EPTDH Oceania - Risky controversy - Page 3
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
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RDO
Italy60 Posts
On August 06 2020 04:58 Fango wrote: If you have citizenship and want to farm a weaker region, go ahead. But you should be at least made to play on that server. Why? If rules allow for someone with citizenship to play on another region, the game should be played on the fairest server for both players. Making the player with the citizenship play on a disatvantage on pourpose sounds way more like kind of a retaliation for "someone who tries to steal our spot" than a fair rule. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On August 06 2020 05:02 RDO wrote: Why? If rules allow for someone with citizenship to play on another region, the game should be played on the fairest server for both players. Making the player with the citizenship play on a disatvantage on pourpose sounds way more like kind of a retaliation for "someone who tries to steal our spot" than a fair rule. The whole purpose of having regional qualifiers is to try and benefit scenes that don't get as much support or have a lot going for them. Letting players that live, practice, and compete outside of those regions enter is already concerning, but there's not much you can do if they're legally citizens. What's happening here is that TOs aren't merely allowing it, they're accomodating it by forcing them to play on middle-ground servers. Regional qualifiers should be hosted on that regions server. If you don't actually live there why should we feel bad for you? Otherwise you're just limiting the oppurtunity for those regions to develop because any GM on EU who happens to have citizenship can claim the spot. | ||
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dbRic1203
Germany2655 Posts
On August 06 2020 04:58 Fango wrote: If you have citizenship and want to farm a weaker region, go ahead. But you should be at least made to play on that server. They actually play on the server of the region, as it is not only Australia, but Oceania + Rest of Asia. Singapore is part of it and that was the server, it was played on. | ||
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RDO
Italy60 Posts
On August 06 2020 05:13 Fango wrote: The whole purpose of having regional qualifiers is to try and benefit scenes that don't get as much support or have a lot going for them. Letting players that live, practice, and compete outside of those regions enter is already concerning, but there's not much you can do if they're legally citizens. What's happening here is that TOs aren't merely allowing it, they're accomodating it by forcing them to play on middle-ground servers. Regional qualifiers should be hosted on that regions server. If you don't actually live there why should we feel bad for you? Otherwise you're just limiting the oppurtunity for those regions to develop because any GM on EU who happens to have citizenship can claim the spot. I strongly, strongly disagree. This isn't about feeling bad for someone, it's about rules and faireness, not feelings. We might discuss the rule about allowing citizenship, but other than that, once it's allowed, putting someone in a disadvantage just because it's perceived as someone out of his place, or because we want to help the opponent for whatever reason, is the definition of unfairness. It's like allowing someone to park their car on a certain place and then pretend that because that slot was originally thought as a slot for the people of that neighborhood, it should be allowed to cut their tires. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
You're saying that what's happening with Risky is fine by the rules, I'm not disagreeing with that. I'm saying that the rules shouldn't accommodate a situation where a player who doesn't reside, practice, or compete in a certain region is taking that region's spot. Due to restrictions being based of citizenship, you can say it's unavoidable, but just hosting all qualifiers on that region's server (unless both players agree between them) seems like a sensible step. Otherwise you're supporting the above problem. | ||
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imre
France9263 Posts
On August 06 2020 06:59 Fango wrote: Qualifiers should not be a political or nationality issue. They're to help develop certain regions of play. Therefore people living in that region should be able to play on their own server. It's really that simple. You're saying that what's happening with Risky is fine by the rules, I'm not disagreeing with that. I'm saying that the rules shouldn't accommodate a situation where a player who doesn't reside, practice, or compete in a certain region is taking that region's spot. Due to restrictions being based of citizenship, you can say it's unavoidable, but just hosting all qualifiers on that region's server (unless both players agree between them) seems like a sensible step. Otherwise you're supporting the above problem. All qualifiers are hosted on the region's server. It just that the region is very big. | ||
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dbRic1203
Germany2655 Posts
