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StarCraft 2: Powered - another way to play LotV

Forum Index > SC2 General
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OGamingTV SC2
Profile Joined March 2013
France84 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-27 17:32:46
August 25 2017 17:37 GMT
#1
After months of work, this is it: O'Gaming is proud to present:

StarCraft 2: Powered


The idea of this mod is simple: getting back the sensations we had at the release of each new expansion, some sort of renewal of StarCraft, a will to play with new units and discover new strategies.

We already started to test new things to entertain, by proposing a new way to play LotV with OG 6 Start (a tournament where you start with only 6 workers intead of 12).

We did 4 Seasons of OG 6 Start, including the last one with 8 of the best Korean players (soO, INnoVation, GuMiho...), and every time the games were fun and diversified, which were with no doubt what made this hybrid competition such a success with our audience.

With this sucess, we wanted to go further, because even though we are convinced that starting with 6 workers make the games more dynamic and accessible, we think it's also possible to slightly modify the mid and late game, to watch games that would be different from start to end, while still keeping the spirit of StarCraft 2.

In this light, we worked with VisionElf to make a mod which shouldn't contain too many changes, because StarCraft 2 is already a great game, but enough to allow players to experiment new strategies. No pure balance changes (like +1 range, etc), but a will to change the game's dynamic rather than its balance.

To achieve that, we chose to concentrate our efforts on spellcasters, by trying to make them decisive units in several configurations. The final goal is to make positionning less crucial in a fight. In StarCraft 2: Powered, spells have a greater effect than in normal LotV, big enough that, in an equal fight, it can make a real difference.

Mainly, we modified the spells, by doing the least amount of changes possible. As a result, some games won't change much from LotV, but the important is to have good games.

+ Show Spoiler +
To go further in details, the idea was that Broodwar worked because game mechanics are so intense that it's impossible to play a perfect game. The game is won by the one who does the least errors, each player always doing at least some. On StarCraft 2 you can do much less errors because the ergonomy of the game has been greatly improved, which tends to reduce the skill gap between players. A way to bring back this skill gap is to introduce more spells, and to make them more important in the game, while being careful that the spellcasters don't become killer machines. So we have limited the spells doing damage, and increased spells doing control, so that units can make a true difference while still needing to be supported by standard units.

The advantage spells have on strict positionning of the units, is that a positionning can be anticipated, you just need to look at where you're going to attack to see the terrain and play with the topography. For the spells, the calcul is not that simple because you can't see in advance how the opponent's army will behave, so it's impossible to strictly plan things. If you add to that the addtional micro it requires, it should give more rythm to the games from the mid game on.

Obviously all of this is to take with caution. The goal is not to change the game into WarCraft 3 or League of Legends. That's why the game will start with only 6 workers, which will make the early game longer. T2 units will come one by one, which keeps the dynamic allowing for a transition to the mid-game that's often great (ex. Zerglings / Banelings / Mutalisks vs Marines / Mines / Medivac). Once you're above 140 population, the spellcaster becomes a very interesting unit. With a good game sense, you'll be able to take a significant advantage on your opponent, more than right now. That should give us games with more twists, games even more beautiful.

If everything happens as expected, the additional difficulty required by the use of the spells shouldn't affect the beginners, since the spellcasters become really interesting when you understand the basic aspects of the game. So in the low/mid ranks, the changes we made shouldn't discourage the players: having a bigger number of units will be more appealing and effective than spellcasters badly used. As this additional difficulty isn't restrictive in the early and mid game, it should rather empower the beginners to reach a sufficient level to start playing those spellcasters properly.


Tournaments will be announced soon, including Open Qualifiers. If you find this mod appealing, come and show your strategy against other players who will also have prepared their "Special Tactics". Let's have fun on StarCraft 2 like before!

Without further adue, here's the presentation of the modifications for each races. The videos show the most important changes, you can find the complete modifications and their explanation below.


[image loading] TERRAN



Ghost

- Steady Targetting now does 70 damage, 155 against Psionic.

- Building a Nuke now costs 250 Mineral, instead of 100 Mineral / 100 Gas. It takes 12 seconds to drop instead of 14.

- New spell: Point Defense Drone (costs 75 Energy, has 110 Energy and lasts 8 seconds). It basically works like the Raven's, the size being a bit smaller.

- New spell: Lockdown (costs 100 Energy, duration 7 seconds).
The Lockdown stuns a unit: it can't move, attack or use its abilities. It works on all units, ground and air, even on the Ultralisk despite the Frenzy ability.

- Removed spell: EMP.

