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On March 15 2014 02:59 Zaqwe wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 02:58 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 02:56 Smaug.GR wrote:
if it was really not soundproof and the crowd gave it away I would react like him. The LoL players (sitting in identical booths but with larger crowds) have voiced no concerns and the other SC2 players have raised no complaints either. And nobody mentioned GOM's soundproofing issue until Jinro. Turns out people not whistleblowing isn't an indicator of anything other than people's reluctance to be whistleblowers.
When GOM's soundproofing issue came up they fixed it, because it was true.
When Naniwa's soundproofing issue came up they tested the booths, checked with other events (with a louder crowd), discovered he was full of shit and published that via twitter.
I don't see the comparison. Jinro discovered something real, and Naniwa abandoned his fans and took a shit all over the very idea of competition.
The fallacy with whistle-blowing is that the whistle-blower is always telling the truth. Usually, after a whistle is blown, it compels others to tell the truth, and it then corroborates with what the whistle-blower says . This is not one of those situations. This was just a guy who wanted out. Let him go, and be careful patting him on the back, lest you reinforce this behaviour even more.
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Is anybody gonna be starting a thread like this about Taeja next?
Another guy giving a middle finger to the crowd and viewers
Pretty sad to see these "professionals" show up to a $100k tournament that hundreds of others would love to be at and they don't give a F**K
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Glad he got boo'd out. Deserves it for being a little shit like that my god he should have forfeited before hand and let another player take his place.
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naniwa just has been lacking the overall mindset which is required to be successful in the long run in any competitive environment. If he really wants to end his career as one of the most promising foreign talents in SC2 that way, it's best for all of us to quickly forget about him and move on. No tears to be shed, it's just a waste of time, no need to give him any more attention for his bitchy behaviour.
Sad for IEM production and audience, though, that spot could have been used in a better way, after all.
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Lets put forward a situation.
Game 7, of the final finals. $100k on the line. 3-3.
You cannot cheese because the crowd will give it away.
This tournament being winner takes all, I have no problem with.
This tournament being winner takes all with no soundproofing, meaning the crowd can screw over a player? That's ABSURD.
Too right Naniwa walks off. They took a slightly off-beat idea some people weren't keen on. Then they made it REALLY FUCKING STUPID by letting the crowd fuck things up. It's winner takes all. Why are you letting the crowd decide who wins?
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On March 15 2014 03:09 BigFan wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 03:02 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:55 Whatson wrote:On March 15 2014 02:54 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 HellNino wrote:On March 15 2014 02:51 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:49 Whatson wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:43 Whatson wrote:On March 15 2014 02:14 Gr33d wrote:
[quote]
With ESL history of not-so-perfect tournament conditions I would not rule out a sound issue. It would not be the first time players can hear the crowd / casters, especially if it gets realy loud. Naniwa was in the booth and heard the crowd. So he says. There's no reason to believe he is lying. In fact if there were no soundproofing issue he would have no way to know there was noise. QED. It's impossible for him to be lying. or maybe he lies to save what rest of his reputation? If all the other people that played/tested the booth didnt hear a thing, then maybe the liar is the only guy arguing otherwise? Won't miss the guy. He would have no way to know there was noise, unless he heard noise. Either he is psychic or there's a soundproofing issue. LOL there's a crowd. Of course there'll be noise. It's really not that hard of a conclusion to make. On March 15 2014 02:55 Chewbacca. wrote:On March 15 2014 02:54 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 HellNino wrote:On March 15 2014 02:51 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:49 Whatson wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 Zaqwe wrote:Naniwa was in the booth and heard the crowd. So he says. There's no reason to believe he is lying. In fact if there were no soundproofing issue he would have no way to know there was noise. QED. It's impossible for him to be lying. or maybe he lies to save what rest of his reputation? If all the other people that played/tested the booth didnt hear a thing, then maybe the liar is the only guy arguing otherwise? Won't miss the guy. He would have no way to know there was noise, unless he heard noise. Either he is psychic or there's a soundproofing issue. Or maybe he realizes that the