg will just attack the weak side with their mobility and get more map control. In your mind, Zerg players probably doesnt know how to scout and would charge head first without any spell caster into 10 tanks and 5 Thors wating or something, then saying Tanks and Thors are too strong, lol.
If you want proof that Siege Tanks are overtuned, just look at TvT. They've completely warped the matchup to the point where it's honestly painful to watch - it's just one long tank crawl.
Terran doesn't need buffs to Tanks, and definitely not to Thors. Thors barely even require any control since they automatically target air units.
If anything needs a buff, it's the Raven. Not to the point where people start massing 40 Ravens again like in the old days, but by shifting some of the Ghost's power into the Raven in one way or another. That would make the Ghost less of a universal unit instead of being the answer to basically everything in TvZ.
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On July 22 2026 03:31 BlackEyed wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2026 00:39 tigera6 wrote:On July 21 2026 18:51 TeamMamba wrote:On July 21 2026 13:47 tigera6 wrote:On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them? For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane. They can’t buff most of the mech units you suggested since ghost / lib combo is literally unloseable in tvp. Any buffs in libs does make sense. Doesn’t make sense to buff tank or thors since those are already strong in tvz Not with current Microbial Shroud and Viper if you nerf ghost Snipe, what to stop the Zerg army? It doesnt make sense because you want Zerg to keep wining apparently. Tanks get complete wrecked by Viper or just a couple Lings runby, and Thor is extremely immobile. Zerg will just attack the weak side with their mobility and get more map control. In your mind, Zerg players probably doesnt know how to scout and would charge head first without any spell caster into 10 tanks and 5 Thors wating or something, then saying Tanks and Thors are too strong, lol. If you want proof that Siege Tanks are overtuned, just look at TvT. They've completely warped the matchup to the point where it's honestly painful to watch - it's just one long tank crawl. Terran doesn't need buffs to Tanks, and definitely not to Thors. Thors barely even require any control since they automatically target air units. If anything needs a buff, it's the Raven. Not to the point where people start massing 40 Ravens again like in the old days, but by shifting some of the Ghost's power into the Raven in one way or another. That would make the Ghost less of a universal unit instead of being the answer to basically everything in TvZ.
Siege tanks are fine. They're only used in timings in TvP and Zerg has a plethora of ways to deal with mass tanks. There's nothing wrong with TvT being a tank-centric, positional match-up, just like Brood War.
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On July 22 2026 00:39 tigera6 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 21 2026 18:51 TeamMamba wrote:On July 21 2026 13:47 tigera6 wrote:On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them? For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane. They can’t buff most of the mech units you suggested since ghost / lib combo is literally unloseable in tvp. Any buffs in libs does make sense. Doesn’t make sense to buff tank or thors since those are already strong in tvz Not with current Microbial Shroud and Viper if you nerf ghost Snipe, what to stop the Zerg army? It doesnt make sense because you want Zerg to keep wining apparently. Tanks get complete wrecked by Viper or just a couple Lings runby, and Thor is extremely immobile. Zerg will just attack the weak side with their mobility and get more map control. In your mind, Zerg players probably doesnt know how to scout and would charge head first without any spell caster into 10 tanks and 5 Thors wating or something, then saying Tanks and Thors are too strong, lol.
Snipe shouldn't be nerfed against Vipers. That's a totally valid matchup that the Ghost should dominate. My issue (and I assume that of a lot of people) that Ghosts are also the answer to Ultralisks, Brood Lords and Infestors, without any actual hard counter (Lingbane is ofc technically a hard counter, but only with perfect setup).
Ghosts are just on the usual scale and I'm not even talking about SC2, I'm talking about gaming in general. Everyone knows that high-damage usually means squishy, anti-caster is usually never anti-tank/brawler, great anti-air is rarely great anti-ground and so on.
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On July 22 2026 06:33 Balnazza wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2026 00:39 tigera6 wrote:On July 21 2026 18:51 TeamMamba wrote:On July 21 2026 13:47 tigera6 wrote:On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them? For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane. They can’t buff most of the mech units you suggested since ghost / lib combo is literally unloseable in tvp. Any buffs in libs does make sense. Doesn’t make sense to buff tank or thors since those are already strong in tvz Not with current Microbial Shroud and Viper if you nerf ghost Snipe, what to stop the Zerg army? It doesnt make sense because you want Zerg to keep wining apparently. Tanks get complete wrecked by Viper or just a couple Lings runby, and Thor is extremely immobile. Zerg will just attack the weak side with their mobility and get more map control. In your mind, Zerg players probably doesnt know how to scout and would charge head first without any spell caster into 10 tanks and 5 Thors wating or something, then saying Tanks and Thors are too strong, lol. Snipe shouldn't be nerfed against Vipers. That's a totally valid matchup that the Ghost should dominate. My issue (and I assume that of a lot of people) that Ghosts are also the answer to Ultralisks, Brood Lords and Infestors, without any actual hard counter (Lingbane is ofc technically a hard counter, but only with perfect setup). Ghosts are just on the usual scale and I'm not even talking about SC2, I'm talking about gaming in general. Everyone knows that high-damage usually means squishy, anti-caster is usually never anti-tank/brawler, great anti-air is rarely great anti-ground and so on.
