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Hi Teamliquid,
First lets start off with a poll:
Poll: Do you use the "Select all army units" button regularly?No, not at all (417) 49% Yes, continiously to manage my army (231) 27% Only to select my army units during panic situations (211) 25% 859 total votes Your vote: Do you use the "Select all army units" button regularly? (Vote): Only to select my army units during panic situations
(Vote): Yes, continiously to manage my army
(Vote): No, not at all
Army management
I, myself am currently using the 'select all army units" button (now to be known as SAAUB) to manage my army. For example:
- 50 zerglings
- 20 banelings
- 15 mutalisks just hatched.
I would click that button, ctrl-click the mutalisks and put them on a seperate control group.
Then I would click the SAAUB button again, shift+ctrl click the mutalisks (to remove them from the list) and add my remaining units to a seperate control group.
I am only a low masters (1800pts, around 1400MMR) and I am quite sure that a lot of other lower leagued people also have issues with proper army management.
This SAAUB button is really a big savior, and after some polling/questioning around, I found that a lot of people actually use them as described above.
I know that the alternative way is to ctrl-click the morphing eggs and to shift-click them to your army. But this is a very tedious task, especially when you're in the midst of battle etc.
And terran/protoss can't do that, they have to actually rally their units somewhere.
The problem
The current problem I found is the following:
- Overseers are added to that SAAUB button, I often use overseers as static detection at every single one of my hatcheries, and I want them to stay there, not join in.
- Units at a watchtower, I also want them to stay put
- A burrowed move-able unit at a proxy to-be expansion. I want that unit to continue blocking the expansion, rather than walking back to me (e.g. an infestor or roach with roach burrow movement)
- stray lings across the map for vision in general
Now all of the above units will also be added when using that button.
The suggestion
What I would love to see is a way to un-flag army units, as army units. So that they will no longer be selectable by the SAAUB button, this will create a much smoother experience for those using that button.
Imagine the smoothness of being able to unflag that zergling at the watch tower and the overseers above your bases, while happily using that button for some serious management.
Advice?
If anyone has any advice in regards to army control with (or without?) that button, please do join in.
I am currently curious about who uses the SAAUB button, and why and when, and who doesn't. whether it's a large or just a minor part of the community, keep the votes coming.
Regards,
Kaluro
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yes I use it from time to time. It does more good then bad, but some of it's aspects are annoying.
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static d sucks at defending drops, leaving lings/bling at bases to defend drops and then at some point in the game hit the button to prevent having to go to every base or selecting every group
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Don't even have it keybinded, never once used it.
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I use F2 as a location hotkey so no. I would feel pretty retarded using that button anyway and since you will in most cases leave units to defend drops etc so it doesn't seem very useful.
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
As Zerg, I always bind all my eggs and units into groups. So I don't need that "Select army" button.
I also use F1-F2-F3 for unit abilities, like spawn larva or fungal growth
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I do a mix of eggs hotkeying and the method you did explain.
Never use the -select all units- key to move my army or attack, since it mess up all the spotters/drop defense units.
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I always forget about that one lol
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I rebound it away from F2, but I will click on it often in early game to regroup my army when I can.
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They need to make it so that units on "hold position" don't move when you press it, then it might actually be useful. I hate when I have air units to intercept drops and they come join in with my ground army, really dumb
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Yes. I'm slow so it's quite useful.
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I use it too much, I click it all the time and continiously stim my units, I just wanna stim the ones rallying but I stim the ones at front aswell.
Also very annoying when you drop etc,
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Hm as zerg you should be control clicking the eggs when you make army units and adding them to the appropriate control group, instead of just letting them idle at the rally point. Then you wouldn't have to use the SAAUB to grab mutas, for instance.
Unflagging units from a button is what control groups are for. I guess my point is: If you want to control two or three groups of army separately, control groups live up to their namesake. SAAUB was made for people who would just walk around with one control group all game anyways.
Imagine the smoothness of being able to unflag that zergling at the watch tower and the overseers above your bases, while happily using that button for some serious management.
Sounds exactly like the smoothness and facility of control groups. Deselecting a single zergling from your ctrl+1 would take the same amount of commands as deselecting it from select all army units.
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Norway839 Posts
Yes. It's great for finding high-tech units, especially 'lost' vipers and overseers -
Another great use is for basetrade-situations where you need a complete overview of your army.