crowd has always cheered when they see stuff like proxies from the very first SC tournaments? On March 15 2014 02:57 BigFan wrote:On March 15 2014 02:54 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 HellNino wrote:On March 15 2014 02:51 Zaqwe wrote:On March 15 2014 02:49 Whatson wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 Zaqwe wrote:Naniwa was in the booth and heard the crowd. So he says. There's no reason to believe he is lying. In fact if there were no soundproofing issue he would have no way to know there was noise. QED. It's impossible for him to be lying. or maybe he lies to save what rest of his reputation? If all the other people that played/tested the booth didnt hear a thing, then maybe the liar is the only guy arguing otherwise? Won't miss the guy. He would have no way to know there was noise, unless he heard noise. Either he is psychic or there's a soundproofing issue. you realize that it's a live event, right? cmon, no need to make excuses for him. If other players complained about sound issues, then I would agree with you but he's the only one to complain. It was obvious that he was trying to just get out of IEM using that as an excuse. Pretty poor on his part. That would be quite the gamble. If there was no spike in crowd volume at the time he would end up humiliated and outed as a liar.Yet there's no payoff if he wins the gamble. So why would he take that gamble? But hey, don't let common sense get in the way of your mindless Naniwa hatred. what? how? how is he humiliated if he says he heard noise when there wasn't? If he doesn't care about doing probe rushes and causing fans to rage, I doubt he cares about something like that. You're sugarcoating this whole volume excuse way too much >.> I'm not a naniwa fan or hater so I don't have any reason to be bias against him. Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 03:05 iLikeRain wrote:
I'm pretty sure that Naniwa heard or felt something related to the crowd. Whether it made a difference in Polt's actions or not in my mind is completely irrelevant; Naniwa thought it made a difference. I'm not particularly fond of Naniwa but if I was in a bad place, tired of the game and suddenly you feel the organizers can't properly isolate the booths I'd be pretty pissed as well. You're all acting like this is super shocking or something, he clearly didn't feel like completing the games. Would a 0-3 demolish make you feel better, like really? there's a difference between you know and you feel. This was just a way for him to leave the tourney without playing the rest of the games. That's my theory based on the timing of it.
He would be caught in an outrageous and embarrassing lie. It's not a gamble anyone would take. The payoff is nonexistant and the loss would be huge.
He correctly identified the noise because he heard it. That's the only rational explanation.
It has already been established the soundproofing had no impact on the game as Polt used the same scouting pattern as always and didn't change anything in reaction to the noise. So I don't care about the "excuse" at all.
I am just calling people out on the fact that their irrational hatred of Naniwa is causing them to call him a liar when common sense suggests he is not lying.
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this is actually a good thing, we need more drama 
and to you guys saying that sc2 is dead -> take the Naniwa road, you wont be missed
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On March 15 2014 03:03 pms wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 02:53 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:40 Dismay wrote:On March 15 2014 02:39 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:32 Ansinjunger wrote:
If it's true Naniwa said he took the spot to take advantage of the hotel, that's pretty dishonest. He's shown quite a bit of disregard for fans/his fans. I don't know why people are defending him. That's not to say he's unforgivable--that goes too far, but right now, he's wronged the audience and there's no point making excuses. I don't understand people like you. You think that you deserve something, because of what exactly? Because you seat in the front of computer watching? Who are you? Naniwa earned whatever he had. He wanted to win and only to win. There is only one God in tournaments like that. It's the competition. Naniwa was giving all to the competition. What the hell gave you??? He certainly gave his all today. Your memory is one-day long or what? Pathetic crybabies in the audience need to eat today, so they will trash whoever doesn't deliver them food. It's hilarious to see people hoarding like sheep. From one fan to another, are you actually defending Naniwa's actions today (or the last week)? He has rights to do whatever he likes and I'm laughing at everybody who thinks differently. That's because he earned what he had. You guys earned nothing. I don't know what happened today or in the last month with Naniwa, but I'm definitively not going to jump on the same wagon as all the people who are so fast to judge Naniwa and to take away his spot from IEM and his contributions to SC2 competitions. What the heck? If the audience is so important then why they don't choose the players for the tournaments themselves? Guys, listen to yourself. Do you hear the ridiculousness?
