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Co-op Commander Guide: Swann

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Co-op Commander Guide: Swann

Text byTL.net ESPORTS
Graphics byJester
October 9th, 2017 16:24 GMT









Overview


[image loading]
As the Terran mech specialist, Swann excels at defeating his enemies with enhanced Terran Factory units. Swann’s style of armored warfare is supported by a strong static defense, allowing him to obliterate any enemy that dares to come into his range. The in-game description for Swann suggests that he is intended for "experienced" players and that much is accurate. One of the most difficult commanders to use well, mastering Swann is a true challenge to overcome. As Swann, the entire game can often feel like an uphill battle, but unlocking his true potential in the end game just might be worth the struggle.

Towards the the end of the game when you’ve reached 200 supply, Swann's power-level is only rivaled by the likes of Abathur, Stukov and Dehaka. Siege Tanks easily obliterate everything on the ground while Goliaths and Thors are quite formidable against air enemies. Not only that, but Swann's static defense is only matched by Karax's. The real challenge, however, is making it to the late game stage.

Strengths


Siege Tanks: Swann’s Siege Tanks are powerful long-ranged weapons that can melt anything on the ground from a huge distance. When massed in large numbers, no other commander can match the sustained damage that these put out from a safe distance.

Strong Static Defense: Swann has access to some of the strongest static defense in the game. When combined with Siege Tanks, Swann can effortlessly hold positions against both ground and air enemies.

Vespene Drones: Many commanders tend to find themselves with huge mineral banks and no Vespene Gas- especially Vorazun and Abathur. The extra gas from these drones is incredibly useful to these commanders, drastically enhancing their gameplay and thus making Swann a great source of support for his teammates.

Weaknesses


Slow Ramp-up Time: Swann is notorious for having one of the longest ramp-up times in the game, with no way to kickstart his economy. In addition, all of his units work best in numbers and are quite costly. Though his Combat Drop calldown is powerful, you can't rely on it for the entirety of the early game. In many missions, you might have to rely on your ally to carry you for the first 7 minutes of the game before you can really power up.

Difficult to Use: Swann requires intricate knowledge of timings or heavy assistance from his ally in order to survive in the early game. Hercules + Siege Tanks are an essential part of Swann’s preferred playstyle, but requires very precise micro to use effectively. Even less-effective strategies such as Cyclone/Hellion/Science Vessel require you to have a great deal of control. As such, we recommend that you watch the replay pack associated with this guide more than we have with any other guide.





Suggested Unit Compositions



[image loading]

Hercules/Siege Tank/Goliath/Science Vessel:

Swann's premier unit composition involves copious use of the Hercules/Siege Tank combination (Herc/Tank for short), which gives Swann a mix of pure power and mobility. Science Vessels and Goliaths are added on later to supplement this combination. Thors can also be added to this unit composition in the late game in order to provide area damage against light air enemies and Void Rays. More about the practical use of Herc/Tank can be found in the Hercules/Siege Tank section.

[image loading]

Siege Tank/Turret (Flaming Betty/Blaster Billy/Spinning Dizzy):

This is possibly the strongest defensive composition in the game. With Siege Tanks as the best defensive anti-ground unit in the game and Spinning Dizzys as the best anti-air structure in the game, this composition can hold positions indefinitely on defensive maps.

[image loading]

Goliath/Science Vessel:
At a high enough skill level, Herc/Tank/Goliath is the most effective composition in every non-mutation mission no matter what the enemy composition is (even Sky Terran). However, for the vast majority of co-op players this might be a tall order, given the difficulty of the micro involved. If you're not confident with Hercules micro, mass Goliaths makes for an easy way to A-move through the game. Science Vessels should be actively microed to provide Defensive Matrix for Goliaths that are under heavy fire; otherwise you may be incurring significant losses in every engagement, owing to the Goliath’s low HP. A few Hercules can also be added for fast relocation of your Goliaths to other parts of the map. This composition obviously lacks the strong anti-ground capabilities of a Siege Tank-based composition and you’ll have to rely on your ally to carry you through the early game more so than you would otherwise have to.

Niche Compositions



[image loading]

Cyclone/Hellion/Science Vessel:

Compared to Tank-based compositions, Cyclone-based compositions output much less damage and require a similar amount of micro for less return and more risk. Either Hellions or static defenses can be added to this composition as a mineral dump, providing either extra damage versus swarms of light units or a defensive bulwark to fall back to.

[image loading]

Wraith/Science Vessel:

Wraiths aren’t exactly a stellar unit, but you can easily build a sizeable army of massed Wraiths and Science Vessels off of three Starports due to the Wraith’s relatively cheap resource costs. The composition is somewhat mobile, but it lacks the firepower of any of Swann’s other compositions and will struggle in missions that requires you to output sufficient DPS within the given time such as on Oblivion Express, or when you have to protect objectives such as on Miner Evacuation. It’s also particularly vulnerable to area-of-effect damage, and is less mobile than an army of Goliaths supported by Hercules.




General Tips

  • Remember that you can speed up the construction of your structures by using multiple SCVs to construct the building. Always use this ability on Command Centers, Refineries, and Armories. This utility function is also useful on Factories, Starports, and Supply Depots (when supply-blocked) as well.
  • A common mistake many Swann players make is rushing out the Laser Drill upgrades too quickly. It’s generally more important to build a small standing army first before you speed-build an Armory and invest in the expensive Laser Drill upgrade.
  • A Siege Tank opening (see below) is much more efficient in general in comparison to a Goliath opening. In combination with A.R.E.S. Bots,Herc/Tank micro allows you to handle most waves and objectives during the early game, whereas Goliaths cannot move out until a critical mass is reached.
  • Swann should expand as soon as possible in order to ramp up his army faster (see build order below). Between salvageable Turrets, Tanks and A.R.E.S. Bots, Swann has a number of options to deal with the early waves, whereas a delayed expansion generally leads to an ineffectual mid-game.
  • In defensive missions, it can often be more efficient to rely on Turrets rather than Goliaths as your anti-air, especially in the beginning of the game.
  • For defense, Siege Tanks supported by a few Flaming Bettys/Blaster Billys are your best choice for anti-ground. Mass Spinning Dizzys is your best choice for anti-air.
  • In general, Concentrated Beam and Pulse Cannon are better for clearing out clumped-up enemy waves while A.R.E.S. is a better option for pushing into the enemy base, supported by your army moving in behind them. A.R.E.S. work best when used to absorb enemy fire while your Siege Tanks and Goliaths provide long-range artillery fire from behind.
  • The Herc/Tank combination gives diminishing returns past the first Herc and eight Tanks. It is considerably more difficult to micro two Hercs compared to one Herc at an efficient level. For the majority of missions and enemy compositions, it’s recommended to use only one Herc and eight Tanks. The rest of your supply should be in Science Vessels, Goliaths, and possibly Thors. For compositions with significant ground splash damage or for missions which require the ground-based objective to be protected, it may be better to build more Herc/Tank units.
  • For most of the mid-game you’ll want to be working with 4 Science Vessels. A maxed-out Swann army should generally contain around 6-8 Science Vessels. A mass Goliath composition will require more Science Vessels than a Siege Tank-centric composition, preferably a 4:1 Goliath/Science Vessel ratio, as Goliaths are much more likely to suffer damage than Siege Tanks.
  • Hercules can be warped to any part of the map, even without vision. Use this to your advantage by transporting your army across the map or to provide vision for your top bar abilities.
  • Swann’s SCVs are able to repair structures and units for free and at a faster rate than Science Vessels. It is usually useful to build extra SCVs and put them to work building Turrets with your spare minerals or repair your- or your ally’s units while they are idling.
  • Unless you are planning to rely heavily on Turrets for the majority of the mission, it is usually not necessary to build the Engineering Bay or research any of its upgrades. Even without the upgrade, burning Turrets can be quickly repaired with SCVs or Salvaged for their full costs before they are destroyed. Note that initiating Salvage on a Turrets will divert the enemy target priority away, as it is no longer attacking.