Also it's good to use with ctrl-click to double-check that you have all your mutas in the control group, for example.
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I use it, but I feel like it's put me in a bad habit. It's very useful for things like allin's if you're not used to shift-clicking your eggs into control groups, and for panic situations, but I have definitely over-relied on it much too often.
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the reason why I dont use it is becuase
it mixes up with my "Drop/Harassment" group.
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i'm personally big on map presence/awareness, and if i use it, all my lings at the watchtowers and possible future bases rejoin my army, and i have to put them all out again. its kind of annoying.
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I find it useful. I have control groups of course. But Sometimes you just need to select your whole army at once to deal with something. I also will use it to just collect my whole army together in one spot. Sometimes for example I might find myself with marine packs around my base just to deflect mutas or drops or whatever. And when I am ready to move out I push out onto the map.
Also a little edit note cause I know there will be that one guy who says you are a noob if you use it. My response is: It is built into the game and if it makes your life easier during a stressful match use it. No need to feel ashamed of it, what matters is that you find a way to win and you have fun.
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I think a good idea would be unit on hold position don't get selected. That way you can put overseers on hold, units at watch towers on hold. High templars on hold. Small groups of marines on hold at an expansion and none of them will get selected with the select all button.
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I do because i hotkey my eggs and now its a super unit hotkey adder. I press it (space bar) and then deselect things i dont need and a move. Makes my life easier.
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I freaking blame it on the campaign. Playing zerg, it was easy to A-move and I got used to it and brought it into playing it online.
I would have used the select all army and move with 2-4 used as colli/spellcasters, MSC and obs. So I could still micro them individually.
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My friend who just got this game uses this as his only army hotkey and his army control is god aweful (as we all were when we started out)
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I do from time to time so i don't leave iddle some of the stuff because i forget it.
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I think most people don't use it, but I suck so its my favorite button since HOTS launch. Pretty useful to just hit f2 then cntrl+click a certain unit to select all of your mutas for instance. If you are lazy like me just F2 -->AMOVE
The morphing baneling/overseer patch screws up how I use it but not a big change.
Also if overseers are excluded then your army will have no detection with it so there is no good way to do this 
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One thing that could help with the "don't select the ling at the naga"-issue could be not to select units that are on hold position. That way you could leave a ling at a tower, an overseer on an expand, etc. without having to change your controls all the time.
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On August 21 2013 06:21 TXRaunchy wrote:
I freaking blame it on the campaign. Playing zerg, it was easy to A-move and I got used to it and brought it into playing it online.
I would have used the select all army and move with 2-4 used as colli/spellcasters, MSC and obs. So I could still micro them individually.
LOL me too, I've been trying to hard to undo this bad habit. So many times I've pulled my marines away from the xel naga towers.
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i got it binded as ( . Del) key on num part. If needed i use my mouse hand thumb to click is since it's close. It's useful for surrounding with zerg (having like 3-4 groups of units to attack at once) or to find high tech units/ switch them to other control group
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It's somewhat useful early game when you have units spread around, and to collect units currently rallying. Sometimes I use it if I know there's some units I left somewhere, but I can't find them. It is also useful to say collect all vikings together, if they happen to be spread out to spot for drops, since you can select all units then tab thru and control click to select only 1 type of unit.
It's useful if you play a deathball type style, but if you prefer multipronged harass, map control and overall improvement, then this button is to be avoided.
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As a terran it's a great way of finding ghosts and ravens. And other tech units of course. It's great early game and in panic situations, or when I just wanna send everything to my opponent and I have all sorts of other stuff to take care of and I want to put off organising my control groups for a bit.
I have it bound to one of my mouse buttons. So I'm actually worse then 1a, I'm just a.
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Yup, use it all the time to just grab everything periodically and section off control groups from that, or when I go to move out with everything for a big attack.
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Never ever ever ever ever.
As terran I do not see the use as I always have a marine on a tower or at some pathway or a drop going somewhere and that button would just screw me over so hard if I used it.
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Oh yea and if all my rallies get fucked up for some reason it's really useful.
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I've used it several times mostly to hotkey my spell casters as Protoss or to find my MSC that I sometimes lose in the lategame because I don't find it as useful.