Cloak wasn't changed.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
The goal is to make the spellcasters more operational. We first added the Point Defense Drone to the Ghost to give him a support purpose as soon as he arrives.
It will be useful against Hydralisks, Mutalisks, Adepts, Stalkers and Marauders.
We then added the Lockdown to make the Ghost more effective in the transition toward the late game, by holding off the arrival of the first Ultralisks / Carriers / BattleCruisers.
The Nuke has a reduced cost so Terran players can use it more in offense as well in defense.
Obviously, those new spells mean Steady Targetting will have a lesser impact.
It can still one shot the spellcasters like High Templars, Vipers or Infestators,
but the damages are reduced on others. 6 Steady Targetting shots are now required to kill an Ultralisk, instead of 3. With those new attributes, the Ghost becomes a major unit which will help you get away in many situations.



Raven

The Raven is repealed from the game, and replaced by the Science Vessel.


Science Vessel

- HP: 145
- Energy: 50
- costs 100 Mineral / 200 Gas and 43 seconds to build

- Nano Repair: the Science Vessel passively heals all the units around, its area being 4. It costs 1 Energy for 5 HP, and the spell can be deactivated.

- Vessel EMP (costs 100 Energy): works exactly as the EMP removed from the Ghost.

- Irradiate (costs 75 Energy): needs to be researched in the Lab Tech for 200 Mineral / 200 Gas and 79 seconds.
Irradiate does 6 damage per seconds over 21 seconds to ground and air biological units. It has a 1,43 seconds cooldown. Once the spell is cast on a unit, all units around in a 1,5 radius are affected. The spell can be cast on mechanical units: they won't take any damage themselves, but will damage biological units around.
Irradiatecanceled by burrowing the targetted unit.

- The Corvid Reactor upgrade from the Raven is given to the Science Vessel, for the same effect: +25 Energy when built.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
We removed the Raven because 2 of his 3 spells already existed in the Science Vessel on Broodwar. It seemed more logical to put it back.
Nano Repair has been added to allow the unit to have a support function as soon as it arrives. It's useful for its detection ability, but also its support to mech units.
Vessel EMP will allow Terran players to deal with Vipers which have also been modified and will more easily be stacked and hidden among the rest of the army. Sames goes with mass High Templars / Archons.
Irradiate will force the opponent to micro out the affected unit(s). It can be devastating against packed or weak units if properly micro'ed. It replaces the Seeker Missile that was not really fitting, by giving more opportunities. It's also possible to irradiate your own mechanical unit, which needs you to put in additional micro but also makes it harder for your opponent to avoid. There are more counters, especially burrowing.
The Science Vessel, just like the Ghost becomes an important unit that can be used in several configurations and make the difference.



Liberator

The Liberator is removed from the game, and replaced by the Herc.


Herc

- Can only attack ground units with a small splash damage
- Damage: 21
- Attack speed: 1,7 seconds
- Ability: Grapple, to jump on ally or enemy units
- If Grapple is used on an enemy, the Herc commits suicide and deals 100 damage against Light and Armored, 175 against Psionic and 200 against Massive. The damage is dealt only to the targetted unit (no splash damage) and there's no friendly fire.
The Grapple won't provoke the Herc's explosion if targetting ally units, but will allow him to jump cliffs. It works on both ground and air units.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
The Herc is here mainly to replace the Liberator, which was added to give Terrans a way to deal with massive ground units, and partially with light air units. The air light units shouldn't be an issue thanks to Irradiate, PDD and Lockdown, so we focused the functionality of the Herc on massive units.
The first Carriers or Ultralisks can be a disaster for the Terran race, so the Herc will allow Terran players to blow up massive units and try to save the biobal.
The fact the Herc explodes will smoothen the transition to T3, since it won't be possible to snowball the Hercs and accumulate them throughout the game like it's possible with Liberators. The idea is to accept that the Terran race plays mainly with its T2 (MMM as well as Hellbats / Tanks / Vikings) by giving them weapons to keep it rather than reinforce it. The Herc will be a good unit for a moment in the game with equal economy, and will allow Terran players to reach its ultimate composition (BattleCruisers / Vikings / Science Vessel / Ghosts for instance), to snowball once again.



- New building: Tech Reactor (needs to be researched in the Fusion Core for 300 Mineral / 300 Gas): this add-on works like in the StarCraft 2 campaign, allowing all units to be produced by 2. When the upgrade is done, all Reactors and Lab Tech are automatically transformed into Tech Reactors.
Once the research is done, building a new Tech Reactor costs 50 Mineral / 50 Gas.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
The Tech Reactor makes it easier for the Terran to adjust its army composition in the late game. The upgrade being in the Fusion Core, it also helps with the transition to T3, by giving another reason to Terran players to build it. Once it's done, take the step towards BattleCruisers will be much easier, especially since it will be possible to produce 2 of them at once in the same Spatioport.