Calldown and Unit Overview



Calldowns



Drakken Laser Drill
Swann's Laser Drill deals a consistent 20/30/50 DPS to any unit or building on the map within vision. Hotkey your Laser Drill at the start of the game in order to quickly retarget it in order to snipe dangerous enemies, especially stray air units. In addition, you or your ally can scout enemy defenses to provide vision for the Laser Drill in order to maintain constant damage output from the Drill.

Combat Drop
Drops 6 A.R.E.S. Bots onto the battlefield, stunning ground enemies on impact.
20.00 DPS x 5
4 minute cooldown


A.R.E.S. War Bots are core to Swann’s early game and are a key ability in overcoming his long ramp-up time. Though their damage output is not the greatest, they’re extremely durable and last for 60-96 seconds depending on mastery point allocation - this results in a 25-40% uptime on the ability if you use it on cooldown. This allows them to be useful even in the late game as a tank for your otherwise fragile units. It’s generally advised that you plan around using them at every available cooldown: 4 minutes, 8 minutes, 12 minutes, etc.


Concentrated Beam
Fires a beam emanating from the Laser Drill that does 400-640 damage, depending on mastery point allocation.
3 minute cooldown


Concentrated Beam is the first direct damage ability that Swann gets access to. Generally, you should try to time your Drill upgrades so that Concentrated Beam should become available just in time to take out an enemy wave in the mid-game.


Pulse Cannon
Deals 600 damage in a huge circular area after a 1 second delay.
5 minute cooldown


This is Swann’s late-game ultimate ability. If you’re following our recommended build order, oftentimes it will first become available for use around 14-15 minutes into the game. Save it for when you’re pushing into the final enemy base or to use against the most difficult of enemy waves.


Units and Buildings


Hellion/Hellbat

Hellion Mode: 2.30/(9.60 vs light) DPS
Hellbat Mode: 9.00/(20.00 vs light) DPS


Hellions and Hellbats are generally not great units, even as a mineral dump. They're fragile and not very versatile. However, they are at times integral to a Cyclone composition because they shore up the Cyclone's weakness of masses of light units. Be mindful that this is only a relevant feature of the Hellbat against some enemy compositions, however.
Goliath

Vs Air: 10.67/(21.33 vs armored) DPS
Vs Ground: 12.00 DPS


Goliaths are an all-purpose unit that excels against armored air units. Though they don't have the best DPS compared to Marines and Hydralisks, their superior range and ability to attack both air and ground targets at the same time is what allows them to be an effective all-around unit.
Siege Tank

Tank Mode: 14.22/(24.04 vs armored) DPS
Siege Mode: 25.00/(30.00 vs armored) DPS


In combination with Turrets, Siege Tanks offer a strong defense against any and all ground units. In combination with Hercules, they become a strong offensive force capable of reducing enemy defenses and units to ashes.
Cyclone

Normal Attack: 18.00 DPS
Lock-On Mode: 37.50 DPS


Cyclones can be used as part of an alternative unit composition that can kite enemies for extended periods. Left to their own devices, only one Cyclone will lock-on to each individual enemy unit, and as such, manual casting of this ability is needed in order to fully utilise the enhanced DPS of the lock-on mode. This means that Cyclones do decent damage against high-HP single targets, but oftentimes they fall short against the multiple units that come in an attack wave. In practice, this unit composition is one of the weakest in Swann’s arsenal, held back by the prohibitive gas cost.
Thor

Vs Air: 8.00/(16.00 vs light) DPS
Vs Ground: 46.88 DPS


Thors are large, beefy units that have good anti-ground DPS and happen to also excel against air units that tend to clump up including Mutalisks, Phoenixes, Banshees, and even Void Rays in the late game. Their 330mm Barrage Cannon is largely useless due to its long animation time, but this ability isn't necessary to their overall effectiveness. Generally, Goliaths are a more effective anti-air option, especially when facing armored air units, but mixing in Thors can help as the game goes on. Thors are also prohibitive in the early game due to their high gas cost when gas can be more effectively spent elsewhere. Finally, because of their large size, Thors tend to attract lots of enemy fire, which makes them excellent targets for Defensive Matrix. It is not recommended to build excessive numbers of Thors, as they are slow and have limited ground range.
Wraith

Vs Air: 8.00/(16.00 vs armored) DPS
Vs Ground: 9.47 DPS


Similar to Cyclones, Wraiths are almost always overshadowed by alternative Swann units due to their pathetic damage-output. Their evasion ability is not particularly useful because their weakness is area of effect damage (vs spells) and not direct physical damage. A 20% chance to avoid damage that is limited by a resource is also not worth much - the dodge chance would need to be higher for it to be impactful.
Hercules

The primary use of the Hercules (Herc) is to provide extreme mobility to an otherwise immobile unit - the Siege Tank. Depending on how many of them you build, they can also be used to transport your entire army across the map. They can also directly reinforce your army without having to pass through dangerous obstacles such as lava on Vermillion Problem or infested on Miner Evacuation. Lastly, they can be used as an effective scout to spot units or objectives for your Laser Drill.
Science Vessel

Science Vessels are the healers of Swann's army and are instrumental to any of his compositions. However, the biggest mistake most players make is not utilizing the Science Vessel's other abilities: Irradiate and Defensive Matrix. Both abilities are very powerful with Irradiate effectively taking out most biological units, whether air or ground - something that is especially effective against low-HP Zerg units. Defensive Matrix will also save the lives of any of your units on the front-line when used actively.
Flaming Betty