They agreed to the players the moment they paid for the tickets for the show. And he robbed them of the show they wanted to watch. And without the audience there would be no e-sports = no Naniwa.
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See to what it has come Blizzard. Your game is shit boring to play.
Doesn't justify this dick move though.
User was warned for this post
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On March 15 2014 03:13 Roman666 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 03:03 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:40 Dismay wrote:On March 15 2014 02:39 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:32 Ansinjunger wrote:
If it's true Naniwa said he took the spot to take advantage of the hotel, that's pretty dishonest. He's shown quite a bit of disregard for fans/his fans. I don't know why people are defending him. That's not to say he's unforgivable--that goes too far, but right now, he's wronged the audience and there's no point making excuses. I don't understand people like you. You think that you deserve something, because of what exactly? Because you seat in the front of computer watching? Who are you? Naniwa earned whatever he had. He wanted to win and only to win. There is only one God in tournaments like that. It's the competition. Naniwa was giving all to the competition. What the hell gave you??? He certainly gave his all today. Your memory is one-day long or what? Pathetic crybabies in the audience need to eat today, so they will trash whoever doesn't deliver them food. It's hilarious to see people hoarding like sheep. From one fan to another, are you actually defending Naniwa's actions today (or the last week)? He has rights to do whatever he likes and I'm laughing at everybody who thinks differently. That's because he earned what he had. You guys earned nothing. I don't know what happened today or in the last month with Naniwa, but I'm definitively not going to jump on the same wagon as all the people who are so fast to judge Naniwa and to take away his spot from IEM and his contributions to SC2 competitions. What the heck? If the audience is so important then why they don't choose the players for the tournaments themselves? Guys, listen to yourself. Do you hear the ridiculousness? They agreed to the players the moment they paid for the tickets for the show. And he robbed them of the show they wanted to watch. And without the audience there would be no e-sports = no Naniwa.
They get to make the show. Winner takes all and they can decide who wins. They got what they paid for, Naniwa just made sure they know what they can get. The choice of who wins $100k.
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Either way, whether there were/are soundproofing issues or not, it doesn't even matter (in the context of his behaviour), since Polt had already sent the SCV. Naniwa is unprofessional and contrary to the opinion of some people he HAS an obligation to be entertaining for fans (especially if they pay for tickets), even if it is for selfish reasons. You are/were a professional player on a team, tournaments and teams need money, money comes from sponsors, sponsors come from fan-interest which comes from... being either one of the godliest players or entertaining. Forfeiting a series when you allegedly haven't practiced makes you neither interesting through skill nor entertainment value - unless you are into car-wrecks.
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So much hate in this thread. Naniwa was entirely within his rights to do what he did. You can disagree with the decision, but if he raised an issue with the admin and the admin (presumably) failed or refused to resolve it to his satisfaction, forfeiting isn't all that unreasonable.
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On March 15 2014 03:09 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 03:03 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:40 Dismay wrote:On March 15 2014 02:39 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:32 Ansinjunger wrote:
If it's true Naniwa said he took the spot to take advantage of the hotel, that's pretty dishonest. He's shown quite a bit of disregard for fans/his fans. I don't know why people are defending him. That's not to say he's unforgivable--that goes too far, but right now, he's wronged the audience and there's no point making excuses. I don't understand people like you. You think that you deserve something, because of what exactly? Because you seat in the front of computer watching? Who are you? Naniwa earned whatever he had. He wanted to win and only to win. There is only one God in tournaments like that. It's the competition. Naniwa was giving all to the competition. What the hell gave you??? He certainly gave his all today. Your memory is one-day long or what? Pathetic crybabies in the audience need to eat today, so they will trash whoever doesn't deliver them food. It's hilarious to see people hoarding like sheep. From one fan to another, are you actually defending Naniwa's actions today (or the last week)? He has rights to do whatever he likes and I'm laughing at everybody who thinks differently. That's because he earned what he had. You guys earned nothing. I don't know what happened today or in the last month with Naniwa, but I'm definitively not going to jump on the same wagon as all the people who are so fast to judge Naniwa and to take away his spot from IEM and his contributions to SC2 competitions. What the heck? If the audience is so important then why they don't choose the players for the tournaments themselves? Guys, listen to yourself. Do you hear the ridiculousness? I was a fan until last week because of the contributions you talk about. He's played stunningly awesome games against a wide array of top opponents and made me scream and shout and jump with glee, but I can't support the kind of unsportsmanlike bullshit Naniwa pulled today. That makes me really sad, but it's how I - and a lot of others - feel. Naniwa is not above criticism because he has done well in the past.