The Terran race is the only one blocking systematically on the T2. The few times T3 is built, the whole strategy is fully committed to it (full air turtle style). The choice to go T3 is rarely done when the biobal is 3/3.
The goal of the additional changes (Herc and Tech Reactor) is to modify those dynamics to try and make them more flexible: opening bridges to Terran players towards T3 with the Tech Reactor which will be a must have in the late game, and the Herc which can't snowball the same way as Liberators do.
The Ghost and Science Vessel are designed to be game changer and make the fight engagement more complicated than just taking a good concave, by giving them ways to interact in many ways, without just giving them brutal strength. The nerf of Steady Targetting goes in the same direction, as well as removing the Auto Turret and the Seeker Missile.
Terran spellcasters mainly become control units rather than destruction units. They'll still be able to do significant damage, but it will more dependent on your opponent's response. The goal is to make basic Terran units the true DPS, and spellcasters as their guardians.
The Tech Reactor is here to ease the access to T3, just like the Herc since it's a unit with a short living span. This should push Terrans to transition to T3 units like BattleCruisers more often.




[image loading] ZERG



Infestator

- Infested Terran is removed from the game.

- New spell: Tunnel (requires Burrow, costs 50 Energy): its allows the Infestator to dash to a selected position while creating an entry point (its starting position) and an exit point (its end position, where you clicked). The 2 points are connected and allow units to move like a normal Nydus Canal, except they can't be stored in it: they exit immediately after entering.
Each entry point have 250 HP and can be destroyed. Once one entry point is destroyed, the other is as well automatically.
Its maximum range is 13, it can climb cliffs and pass under buildings.

- Changes to Fungal Growth: it can't be used while the Infestator is burrowed, and it slows down the units by 90% instead of totally preventing them from moving.

- Changes to Neural Parasite: it can't be used while the Infestator is burrowed, and it now stuns the targetted unit for 5 seconds, during which you own it, but you can't control it. If the Infestator doesn't die meanwhile, at the end of the 5 seconds the unit permanently joins your army, and you can control it entirely until it dies. It will use space in your population just like if you made it yourself.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
The Infested Terran, like the Auto Turret, have been removed from the game to avoid the situation where the players would make a lot of them to tank up and make damage. To stay in the idea of spellcasters being support units, we replaced it by the Tunnel which will allow the Infestator to chase units to use Neural Parasite on them.
Neural Parasite becomes a dreadful weapon which will be able to punish positionning errors of the opponent, and to make a difference against big units if you use the Viper in addition.
Fungal Growth is a bit nerfed in its capacity to stop the opponent's army to increase the need of skill for the combo with Ravagers.
The Infestator becomes a key unit in the mid game up to the late game with the new Neural Parasite.



Viper

- Blinding Cloud is replaced by Dark Swarm.

- New spell: Dark Swarm (costs 100 Energy and lasts 7 seconds): it's an orange gas which protect all units within by making them untargettable. All units that will shoot from outside Dark Swarm on a unit inside it will have its damages reduced to 0, until they enter the Dark Swarm themselves, at which point they can attack normally.
Dark Swarm is a projectile and works against both ground and air attacks. Spells like Storm, Irradiate and Nova aren't impacted by Dark Swarm and still work as usual.

- Parasitic Bomb now deals 140 damage instead of 120.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
Blinding Cloud was often forcing the Vipers to take too much risks by being on the front line to be able to target for example the tanks behind the Terran lines. With Dark Swarm, the Viper will be able to stay back and support units from there.
Dark Swarm is interesting when engaging, because it will be easy to avoid it in the middle of the map, by going in or disengaging, but almost impossible to avoid if the Zerg player has you corned in your base. It will also help the Zerg to finish off their games, which tends to be difficult even when they have the advantage, especially because of their opponent's base layout. With Dark Swarm, an advantage gained will be easier to transform into a siege which can finish the game, if the opponent can't produce the counter units (Storm / Nova / Stasis / Irradiate / Vessel EMP / PDD)



Brood Lord

- New spell: Frenzy (5 seconds duration, 90 seconds cooldown): doubles the moving speed of the Brood Lord, to either go in or disengage of a battle quicker.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
The moving speed of the Brood Lord is too much of a burden. It will make the Brood Lord play more interesting and viable to play.