20.00/(26.67 vs light) DPS

The Flaming Betty is a very cheap investment for the high HP it provides (300-480 depending on points in Structure mastery) and possesses good splash damage. Build a few Flaming Bettys in front of your other Turrets to deal with enemy melee units and to absorb incoming damage in place of the more expensive Blaster Billys. However, it is best not to build excessive number of Flaming Bettys due to their limited range.
Blaster Billy

22.22/(44.44 vs armored) DPS

Blaster Billys provide higher range and better single-target damage to armored ground units than Flaming Bettys and they can be a very powerful option against Trains in Oblivion Express. With 9 range and an attack that slows enemies by 30%, they do well against enemies that are trying to close in on your defenses. However, Siege Tanks are usually more useful due to their mobility and splash damage, and it is recommended to build Blaster Billys only as a defensive mineral dump option.
Spinning Dizzy

43.20 DPS

Unlike other Terran commanders, Swann’s Missile Turrets are able to deal splash damage to clumped-up aerial units. Possessing high DPS and HP, they are usually more capable than Goliaths in dealing with shorter-range air units, especially when mobility is not a concern.


The Hercules/Tank Opening


There is no question among experienced players that Hercules/Tank is the most efficient way to play Swann. However, for a less experienced player, it can be a very clumsy journey before you reach a critical mass of Tanks. As Swann is a very snowbally and unforgiving commander, it’s important to have a gameplan in order to always know what you’re going to do next in the first few minutes of the game. The following will describe the optimal opening for Hercules/Tank. We recommend that you open up one of the replays in the replay pack to follow along.
  • Open up with a small force of two to eight Tanks (depending on the map), a Hercules and two Science Vessels with the Improved Nano-Repair ability. It’s a misconception that you need any Goliaths at all at this stage as anti-air during this time can be covered by the first two sets of A.R.E.S. Bots, your Laser Drill, and Irradiate. Do not build any Goliaths until you’ve accumulated at least eight Tanks. It is important to research the Maelstrom Shells upgrade for the Siege Tanks as you build them, as it allows them to deal much greater damage.
  • Push enemy bases with your Herc-full of Tanks at the eight-minute mark along with your A.R.E.S. This combination can rip through any defenses that you encounter at this stage of the game.
  • After you’ve accumulated a decent number of Tanks, build your Armory with multiple SCVs in order to speed up your Laser Drill upgrade time. The best time to upgrade your Laser Drill heavily depends on the map and will be addressed below in the map-specific section. On some maps, the Laser Drill abilities are a nice luxury but on others, it’s required to defend specific waves.
  • After you’ve accumulated eight Tanks, add a second Factory and switch to mass Goliath production. Goliath production should ideally kick in at around the 9-10 minute mark, around the time when your second set of A.R.E.S. is expiring. You can also begin adding in Science Vessels and researching Defense Matrix as your gas income allows.
  • Against most compositions and on most maps, eight Tanks is enough for the rest of the game. However, adding in additional Tanks and Hercules is recommended against certain ground-heavy compositions and on certain maps (see Map Specific section).


Microing Hercules/Tank


As any Swann veteran will tell you, Hercules are able to instantly pick up and drop Tanks while they’re in Siege mode. This allows for some interesting micro as you can negate the main disadvantage inherent in Siege Tanks - their immobility. The simplest execution of this strategy is to put 8 sieged-up Tanks in a Hercules and unload them next to an enemy base or wave. To quickly load all Siege Tanks to the Hercules, double-click on your Siege Tanks and right-click the Hercules, then move the Hercules about as you like. Alternatively, put the Hercules and Siege Tanks in the same control group, and right-click the Hercules to load the Tanks. In addition, there are a few advanced techniques to maximize your efficiency:
  • Move-Drop: To unload a Hercules while it’s moving, click “D” (standard hotkey for unload) on the Hercules while it’s moving. This allows for a quicker unload that doesn’t decelerate your Herc, allowing you to have greater control over both your Herc and your Tanks.

  • Cycling Units: You’ll also want to reposition damaged Siege Tanks behind your full-HP Siege Tanks by picking them up and dropping them down via the Herc. This is a common micro trick used in StarCraft multiplayer that preserves units and maximizes damage.

  • Instant Load/Unload: When you have a low number of Tanks (2-4), you won’t be able to sustain fire on the ground consistently. Thus, it’s advisable to drop your Tanks so they fire one shot and then pick them up instantly so that the enemy units cannot touch your tanks. Then, once the attack cooldown of the Tanks has reset, drop the Tanks on the ground again for another volley. Because the Siege Tank attack cooldown is so long, employing this technique doesn’t actually lose you any damage output if you time it correctly, and this allows a small group of Siege Tanks to defeat a much larger army.

  • Constant Movement of Hercules: All units have an acceleration rate, which represents the time it takes for them to go from being immobile to reaching full speed. If you keep your Hercules moving, they’ll be at full speed at all times and thus have an easier time efficiently picking up your Tanks at a moment’s notice. This is a very advanced tactic that you shouldn’t worry about until you’ve already mastered everything else in this guide.

In-depth



Build Order


The following build is recommended on maps with Rocks at your natural. For all other maps and Rifts to Korhal, refer to the map-specific section and the attached replays.
  • 14 Supply Depot
  • 16 Factory (Build with 4 SCVs)
  • 18 Blaster Billy at expo (Build with the same 4 SCVs)
  • 18 Blaster Billy at expo (Build with the same 4 SCVs)
  • - When the main rock is down to 25% HP, pull an additional 4 SCVs from your main and send them to the expansion.
  • - Salvage one Blaster Billy when the expansion rock is down. Keep one up to kill the Gas rocks, then salvage after.
  • 21 Command Center (Build with 8 SCVs)
  • 22 Refinery (Build with 3 SCVs, Vespene Harvester after)
  • 25 Refinery (Build with 3 SCVs, Vespene Harvester after)
  • 26 Refinery (Build with 3 SCVs, Vespene Harvester after)
  • 26 Refinery (Build with 3 SCVs, Vespene Harvester after)
  • The above build order works well for a Herc/Tank opener. For a Goliath or Turret-based composition, it is more likely for you to be Mineral-starved than Gas-starved. Hence, you can build each Refinery with 3 SCVs only, only to pull all the SCVs off after the Refinery is finished building. This allows you to maximize Vespene Harvester income while not sacrificing mineral income.
  • Note that this build assumes full mastery in Vespene Harvester - without it, you may have a somewhat slower start-up.
  • Also, check your ally’s bases and put Vespene Harvester on their Gas extractors once available, especially if you have full mastery points in Vespene Drone Cost.
  • Make sure you read the notes in the map-specific section. This build may be modified on each map.