You were always making a bad image of Naniwa, now you claim that you were a fan?
The competition is above it all, and so is Naniwa, because he's just a servant of competition. The competition is and always was the first. Fans are just the second.
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On March 15 2014 03:17 pms wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 03:09 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 03:03 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:40 Dismay wrote:On March 15 2014 02:39 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:32 Ansinjunger wrote:
If it's true Naniwa said he took the spot to take advantage of the hotel, that's pretty dishonest. He's shown quite a bit of disregard for fans/his fans. I don't know why people are defending him. That's not to say he's unforgivable--that goes too far, but right now, he's wronged the audience and there's no point making excuses. I don't understand people like you. You think that you deserve something, because of what exactly? Because you seat in the front of computer watching? Who are you? Naniwa earned whatever he had. He wanted to win and only to win. There is only one God in tournaments like that. It's the competition. Naniwa was giving all to the competition. What the hell gave you??? He certainly gave his all today. Your memory is one-day long or what? Pathetic crybabies in the audience need to eat today, so they will trash whoever doesn't deliver them food. It's hilarious to see people hoarding like sheep. From one fan to another, are you actually defending Naniwa's actions today (or the last week)? He has rights to do whatever he likes and I'm laughing at everybody who thinks differently. That's because he earned what he had. You guys earned nothing. I don't know what happened today or in the last month with Naniwa, but I'm definitively not going to jump on the same wagon as all the people who are so fast to judge Naniwa and to take away his spot from IEM and his contributions to SC2 competitions. What the heck? If the audience is so important then why they don't choose the players for the tournaments themselves? Guys, listen to yourself. Do you hear the ridiculousness? I was a fan until last week because of the contributions you talk about. He's played stunningly awesome games against a wide array of top opponents and made me scream and shout and jump with glee, but I can't support the kind of unsportsmanlike bullshit Naniwa pulled today. That makes me really sad, but it's how I - and a lot of others - feel. Naniwa is not above criticism because he has done well in the past. You were always making a bad image of Naniwa, now you claim that you were a fan? The competition is above it all, and so is Naniwa, because he's just a servant of competition. The competition is and always was the first. Fans are just the second.
Without fans there will be no competition. Who will organize events which no one will want to watch?
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On March 15 2014 03:19 Roman666 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 03:17 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 03:09 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 03:03 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:40 Dismay wrote:On March 15 2014 02:39 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:32 Ansinjunger wrote:
If it's true Naniwa said he took the spot to take advantage of the hotel, that's pretty dishonest. He's shown quite a bit of disregard for fans/his fans. I don't know why people are defending him. That's not to say he's unforgivable--that goes too far, but right now, he's wronged the audience and there's no point making excuses. I don't understand people like you. You think that you deserve something, because of what exactly? Because you seat in the front of computer watching? Who are you? Naniwa earned whatever he had. He wanted to win and only to win. There is only one God in tournaments like that. It's the competition. Naniwa was giving all to the competition. What the hell gave you??? He certainly gave his all today. Your memory is one-day long or what? Pathetic crybabies in the audience need to eat today, so they will trash whoever doesn't deliver them food. It's hilarious to see people hoarding like sheep. From one fan to another, are you actually defending Naniwa's actions today (or the last week)? He has rights to do whatever he likes and I'm laughing at everybody who thinks differently. That's because he earned what he had. You guys earned nothing. I don't know what happened today or in the last month with Naniwa, but I'm definitively not going to jump on the same wagon as all the people who are so fast to judge Naniwa and to take away his spot from IEM and his contributions to SC2 competitions. What the heck? If the audience is so important then why they don't choose the players for the tournaments themselves? Guys, listen to yourself. Do you hear the ridiculousness? I was a fan until last week because of the contributions you talk about. He's played stunningly awesome games against a wide array of top opponents and made me scream and shout and jump with glee, but I can't support the kind of unsportsmanlike bullshit Naniwa pulled today. That makes me really sad, but it's how I - and a lot of others - feel. Naniwa is not above criticism because he has done well in the past. You were always making a bad image of Naniwa, now you claim that you were a fan? The competition is above it all, and so is Naniwa, because he's just a servant of competition. The competition is and always was the first. Fans are just the second. Without fans there will be no competition. Who will organize events which no one will want to watch?
