EPTAnd yet it is this question of connectivity that seems to have confounded us as educators for centuries. We’ve been experts at describing and defining at great length what a thing is and what it appears to be doing on its own, but have managed somehow and too often to avoid its place and function as a part of something larger. Our life sciences and ecological investigations have gradually overturned this perspective as simply poor science. Yet far too many of our great institutions still operate as collectives of silos and fiercely defended fiefdoms with meager connectivity among their constituent parts.
Call to Action: June 28 Balance Testing - Page 6
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I wasbanned fromthis
113 Posts
And yet it is this question of connectivity that seems to have confounded us as educators for centuries. We’ve been experts at describing and defining at great length what a thing is and what it appears to be doing on its own, but have managed somehow and too often to avoid its place and function as a part of something larger. Our life sciences and ecological investigations have gradually overturned this perspective as simply poor science. Yet far too many of our great institutions still operate as collectives of silos and fiercely defended fiefdoms with meager connectivity among their constituent parts. | ||
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PinoKotsBeer
Netherlands1385 Posts
On June 30 2016 16:18 SwiftCrane wrote: Really?! Instead of addressing pressing matters like parasitic bomb, tankevac, tempest 4 supply, ultra armor, ravagers, adepts, immortal damage, pylon overcharge, current state of raven, cyclone being useless, mech beng useless... they go for a queen range buff and spore root time? LOLOL It's nowhere near in the right direction, and even if it was, it wouldn;t be anywhere near enough... I agree, the list is huge. | ||
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Beelzebub1
1004 Posts
The only thing I would remove is Parasitic Bomb (only thing that let's you come back in Mutalisk wars or do jack shit against bigger aerial armies) and Ravagers (Haven't really seen these be a "problem" in a little while" but yes, things like David being afraid of Swarm Hosts (ROFL) and yet allowing Tempests to be massed at the same supply as the useless since release Cyclone is pretty bad and needs to be addressed. Raven could use a tweak, mech could use a tweak (You know like making tanks really good and removing the idiot Medivac ability but hey I'm not on the balance team sooo...) and the Ultralisk should probably at the very least receive a -1 armor nerf so bio can scratch them. I wonder though, will the Ghost ever even be used if the Ultralisk can be defeated by bio alone? The Ghosts sole point to exist right now is to Steady Target the Ultralisks but I guess that's another can of worms entirely. - Make Cyclone reliable anti - air footman for mech and remove the gimmick lock on ability, good units are just good, they don't need a gimmick ability as a crutch, that's bad/lazy design. - Redistribute air power, take something away from Liberators (like the ground mode upgrade with a damage nerf or something) and make Viking ground mode actually good for once in 5 years. Currently the Liberator takes the identity away from the Banshee for air to ground drone kills and air power from the Viking, this is bad/lazy design as well. 1 unit overlapping all other Starport units? Tell me that's not bad/lazy design. - Remove idiotic Tank/Medivac ability, the novelty has worn off and it's cancer for TvT, not sure the balance teams obsession with the tank sucking and retaining this gimmick ability. - Do work on Ghosts/Infestors/Ravens, make them better somehow, currently they are all super niche while the High Templar is a staple unit in every match up, are the other races not allowed to have good spell casters or something? Okay the Viper is good, but Infestors are still pretty terrible and vulnerable at best. - Tone down Ultralisk armor or give Marauder single attacks back so they don't get affected twice by armor - Raise Tempest supply to 6 because common sense dictates that this unit and the Cyclone probably shouldn't use the same supply. - Rework Nydus to not be a gimmick - Remove Swarm Hosts from the game entirely, they serve no real purpose to the Swarm, sorry David, time to let this one go, it's a failed implementation. There you go, game is pretty much 100% if all of these went through. | ||
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MockHamill
Sweden1798 Posts
On July 01 2016 01:33 Beelzebub1 wrote: The only thing I would remove is Parasitic Bomb (only thing that let's you come back in Mutalisk wars or do jack shit against bigger aerial armies) and Ravagers (Haven't really seen these be a "problem" in a little while" but yes, things like David being afraid of Swarm Hosts (ROFL) and yet allowing Tempests to be massed at the same supply as the useless since release Cyclone is pretty bad and needs to be addressed. Raven could use a tweak, mech could use a tweak (You know like making tanks really good and removing the idiot Medivac ability but hey I'm not on the balance team sooo...) and the Ultralisk should probably at the very least receive a -1 armor nerf so bio can scratch them. I wonder though, will the Ghost ever even be used if the Ultralisk can be defeated by bio alone? The Ghosts sole point to exist right now is to Steady Target the Ultralisks but I guess that's another can of worms entirely. - Make Cyclone reliable anti - air footman for mech and remove the gimmick lock on ability, good units are just good, they don't need a gimmick ability as a crutch, that's bad/lazy design. - Redistribute air power, take something away from Liberators (like the ground mode upgrade with a damage nerf or something) and make Viking ground mode actually good for once in 5 years. Currently the Liberator takes the identity away from the Banshee for air to ground drone kills and air power from the Viking, this is bad/lazy design as well. 1 unit overlapping all other Starport units? Tell me that's not bad/lazy design. - Remove idiotic Tank/Medivac ability, the novelty has worn off and it's cancer for TvT, not sure the balance teams obsession with the tank sucking and retaining this gimmick ability. - Do work on Ghosts/Infestors/Ravens, make them better somehow, currently they are all super niche while the High Templar is a staple unit in every match up, are the other races not allowed to have good spell casters or something? Okay the Viper is good, but Infestors are still pretty terrible and vulnerable at best. - Tone down Ultralisk armor or give Marauder single attacks back so they don't get affected twice by armor - Raise Tempest supply to 6 because common sense dictates that this unit and the Cyclone probably shouldn't use the same supply. - Rework Nydus to not be a gimmick - Remove Swarm Hosts from the game entirely, they serve no real purpose to the Swarm, sorry David, time to let this one go, it's a failed implementation. There you go, game is pretty much 100% if all of these went through. I 100% agree with this. The game is in serious trouble and Blizzard is doing too little to save it. The above changes would change the status of SC2 from dying to doing well. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