Masteries


Power Set 1:

  • Concentrated Beam Width and Damage: +2% - 60% (starts at 400 and goes up to a maximum of 640 damage)
  • Combat Drop Duration and Life: +2%-60% (starts at 60s/400HP and goes up to a maximum of 96s/640HP)
There are two schools of thought regarding this mastery choice. The first one that we’ll recommend is all points into Combat Drop - This shores up Swann’s early game better and allows for your A.R.E.S. to tank more efficiently for your Siege Tanks in the mid- and late game. Alternatively, a 19/11 split can be used, which allows your Concentrated Beam to deal 552 damage, which is enough to one-shot the highest-HP standard unit in the game: the Battlecruiser.

Power Set 2

  • Immortality Protocol Cost and Build Time: -2%-60%
  • Structure Health: +2%-60%
For the most part, the ability to revive units more cheaply is more important if you are using Siege Tanks heavily, especially because you then won’t be relying as much on your static defense on most maps. However, Structure Health can be useful on certain defensive maps and mutations when you want to use Turrets in abundance.

Power Set 3:

  • Vespene Harvester Cost: -3%-90% (100 minerals down to a minimum of 10 minerals)
  • Laser Drill Build and Upgrade Time: -2s-60s (300/190/220 seconds down to a minimum of 240/130/160 seconds)
Vespene Harvester Cost decrease is the clear choice here as Swann usually needs his extra gas income as fast as possible. With full mastery points, Swann reduces his total Drone cost on all 4 initial bases from 800 Minerals to 80 Minerals. Being able to afford Gas Harvesters much earlier in the game is also a huge deal, as it allows Swann to ramp up his army earlier. Since you cannot depend on the Laser Drill to take out all attack waves and objectives consistently, and hence a stronger early-game army is more desirable.


Synergies

Raynor

Raynor doesn’t especially appreciate Swann’s extra gas income unless he’s going Mech and even then, it’s not a necessity. Scans can synergize well with Swann’s Laser Drill. Raynor can use Swann’s Tech Reactor, but it’s generally not worth Swann’s time to create extra add-ons for Raynor.

Kerrigan

Swann’s Gas Harvester allows Kerrigan to build additional Omega Worms and Ultralisks, allowing Kerrigan to build a more mobile and robust army.

Artanis

If Swann’s units are managed properly, they shouldn’t die enough to really make too much use of Guardian Shell - though he nevertheless appreciates extra protection for his expensive units. He also appreciates Chrono Boost on his Laser Drill in order to speedily upgrade it - but keep in mind that that is the only advantage provided by the Chrono Boost, and it is no longer necessary once the Laser Drill is fully upgraded. On the flipside, Artanis can mass even more tech units with Swann’s extra gas and Science Vessels are extremely valuable in healing Artanis' mechanical units.

Zagara

While Zagara has a strong early game to cover for Swann’s long ramp-up time, Swann has a formidable mid- to late game army and can carry the game once Zagara’s effectiveness starts to taper off.

Vorazun

Swann's Vespene Harvesters allow Vorazun to spend her resources more evenly in order to amass even more Corsairs and Dark Templar. Vorazun can cloak Swann’s static defense, offering significant protection to them. Note that structures do not benefit from Vorazun’s 15% damage increase to cloaked units, but Siege Tanks certainly do.

Karax

Swann + Karax together combine into the ultimate defensive duo. Swann and Karax can also repair each other's units and buildings through their respective repair abilities. Also, Swann provides much-needed Gas for Karax’s expensive Solar Forge upgrades and Carriers. The problem with this match-up is that it lacks in offensive power, and therefore this team is best used for defensive missions and mutations.

Abathur

More than any other commander, Abathur greatly appreciates Swann's Vespene Harvesters in order to be able to mass his powerful gas-intensive Spire units. Abathur's high-HP units also make for perfect tanks for Swann's relatively fragile units.

Alarak

One of Alarak's main weaknesses is his lack of pushing power against buildings, something that Swann has in spades.

Nova

Nova's Defensive Drones can protect Swann's expensive units and allow him to be more aggressive in his push. Extra gas from Swann helps Nova to get her expensive units out earlier, especially her Raid Liberators and Heavy Siege Tanks.

Stukov

Together, Swann and Stukov represent two of the best defensively oriented commanders in the game. While pushing, Stukov’s biological units can serve as effective bullet sponges for the long-range units in Swann’s army.

Fenix

Swann's Vespene Harvesters allow Fenix to mass Carriers more quickly. His Science Vessels repair Fenix’s mechanical units.

Dehaka

As with many other commanders, Dehaka appreciates the extra gas income from Swann’s Vespene Harvesters. Dehaka can also help to clear the early waves on his own, which allows Swann to focus on getting his economy and army up and running.


Map-Specific Tips

Chain of Ascension

  • Ideally you’ll want your Concentrated Beam ready by 9:00, which when the first Hybrids spawn by default. However, this often isn’t feasible since it’s hard to both expand, build an Armory, and upgrade your Laser Drill by 5:50. Instead, just try to upgrade your Laser Drill as fast as possible, ideally after you have expanded and have two Siege Tanks ready.
  • Since there are no rocks on this map, open with fast Refineries rather than a Factory in order to maximize your gas income, especially if you are opening with a Herc/Tank build.
  • The first A.R.E.S. should be used to clear the first wave, your expansion and the first encampment in the center lane. You should be able to speed-build your expansion at around 5 minutes into the game.
  • Your second A.R.E.S. cooldown should be used to defend the second enemy wave at 8 minutes. You can then clear the first Hybrid spawn with your remaining A.R.E.S. Bots and a few Tanks.
  • The second Hybrid spawn can be cleared with your 12 minute A.R.E.S. and a small squad of Tanks.
  • Rally your reinforcements to Ji’nara in order to defend against small forces that try to lend Amon’s Champion power. In addition, build a few Turrets along Ji’nara’s pathway to deal with the trickle of units.
  • Goliaths excel at killing the Slayn Elementals because they can attack the Elemental and any Cocoons you fail to dodge at the same time.
  • Cyclones also deal well with the Slayn Elementals, but they struggle with pushing into defenses and effectively taking on Hybrid spawns.
  • The third Hybrid spawn can be cleared with a combination of your army, your 16 minute A.R.E.S. and a Pulse Cannon.
  • The fourth- and final Hybrid spawn should be defeated with anything and everything you that you still have remaining.