Let's face it. Competition is first. People want to compete even if there is no fans.
Then, if you want to have money in the competition, then you need to add the second component, i.e., fans.
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Zaqwe is not using common sense really though... Just because he heard the crowd, that means that there is a widespread soundproofing issue?
It couldn't have been that his headphones weren't seated quite right or any number of things that were in his control that could affect the soundproofing. What are the people at IEM to do? Inspect how you place your headphones on your head and do noise testing before you let the player play?
Naniwa displays no respect for the game or e-sports. Yes, he earned his spot and he has the right to do whatever he wants, but that doesn't make the actions warranted or proper. Can't expect people to be respectful to him when he acts that way.
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Thats really shitty way to end ones SC2 career.
BURN ALL BRIDGES !!! BURN!!! lol
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On March 15 2014 03:17 pms wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2014 03:09 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 03:03 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:53 Zealously wrote:On March 15 2014 02:46 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:40 Dismay wrote:On March 15 2014 02:39 pms wrote:On March 15 2014 02:32 Ansinjunger wrote:
If it's true Naniwa said he took the spot to take advantage of the hotel, that's pretty dishonest. He's shown quite a bit of disregard for fans/his fans. I don't know why people are defending him. That's not to say he's unforgivable--that goes too far, but right now, he's wronged the audience and there's no point making excuses. I don't understand people like you. You think that you deserve something, because of what exactly? Because you seat in the front of computer watching? Who are you? Naniwa earned whatever he had. He wanted to win and only to win. There is only one God in tournaments like that. It's the competition. Naniwa was giving all to the competition. What the hell gave you??? He certainly gave his all today. Your memory is one-day long or what? Pathetic crybabies in the audience need to eat today, so they will trash whoever doesn't deliver them food. It's hilarious to see people hoarding like sheep. From one fan to another, are you actually defending Naniwa's actions today (or the last week)? He has rights to do whatever he likes and I'm laughing at everybody who thinks differently. That's because he earned what he had. You guys earned nothing. I don't know what happened today or in the last month with Naniwa, but I'm definitively not going to jump on the same wagon as all the people who are so fast to judge Naniwa and to take away his spot from IEM and his contributions to SC2 competitions. What the heck? If the audience is so important then why they don't choose the players for the tournaments themselves? Guys, listen to yourself. Do you hear the ridiculousness? I was a fan until last week because of the contributions you talk about. He's played stunningly awesome games against a wide array of top opponents and made me scream and shout and jump with glee, but I can't support the kind of unsportsmanlike bullshit Naniwa pulled today. That makes me really sad, but it's how I - and a lot of others - feel. Naniwa is not above criticism because he has done well in the past. You were always making a bad image of Naniwa, now you claim that you were a fan? The competition is above it all, and so is Naniwa, because he's just a servant of competition. The competition is and always was the first. Fans are just the second.
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/334324-were-not-all-nationalists (written two years ago)
I know you were upset about the way I wrote Naniwa's Road to Blizzcon entry, but please cut the bullshit about me not being a fan. You're so far off you're making yourself look like a fool. I am a fan and I have been for years - that you think otherwise does not make it so.
Also, you say that competition is above all, and yet you think it's fine when Naniwa spits in the face of competition by throwing game one, complaining about a non-issue and then forfeiting? What kind of competition is that?
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On March 15 2014 03:11 VasHeR wrote:
Is anybody gonna be starting a thread like this about Taeja next?
Another guy giving a middle finger to the crowd and viewers
Pretty sad to see these "professionals" show up to a $100k tournament that hundreds of others would love to be at and they don't give a F**K
There is a huge difference between what Taeja and naniwa did.
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EPT