The Zerg race is the most interesting race when it comes to dynamics,
but a lot of strategies are not used that much like Baneling traps, Contaminate from the Overseer, Nydus Canals, etc. They often rely on their T3 so it's the race with the least amount of changes needed. To amplify the dynamics, we gave to the Infestator and the Viper the ability to combine their spells to create a strong synergy. For instance, the Dark Swarm with Neural Parasite, or the Abduct which can help the player get back a converted unit from Neural Parasite that would be a bit too far.
Tunnel will allow Zerg players to engage differently, and it can be easily used in a combo with Neural Parasite or Fungal Growth and offer new options to harass or move on the map.
Everything has been done to allow smart players to stand out even more from their opponent by taking full advantage of the Zerg spells.
The Brood Lord is uped because considering its price, it's not mobile or resistant enough, while it seems critical for the Zerg to have a strong air unit to finish the games. With Frenzy, it will be easier to use Brood Lords to their full potential.



[image loading] PROTOSS



Sentry

- New spell: Replicate (costs 75 Energy, duration 31 seconds): temporarily transforms itself in a copy of the targetted unit, except Psionic, Massive and workers. Can select both ally and enemy units. After 1,8 seconds during which it scans the targetted unit, the Sentry transforms itself in that unit, including its skills and upgrades, although the Sentry will keep its 40 Shield and 40 HP.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
This capacity is interesting because it will diversify the Protoss gameplay with a greater need of reflexion. The fact that the Sentry keeps its life makes weak units replicated stronger (ex. a Zergling with 40/40 instead of 35), while strong units will be weaker (Immortals for instance), avoiding a spell that would be overpowered.
It makes Replicate a tactical-based decision, where you want to pick the right units instead of just building mass Sentries and spamming the spell.
Just like the Ghost and the Infestator, the Sentry becomes a must-have, with the combinaison of the Forcefields to control the terrain, Guardian Shield to protect your other units, Hallucination to scout and Replicate to return bad situations to your advantage.
Replicate is going in the same direction as Forcefield or Storm: a reflex-based spell which requires good thinking and tactical decision-making.



Mothership Core

- Mass Recall is removed, and replaced by Recall Pylon.

- New spell: Recall Pylon (costs 50 Energy, 4 seconds casting time): transforms a Pylon into a Recall Pylon, which can recall all units in a 3 radius around the targetted unit from anywhere on the map to it. The ability has a 90 seconds cooldown. A Recall Pylon can't be used for a Photon Overcharge.

- Changes to Photon Overcharge: damages nerfed from 30 to 15.

- Changes to Time Warp: instantly created, it reduces speed by 75% instead of 50%.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
Mass Recall is removed because the Mothership Core should rather be a defensive unit than be used to support the army when leaving the base, especially when Photon Overcharge is so important to defend the base.
The Protoss race having problems to make its gameplay dynamic, simply removing the Mass Recall would have been complicated. To help with that, we separated Mass Recall from the Mothership Core, so Protoss players don't have to wait for a critical amount of units to go out of their base.
Managing run by and drops will be easier by using good recalls.
Time Warp is improved to allow players to better control the terrain while moving their army.
Photon Overcharge is nerfed to avoid making it too strong in defense, while still being strong enough to kill and Oracle or a drop Mine, and that way being effective in early game.



High Templar

- New spell: Cleanse (costs 100 Energy, requires an upgrade in the Templar Archive for 200 Mineral / 200 Gas and 79 seconds): it cancels the effect of any spell currently active in the targetted area, with a 1,5 radius (like EMP). For instance it will cancel Fungal Growth, Dark Swarm, Lockdown, Storm ...

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
Since we gave a lot of new spells to other races (Lockdown and Irradiate for Terran, Neural Parasite and Dark Swarm for Zerg), it was important to help the Protoss defend themselves against them by either doing more damage, or to lower it, as soon as the beginning of the mid game. Cleanse requires skill and to keep the units alive for the late game.
Cleanse won't work against Neural Parasite during the 5 seconds the Infestator is still "attached" to the unit it targetted. It will work however on a completely converted unit, and will give it back to the Protoss.



Mothership

- New spell: Vortex (costs 125 Energy, lasts 20 seconds): behaves exactly like in Wings of Liberty by sucking up all units inside, then releasing them. Upon release, the units are immune to damage for 1 second.
The only change is that it takes 3 seconds to be casted.