Dead of Night

  • Swann can afford to upgrade his Laser Drill very early on this map and still be safe during Night 1, thanks to his powerful Turrets and Siege Tanks. Try to upgrade your Laser Drill as fast as possible, at about 5 minutes into the game.
  • Swann's Tanks are some of the best defensive units against Infested. They're so powerful that a small squad can continue pushing and destroying structures at night while a second squad defends at home.
  • Flaming Bettys are an excellent mineral dump that will do well against large groups of Infested. A few Blaster Billys can also be built in front of the Siege Tanks, so that they can slow the Aberrations as well as soaking up damage for the Siege Tanks.
  • Try to aim for a Herc with eight Tanks in it by the end of Night 1, so that you can start clearing Infested buildings right away.
  • Swann's Laser Drill can take care of all the air units on this map (if there are no Spotters), so Swann can focus on mass Siege Tanks and defensive structures. The only units you should be making on this map are Siege Tanks, Hercules, and a bare few Science Vessels.

Lock & Load

  • You don’t need much firepower early on, so you can upgrade your Drill fairly early once you have 2-4 Tanks. Speed-build your Armory sometime around 7 minutes.
  • The first A.R.E.S. can clear the first Lock, the first enemy wave, and most of the left Lock.
  • Against Zerg and Protoss, an early Science Vessel not only lets you detect early cloaked units but also take them out via Irradiate.
  • The second 8-minute A.R.E.S. can clear the second wave, the area above the central Celestial Lock, and the bottom right Celestial Lock.
  • Your 12-minute A.R.E.S. should be used to push into a base of your choice.
  • Build a small amount of static defense at each captured Celestial Lock in order to stem the trickle of enemy units trying to recapture those Celestial Locks. For large attack waves, you should not depend solely on these Turrets. Instead, warp your Herc/Tank back, or use your Laser Drill abilities.
  • Concentrated Beam and Pulse Cannon can be used in conjunction with static defense to defend your Locks against enemy waves.
  • Build extra Hercules in order to capture Celestial Locks quickly. Teleporting Hercules onto a Celestial Lock also prevents enemy units from capturing a contested Lock.
  • Build static defense at Celestial Locks to prevent trickling enemy units from recapturing them.
  • Siege Tanks can be unloaded below the ramps while Hercules provide sight for them. This triggers the enemy ground units to start clumping up at the ramps, which is fatal against Siege Tanks.

Malwarfare

  • The second wave should hit between 10:00 and 11:00, depending on how well you deal with the first Suppression Tower. You can use either your Concentrated Beam to defend it or setup static defense while you’re pushing. In order to have your Concentrated Beam ready by this time, you’ll need to upgrade your Laser Drill at around 6:50-7:50, after you have about 2-4 Tanks on the field.
  • You can expand by speed-building Blaster Billys near the expansions. Since they have 9 range, you can build them quite far from the enemy units guarding the expansions.
  • Focus more heavily on minerals over gas in the early-game, as you will need a few Turrets to defend the first enemy wave. Two Flaming Bettys along with two Siege Tanks will be able to defend against any type of enemy wave.
  • There are only three enemy waves that actually attack your main base. If you know where they spawn, you can build Turrets on top of them. The third and final wave will spawn near the top of the second set of Suppression Towers. After the third wave, you can ignore base defense altogether.
  • As you push deeper into enemy territory, reinforce your army via Hercs filled with fresh units.
  • By the end of the game, you’ll always want at least two Hercs full of Siege Tanks to help you push and destroy Suppression Towers. Against ground enemy compositions, three Hercs full of Siege Tanks may be wise. The rest of your supply should be filled with Goliaths and Science Vessels.
  • Bring SCVs along with you when you push in order to build static defense at Security Terminals as you secure new ground.

Miner Evacuation

  • You’ll want to use your Concentrated Beam at around 13:30 to handle the second wave. This means that you will want to begin upgrading your Laser Drill at 10:20 at the absolute latest.
  • Use your first A.R.E.S. to clear the first Evacuation Ship and start building static defenses there. You have enough time to produce a Herc, 3-4 Tanks, and at least three Flaming Bettys for this defense.
  • Siege Tanks in sufficient numbers decimate Infested. You’ll need approximately this many Siege Tanks for each Evacuation Ship:
    • Ship 1: 3 Siege Tanks
    • Ship 2: 6 Siege Tanks
    • Ship 3: 8 Siege Tanks
    • Ship 4: 12 Siege Tanks
    • Ship 5: 16 Siege Tanks
  • For Evacuation Ships 2 and 3, Spinning Dizzys, Irradiate, and your Laser Drill are sufficient tools to cover against air enemies. You’ll also want a few Flaming Bettys for ground defense.
  • For Evacuation Ships 4 and 5, Goliaths should be used to supplement your anti-air. You’ll have to defend against air from multiple different angles, and structures tend to be very vulnerable at the last Evacuation Ships that spawn Volatile Infested and Infested Siege Tanks. Thors can also be a good choice in the late game due to their high anti-air splash damage against Banshees as well as for their high HP.
  • Remember that Infested Banshees are biological light units and are therefore vulnerable to Irradiate and the Thor’s Javelin Missiles. Both of these measures are helpful because they tend to spawn in clumped-up packs.
  • If you and your ally have set up sufficient defences for the currently launching Evacuation Ship, you can use your A.R.E.S. Bots to clear the next evacuation launch site and grab some SCVs to build some Flaming Bettys and Spinning Dizzys there.
  • Both bonuses can be optimally cleared by Herc/Tank micro. You’ll take too much damage from Eradicators if you try to fight them head on without micro’ing Hercs.

Mist Opportunites

  • Because Mist Opportunities features many constant but small waves, it's more important to build up a strong standing force before you upgrade Swann's Laser Drill. Getting out eight Tanks is advised before you even start thinking about upgrading your Laser Drill. A benchmark you’ll want to hit, however, is to have your Pulse Cannon ready by 15:30, which is the timing at which the most difficult wave spawns on the far right side of the map. To do so, you’ll have to begin your initial Laser Drill upgrade by 9:00 at the latest.
  • It is advised to construct either a Flaming Betty or Blaster Billy to defend the first Harvesting Bot while he powers up, even with max-duration A.R.E.S.
  • Against Sky Terran or any Protoss waves, it’s recommended to build a few Spinning Dizzys to help defend the second wave of Harvesting Bots. Against Protoss, it’s impossible to tell whether the enemy composition has air units until they begin attacking you. Against Muta/ling, Irradiate and your Laser Drill are more than enough for the first wave.
  • In conjunction with Tanks and Goliaths, all three types of Turrets are useful for defending Harvesting Bots.
  • You should have plenty of time to build Turrets at the attack wave spawn locations for the last wave of Harvesting Bots.

