• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 16:03
CET 21:03
KST 05:03
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Finals Preview: Sweet Victory!12[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5
Community News
Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.174Evil Geniuses - shutting down20ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier5Weekly Cups (October 12-18): 5.0.17 era begins1[$1250] International ShieldBattery League92
StarCraft 2
General
How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? Weekly Cups (October 19-25): Clem triples first in 5.0.17 Evil Geniuses - shutting down REPORT: StarCraft 2: Remastered In Development No more SC2 streamers on team liquid?
Tourneys
Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) RSL 2026 Offline Finals LCQ Sign-Ups Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 KungFu Cup Announcement RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-22
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
Simple Questions/Answers [G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
Mutation # 549 Endless Sparkles The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 548 Shining Bright Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror
Brood War
General
Sagi.gg Launcher Released SC4ALL II Brood War Complete Invited Player Lineup BW General Discussion Starcraft player cRuZa Passed away. BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[IPSL] IPSL Winter 26-27 Ro24 is HERE! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4 [BSL23] RO24 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET
Strategy
50,000-Word Terran Builds Memo 2026-10-22 Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Mobile Legends: Bang Bang Armies of Exigo - YesYes? General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Chess Thread
Fan Clubs
Reynor Fan Club The Flash Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Innovate or Game Over?
TrAiDoS
ShieldBattery on Mac
Kraekkling
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8606 users

5.0.11 Patch Released - Balance Changes - Page 12

Forum Index > SC2 General
223 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 10 11 12 All
moonsjde
Profile Joined October 2022
48 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-14 04:39:24
February 14 2023 03:38 GMT
#221
On February 14 2023 00:23 Sogetsu wrote:
Honestly, to everyone saying Overchard nerf was huge, yeah it is, build some more batteries, problem solved. It is not like Zerg has only 1 Queen and can deny any push, most of them spam them like Lings, and in most Cheese the Protoss do exactly that, spam Batteries with the push, but not for defense... like "Yeah I will try to Overcharge one Pylon and I will be fine"

i think you're missing something critical about what makes overcharge effective. the healing rate (not the total shields healed, but how quickly they heal) is super important for keeping expensive units alive, and having extra batteries won't make a robo or stargate unit survive if the healing can't out-DPS your opponent's focus fire. extra batteries can provide longevity against extremely committed attacks with a lot of reinforcement, but they don't do anything to prevent something like a tank push from just bullying tech units or a nexus to death. this is where the "just one battery" meme comes from and why often pros don't care to build more than one per nexus - it's really specifically about the overcharge healing rate. the reason you build many batteries with cheese is because it extends the longevity of an attack which in theory extends your timing window

i understand why people dislike super batteries and why they were nerfed, but it does create a hole in protoss's defensive power that can make the econ/army balancing act really difficult. toss needs something else to fill that defensive role that isn't a feelsbad for the opponent and perhaps rewards execution more than pressing a button. maybe something like batteries healing buildings faster than units so toss can take more advantage of backward positioning behind their buildings (which benefits both zerg and terran immensely in defensive fights and is supposed to be part of basic RTS tactics and defender's advantage) but can't simply stand forward and take an unfair fight? not sure, but there has to be a solution better than "build more batteries," which just encourages even less active play by toss. toss players WANT to be active in macro games, but there has to be an incentive for it!

problem is people love to hate on turtling and toss deathballs but they also hate the things that discourage those playstyles, the things that allow toss to split army and harass. people forget that defensive tools are not just for turtling, they also enable counterplay. people bitch about prisms, recall, batteries, but without those tools protoss is a race of slow, expensive units that have to be positioned perfectly 100% of the time or a good opponent will very rapidly use faster units to find superior value. so either allow protoss to have the "cheats" everyone hates playing against or substantially alter the lower tech units to be faster and more efficient when actively microed. for my money i would prefer taking power out of high tech units and putting it into stuff like gateway/immortal and phoenixes, all of which are widely considered the most mechanically fun units toss has, but it has to be one way or the other. in a game as fast as SC2 you can't just click your way out of the limitation that unit speed puts on your micro potential. this is a huge reason mech struggles to be relevant and a common complaint from mech players as well. i get that "big giant laser robots and technology" is part of the assumed identity of the race, but if you ask me it's more important for matchups to be fun on both sides than it is to get the "flavor win" of carriers and colossus being core units. frankly if you want to talk about flavor i think the advanced technology race should be the one with scans and sensor towers and terran should probably have stuff like observers, but that's stepping out of matchup balance and into major redesigns that will never happen
Turbovolver
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia2454 Posts
February 14 2023 04:19 GMT
#222
Whiners in shambles. You love to see it.
The original Bogus fan.
TurtleFish
Profile Joined December 2022
11 Posts
Last Edited: 2023-02-14 05:37:07
February 14 2023 05:34 GMT
#223
[image loading]

Protoss' only representative in the balance council (Harstem) is Reynor's bi*tch. Are you really that surprised Zerg keeps getting buffed every patch?
ishitlaxkar1010
Profile Joined August 2024
1 Post
Last Edited: 2024-08-21 09:24:19
August 21 2024 08:50 GMT
#224
Bot edit.

User was banned for this post.
Prev 1 10 11 12 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 15h 57m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
MindelVK 24
EmSc Tv 16
StarCraft: Brood War
Shuttle 560
White-Ra 134
ProTech132
sSak 41
910 31
Sexy 26
Dota 2
Gorgc17589
Counter-Strike
edward43
Heroes of the Storm
Liquid`Hasu545
XaKoH 320
Trikslyr76
Other Games
FrodaN1013
Beastyqt981
B2W.Neo778
ceh9624
mouzStarbuck390
ToD173
KnowMe90
Dewaltoss51
QueenE50
Organizations
StarCraft 2
EmSc Tv 16
EmSc2Tv 16
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 24
• Adnapsc2 15
• Reevou 5
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• 80smullet 21
• FirePhoenix11
• ChaeLyn 7
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis2825
• Jankos2509
• TFBlade1096
Other Games
• imaqtpie702
• Shiphtur135
Upcoming Events
GSL
15h 57m
Epic.LAN
16h 57m
Big Brain Bouts
20h 57m
OSC
1d 1h
Replay Cast
1d 2h
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 13h
WardiTV Invitational
1d 15h
Epic.LAN
1d 16h
IPSL
1d 19h
eOnzErG vs McRibbed
LancerX vs StRyKeR
AI Arena Tournament
1d 21h
[ Show More ]
OSC
2 days
Yamato Cup
2 days
IPSL
2 days
Artosis vs RiceHat
Kyrie vs Sony
Map Test Tournament
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
Ultimate Battle
3 days
Rush vs BeSt
Replay Cast
4 days
Rogue vs Classic
Patches Events
4 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
KCM Race Survival
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-10-28
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HCC Season 3

Ongoing

Acropolis #5
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 4
International ShieldBattery League
BSL Season 23
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026

Upcoming

IPSL Winter 2026-27
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.