Details about these changes:
+ Show Spoiler +
The Vortex is added to give the ability to players to get out of a bad engagement. Since it takes 3 seconds to be effective, the opponent has ti,e to disengage, which is the main point of the Vortex. It also allows the player to control a zone. In a way, it's still possible to make a combo with the Archon Toilet, without it being too powerful with both the 3 seconds delay and the 1 second immunity of all units to damage. This way, the Mothership becomes a key unit again if well used.



The Protoss race has always had trouble moving and always had to make choices and play defensively in a lot of configurations. That's why we created the Pylon Recall, which will allow Protoss players to be more mobile, while removing this functionality from the Mothership Core who wasn't a good fit to use it.
The up of Time Warp will give better control over the fights and to make Zealots more effective in defense.
Photon Overcharge is nerfed to allow for more aggressive options in early TvP for instance, and also to avoid having a Protoss defense too powerful, Pylon Recall already being quite powerful.
For the Sentry, we wanted to stay in what Protoss is about, while still giving it new weapons which, used smartly, will allow it to make the difference. It becomes an inevitable unit on many aspects.
When it comes to the High Templar, we didn't want to add damage spells, but considering the changes to Zerg and Terran, it seemed necessary to give them the new "Cleanse" weapon which will allow the Protoss player to choose between protecting units by using Cleanse or dealing damage with Storm, especially in the late game. It also allows the Protoss, whose army is rather slow, to get better solutions against spellcasters.
Finally, the Vortex will be harder to use than in Wings of Liberty since it now needs 3 seconds to be activated. But if units fall inside by mistake, it will be as lethal as before, especially if Archons are nearby. The goal is to give the Mothership to control an area for some time, to block access to further down the road for instance. At the end of the day, the Vortex also transformed simple games into incredible moves that made everyone hold their breath. It had to be back.



GLOBAL GAMEPLAY


- The players start the game with 6 workers instead of 12 (the supply is scaled appropriately, just like in HotS).

Thanks to the 4 editions of OG 6 Start, we're convinced that starting with 6 workers only brings positive things. It gives more depth in the choice of build orders, there's more precise micro-gestion moves in the early game with a very small army composition, it's harder to snowball so the fights are more intense, etc. All those effects make the game more interesting, with more details, where each unit dying has a bigger impact.

Even on a community level, 6 workers allows for easier builds to understand and replicate, which makes it easier for beginners to start the game, or the return of older players who were finding the game too demanding. With 6 workers, the game is easier to begin for everyone, especially since you can do strategies like 6 Pool or 4 Gates to have fun and sensations very early in the game, which is now impossible with LotV.

In the end, this mod combines 2 ideas: first making sure that a 6 workers start was really effective, which make the very early game more interesting, then make the spellcasters into real support units which can interact in a lot of situations. We focused on control spells rather than damage spells to avoid a snowball effect on spellcasters, the goal being to have just the right amount of them compared to the army size, where having too many of them would lower the DPS too much to be worth it.

Obviously the objective isn't 100% met and there's probably balance issues. The goal isn't to have a perfect balance, but to have fun. If a player finds a combinaison that's too strong, they will have impressed us during the game and we'll fix the issue later on. Don't hesitate to play with it and point out to us what's overpowered or underpowered! We have put in serious efforts in the balance and dynamic, but all of that is just to create different and surprising tournaments. If those tournament work, we'll have more data to update the mod and to continue to surprise you.


The mod is now in the Arcade on EU, US and KOR servers. You can find it by searching for "Powered".

You can also select a map in "Custom Game" and then click on "Create with a mod". Type in "Powered" in the search bar, and the map you chose will use the mod.

If you want to help us develop the mod, don't hesitate to send us your replay at OGSC2Powered@gmail.com!

A tournament will soon be announced, hopefully next week, stay tuned! Meanwhile, we're organizing a showmatch tonight at 19:30 GMT (+00:00) on [image loading] O'GamingTV, come check out the mod in action!

A huge thank you to all the players who gave us some of their time to test the mod and balance it as much as possible: Clem, Garitos, Denver, Uzikoti, ImData, Lind, Cripseil, FerouCyril, Slide.

Thank you!
O'GamingTV Crew !
Chaden
Profile Joined August 2017
5 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-25 18:22:00
August 25 2017 18:19 GMT
#2
I'd really happy to see Sc2 devs testing this mod. I think some changes of this mod would make next Sc2 patch better for players and viewers.

Thanks O'gaming fore making our game alive than never. Love you guys
Kerdinand
Profile Joined November 2016
Germany113 Posts
August 25 2017 18:29 GMT
#3
Oh look, another community mod that tries to make the game more like BW and that nobody will play after trying it out once or twice....