Oblivion Express

  • You should be massing Siege Tanks with Turrets as an optional mineral dump. Massing Siege Tanks with Hercules for mobility is generally the most effective build on this map in taking out both the enemy units and trains quickly. Be cautious of the enemy composition, however, as you will want to respond by adding Goliaths and Spinning Dizzys if the enemy is an air composition.
  • Build more Blaster Billys when facing enemy ground units, or Spinny Dizzys when facing enemy air units. Blaster Billy is much better than Flaming Betty against Trains, due to better damage and range.
  • If necessary, Siege Tanks can be placed on the high ground, where they can still fire on the Trains and have protection from many ground units at the same time. These high grounds include the left side of the main base, and the cliff overlooking the bend in the bottom objective Train tracks.
  • Build Blaster Billys where the bottom track and the bonus track coincide so that they can hit both Trains.
  • For the double Train spawns, Concentrated Beam is better used for taking out the top Train escorts than the bottom Train due to its better alignment with the top track.

Rifts to Korhal

  • You’ll want to use your Concentrated Beam at around 11:20 for the fourth wave, so you’ll want to begin upgrading your Laser Drill by at least 8:10. Build your Armory after approximately four Siege Tanks.
  • The first wave arrives very early. Use a combination of one Flaming Betty and one Blaster Billy to defend the first wave. You should ideally be building them at the two minute mark with two SCVs after you build a single Blaster Billy at your natural to help clear the rocks. After the first wave is cleared, salvage the Turrets so that you have enough minerals for building a Command Center at your expansion. If you can scout the enemy race, three Flaming Bettys is usually better against Protoss.
  • If you have full mastery points in A.R.E.S., delay your first A.R.E.S. by 10 seconds (or at 4:10). This allows you to start clearing defenders at the first two sets of Void Shards and pick off the second wave during the tail end of their duration. Don’t waste precious A.R.E.S. duration doing damage to the Void Shard.
  • The second (8:10) A.R.E.S. Bot cooldown can be used to push the second set of Void Shards alongside your Herc/Tanks and help clear the third wave.
  • After you clear the second Void Shard area, build some static defense there in order to help tank and provide vision for your calldowns against enemy waves - they always spawn in the same spot, so simply place them where they will intercept the enemy. Flaming Bettys and Spinning Dizzys are your structures of choice since they’re the two most cost effective structures for the HP they provide.
  • If you’ve upgraded your Laser Drill on time, you should have Concentrated Beam ready in time to fend off the fourth wave.
  • Use your third (12:10) A.R.E.S. Bots to clear out third Void Shard area.
  • If you’ve kept up on Laser Drill upgrades, you’ll have Pulse Cannon ready in time for the fifth wave, but feel free to use it however you choose.
  • The sixth wave can be taken down by another Concentrated Beam with some help from your units.

Scythe of Amon

  • As there are a large number of air units defending each Void Sliver - especially the later ones - Goliaths should make up your primary pushing force. Herc/Tank is still effective in providing additional ground DPS and for defending attack waves, but not in large numbers.
  • Hercules are very useful at moving your entire army around the map quickly, allowing you to minimize travel time on this large map. Hercules also allows your ground units to escape easily if they are in danger.
  • The last Void Sliver at the top-left corner of the map can be ‘cheesed’ by warping all your units in directly using Hercules and have them focus-fire on the Void Sliver, ideally with the help of Concentrated Beam or Pulse Cannon to take out most of the enemy units. However, this is a risky commitment to make and will require some practice to execute well.
  • You’ll want to use your Concentrated Beam at around 9:50 for the third wave, so you’ll want to begin upgrading your Drill by at least 6:40. Build your Armory after you have two Siege Tanks, around 5 minutes into the game.
  • The bonus objective on this map is incredibly difficult for Swann to complete. Without your ally’s help, Swann in the only commander in the game that has to delay his expansion if he wants to complete the first section of the bonus on his own.
  • If you don’t feel like you can rely on your ally for the bonus, use the first (4-minute) A.R.E.S. Bot to clear the first wave, then clear the rightmost Void Sliver of defenses, and then clear the bonus. You will need full mastery in A.R.E.S. Bots and two Siege Tanks in a Herc to accomplish this feat. Use an SCV to construct a Blaster Billy next to the Void Sliver in order to finish it.
  • If you’re confident in your ally’s ability to take care of the bonus or in his ability to clear your expansion, use your A.R.E.S. to push toward the expansion, clear it, and expand.
  • Use the second (8-minute) A.R.E.S. Bots to take care of the second enemy wave and the second Void Sliver.
    Starting at around 11 minutes, begin building static defenses at both your main and your expansion. The next wave that spawns at 12:30 will come to your main. From thereon out it’s random. Static defense can delay the enemy waves while you clean them up with your calldowns supplemented by a few units.
  • Use the third (12-minute) A.R.E.S. Bots along with your army to clear the second bonus area.
    The fourth wave can be softened up with your Concentrated Beam or completely decimated by the Pulse Cannon.
  • Use the fourth (16-minute) A.R.E.S. Bots to clear the third Void Sliver at the top-mid as well as the third bonus area.
    From then on, alternate calldowns to clear enemy waves and use A.R.E.S. to push into Void Slivers.

Temple of the Past

  • Minerals are more important than gas on this map, because you’ll be heavily relying on Turrets. In the early game, focus mining Minerals over mining Gas. That is, still speed-build your Refineries, but keep only 1 SCV on them each at the start.
  • Against ground enemies, rely mostly on Siege Tanks for defense but supplement them with Flaming Bettys and Spinning Dizzys.
  • Against air enemies, rely on Spinning Dizzys for defense against air units. Should the enemy have siege-ranged air units, especially Tempests in late game, Hercules can be used to kite them into the range of your Spinning Dizzys. Alternatively, you can use Goliaths. Even against air, Siege Tanks are still useful, though not in large numbers, as they allow you to quickly kill both ground units, Zenith Stones, and Void Thrashers more easily.
  • Bonuses can be “cheesed” by your Laser Drill as long as an air unit gives you vision. Alternatively, you can send a Herc-full of Tanks to quickly dispatch each bonus objective.
  • Remember to build Turrets/Tanks to defend the top-right lane of the Temple before 15 minutes into the game, which is when the earliest drops can come from the enemy island base.
  • If the base defenses have already been cleared out, you may advance your Turret line into the enemy lanes so that they can deal with both the spawning Thrashers and attack waves. However, there is not much lead time between the announcement of the wave spawn and when it arrives at your Turrets; use this strategy at your own risk.

The Vermillion Problem

  • You’ll want to use your Concentrated Beam at around 10:10 to deal with the third wave, so you’ll want to begin upgrading your Drill by at least 7:00. Build your Armory after pumping out approximately 2-3 Siege Tanks.
  • Defend the first wave with Turrets while dropping A.R.E.S. onto expansion area. Use one SCV to bypass the initial defense and provide vision for A.R.E.S. to drop directly onto expansion area, then move in a Herc loaded with two Siege Tanks.
  • When the Lava erupts, you can use one or more Herc-fulls of Tanks to warp to Molten Sal and rapidly take it out.

