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On May 10 2020 06:05 Waxangel wrote:Feels bad being the only one who thought the cheeses were hilarious and fun :[ sOs builds a Nexus in opponent's main which doesn't really do anything (he won cause of the DT's), and everyone loses their minds. TY floats four barracks into Solar's main and people are calling it a terrible night of games 
the probe that built the DT pylon was successfully hidden in the main because it was rallied out of the nexus, which caused a distraction. otherwise he never would have had a hidden pylon. it was clearly a practiced plan B for the allin
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Czech Republic12128 Posts
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats)
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On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats)
The seasons were probably hard enough even with them.
The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago.
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On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago.
Zest is almost gone too, sad for protoss. Really hope trap and Parting could perform well enough to fill the hole.
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On May 11 2020 07:00 Howard_Kao wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago. Zest is almost gone too, sad for protoss. Really hope trap and Parting could perform well enough to fill the hole.
Yea, we will be left with:
Trap
Parting
Sos
Dear
Neeb is still very young and has proven he could win against Korean tier opponents in the past. Maybe he can make a resurgence
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Solar was a total let-down. After the 4 barracks float into the main in the first game he was on tilt the rest of the night. When his Nydus play was stopped on golden wall, he could could have just gotten back into the worm and lived to fight another day (they were even on workers) but instead took a bad fight like he had no choice and gg'ed out. His baneling all in vs Stats was ill executed in game 1 (see Scarlett vs Dear for a better version) and felt like he was in a hurry to catch a train. Thus when he somehow got a decent lead w roaches in game 2, it wasnt much surprise when he threw it away as fast as possible.
I recall the GSL group selection interviews talking about him needing to get some perspective and maturity, and this performance didn't do much to convince me his peers were wrong.
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On May 09 2020 23:33 rasi86 wrote:
Toss needs to be buffed badly if Blizzard wants to have the game balanced again.
User was banned for this post.
You get banned for stating your opinion?
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On May 11 2020 10:58 Dedraterllaerau wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2020 23:33 rasi86 wrote:
Toss needs to be buffed badly if Blizzard wants to have the game balanced again.
User was banned for this post. You get banned for stating your opinion?
How do you think this forum became such a ghost town?
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On May 11 2020 10:58 Dedraterllaerau wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2020 23:33 rasi86 wrote:
Toss needs to be buffed badly if Blizzard wants to have the game balanced again.
User was banned for this post. You get banned for stating your opinion?
Because racial imbalance was totally a factor in those games
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On May 11 2020 10:58 Dedraterllaerau wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2020 23:33 rasi86 wrote:
Toss needs to be buffed badly if Blizzard wants to have the game balanced again.
User was banned for this post. You get banned for stating your opinion?
Well this isn't the balance thread, I'm pretty sure you'd get banned for coming in here and talking Chemistry, politics or whatever that has nothing to do the actual topic at hand.
I haven't seen the game but it sounds when Reading the summary like the none Solar games were great, ofc Stats getting killed by light pressure is really weird but happens.
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On May 11 2020 07:04 BerserkSword wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 07:00 Howard_Kao wrote:On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago. Zest is almost gone too, sad for protoss. Really hope trap and Parting could perform well enough to fill the hole. Yea, we will be left with: Trap Parting Sos Dear Neeb is still very young and has proven he could win against Korean tier opponents in the past. Maybe he can make a resurgence
Considering he couldn't even qualify for TSL.... yea I wouldn't hang on to hope of his being the Protoss hope for the world.
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Bisutopia19152 Posts
On May 11 2020 10:58 Dedraterllaerau wrote:Show nested quote +On May 09 2020 23:33 rasi86 wrote:
Toss needs to be buffed badly if Blizzard wants to have the game balanced again.
User was banned for this post. You get banned for stating your opinion?
Unfortunately seeing the ban text doesn't tell the whole story. This person, in particular, has been warned 4 times and banned twice for posts with very blatant balance whining. This ban is a culmination of the user's posting history and not just this post.
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Czech Republic12128 Posts
On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago.
We had finalists, Classic, Stats or Zest. It's not like Protoss cannot reach finals, it's more about winning it.
Issue is we just lost 2 top S players and 1 who could have gone there had he wanted(herO)
Which is big because unless Dear finds his long lost mojo and Trap finds out how to play PvZ there's nobody who can replace Classic or Stats.
I don't think sOs will ever go back to his HotS levels.
Edit: it's like losing Maru, Inno and TY in 2 consecutive seasons.(more or less)
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Well Protoss would have a better chance of winning a finals if they'd run up against someone other than Maru. You can blame Maru for Protoss not winning a finals in several years.
Well, aside from Super Tournaments, Protoss has won Super Tournaments recently.