Honestly, I appreciate the effort everybody puts into these mods, but it seems like a waste of time to me. If you want to help the development of this game then give feedback in the community update threads. Now, that a big organisation like o'gaming does it this might actually gain some track, but I dont believe it will last longer than a few weeks without a dedicated ladder and playerbase.
Na jakar me'nah. - sOs - PartinG - Stats
bosshdt
Profile Joined April 2015
Afghanistan98 Posts
August 25 2017 18:43 GMT
#4
Well done.
OGamingTV SC2
Profile Joined March 2013
France84 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-25 18:55:40
August 25 2017 18:55 GMT
#5
Kerdinand the goal isn't necessarily to convince Blizzard about these changes. We wanted to make a fun mod to have games radically different than what we can see in LotV. We plan to create tournaments with this mod and see great stuff!
O'GamingTV Crew !
OGamingTV SC2
Profile Joined March 2013
France84 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-25 19:58:33
August 25 2017 19:58 GMT
#6
The showmatch have started, with players who helped us test the mod so they already know it!
[image loading] O'GamingTV
O'GamingTV Crew !
Siegetank_Dieter1
Profile Joined August 2017
117 Posts
August 25 2017 20:11 GMT
#7
Guys increase the ressources per base please ,_______,

6 worker start is good, but bases still run out way too fast. When you macro on 3base, your main is already down to like 6 workers.
fastr
Profile Joined February 2011
France901 Posts
August 25 2017 20:28 GMT
#8
- Changes to Neural Parasite: it can't be used while the Infestator is burrowed, and it now stuns the targetted unit for 5 seconds, during which you own it, but you can't control it. If the Infestator doesn't die meanwhile, at the end of the 5 seconds the unit permanently joins your army, and you can control it entirely until it dies. It will use space in your population just like if you made it yourself.


wololo
OGamingTV SC2
Profile Joined March 2013
France84 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-25 21:20:18
August 25 2017 21:20 GMT
#9
Here's a play we just saw with Clem and Denver, who helped test the mod and played a lot of games on it!
Showmatch Clip
O'GamingTV Crew !
Rococo
Profile Joined May 2011
United States331 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-26 01:18:00
August 25 2017 22:23 GMT
#10
I always love to see well thought out 1v1 mods like this (emphasis on well thought out, which this seems to be), even if trying to place more emphasis on spellcaster micro isn't the direction I would take the game myself.
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
August 26 2017 01:10 GMT
#11
It's interesting at least, thanks for the effort (more later when i tried it and thought about it more)
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Mahanaim
Profile Joined December 2012
Korea (South)1002 Posts
August 26 2017 01:49 GMT
#12
Keep them coming! The community brainstorming about good potential changes is A+
Celebrating Starcraft since... a long time ago.
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10670 Posts
August 26 2017 01:53 GMT
#13
Woah really nice and interesting changes actually, good work guys!
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
404AlphaSquad
Profile Joined October 2011
839 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-26 02:28:58
August 26 2017 02:25 GMT
#14
On August 26 2017 03:29 Kerdinand wrote:
Oh look, another community mod that tries to make the game more like BW and that nobody will play after trying it out once or twice....

Honestly, I appreciate the effort everybody puts into these mods, but it seems like a waste of time to me. If you want to help the development of this game then give feedback in the community update threads. Now, that a big organisation like o'gaming does it this might actually gain some track, but I dont believe it will last longer than a few weeks without a dedicated ladder and playerbase.


If you think this mod makes the game like BW then you have never played BW. Also some people enjoy making mods even if there is not a huge community behind it. And nobody who mods actually believes that Blizzard is going to implement these changes. They have never done that and never will. They already do not listen to community feedback and always do what they want, so there is no reason to assume a mod will change their mindset on design.
aka Kalevi
todespolka
Profile Joined November 2012
221 Posts
August 26 2017 11:20 GMT
#15
A lot of the ideas are imbalanced, look cool first, but are bad gameplay. The mod has also very good ideas. So it is an interesting mix of ideas worth testing.
Kerdinand
Profile Joined November 2016
Germany113 Posts
August 26 2017 11:41 GMT
#16
On August 26 2017 11:25 404AlphaSquad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2017 03:29 Kerdinand wrote:
Oh look, another community mod that tries to make the game more like BW and that nobody will play after trying it out once or twice....

