EPTPower Rank - Post-Blizzcon Edition - Page 9
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smashlloyd20
251 Posts
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Zealously
East Gorteau22261 Posts
On November 14 2014 00:11 Caladan wrote: Places MMA after #2 of WCS and #1 of WCS EU and winning vs GSL champion on "WCS Powerrank" #6. Especially lower than overrated Innovation and a Zest who was a total utter complete failure in WCS. Good job, Zealously! *tactical facepalm* It's not a "WCS power rank" though | ||
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Dumbledore
Sweden725 Posts
How was this power rank calculated? Eh | ||
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bourne117
United States837 Posts
On November 13 2014 21:15 The_Red_Viper wrote: Cause he never won a tournament where you can prepare for your opponent? Taeja is a great player, one of the best the game has seen for sure, but he still lacks a GSL title (or even wcs one). Next year he will have the chance to win one (with the new spotv league even more than ever)  Innovation had a week to prepare. About the same as the GSL ro8 and on wards. Soo had more than a month (give or take can't remember the exact length from the bracket being locked in and the ro16 being played) He didn't win the tournament but he beat both GSL finalists after both had an extended period of time to prepare. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On November 14 2014 01:09 bourne117 wrote: Innovation had a week to prepare. About the same as the GSL ro8 and on wards. Soo had more than a month (give or take can't remember the exact length from the bracket being locked in and the ro16 being played) He didn't win the tournament but he beat both GSL finalists after both had an extended period of time to prepare. So? I don't see how that changes my point. I never said he will lose vs any good player as soon as you can prepare. But if you wanna win GSL you have to go through a lot of different opponents who prepare for you. He couldn't do that yet. Also the games vs Innovation, well... it doesn't really matter, next year we will have more answers | ||
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p14c
Vatican City State431 Posts
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
Thank goodness, Life is awesome, so I can't really disagree much, but where the fuck were the TL writers and the awesome Power Rank right after IGN ProLeague Season 4, which, you know, aLive won? :D | ||
Shellshock
United States97277 Posts
On November 14 2014 01:48 ZenithM wrote: The cool thing when you are a TL writer is that you can just insta-put your favorite player at the top of some "Ultimate Latest Edition Power-Rank: Only The Strong Will Survive!" as soon as he wins something. Thank goodness, Life is awesome, so I can't really disagree much, but where the fuck was the TL writers and the awesome Power Rank right after IGN ProLeague Season 4, which, you know, aLive won? :D Darkhorse wasn't a writer yet at that time | ||
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bourne117
United States837 Posts
On November 14 2014 01:19 The_Red_Viper wrote: So? I don't see how that changes my point. I never said he will lose vs any good player as soon as you can prepare. But if you wanna win GSL you have to go through a lot of different opponents who prepare for you. He couldn't do that yet. Also the games vs Innovation, well... it doesn't really matter, next year we will have more answers Except Taeja hasn't been in GSL to actually try since HoTS came out and when he was he was consistently performing despite being having to battle against arguable the most imbalanced time in SC2. You can certainly argue that his lack of success in WCS AM is the same thing except almost all of his failures in WCS AM have been during the ro8 onwards where it is more like a weekend tournament again instead of a GSL style where you can prepare. Why does this whole he lacks a GSL title thing always come up with Taeja? GSLs are incredibly hard to win and there aren't exactly a lot of them making using them as a great indicator of a players strength less than ideal because one bad series and suddenly 1/3rd of the year is lost in terms of GSLs. Rain hasn't won a GSL. Innovation was the consensus best player in the world last year despite never winning. Soo hasn't won one either. Are those players suddenly of lesser quality because of this? Of course not. Is Sniper or roro suddenly a better player than them because they have won a GSL? Of course not. Consistent results are way better than just looking at one tournament and saying oh well you haven't won it so you consistently doing extremely well in it doesn't matter and consistently doing extremely well everywhere else doesn't matter. | ||
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ANLProbe
667 Posts
On November 13 2014 21:15 The_Red_Viper wrote: Cause he never won a tournament where you can prepare for your opponent? Taeja is a great player, one of the best the game has seen for sure, but he still lacks a GSL title (or even wcs one). Next year he will have the chance to win one (with the new spotv league even more than ever) Taeja vs SoO and Taeja vs Inno were both preparation formats. | ||
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Zealously
East Gorteau22261 Posts