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On May 11 2020 16:15 deacon.frost wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago. We had finalists, Classic, Stats or Zest. It's not like Protoss cannot reach finals, it's more about winning it. Issue is we just lost 2 top S players and 1 who could have gone there had he wanted(herO) Which is big because unless Dear finds his long lost mojo and Trap finds out how to play PvZ there's nobody who can replace Classic or Stats. I don't think sOs will ever go back to his HotS levels. Edit: it's like losing Maru, Inno and TY in 2 consecutive seasons.(more or less)
I'd assume that protoss enthusiasts would care about protoss players winning finals instead of nonstop losing to terran and zerg players in code S finals for over 3 years lol. The New York Knicks losing every finals I've seen them play in in didnt make it easy for me to be a Knicks fan lol
But yea I agree - losing those 4 are huge as they are the only ones who won any kind of GSL event in LotV.
On May 11 2020 16:50 Vindicare605 wrote:
Well Protoss would have a better chance of winning a finals if they'd run up against someone other than Maru. You can blame Maru for Protoss not winning a finals in several years.
This is not true.
Since protoss last code S win, Protoss players HAVE went up against someone other than maru. Innovation, Maru, Rogue, and Dark have all beaten protoss players in the Code S finals since the race's Code S win
On May 11 2020 16:01 Vindicare605 wrote:
Considering he couldn't even qualify for TSL.... yea I wouldn't hang on to hope of his being the Protoss hope for the world.
Yea neeb isnt looking too hot this year. It's possible that it's just a temporary slump though, especially since he's young. In 2018 he was a code S quarterfinalist
I'm just throwing out names of possible protoss talent for the future lol. They truly are taking a huge hit in terms of elite talent
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On May 11 2020 17:33 BerserkSword wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 16:15 deacon.frost wrote:On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago. We had finalists, Classic, Stats or Zest. It's not like Protoss cannot reach finals, it's more about winning it. Issue is we just lost 2 top S players and 1 who could have gone there had he wanted(herO) Which is big because unless Dear finds his long lost mojo and Trap finds out how to play PvZ there's nobody who can replace Classic or Stats. I don't think sOs will ever go back to his HotS levels. Edit: it's like losing Maru, Inno and TY in 2 consecutive seasons.(more or less) I'd assume that protoss enthusiasts would care about protoss players winning finals instead of nonstop losing to terran and zerg players in code S finals for over 3 years lol. The New York Knicks losing every finals I've seen them play in in didnt make it easy for me to be a Knicks fan lol But yea I agree - losing those 4 are huge as they are the only ones who won any kind of GSL event in LotV. Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 16:50 Vindicare605 wrote:
Well Protoss would have a better chance of winning a finals if they'd run up against someone other than Maru. You can blame Maru for Protoss not winning a finals in several years. This is just wrong. Since protoss last code S win, Protoss players HAVE went up against someone other than maru. Innovation, Maru, Rogue, and Dark have all beaten protoss players in the Code S finals since the race's Code S win
Of the players you've listed, I can't name a Protoss that is objectively, definitively better than any of them. If the best in the world is who is holding Protoss back, I can't think that's a bad thing.
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On May 11 2020 17:33 BerserkSword wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 16:50 Vindicare605 wrote:
Well Protoss would have a better chance of winning a finals if they'd run up against someone other than Maru. You can blame Maru for Protoss not winning a finals in several years. This is not true. Since protoss last code S win, Protoss players HAVE went up against someone other than maru. Innovation, Maru, Rogue, and Dark have all beaten protoss players in the Code S finals since the race's Code S win
Yeah that is true, technically though half (3/6) GSL finals lost by protoss platyers were against Maru. While its not true Maru alone has stolen the Championships away from the protoss players he has been the greatest thorn in their side by far.
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On May 11 2020 17:43 Vindicare605 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 17:33 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 16:15 deacon.frost wrote:On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago. We had finalists, Classic, Stats or Zest. It's not like Protoss cannot reach finals, it's more about winning it. Issue is we just lost 2 top S players and 1 who could have gone there had he wanted(herO) Which is big because unless Dear finds his long lost mojo and Trap finds out how to play PvZ there's nobody who can replace Classic or Stats. I don't think sOs will ever go back to his HotS levels. Edit: it's like losing Maru, Inno and TY in 2 consecutive seasons.(more or less) I'd assume that protoss enthusiasts would care about protoss players winning finals instead of nonstop losing to terran and zerg players in code S finals for over 3 years lol. The New York Knicks losing every finals I've seen them play in in didnt make it easy for me to be a Knicks fan lol But yea I agree - losing those 4 are huge as they are the only ones who won any kind of GSL event in LotV. On May 11 2020 16:50 Vindicare605 wrote:
Well Protoss would have a better chance of winning a finals if they'd run up against someone other than Maru. You can blame Maru for Protoss not winning a finals in several years. This is just wrong. Since protoss last code S win, Protoss players HAVE went up against someone other than maru. Innovation, Maru, Rogue, and Dark have all beaten protoss players in the Code S finals since the race's Code S win Of the players you've listed, I can't name a Protoss that is objectively, definitively better than any of them. If the best in the world is who is holding Protoss back, I can't think that's a bad thing.