Ghosts don't dominate vipers. EMP is a temporary shutdown and an unfavorable energy trade long term (since vipers have consume) and abduct goes off before snipe, so at best you're trading a ghost for a viper (maybe not even that if the snipe still gets interrupted by the abduct) if both sides are microing.
And ling-bane is the hard counter to mass ghosts. What you're actually complaining about is there is no hard-counter to the endgame terran composition of liberator-mine-marine-marauder-medivac-ghost (and sometimes tanks and hellbats).
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On July 22 2026 07:08 Athenau wrote:
Ghosts don't dominate vipers. EMP is a temporary shutdown and an unfavorable energy trade long term (since vipers have consume) and abduct goes off before snipe, so at best you're trading a ghost for a viper (maybe not even that if the snipe still gets interrupted by the abduct) if both sides are microing.
I think we've reached peak mental gymnastics.
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On July 22 2026 06:33 Balnazza wrote:Show nested quote +On July 22 2026 00:39 tigera6 wrote:On July 21 2026 18:51 TeamMamba wrote:On July 21 2026 13:47 tigera6 wrote:On July 20 2026 23:47 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 19:26 Agh wrote:On July 20 2026 15:05 THERIDDLER wrote:On July 20 2026 13:07 BlackEyed wrote:On July 20 2026 09:45 CicadaSC wrote:
Say what you want about the state of Zerg, a world where only Serral is competitive is not healthy for the game or it's players. Yeah, and that's the sad part. But what's even sadder is that a few years ago, when Serral was losing 0-4 to Clem, everyone was perfectly fine with it and called it "balanced." Then Clem loses a few series, and suddenly Terran starts getting buff after buff. And not just minor tweaks - completely insane, unprecedented buffs. What if even this isn't enough and Clem still keeps losing? What's next? Terran starts with 10 workers while every other race starts with 8? When serral lost 0-8 to clem that patch wasn't fine. TvZ was zerg favored that patch. That's why you balanced the game around the entire pro scene instead of just 2 individuals. I don't even know what I'm reading except for people trying to rage bait each other or mislead. their skill level. This patch already brought all of this on itself. Changes like these do nothing but create a massive sense of unfairness. A 300 mineral Command Center? Seriously? I genuinely can't wrap my head around how anyone thought this was a good idea. This isn't just a balance tweak anymore. It's something else entirely - borderline deliberate destabilization of the game. It honestly feels like they're intentionally taking the most frustrating aspects of StarCraft II and making them even worse. Ghosts were already driving everyone insane. It's obvious to anyone being remotely objective that some of their power should be redistributed to other Terran units instead of being concentrated in a single unit. So what do the developers do? They buff the Ghost. After that, what exactly are people supposed to think about them? For some reason buffing Mech and SkyTerran is a taboo within the balance council, they could make a late game upgrade to reduce Terran splash to ally units, another one to negate Viper Abduct to Thor/Tank in Seige mode, or something that buff Bashee/Viking/Libs, all that to make Snipe only deal 50-75 dmg and cost 50 Engr. Instead we have Zerg with another spell that negate 50% range damage (which is from 80% of Terran unit) to buff Ultra rushing with lingbane. They can’t buff most of the mech units you suggested since ghost / lib combo is literally unloseable in tvp. Any buffs in libs does make sense. Doesn’t make sense to buff tank or thors since those are already strong in tvz Not with current Microbial Shroud and Viper if you nerf ghost Snipe, what to stop the Zerg army? It doesnt make sense because you want Zerg to keep wining apparently. Tanks get complete wrecked by Viper or just a couple Lings runby, and Thor is extremely immobile. Zerg will just attack the weak side with their mobility and get more map control. In your mind, Zerg players probably doesnt know how to scout and would charge head first without any spell caster into 10 tanks and 5 Thors wating or something, then saying Tanks and Thors are too strong, lol. Snipe shouldn't be nerfed against Vipers. That's a totally valid matchup that the Ghost should dominate. My issue (and I assume that of a lot of people) that Ghosts are also the answer to Ultralisks, Brood Lords and Infestors, without any actual hard counter (Lingbane is ofc technically a hard counter, but only with perfect setup). Ghosts are just on the usual scale and I'm not even talking about SC2, I'm talking about gaming in general. Everyone knows that high-damage usually means squishy, anti-caster is usually never anti-tank/brawler, great anti-air is rarely great anti-ground and so on.
Ling Bane would be the hard counter if ghosts also didn't have cloak. So you need to add in the overseer. And what's the "hard counter" to the overseer? You got it- the ghost.
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EPT
