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Code S - Ro16 Group D Preview (Season 3) - Page 6

Forum Index > SC2 General
104 CommentsPost a Reply
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Caladan
Profile Joined May 2008
Germany1238 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-09-29 23:43:56
September 29 2013 23:27 GMT
#101
Gotta agree to that.

The point in SC2 is that it's so fragile that very often not the better player wins, but the winner is determined by luck (best example: this close group). The skill ceiling in SC2 is reached by all the top players, and minor mistakes, random stuff like scouting luck or build order luck decide the games and often whole careers.
Flash has yet to improve, yes, but it's not his fault alone. How many "upsets" have been happening in the last months of SC2? It's the common thing in SC2 to happen.

A fact is: A top SC2 player can often lose to a worse player. Substantially more often than for example in Chess or also Starcraft:Broodwar.

Look at WCS EU. Three seasons and three times almost all new RO8 players. It's like shuffeling, luck and minor things.

For the best player to mostly win there needs to be a higher skill ceiling and more possibilities to come back. It's just not there yet in SC2 gameplay-wise - as all the results have shown the last year - and probably will never be, according to Blizzard.

And that all is in my opinion the prime reason for SC2's decline. The crowd wants heroes winning, it wants them to do things that normal players never could do (like thinking 8 moves ahead in chess or doing perfect storms in broodwar), and it wants comebacks to happen. All those things are rather seldom in SC2. But why am I writing this... 3 years ago we told Blizzard exactly this and nothing changed.
opterown *
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
Australia54784 Posts
September 29 2013 23:37 GMT
#102
On September 30 2013 08:04 lifecanwait wrote:
Guys you should stop blaming the players on everything.

Do you actually still play this game? Do you play highest level? No? Then you don't have much clue.
Like Flash said in an interview, sc2 is so very different from bw. A slight mistake can cause you the game immediately. There are often no comebacks, just all-ins if players are smelling blood.
The whole game feels so fragile. In a BW match, you could fight on multiple fronts. There was 1000 x more strategy involved... Move your forces in the right way, get in position, flank, arch.
Now this is also coming more and more in sc2, but in how many matches can we acutally see this? 1/8 maybe. Most matches are actually quite boring especially lately in GSL.

And thanks to David Kim it is too late to 'change the pace' of the game. I will keep watching the highest level play but in terms of strategy this is just not the game I was looking forward to. The faster pace makes it even more reliant on APM and less on strategy. Mechanics is key, thinking is not necessary. Imho that's why a lot of the BW players are loosing vs the new sc2 pros. It's not tactics, it's not lack of strategy or game understanding. Sc2 is not hard to understand. It is lack of mechanics and fragility or pace of the game.

bro if you don't play at the highest level I don't think you can make any of these claims either rofl
ModeratorRetired LR Bonjwa
TL+ Member
Crowz
Profile Joined September 2013
4 Posts
September 30 2013 00:42 GMT
#103
On September 30 2013 04:58 H0i wrote:

You can watch them here for free: http://www.twitch.tv/wcs_gsl/profile

Just make sure to hover over the video names and find the right order, because the order is a bit shuffled.


Thank you very much!!
mostwanted
Profile Joined March 2011
83 Posts
September 30 2013 02:38 GMT
#104
I agree that SC2 skill cap level has been reached

That explains why a tiny mistake is so intolerable and luck, blind counter builds play major role in MU
It wasn't the case with BW.
I am not playing this game enough to tell how but Blizzard needs to get more feedback from the pro seriously.
NA BNET forum is the worst place to get feedback on balance etc.

ASK those who play this for living and redesign this game in LoTV, you Blizzard only has 1 chance left.
Please make it worthy successor of BW
Scarecrow
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Korea (South)9174 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-09-30 03:13:31
September 30 2013 02:56 GMT
#105
On September 30 2013 08:04 lifecanwait wrote:
The faster pace makes it even more reliant on APM and less on strategy. Mechanics is key, thinking is not necessary. Imho that's why a lot of the BW players are loosing vs the new sc2 pros. It's not tactics, it's not lack of strategy or game understanding. Sc2 is not hard to understand. It is lack of mechanics...

I'm a big fan of the BW players but seriously just read what you wrote and notice how retarded you sound. The BW players are losing due to a lack of mechanics? A lack of APM? SC2 requires far less. Mechanics is the main thing they've got going for them and the reason many struggle is that their mechanics used to carry them whereas strategic geniuses and micro/engagement specialists with inferior mechanics can now compete in SC2.
Yhamm is the god of predictions
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