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It's essential. If you need your mutas or whatever out of the group just press ALT (what I have it binded to) and CTRL+click the mutas or whatever I want out of it and put them on a different key.
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Only when I know an all-in will win the game.
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i use it only to find my mothership core when i screw up my hotkeys and cant find it. sometimes when i lose my obs too. i think its useful
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I have it bound to space and it is extremely useful. Much easier to manage your whole army with one key instead of constantly having to assign every unit to different control groups. I then use the mouse wheel to cycle through the unit types and fire off abilities with A S D.
I still use Q and W as control groups for my raid groups though.
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If I am playing monobattles the select all button is my best friend, that is until drops come into the picture. Otherwise I never use it.
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Yeah I've rebound F2 to a location camera hotkey.
But I'd never use it anyway unless I'm going all-in, gotta have a zealot blocking the gap, HT/stalker squads for drops/mutas etc...
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It's actually extremely useful if you've split some units up beforehand and want to either reorganize or commit to a large attack.
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It is a function that helps new players, like the simplified command card and non-selection of non-friendly units. They are the new functions add to HOTS to help new players play.
So yes, it's very important for SC2, the hardest game in town.
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i like how people are still posting that it's useless or for newbies after Snute posted saying how useful he thinks it is... lol
it's fine if you don't use it, but i think we can stop with the "rah rah smash newbie friendly interface" rhetoric
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yes, i got into the habit of doing so. the sad thing is that my drop defense and observer positioing often time gets fucked up (or warpprisms i use).
i use it way too often tt
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On August 21 2013 07:29 Waise wrote:
i like how people are still posting that it's useless or for newbies after Snute posted saying how useful he thinks it is... lol
it's fine if you don't use it, but i think we can stop with the "rah rah smash newbie friendly interface" rhetoric
Yeah, Scarlett had a good chance of winning that game against dream if she only used it one time ^^. 2 Full energy infestors mang.
I never use it as protoss tho.
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I found it incredibly annoying, so much so that I unbound it. I have a tendency to keep a handful of units scattered about that don't participate in battles with my main army, so there's almost never a point where I would actually want to select every combat unit at once.
Also, adding exceptions to it would basically make it the same as any other hotkey. If you want your whole army sans a few select units on a hotkey, just put it on one.
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Canada8157 Posts
I use it multiple times every game
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Using it frequently on gateway pushes since I want all my army there together anyway.
Would love to dismiss observers from it though.
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I used it for a while, but not now. It is too cumbersome because of how it recalls every fighting unit - - and some are used for scouting.
Obviously it is designed to be a different key than a bound key, as assigning anything you want to whatever button is
already possible. So I was surprised that Blizzard did this. I think that anymore simplyfing is unnecessary.
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I don't even know what button it it lol.
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I only use it after recalling to a Nexus, since units mixes with probes. Other than that I use a diff control group for each type of unit.
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I use it for adding stray Units into my army when I macro too fast and miss the egg rally
diamond zerg
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hopefully they don't follow your suggestion and make this UI even more user friendly. It's already dumb enough that they added this, it just promotes a-moving and non-tactical play.
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It is very handy feature to find misplaced units whether it be observer, prism, ms core, burrow infestors, overseers, etc. These can be sometimes very hard to find, if they have been accidently unbound from command groups. But now with 'select army' you can find them almost instantly.
I have never used 'select all units' to attack with all to somewhere, but I have used it plenty of times for finding missing units or selecting all certain type of units (e.g. picking up just build certain type of units).
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Only when I'm zerg, and playing team games .
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On August 21 2013 07:19 larse wrote:
It is a function that helps new players, like the simplified command card and non-selection of non-friendly units. They are the new functions add to HOTS to help new players play.
So yes, it's very important for SC2, the hardest game in town.
+1.
its an example of Blizzard having its "ear to the ground" despite being a big company.
C&C also has a "select all army units" button.
its a great button 
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Talking about the "SAAUB button" is redundant. Like how "ATM machine" is redundant. ATM machine is engrained in the language now, but we still have the chance to save ourselves from "SAAUB button"!
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Use it primarily for base trades and want I want to execute a fast counter attack after a panicked situation. It's insanely useful. Those who don't utilize imo are putting themselves at a disadvantage.