Void Launch

  • You’ll want to use your Concentrated Beam at around 11:10 for the fifth wave, so you’ll want to begin upgrading your Laser Drill by at least 8:00. Build your Armory after approximately four Siege Tanks.
  • You should primarily rely on Spinning Dizzys and not Goliaths to shoot down Shuttles, as Spinning Dizzys are the most cost-efficient anti-air option that Swann has access to. Quickly build a few of them in front of the Warp Conduits when you see a Shuttle is headed there.
  • With full mastery in Combat Drop, the first set of A.R.E.S. Bots can clear both the first and second enemy waves.
  • The second (8-minute) A.R.E.S. Bot will be ready just in time to help you defend wave three and to intercept the first Shuttle.
  • It’s possible to use the third (12-minute) A.R.E.S. to push into the enemy main base to secure yourself a third base. Swann lacks the resources on two bases for sufficient production of both Tanks and static defense.
  • Ideally, you can push far enough to build Spinning Dizzys around the Shuttle Launch Bays.
  • Since enemy waves only spawn from two possible locations, you can easily camp them with Tanks and Turrets.

Void Thrashing

  • There are two spawning patterns on this map for enemy units, so ideally your Laser Drill timing should depend on which pattern you encounter.
  • To account for the earlier pattern, you’ll want to use your Concentrated Beam at around 12:30 for the fourth wave, so you’ll want to begin upgrading your Laser Drill by at least 9:20, or you can just always aim to have it ready by 9:20 if you don’t want to take this into account. Either way, build your Armory after approximately eight Siege Tanks.
  • The first A.R.E.S. should be used to defend the first wave and push into enemy territory as far as possible. Do not waste their duration attacking the first Void Thrasher.
  • The second A.R.E.S. along with 4-6 Tanks should be used to push the second Void Thrasher. This combination can easily clear all the defenses available there as well as intercept the third enemy wave. They also has enough firepower to decisively take down the Void Thrashers.
  • The Void Thrashers can deal devastating AoE damage to the Swann’s clumped-up ground units, so try to keep your eyes on your army at all times when pushing into the Void Thrasher encampments.

Replay Pack

Attached is a replay pack of the record solo speed runs for Swann on each map. These replays demonstrate how to play Swann as a general concept. In addition, we have broken down which compositions you'll be able to find on each run:
  • Hercules/Siege Tank/Goliath/Science Vessel: Chain of Ascension, Lock & Load, Malwarfare, Mist Opportunities, Oblivion Express, Rifts to Korhal, Scythe of Amon, The Vermillion Problem, Void Launch, Void Thrashing
  • Hercules/Siege Tank/Turrets: Dead of Night, Oblivion Express, Temple of the Past
  • Hercules/Siege Tank/Goliath/Science Vessel/Turrets: Miner Evacuation

    [image loading] Swann Replay Pack


Other Commander Guides





Writers: monk
Graphics: Jester, Kat, v1
Editors: Aron, Axiom, Maguro, monk, Raincamp, T.Chosen
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TL+ Member
DSh1
Profile Joined April 2017
292 Posts
October 09 2017 21:43 GMT
#2
I really like this series.

Personally I do prioritize Laser Drill upgrades though. Both can solo clear enemy waves (reliably in my opinion). On average this is one of these calldowns every 2,5 minutes plus combat drop. I actually wonder how it is possible to lose if the Laser Drill Upgrades are rushed out early.

Also Thors are much more sustainable then Goliaths and more easy to micro in combination with the Hercules and also the Science Vessel (as you mentioned), so they sometimes are the better antiair. Especially when considering Immortality Protocol and that Swann's army is so expensive.

One thing to note is, that Swann's masteries are what really makes him shine. Each of them can have a huge impact.
pzlama333
Profile Joined April 2013
United States276 Posts
October 10 2017 01:33 GMT
#3
About Immortality protocol mastery, as you said in synergy with Artanis, if you do not lose any tank or thor by good micro, this mastery does not help a lot. However, in an offensive map, the structure health mastery does not help your static defense as well.

About synergies, Raynor's medic (with upgrade) heals Swann's mech faster than science vessel and SCV. Kerrigan can also help to clear the early waves on her own, same as you mentioned in Dehaka. Alarak's havoc will increase Swann's already-long-range unit's range by additional 2, and the highlord can push the enemy away to prevent them for attacking Swann's fragile units.
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16056 Posts
October 10 2017 07:06 GMT
#4
Swann is my main Co-Op commander. As far as I'm concerned, Cylcones and Helbats DO NOT exist. There's almost no situation where spending money on them is worthwhile compared to Goliaths, Tanks or Turrets.

Wraiths are SUPER SUPER niche, viable in my experience in one mission only, Void Launch.

Goliaths, Tanks and Science Vessels are your bread butter and meat and potatoes. The trick to playing Swann effectively is mastering those units as well as his call downs.

Ignore his other units, they aren't viable, they arent meant to be. Mech it up Old school style and you'll be happy.
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
Quateras
Profile Joined August 2012
Germany867 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-10-10 11:27:18
October 10 2017 11:26 GMT
#5
Sweet, didnt expect this one to come out so quickly.
Seems like i need to practice scv pulling more, always figured it might not be worth if considerign the mining loss.(will try the 8 scv CC and worker transfer early on now)

Question tho about chrono boost on the Laser Drill, simply from aestetics it does look like it affects the fire rate of the drill as in not the DPS itself but the target switching?It does feel like its targetting different units more quickly with chrono and thus having a dps increase by having more *uptime*.Especially with a 50+% chrono boost ?(is this wrong?)

Thanks for the indepth guide once again, loving these :D
"If you don't know where you are going, you can never get lost."
Ransomstarcraft
Profile Joined September 2016
75 Posts
October 10 2017 13:51 GMT
#6
Great series, thanks so much for all your work on this!
asongdotnet
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States1060 Posts
October 10 2017 17:35 GMT
#7
Mass cyclones ftw
BaneRiders
Profile Joined August 2013
Sweden3630 Posts
October 10 2017 19:15 GMT
#8
Much as I like Swann and his turrets, I feel I'm not good at playing him, especially not on offensive maps. I tend to go mass Thors (with immortality protocol maxed) + Science vessels for the late game, possibly with a few hellbats as cannon fodder if I have too much minerals, and that comp is not even considered in the guide.