Honestly, I appreciate the effort everybody puts into these mods, but it seems like a waste of time to me. If you want to help the development of this game then give feedback in the community update threads. Now, that a big organisation like o'gaming does it this might actually gain some track, but I dont believe it will last longer than a few weeks without a dedicated ladder and playerbase.


If you think this mod makes the game like BW then you have never played BW. Also some people enjoy making mods even if there is not a huge community behind it. And nobody who mods actually believes that Blizzard is going to implement these changes. They have never done that and never will. They already do not listen to community feedback and always do what they want, so there is no reason to assume a mod will change their mindset on design.


1. Yes, I have never played BW except for the campaign.
2. I did not say "like BW" but "more like BW". Thats intended and an important difference.
3. Bringing back Science Vessels, Dark Swarm, Lockdown, EMP, etc. and reduce starting workers seems like taking the game in the BW direction to me.

And if this is not meant as a suggestion to Blizzard, what is it meant to be? A a lot of people will play because they prefer it? Without a ladder? A mod that makes tournaments flashier? Why would I want to watch a tournament on a mod, meaning I cannot see my favourite pro players, cannot learn new strategies/tactics/tricks and without Blizz support there wont be a big storyline or prizepool either. Just look what happened to Starbow, Vanguard, etc.. They are fun messing around in once or twice but they die of pretty quickly.
As I said, I appreciate the time and effort people put into this, but I just dont think its worth the investment. If its for your personal enjoyment, ok, I guess I can understand that. But then dont exspect a lot of people to play it.
Na jakar me'nah. - sOs - PartinG - Stats
neptunusfisk
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
2286 Posts
August 26 2017 11:48 GMT
#17
On August 26 2017 20:41 Kerdinand wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2017 11:25 404AlphaSquad wrote:
On August 26 2017 03:29 Kerdinand wrote:
Oh look, another community mod that tries to make the game more like BW and that nobody will play after trying it out once or twice....

Honestly, I appreciate the effort everybody puts into these mods, but it seems like a waste of time to me. If you want to help the development of this game then give feedback in the community update threads. Now, that a big organisation like o'gaming does it this might actually gain some track, but I dont believe it will last longer than a few weeks without a dedicated ladder and playerbase.


If you think this mod makes the game like BW then you have never played BW. Also some people enjoy making mods even if there is not a huge community behind it. And nobody who mods actually believes that Blizzard is going to implement these changes. They have never done that and never will. They already do not listen to community feedback and always do what they want, so there is no reason to assume a mod will change their mindset on design.


1. Yes, I have never played BW except for the campaign.
2. I did not say "like BW" but "more like BW". Thats intended and an important difference.
3. Bringing back Science Vessels, Dark Swarm, Lockdown, EMP, etc. and reduce starting workers seems like taking the game in the BW direction to me.

And if this is not meant as a suggestion to Blizzard, what is it meant to be? A a lot of people will play because they prefer it? Without a ladder? A mod that makes tournaments flashier? Why would I want to watch a tournament on a mod, meaning I cannot see my favourite pro players, cannot learn new strategies/tactics/tricks and without Blizz support there wont be a big storyline or prizepool either. Just look what happened to Starbow, Vanguard, etc.. They are fun messing around in once or twice but they die of pretty quickly.
As I said, I appreciate the time and effort people put into this, but I just dont think its worth the investment. If its for your personal enjoyment, ok, I guess I can understand that. But then dont exspect a lot of people to play it.


I think this makes the game more like Dota more than anything else, with every unit getting new spells...



On August 26 2017 05:28 fastr wrote:
Show nested quote +
- Changes to Neural Parasite: it can't be used while the Infestator is burrowed, and it now stuns the targetted unit for 5 seconds, during which you own it, but you can't control it. If the Infestator doesn't die meanwhile, at the end of the 5 seconds the unit permanently joins your army, and you can control it entirely until it dies. It will use space in your population just like if you made it yourself.


wololo


11
maru G5L pls
OGamingTV SC2
Profile Joined March 2013
France84 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-26 14:01:29
August 26 2017 14:00 GMT
#18
On August 26 2017 20:41 Kerdinand wrote:
And if this is not meant as a suggestion to Blizzard, what is it meant to be? A a lot of people will play because they prefer it? Without a ladder? A mod that makes tournaments flashier? Why would I want to watch a tournament on a mod, meaning I cannot see my favourite pro players, cannot learn new strategies/tactics/tricks and without Blizz support there wont be a big storyline or prizepool either. Just look what happened to Starbow, Vanguard, etc.. They are fun messing around in once or twice but they die of pretty quickly.
As I said, I appreciate the time and effort people put into this, but I just dont think its worth the investment. If its for your personal enjoyment, ok, I guess I can understand that. But then dont exspect a lot of people to play it.