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Select all army button is very useful for globally selecting all of a unit that you need to hotkey near your base. For example, ravens or infestors that just were produced, you can global select everything, control click your ravens, and then hotkey them.
Other than that, players should never use this because it will essentially atrophy you as a player.
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I do believe it is a useful key. It's very helpful for finding all your spellcasters and high tech stary units. But it does lend itself to bad habits which can be worked out of.
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I used to have the same problem, until I forced myself to stop using the SAAUB so often.
If you don't want to grab certain units (watchtower) you either have to:
1. Manually deselect them, (not terribly unreasonable if its once in a a while)
2. Get used to not relying on SAAUB.
Its much easier to manage units with SAAUB but the downside is sacrifice more complex unit controls such as patrolling units, watchtower, drops, scouts ect.
You have to choose whats more important at the particular situation. I think the better you get at always grouping units the less you will want to use the SAAUB, which should improve your game overall.
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I'm someone who does a lot of 10 Min stim +1attack +2 medivac push so i use F3 (yes i hotkeyed F3) to group them all and to push.
Otherwise i don't use it since my drops and static defense would move too.
The only time i would use it is panic mode where you need to absolutely get everything.
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I use it because i'm too lazy to actively add to control group newly produced units :o.
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I should start of by saying that I'm in silver league atm. I play zerg, and if I'm going for a game ending attack I often use the button to summon my whole army. Also early game when i only have a few units, and know where they are I use the button to easily grab them all for defense
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Dia zerg, not really except for when I know its the end of the game. Messes with my scouting lings and tower lings too much lol
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With the amount I get all-in'd, I use this button, or during other panic situations. It's getting to be a bad habit and really annoying when I take a guy off of a tower.
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I think it should be removed. It promotes carelessness, and I think the combination of all of these "ease of use" tweaks is partly (but only partly as the things like "terrible terrible damage" and warpgate are bigger offenders) responsible for the lower skill ceiling of this game and SC2 "drying out" in recent times.
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I'm the kind of player who likes to have a marine sitting at every expansion, watch tower, path of attack etc.
The button, therefore is a curse for me. I should never press it.
But I do. And I regret it almost straight away.
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The only time I ever use this is when I have lost track of one or more observers.
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I used it before, but i stopped because i was getting annoyed with my units leaving the watch tower, or 6 of my marines out on the map in a corner scouting for drops or in scouting paths to know where my oponent was joining my army leaving my map completely dark.
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Only when I'm playing Zerg, so yes.
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I rarely use it, it is in fact currently unbound so if I really need it (in those "I need to move out now or 30 secs later it won't matter" situations)
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I feel like i should use it.... but still haven't.
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On August 21 2013 13:13 vhapter wrote:
The only time I ever use this is when I have lost track of one or more observers.
only reason i use it ever as well
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I use this button quite often. When my army is split around bases for drop defense and my opponent is going for a full attack anywhere, I can use this button to quickly gather up armies. I have it hotkeyed to F5 as F1 to F4 are camera locations.
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It's handy for when you've genuinely lost a unit and can't find it, but otherwise no. Things are generally hotkey tied shortly after leaving their building.
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I'd like to see polls by race, please.
Personally I don't use it, except in very rare situations (when I'm sure that I don't have or need my movable scouting units to stay around the map). At first I even thought it's only for campaign noobs, but later reconsidered some aspects of it.
The most useful thing about it is to statically select all your high priority units of the same type (some of them may be lost) and reset their regular hotkey, but never move the whole army at once with it. I don't do that very often though, perhaps my multitasking isn't at that high level where you end up losing track of units around the map much.
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I shamefully admit that I use that damn button all the time. It is even still sitting on F2 because I can't bring myself to change it to 1...
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I would say trying to get better it's a bad habit to get into using an "all army" button. Developing ur APM is about grabbing units a lot and using this particular button defeats that.
If ur spending that much time just to pull ur army together then I don't think ur playing at a high enough level yet.
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I use it in late-game situations or when I have three control groups of units I need to get together in the mid-game. It's usually vs T where I'll have Templars warped in to defend my expansions or main base. If you get Terraned it's good to just be able to bring in two or three high energy Templars to where you're retreating.