Won't the spore buff negates muta build in ZvZ ? | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15956 Posts
On July 01 2016 01:33 Beelzebub1 wrote: The only thing I would remove is Parasitic Bomb (only thing that let's you come back in Mutalisk wars or do jack shit against bigger aerial armies) parasitic bomb is a problem because terran has no answer to BL/viper. broodlords can only be countered by air units and vipers destroy air units. yes you can emp/snipe them but if the zerg is careful and slowly pushes with mass spores it's impossible to do that. | ||
Liquid`Snute
Norway839 Posts
On July 01 2016 02:33 FFW_Rude wrote: I don't play so i know nothing but... Won't the spore buff negates muta build in ZvZ ? very minor implications for zvz. it's useful for the catz spore rush where rooting time is important, but in general in other scenarios people very rarely unroot spores. it does matter, but it's very insignificant compared to the spore vs bio damage buff for example  | ||
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Beelzebub1
1004 Posts
On July 01 2016 02:50 Charoisaur wrote: parasitic bomb is a problem because terran has no answer to BL/viper. broodlords can only be countered by air units and vipers destroy air units. yes you can emp/snipe them but if the zerg is careful and slowly pushes with mass spores it's impossible to do that. That sounds like a "Terran late game anti - air kind of sucks" but Brood Lord/Viper is one of those (I really hate saying this because it's bullshit but it's so true) "do not let them get there" kind of thing. Nobody calls Sky Protoss imbalanced because there is a clear indicator that he's going Sky toss and you just flat out have to kill the Protoss before they can mass 20 + Tempests with Archons and High Templars underneath them. To afford Broodlords and Viper that's telling me that the Terran pretty much let the Zerg have a 5th and 6th with all 4 geysers base almost totally uncontested. I've also seen Ghosts do bad things to Zerg tier 3 if you can make them work. Slowly pushing with mass spores while controlling Vipers and Broodlords and defending bases (that 5th and 6th) is a mechanical/multitasking/micro nightmare, I applaud any Zerg who can make that work vs Terran without getting double dropped in the main and 4th base and just auto lose. | ||
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Gen.Rolly
United States200 Posts
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SHODAN
United Kingdom1106 Posts
On June 30 2016 16:18 SwiftCrane wrote: Really?! Instead of addressing pressing matters like parasitic bomb, tankevac, tempest 4 supply, ultra armor, ravagers, adepts, immortal damage, pylon overcharge, current state of raven, cyclone being useless, mech beng useless... they go for a queen range buff and spore root time? LOLOL It's nowhere near in the right direction, and even if it was, it wouldn;t be anywhere near enough... the #1 reason mech is useless vZ is because of invincible nydus worms. roach/nydus gives you free win if terran opens hellion/hellbat/banshee. | ||
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Vanadiel
France961 Posts
On July 01 2016 03:00 Liquid`Snute wrote: very minor implications for zvz. it's useful for the catz spore rush where rooting time is important, but in general in other scenarios people very rarely unroot spores. it does matter, but it's very insignificant compared to the spore vs bio damage buff for example The Queen buff, on the other hand, would be very significant for ZvZ vs muta. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15956 Posts
On July 01 2016 04:39 SHODAN wrote: the #1 reason mech is useless vZ is because of invincible nydus worms. roach/nydus gives you free win if terran opens hellion/hellbat/banshee. if you can get an armory in time hellbat banshee shuts nydus allins down hard. | ||
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SHODAN
United Kingdom1106 Posts
On July 01 2016 05:47 Charoisaur wrote: if you can get an armory in time hellbat banshee shuts nydus allins down hard. can you share any replays? how do you deal with the queens/overseer? how do you not lose your reactor/techlab? or most of your scvs? | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On July 01 2016 03:00 Liquid`Snute wrote: very minor implications for zvz. it's useful for the catz spore rush where rooting time is important, but in general in other scenarios people very rarely unroot spores. it does matter, but it's very insignificant compared to the spore vs bio damage buff for example Oh ok thx. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15956 Posts
On July 01 2016 06:16 SHODAN wrote: can you share any replays? how do you deal with the queens/overseer? how do you not lose your reactor/techlab? or most of your scvs? i can't find the replays but if you have 6-8 hellbats with banshees and possibly a liberator with scv surround the nydus gets shut down. you just have to scout it in time so you have your units in your base. early lair is an obvious tell it's either nydus or 2 base muta if you see roaches it's almost certainly a nydus. another story is it when they make the nydus outside of your base and slowly push with queens towards your base but no zerg I've faced was smart enough to do that and I open hellion/banshee every game. | ||
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cheekymonkey
France1387 Posts
On June 29 2016 07:22 ZenithM wrote: I have bad memories of when the "other" queen range was buffed. Me too. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24202 Posts
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
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fireforce7
United States334 Posts
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