On August 06 2020 06:59 Fango wrote: Qualifiers should not be a political or nationality issue. They're to help develop certain regions of play. Therefore people living in that region should be able to play on their own server. It's really that simple. You're saying that what's happening with Risky is fine by the rules, I'm not disagreeing with that. I'm saying that the rules shouldn't accommodate a situation where a player who doesn't reside, practice, or compete in a certain region is taking that region's spot. Due to restrictions being based of citizenship, you can say it's unavoidable, but just hosting all qualifiers on that region's server (unless both players agree between them) seems like a sensible step. Otherwise you're supporting the above problem. So you say Region should be only based on residency, not citisenship? That means Kelazhur has to Play Eu and Special and Scarlett can t compete in Ept at all. LatAm would be pretty dead without the 2 main Players competing for their Region. | ||
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John Madden
American Samoa894 Posts
feel free to come visit our countries anytime though go on] edit: even pedophile sympathisers straight up hate you, think about your actions man. User was warned for this post | ||
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kottbullar
Australia490 Posts
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RPR_Tempest
Australia7799 Posts
On August 06 2020 16:02 kottbullar wrote: We did not even have an AUS server until...HoTS I believe ? SG was the only Oceanic server back then and we still produced people like MoonGlade. Now people are complaining that you are forced to play with ~50 ping advantage instead of 250. The SG server could be better, but people are acting as if that somehow turned the situation into a ping disadvantage for the Aussies which is definitely not true at all. We don't have a ping advantage at all god dammit its even at best, and back then we didn't have cable damage between Australia and Singapore Also we produced mOOnGLaDe because there was a lot of opportunity, interest and LANs at the time that we flat-out don't have anymore. Plus he knew staying in Australia was still nearly a dead-end for a progamer. Petraeus, PiG, iaguz, etc everyone who mattered or could say they were a legitimate pro gamer from Australia went overseas to practice for an extended period of time and play in LANs in that region. PiG and Petraeus to Europe, iaguz to America. Probe has been to America and Korea for brief periods. EPT Qualifier is literally the only thing in the scene to practice for. Our scene hasn't been the same since ACL died in 2015. | ||
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Luolis
Finland7190 Posts
On August 06 2020 16:06 RPR_Tempest wrote: We don't have a ping advantage at all god dammit its even at best, and back then we didn't have cable damage between Australia and Singapore Also we produced mOOnGLaDe because there was a lot of opportunity, interest and LANs at the time that we flat-out don't have anymore. Plus he knew staying in Australia was still nearly a dead-end for a progamer. Petraeus, PiG, iaguz, etc everyone who mattered or could say they were a legitimate pro gamer from Australia went overseas to practice for an extended period of time and play in LANs in that region. PiG and Petraeus to Europe, iaguz to America. Probe has been to America and Korea for brief periods. EPT Qualifier is literally the only thing in the scene to practice for. Our scene hasn't been the same since ACL died in 2015. You think au to sg is worse than uk to sg? Lol | ||
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stilt
France2755 Posts
On August 06 2020 16:06 RPR_Tempest wrote: We don't have a ping advantage at all god dammit its even at best, and back then we didn't have cable damage between Australia and Singapore Also we produced mOOnGLaDe because there was a lot of opportunity, interest and LANs at the time that we flat-out don't have anymore. Plus he knew staying in Australia was still nearly a dead-end for a progamer. Petraeus, PiG, iaguz, etc everyone who mattered or could say they were a legitimate pro gamer from Australia went overseas to practice for an extended period of time and play in LANs in that region. PiG and Petraeus to Europe, iaguz to America. Probe has been to America and Korea for brief periods. EPT Qualifier is literally the only thing in the scene to practice for. Our scene hasn't been the same since ACL died in 2015. It's a bit hard to take you seriously when you're bsing about the ping... Or the numerous personal attacks of your community (or rather group of bullies considering how tiny it is) against Risky. If only you were just bads at the game... I was a bit neutral but I don't think any reasonnable person can have sympathy for you. The success of one subtop eu player (prolly not even top 25-30) playing on the singapor server shows there is not much to develop in this region, Blizzard shouldn't have organize wcs over here. But if anything, the hatred against Risky is a good incentive to train, you literaly have no excuse and this is still 2500 for the second, 1600 for the third (way too much) | ||
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ytherik
199 Posts