On November 14 2014 02:03 ANLProbe wrote: Taeja vs SoO and Taeja vs Inno were both preparation formats. I mean, technically he isn't wrong - Taeja didn't win the tournament. I agree that discrediting him because he didn't win it (it would imply that soO is also shit because he never wins preparation tourneys either) is stupid. | ||
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On November 14 2014 01:53 bourne117 wrote: Except Taeja hasn't been in GSL to actually try since HoTS came out and when he was he was consistently performing despite being having to battle against arguable the most imbalanced time in SC2. You can certainly argue that his lack of success in WCS AM is the same thing except almost all of his failures in WCS AM have been during the ro8 onwards where it is more like a weekend tournament again instead of a GSL style where you can prepare. Why does this whole he lacks a GSL title thing always come up with Taeja? GSLs are incredibly hard to win and there aren't exactly a lot of them making using them as a great indicator of a players strength less than ideal because one bad series and suddenly 1/3rd of the year is lost in terms of GSLs. Rain hasn't won a GSL. Innovation was the consensus best player in the world last year despite never winning. Soo hasn't won one either. Are those players suddenly of lesser quality because of this? Of course not. Is Sniper or roro suddenly a better player than them because they have won a GSL? Of course not. Consistent results are way better than just looking at one tournament and saying oh well you haven't won it so you consistently doing extremely well in it doesn't matter and consistently doing extremely well everywhere else doesn't matter. I don't say it doesn't matter. I also don't say that one gsl win is worth more than what taeja does. But the fact that taeja never won a wcs tournament despite his countless other tournament might imply that he isn't suited for these tournaments. Basically i am just saying that i don't feel comfortable calling him the best terran in the world when he "only" wins weekend tournaments where a lot of hard opponents are missing or can't really prepare for him. That doesn't mean that his achievements aren't worth anything, my statement isn't that black and white I certainly think he is a top 3 terran for sure, at least most of the time^^ On November 14 2014 02:05 Zealously wrote: I mean, technically he isn't wrong - Taeja didn't win the tournament. I agree that discrediting him because he didn't win it (it would imply that soO is also shit because he never wins preparation tourneys either) is stupid. I don't discredit him, at least i don't want to. I just don't agree with people calling him the best terran in the world when all his achievements so far are pretty much in one style of tournament. Missing a lot of great players. People always mention he won like 11 tournaments or something like that, but a lot of these tournaments weren't THAT stacked tbh (even when he won vs one or two s class players in them, that isn't really enough in code s for example) | ||
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Zealously
East Gorteau22261 Posts
Edit: wrong player name | ||
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Shellshock
United States97277 Posts
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The_Red_Viper
19533 Posts
On November 14 2014 02:26 Zealously wrote: But then, for fairness, we must also turn the argument around. How well has Innovation done in the tournaments Taeja has dominated this year? How about Classic? If we want to put weight on being able to handle both, the GSL experts need to suit up and perform at weekend tournaments as well. Edit: wrong player name Yeah sure. These types of tournaments are just completely different, the best player should do well in both. It is just that people usually focus more on the korean tournaments cause of the competition. | ||
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Shellshock
United States97277 Posts
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Caladan
Germany1238 Posts
That said, I agree most of the times with PR.  | ||
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phantomfive
Korea (South)404 Posts
On November 13 2014 08:38 Mistakes wrote: Why the fuck is TaeJa always so high on everything ever? TT Have you seen Taeja play? That's why. | ||
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Bagration
United States18282 Posts
On November 13 2014 15:39 Zealously wrote: I don't think placing MMA at #6 for beating the players he did and getting absolutely crushed by Life is terribly biased. Would you rate him above soO or Zest after Blizzcon? For me, the answer was no - he impressed me, but not that much. My reasoning is this: Up until the finals, MMA beat each of his opponents by a comfortable margin (3-1 each time), and his opponents weren't exactly walkovers - Bomber was pegged as a big contender, and Classic is no slouch either. Secondly, MMA didn't exactly come out of nowhere for Blizzcon. He won 2 Premier tournaments (Dreamhack and WCS EU) in the months right before Blizzcon - overall he's had a very good fall. I don't think that Life at #1 is wrong, but the reasoning is inconsistent - if Life can be #1 from one good tournament, why does MMA need 3 good showings and only gets #6? Ultimately, ability is one thing, but accomplishments when it matters is also very important. soO and Zest FAILED at Blizzcon. When it came down to the wire, they came up short. | ||
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meshfusion
Russian Federation232 Posts
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