We already explained in the first and second post what it's here for:

On August 26 2017 02:37 OGamingTV SC2 wrote:
Obviously the objective isn't 100% met and there's probably balance issues. The goal isn't to have a perfect balance, but to have fun. If a player finds a combinaison that's too strong, they will have impressed us during the game and we'll fix the issue later on. Don't hesitate to play with it and point out to us what's overpowered or underpowered! We have put in serious efforts in the balance and dynamic, but all of that is just to create different and surprising tournaments. If those tournament work, we'll have more data to update the mod and to continue to surprise you.

On August 26 2017 03:55 OGamingTV SC2 wrote:
Kerdinand the goal isn't necessarily to convince Blizzard about these changes. We wanted to make a fun mod to have games radically different than what we can see in LotV. We plan to create tournaments with this mod and see great stuff!


Plus the last edition of OG 6 Start, our previous mod, was played with 8 of the best Korean players. Not sure what you mean by "I cannot see my favourite pro players"

Obviously, if you except / watch only big tournaments like WCS or GSL, this ain't it. But there are other tournaments out there you know And soon one more, on a different way to play the game!
O'GamingTV Crew !
Siegetank_Dieter1
Profile Joined August 2017
117 Posts
August 26 2017 14:40 GMT
#19
Question @Ogaming

Will you expand this mod further and further or is this basically a temporarily project where you try to get a few tournaments on it and then bascially make a new mod with another topic.

The current theme is more focus on spellcaster and more supportive interaction.

So maybe next theme could be "less is more"... drastic unit removals/ race redesign, removal of gimmicky units and focus on more basic compositions for example:

Mech = Tank, hellbat, Thor or goliath

Bio = marine, marauder, medivac

Standard protoss = zealot, Stalker, Collosi

etc.

Maybe having less stuff gimmicky units would open up strategy diversity, allowing for a greater variety of openings in every matchup.
Kerdinand
Profile Joined November 2016
Germany113 Posts
Last Edited: 2017-08-26 15:27:15
August 26 2017 15:19 GMT
#20
On August 26 2017 23:00 OGamingTV SC2 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 26 2017 20:41 Kerdinand wrote:
And if this is not meant as a suggestion to Blizzard, what is it meant to be? A a lot of people will play because they prefer it? Without a ladder? A mod that makes tournaments flashier? Why would I want to watch a tournament on a mod, meaning I cannot see my favourite pro players, cannot learn new strategies/tactics/tricks and without Blizz support there wont be a big storyline or prizepool either. Just look what happened to Starbow, Vanguard, etc.. They are fun messing around in once or twice but they die of pretty quickly.
As I said, I appreciate the time and effort people put into this, but I just dont think its worth the investment. If its for your personal enjoyment, ok, I guess I can understand that. But then dont exspect a lot of people to play it.


We already explained in the first and second post what it's here for:

Show nested quote +
On August 26 2017 02:37 OGamingTV SC2 wrote:
Obviously the objective isn't 100% met and there's probably balance issues. The goal isn't to have a perfect balance, but to have fun. If a player finds a combinaison that's too strong, they will have impressed us during the game and we'll fix the issue later on. Don't hesitate to play with it and point out to us what's overpowered or underpowered! We have put in serious efforts in the balance and dynamic, but all of that is just to create different and surprising tournaments. If those tournament work, we'll have more data to update the mod and to continue to surprise you.

Show nested quote +
On August 26 2017 03:55 OGamingTV SC2 wrote:
Kerdinand the goal isn't necessarily to convince Blizzard about these changes. We wanted to make a fun mod to have games radically different than what we can see in LotV. We plan to create tournaments with this mod and see great stuff!


Plus the last edition of OG 6 Start, our previous mod, was played with 8 of the best Korean players. Not sure what you mean by "I cannot see my favourite pro players"

Obviously, if you except / watch only big tournaments like WCS or GSL, this ain't it. But there are other tournaments out there you know And soon one more, on a different way to play the game!


I understand that you want to make it purely for fun but as I said I just dont think it will actually be played, and that tournaments with a mod will just be less appealing than tournaments without a mod. Thats all I wanted to point out. If it is worth the effor for you, thats totally ok with me (as if I could stop you ).

EDIT: Ok, you got me with the pro player part. Point for you, although even here I dont think we will see consistent pro competition (2 metas is just to much too learn), but Im always open to what the future brings.
Na jakar me'nah. - sOs - PartinG - Stats
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