On August 06 2020 13:36 dbRic1203 wrote: So you say Region should be only based on residency, not citisenship? That means Kelazhur has to Play Eu and Special and Scarlett can t compete in Ept at all. LatAm would be pretty dead without the 2 main Players competing for their Region. I wouldn't be so sure LatAm or any other region would be dead just because 2 best players wouldn't participate in regional tourneys. That could actually have the opposite effect by motivating lesser known players from the region to practice hard because they would realistically have better chance of succeeding and making money. Not saying Special or Kelazhur should be banned from participating, but they should be forced to play on the server of that region if it's a regional qualifier because it's their choice to go live outside of the region. If they want best ping they should play in tourneys in the region they reside in. | ||
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stilt
France2755 Posts
On August 06 2020 22:21 ytherik wrote: I wouldn't be so sure LatAm would be dead just because 2 best players wouldn't participate in regional tourneys. That could actually have the opposite effect by motivating lesser known players from the region to practice hard because they would realistically have better chance of succeeding and making money. Not saying Special or Kelazhur should be banned from participating, but they should be forced to play on the server of that region if it's a regional qualifier because it's their choice to go live outside of the region. If they want best ping they should play in tourneys in the region they reside in. That's totally fucked up. It handicaps the players who dedicated themselves the most to progaming then. | ||
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ytherik
199 Posts
On August 06 2020 22:24 stilt wrote: That's totally fucked up. It handicaps the players who dedicated themselves the most to progaming then. That would only handicap players who are not residing in a region which a given tourney is meant to support. It has nothing to do with the amount of dedication. | ||
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stilt
France2755 Posts
On August 06 2020 22:27 ytherik wrote: That would only handicap players who are not residing in a region which a given tourney is meant to support. It has nothing to do with the amount of dedication. It handicaps the players from the say region who are seeking and taking the risk to get better opportunities to train. I don't think it's helping in any way the scene to penalyze the stronger players of weaker regions this way and I totally understand Special's reaction in this regard. Or then you have to considerably reallocates the cashprize into the stronger region. WCS is still made for progamers, not a bunch of angry aussies/low gm players. | ||
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ytherik
199 Posts
On August 06 2020 22:31 stilt wrote: It handicaps the players from the say region who are seeking and taking the risk to get better opportunities to train. I don't think it's helping in any way the scene to penalyze the stronger players of weaker regions this way and I totally understand Special's reaction in this regard. Or then you have to considerably reallocates the cashprize into the stronger region. WCS is still made for progamers, not a bunch of angry aussies/low gm players. Except it's not really targeted at "stronger players of weaker regions" as you put it, nobody said that. It's about supporting the players staying in the weaker region, so that they also have some incentives to practice, otherwise a weak region may always remain weak and has a smaller chance to get better. Say player like DRG moves to the US and starts farming that NA money by participating in local NA tourneys and what not. When he decides to play e.g. in Olimoleague, which is a tourney supporting KR region, he should be forced to play on KR server imho. It would be unfair to force players from KR to play not on KR while residing in KR and playing in KR tourney. It's clear and simple in my mind, but apparently I'm in a minority. | ||
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Luolis
Finland7190 Posts
On August 06 2020 22:43 ytherik wrote: Except it's not really targeted at "stronger players of weaker regions" as you put it, nobody said that. It's about supporting the players staying in the weaker region, so that they also have some incentives to practice, otherwise a weak region may always remain weak and has a smaller chance to get better. Say player like DRG moves to the US and starts farming that NA money by participating in local NA tourneys and what not. When he decides to play e.g. in Olimoleague, which is a tourney supporting KR region, he should be forced to play on KR server imho. It would be unfair to force players from KR to play not on KR while residing in KR and playing in KR tourney. It's clear and simple in my mind, but apparently I'm in a minority. Singapore server is part of this region so your point is rendered completely invalid with that alone. | ||
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ytherik
199 Posts
On August 06 2020 22:45 Luolis wrote: Singapore server is part of this region so your point is rendered completely invalid with that alone. I was not talking about Singapore specifically, but generally about regional tourneys/qualis. Still, if you don't reside in a region for which a given tourney is meant for, your opponent residing in that region should have the ability to force a server of their choice. | ||
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