Also, as for synergies, I can certainly recommend coordinating Swann's concentrated beam with Vorazun's black hole for a cool party trick.
Earth, Water, Air and Protoss!
seemsgood
Profile Joined January 2016
5527 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-10-10 22:10:32
October 10 2017 22:10 GMT
#9
On October 11 2017 02:35 asongdotnet wrote:
Mass cyclones ftw

I prefer mass cyclones than only spamming turret and tanks in train map.Probadly the best option if you want to do bonus tasks.
29 fps
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States5724 Posts
October 11 2017 01:09 GMT
#10
Should you ever research the auto regen ability from the armory? I never do, but I wonder if it's ever worth it.
4v4 is a battle of who has the better computer.
DSh1
Profile Joined April 2017
292 Posts
October 11 2017 09:29 GMT
#11
I always do, though I never feel a real impact and it is really expensive. I guess in an optimal case you never take damage anyways so you would not need it. And by the time healing is required Science Vessels should be up.

So my answer would be probably not, but it is okay to have it?
monk
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States8476 Posts
October 11 2017 15:33 GMT
#12
It's not great, not terrible. You should always prioritize Attack upgrades on your first Armory. And many missions end before you can get +3 Attack on that first Armory. So I would only consider a second Armory for the Regen upgrade if I have extra resources sometime in the middle of the game.
Moderator
EngrishTeacher
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Canada1109 Posts
October 12 2017 02:06 GMT
#13
On October 12 2017 00:33 monk wrote:
It's not great, not terrible. You should always prioritize Attack upgrades on your first Armory. And many missions end before you can get +3 Attack on that first Armory. So I would only consider a second Armory for the Regen upgrade if I have extra resources sometime in the middle of the game.


As a general rule, do you ever upgrade armor for any of the commanders?

For Nova and mech'ing commanders obviously you'd want attack upgrades only, but what about swarmy compositions like bio Raynor, Zagara or Alarak (shields for supplicants and ascendants)?
monk
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States8476 Posts
October 12 2017 03:07 GMT
#14
On October 12 2017 11:06 EngrishTeacher wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 12 2017 00:33 monk wrote:
It's not great, not terrible. You should always prioritize Attack upgrades on your first Armory. And many missions end before you can get +3 Attack on that first Armory. So I would only consider a second Armory for the Regen upgrade if I have extra resources sometime in the middle of the game.


As a general rule, do you ever upgrade armor for any of the commanders?

For Nova and mech'ing commanders obviously you'd want attack upgrades only, but what about swarmy compositions like bio Raynor, Zagara or Alarak (shields for supplicants and ascendants)?

Raynor: Yes, you get HP boosts
Kerrigan: Yes, because her armor upgrades are so cheap
Artanis: Grond armor/shields only if you're going pure ground
Swann: No
Zagara: Ground Armor usually
Vorazun: No
Karax: No
Abathur: No
Alarak: Yes, because you have so much excess gas
Nova: No
Stukov: Bio armor sometimes, because I always get a 2nd eng bay for bunker upgrades anyways, but these bio armor upgrades aren't that good
Fenix: No
Dehaka: Yea
Moderator
29 fps
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States5724 Posts
October 12 2017 07:29 GMT
#15
Why is armor not worth researching? It's useful in regular multiplayer modes, so why is it not as useful in Coop?
4v4 is a battle of who has the better computer.
DSh1
Profile Joined April 2017
292 Posts
October 12 2017 15:12 GMT
#16
Im not sure, but from just some theoretical thinking:
In 1v1 it's just about being better than your opponent. You can trade out units as long as you are a tad more efficient. In coop not so much. The AI has way more stuff and the focus is on not losing any single important unit of your own. Armor only mitigates damage, but this is often not good enough. In Coop it is more about avoiding any damage altogether rather than reducing it. It is required to output enough damage, so that AI units can't touch your own units.

Also in PvP I've often seen the armor upgrade foregone because protoss units output too much damage and armor is most effective against units with many smaller attacks like zerglings or marines.

Of course having armor is always better than not having armor. In most games I end up having enough resources at the end anyway so it is okay to go for armor upgrades.
monk
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States8476 Posts
October 12 2017 20:18 GMT
#17
In general, enemies do way too much damage in co-op. In 1v1, you're more likely to face 100 supply of stimmed Marines or 100 Supply of Zerglings. In Co-op you can kill both of these types of units with AoE that every commander has access to. The most threatening sources of enemy damage in co-op are ones that trivialize armor. These include Psi Storm, Siege Tanks, Disruptors, Reavers, Banelings, Scourge, Parasitic Bomb, Lurkers, Hybrids, etc...
Moderator
Danglars
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States12133 Posts
October 12 2017 21:17 GMT
#18
Fun guide, monk. Thanks for sharing
Great armies come from happy zealots, and happy zealots come from California!
TL+ Member
EngrishTeacher
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Canada1109 Posts
October 13 2017 00:43 GMT
#19
On October 12 2017 12:07 monk wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 12 2017 11:06 EngrishTeacher wrote:
On October 12 2017 00:33 monk wrote:
It's not great, not terrible. You should always prioritize Attack upgrades on your first Armory. And many missions end before you can get +3 Attack on that first Armory. So I would only consider a second Armory for the Regen upgrade if I have extra resources sometime in the middle of the game.


As a general rule, do you ever upgrade armor for any of the commanders?

For Nova and mech'ing commanders obviously you'd want attack upgrades only, but what about swarmy compositions like bio Raynor, Zagara or Alarak (shields for supplicants and ascendants)?

Raynor: Yes, you get HP boosts
Kerrigan: Yes, because her armor upgrades are so cheap
Artanis: Grond armor/shields only if you're going pure ground
Swann: No
Zagara: Ground Armor usually
Vorazun: No
Karax: No
Abathur: No
Alarak: Yes, because you have so much excess gasy
Nova: No
Stukov: Bio armor sometimes, because I always get a 2nd eng bay for bunker upgrades anyways, but these bio armor upgrades aren't that good
Fenix: No
Dehaka: Yea


Thanks for your input as always, cheers!

I've found that getting air armor for Fenix makes a pretty significant difference though, especially on longer missions. Save for psy storm, enemy anti-air damage usually isn't splash and isn't too high, so armor definitely helps.

Similar for Vorazun, getting shield upgrades is quite useful as DTs are mostly shields and cosairs benefit as well.
29 fps
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States5724 Posts
October 13 2017 01:13 GMT
#20
On October 13 2017 05:18 monk wrote:
In general, enemies do way too much damage in co-op. In 1v1, you're more likely to face 100 supply of stimmed Marines or 100 Supply of Zerglings. In Co-op you can kill both of these types of units with AoE that every commander has access to. The most threatening sources of enemy damage in co-op are ones that trivialize armor. These include Psi Storm, Siege Tanks, Disruptors, Reavers, Banelings, Scourge, Parasitic Bomb, Lurkers, Hybrids, etc...


What about building armor from the ebay? Do you get that one on defensive missions?
4v4 is a battle of who has the better computer.
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