Well whether or not the Protoss GOATs are simply "objectively, definitively" worse than their Terran and Zerg counterparts is a completely different conversation, one that I won't partake in here. I wasn't comparing Protoss legends to Terran and Zerg legends.
I was just having a discussion about how hard Protoss enthusiasts might have been having it and might continue to have it in the future.
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Czech Republic12128 Posts
On May 11 2020 17:33 BerserkSword wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 16:15 deacon.frost wrote:On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago. We had finalists, Classic, Stats or Zest. It's not like Protoss cannot reach finals, it's more about winning it. Issue is we just lost 2 top S players and 1 who could have gone there had he wanted(herO) Which is big because unless Dear finds his long lost mojo and Trap finds out how to play PvZ there's nobody who can replace Classic or Stats. I don't think sOs will ever go back to his HotS levels. Edit: it's like losing Maru, Inno and TY in 2 consecutive seasons.(more or less) I'd assume that protoss enthusiasts would care about protoss players winning finals instead of nonstop losing to terran and zerg players in code S finals for over 3 years lol. The New York Knicks losing every finals I've seen them play in in didnt make it easy for me to be a Knicks fan lol But yea I agree - losing those 4 are huge as they are the only ones who won any kind of GSL event in LotV. + Show Spoiler +On May 11 2020 16:50 Vindicare605 wrote:
Well Protoss would have a better chance of winning a finals if they'd run up against someone other than Maru. You can blame Maru for Protoss not winning a finals in several years. This is not true. Since protoss last code S win, Protoss players HAVE went up against someone other than maru. Innovation, Maru, Rogue, and Dark have all beaten protoss players in the Code S finals since the race's Code S win On May 11 2020 16:01 Vindicare605 wrote:
Considering he couldn't even qualify for TSL.... yea I wouldn't hang on to hope of his being the Protoss hope for the world. Yea neeb isnt looking too hot this year. It's possible that it's just a temporary slump though, especially since he's young. In 2018 he was a code S quarterfinalist I'm just throwing out names of possible protoss talent for the future lol. They truly are taking a huge hit in terms of elite talen t
The thing is that before the Protoss had a chance. While losing to the best who are currently on fire all the time is painful to watch(Especially when Maru was on fire), at least they got to the finals and had a chance. Now we have to hope that Trap won't meet Zerg on the way or that Dear will finally make it. Protoss fans are left exactly with 2 players unless I am missing anyone. Compare this with Classic or the usual Stats(this year Stats made some unusual plays which may be connected with his military departure, or meta not good for him as somebody already mentioned).
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On May 11 2020 17:51 BerserkSword wrote:Show nested quote +On May 11 2020 17:43 Vindicare605 wrote:On May 11 2020 17:33 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 16:15 deacon.frost wrote:On May 11 2020 05:38 BerserkSword wrote:On May 11 2020 01:46 deacon.frost wrote:
So, with Stats out and his army nigh, we just lost 3 top protoss players with no replacement. Protoss entusiasts have hard seasons in front of them(herO, Classic, Stats) The seasons were probably hard enough even with them. The last time a Protoss player won a Code S was over 3 years ago. We had finalists, Classic, Stats or Zest. It's not like Protoss cannot reach finals, it's more about winning it. Issue is we just lost 2 top S players and 1 who could have gone there had he wanted(herO) Which is big because unless Dear finds his long lost mojo and Trap finds out how to play PvZ there's nobody who can replace Classic or Stats. I don't think sOs will ever go back to his HotS levels. Edit: it's like losing Maru, Inno and TY in 2 consecutive seasons.(more or less) I'd assume that protoss enthusiasts would care about protoss players winning finals instead of nonstop losing to terran and zerg players in code S finals for over 3 years lol. The New York Knicks losing every finals I've seen them play in in didnt make it easy for me to be a Knicks fan lol But yea I agree - losing those 4 are huge as they are the only ones who won any kind of GSL event in LotV. On May 11 2020 16:50 Vindicare605 wrote:
Well Protoss would have a better chance of winning a finals if they'd run up against someone other than Maru. You can blame Maru for Protoss not winning a finals in several years. This is just wrong. Since protoss last code S win, Protoss players HAVE went up against someone other than maru. Innovation, Maru, Rogue, and Dark have all beaten protoss players in the Code S finals since the race's Code S win Of the players you've listed, I can't name a Protoss that is objectively, definitively better than any of them. If the best in the world is who is holding Protoss back, I can't think that's a bad thing. Well whether or not the Protoss GOATs are simply "objectively, definitively" worse than their Terran and Zerg counterparts is a completely different conversation, one that I won't partake in here. I wasn't comparing Protoss legends to Terran and Zerg legends. I was just having a discussion about how hard Protoss enthusiasts might have been having it and might continue to have it in the future.
We don't need to have that particular conversation, we just need to ask a simple question.
Do you believe that any of the above results were a result of racial imbalance? I have a hard time believing any of them were. It's a much easier argument to make that the Protoss players were just inferior players in the matches they played.
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EPT
