EPTAnd the less said about recall, the better. It's laughable and redundant to have two forms of recall in the game - there should only be one recall ability with a hefty cooldown.
Community Feedback Update - March 6 - Page 8
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Justinian
United Kingdom158 Posts
And the less said about recall, the better. It's laughable and redundant to have two forms of recall in the game - there should only be one recall ability with a hefty cooldown. | ||
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ihatevideogames
570 Posts
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Popparockz
United States40 Posts
1. seeing an abnormally high queen count 2. no third base 3. 3rd base but no drones on it 4. how about actually sending a hallucination into the zerg base and seeing if there is a nydus worm being made 5. lack of hydra | ||
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On March 08 2018 05:19 Popparockz wrote: Yall, nydus all ins have to be the easiest thing to scout in the game. Here are some of the tells. 1. seeing an abnormally high queen count 2. no third base 3. 3rd base but no drones on it 4. how about actually sending a hallucination into the zerg base and seeing if there is a nydus worm being made 5. lack of hydra I'm sure Classic disagrees. | ||
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winsonsonho
Korea (South)143 Posts
I feel Protoss in LOTV would greatly benefit from return of the (dare I say it) Arbiter (and get rid of the mothership superunit) which would allow Protoss to recall small bunches of its units between bases and around the map. This might make them less reliant on the late game deathball, allow them to play less defensively, and not be constantly outmanoeuvred by zerg and terran. Obviously Protoss might need a few nerfs to balance things out, such as to warp prism and/or warp ins, carrier, oracle, whatever. I might be flogging a dead horse here but certain SC1 units were brought back to SC2 which improved the game, and the msc was removed (thank Aiur!), so I can only hope! | ||
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Elentos
55456 Posts
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Freeborn
Germany421 Posts
Alternatively go and load up the unit tester and have 10+ (20ish supply) shoot at a stacked 100 (air/ground) supply toss army and see it get almost obliterated instantly. It's really ridiculous. Another factor that is often overlooked is that a raven (with 200 energy) can now disable 4 units instantly for 8 seconds, so a single raven can take out all or most collossi from a fight, which is huge. 3 Raven can disable 12 carriers, 9 raven can keep 12 carriers disabled for 24 seconds. Not to mention the fact that the AA missile aoe is so huge that you only need 2 raven to blanket an army for 20 seconds, The effect of which equals a +3 Attack uprade when used with marines. Marauders, cyclones and BC will also hugely benefit from it, I think the 20 sec duration is actually a bit too long. Oh and anyone saying cant force a fight... wtf? terran can just drop toss bases and protoss is forced to defend. And ravens are perfect to accompany and enhance bio drops. The main reason that ravens are rarely used - unless they are overpowered - is probably the fact that terrans basically never need a techlab on a starport.. you want a reactor for medivacs, libs and vikings. I would even recommend changing the liberator into a techlab unit and reducing its buildtime and maybe adjusting some other stats, that would make starport techlabs more common and would probably encourage the raven usage a bit more. there are way too many air units that are reactorable to justify building a techlab for ravens only and the liberator is way too powerful too be mass produced in my opinion... | ||
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bObA
France300 Posts
On March 07 2018 07:50 Topin wrote: from 30 aoe to flat 5... is that right? idk kev That is an insane nerf and that is not good since only Maru is using mass ravens, with that he did not win IEM and he is the only one Terran in GSL... | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16378 Posts
I think Blizzard is very close to end of balance changes to LotV. IEM Katowice was 1 of the most exciting SC2 events i've ever seen. This is why I think they are close to finishing up with balance changes to LotV. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On March 08 2018 05:46 Freeborn wrote: Every terran whining please go and check out the recent youtube videos of the raven obliterating a carrier fleet with zero chance of evasion or counter or escape... Alternatively go and load up the unit tester and have 10+ (20ish supply) shoot at a stacked 100 (air/ground) supply toss army and see it get almost obliterated instantly. It's really ridiculous. You can make all kinds of shit happen in a unit tester. 3 widow mines can kill 50 mutas, one high templar can kill 30 marines etc etc. The game should be balanced around the pro level. And currently at the pro level terran is by far the worst race. They haven't made a final in 6 months, Katowice had 2 terran in the ro12, GSL has 1 in the ro8, and WCS also had 1 in the ro8. That's why terrans are whining. Maru's performance at Katowice was the only glimmer of hope and it was enough to get terran nerfed again. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On March 08 2018 05:19 Popparockz wrote: Yall, nydus all ins have to be the easiest thing to scout in the game. Here are some of the tells. 1. seeing an abnormally high queen count 2. no third base 3. 3rd base but no drones on it 4. how about actually sending a hallucination into the zerg base and seeing if there is a nydus worm being made 5. lack of hydra I've said this before but I honestly cannot remember the last nydus cheese that didn't work in a pro tournament. It's far too effective for something that's supposedly "easy to scout". No cheese/allin should have such a high winrate | ||
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Freeborn
Germany421 Posts
On March 08 2018 05:30 winsonsonho wrote: Watching Serrel vs ShowTime and Classic vs Rogue made me feel like protoss really struggled to move between bases to deal with harass. It felt like Protoss was just on the back foot the whole time and that they are too dependent on their slow late game units templar/carrier/tempest/mothership. It could be that Serrel and Rogue just played far superior but I just don't like the way Protoss has to defend to get to late game deathball (and then loose anyway because they've been outmanouvered the entire game). I feel Protoss in LOTV would greatly benefit from return of the (dare I say it) Arbiter (and get rid of the mothership superunit) which would allow Protoss to recall small bunches of its units between bases and around the map. This might make them less reliant on the late game deathball, allow them to play less defensively, and not be constantly outmanoeuvred by zerg and terran. Obviously Protoss might need a few nerfs to balance things out, such as to warp prism and/or warp ins, carrier, oracle, whatever. I might be flogging a dead horse here but certain SC1 units were brought back to SC2 which improved the game, and the msc was removed (thank Aiur!), so I can only hope! I agree, though I think the mothership should be removed and the nexus recall be changed to not have a cooldown but instead only teleport a limited number of units or units from a small area. I really don't know what the balance team thinks some times... why would you want a huge teleport with long cooldown? This will favor deathballs obviously since it encourages moving and recalling your army in a big clumped up ball. The way that terran and zerg can abuse protoss with drops and runbies is just stupid and though it may be hard to execute it is basically not defendable and will trigger a base trade more often than not, when protoss realizes he can't save his expansions. | ||
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On March 08 2018 06:00 Fango wrote: I've said this before but I honestly cannot remember the last nydus cheese that didn't work in a pro tournament. It's far too effective for something that's supposedly "easy to scout". No cheese/allin should have such a high winrate It's still kind of a fringe build though. It goes under the radar because people don't nydus cheese all that often. If it's done more often (which it very well might considering its recent success and the dropperlord nerf) people will either learn to hold if off better or it will become a "visible" problem. | ||
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Freeborn
Germany421 Posts
On March 08 2018 05:57 Fango wrote: You can make all kinds of shit happen in a unit tester. 3 widow mines can kill 50 mutas, one high templar can kill 30 marines etc etc. The game should be balanced around the pro level. And currently at the pro level terran is by far the worst race. They haven't made a final in 6 months, Katowice had 2 terran in the ro12, GSL has 1 in the ro8, and WCS also had 1 in the ro8. That's why terrans are whining. Maru's performance at Katowice was the only glimmer of hope and it was enough to get terran nerfed again. Check out the youtube videos then of progamers using them in real games lol... The recent set of changes has barely been active for a couple of weeks and the widow mine changes obviously disrupted a lot but you can already see the pro players adapting and using them effectively again. Plus your comparison is not really valid, since 50 mutas still have to fly into the mines and marines have to stand in the storm whereas the AAM has a big range and cant be evaded. Also to be fair widowmines are probably a big reason why mass mutas don't work as well any more and storm is a big reason why mass marine is not the best choice vs a toss with HT. Now also be aware of the fact that the AAM works versus EVERY UNIT IN THE GAME and can only be dimished at all by totally spreading your army. | ||
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zealotstim
United States455 Posts
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Less_Du_Et
United States18 Posts
Start at the root cause - Protoss Air Deathball was too OP for Zerg (and terran) --> nerf Carrier If Carrier is nerfed, Zerg anti air options may also be nerfed (since they were buffed to help counter Protoss Air) --> nerf corruptor and Hydra back to what it was (80 HP) Now with Protoss Air and Zerg corruptor/hydra nerfed, Terran buffs are not needed Massing air armies (ie. pure air deathballs) are boring to watch (less positional play/map has no impact). Air may be seen as an option to break seige lines, harass and support the rest of the army. Not something to reach and face roll A-move to victory. Buffing units to counter other buffed unit messes up things more...for example, buffing the viking has TvT implications. Vikings can now just land on couple of unseiged tanks to snipe them or take on take on more Bio in their ground mode. TLDR: Please consider nerfing the problem units instead of buffing the counters | ||
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kajtarp
Hungary457 Posts
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LSN
Germany696 Posts
Interceptor follow range is still a bit high and unforgiving. I would reduce it by 20 to 33%. Indeed nerfs should be considered instead of buffs. But in this case the viking change is interesting as it also improves the viking's capabilities as a ground unit. | ||
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Ranari
19 Posts
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scoo2r
Canada90 Posts
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