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Yes, I'm Terran and I use it very often, the main reason being that Blizzard is too careless to introduce an attack-move rally point option, so I have to use the "select all army units" as a work-around UI gimmick to make sure new rallying units are issued the attack-move command. Obviously this command has many major drawbacks, for reasons already discussed. There are several ways to improve SC2s horrendous user interface if Blizzard wants to take notes:
1. "Select All Army Units" needs to be redesigned to "Select All Idle Army Units". It only selects army units that are idle (i.e: on stop command). Any army unit that has been issued a command, such as patrol, hold position, or following an attack command, holding watch tower, dropping etc. will not be selected. Most of your problem already solved.
2. Select All Idle Army Units + CTRL/Hotkey will now Select All Army Units regardless of what command they have been issued (i.e: the current SAAUB way).
3. Introduce a new hotkey, "Select All Army Units on Screen", this is self-explanatory and solves many problems in panic situations or allin defends, where you might want scattered on-screen army units to attack without pulling your whole army across the map.
4. Introduce a rally-point attack-move option. You do this by holding CTRL/hotkey + rallypoint. You can also use the SHIFT key to mix up "move + attack-move" rally paths.
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Russian Federation40190 Posts
On August 21 2013 18:30 Cheesologist wrote:
Yes, I'm Terran and I use it very often, the main reason being that Blizzard is too careless to introduce an attack-move rally point option, so I have to use the "select all army units" as a work-around UI gimmick to make sure new rallying units are issued the attack-move command. Obviously this command has many major drawbacks, for reasons already discussed. There are several ways to improve SC2s horrendous user interface if Blizzard wants to take notes:
1. "Select All Army Units" needs to be redesigned to "Select All Idle Army Units". It only selects army units that are idle (i.e: on stop command). Any army unit that has been issued a command, such as patrol, hold position, or following an attack command, holding watch tower, dropping etc. will not be selected. Most of your problem already solved.
2. Select All Idle Army Units + CTRL/Hotkey will now Select All Army Units regardless of what command they have been issued (i.e: the current SAAUB way).
3. Introduce a new hotkey, "Select All Army Units on Screen", this is self-explanatory and solves many problems in panic situations or allin defends, where you might want scattered on-screen army units to attack without pulling your whole army across the map.
4. Introduce a rally-point attack-move option. You do this by holding CTRL/hotkey + rallypoint. You can also use the SHIFT key to mix up "move + attack-move" rally paths.
May be introduce a AI playing instead of you? Your suggestions are the stuff, that is EASILY worked around (well, unless you are rallying units right into enemies' base :D) just by you know... using mouse.
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I use it way too much. It's pretty much a bad habit. I don't know if it's an OCD thing or what, but when defending, I especially have a habit of using it to make sure I'm attacking with all of my units, but it always causes me to move units I want going elsewhere... Basically anytime I'm doing an attack and feel I can't afford to possibly be forgetting some units here and there I find myself using it. Usually will deselect some units and then hotkey the group. Also good for selecting warp prisms/knowing when they have spawned.
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On August 21 2013 18:32 lolfail9001 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 21 2013 18:30 Cheesologist wrote:
Yes, I'm Terran and I use it very often, the main reason being that Blizzard is too careless to introduce an attack-move rally point option, so I have to use the "select all army units" as a work-around UI gimmick to make sure new rallying units are issued the attack-move command. Obviously this command has many major drawbacks, for reasons already discussed. There are several ways to improve SC2s horrendous user interface if Blizzard wants to take notes:
1. "Select All Army Units" needs to be redesigned to "Select All Idle Army Units". It only selects army units that are idle (i.e: on stop command). Any army unit that has been issued a command, such as patrol, hold position, or following an attack command, holding watch tower, dropping etc. will not be selected. Most of your problem already solved.
2. Select All Idle Army Units + CTRL/Hotkey will now Select All Army Units regardless of what command they have been issued (i.e: the current SAAUB way).
3. Introduce a new hotkey, "Select All Army Units on Screen", this is self-explanatory and solves many problems in panic situations or allin defends, where you might want scattered on-screen army units to attack without pulling your whole army across the map.
4. Introduce a rally-point attack-move option. You do this by holding CTRL/hotkey + rallypoint. You can also use the SHIFT key to mix up "move + attack-move" rally paths. May be introduce a AI playing instead of you? Your suggestions are the stuff, that is EASILY worked around (well, unless you are rallying units right into enemies' base :D) just by you know... using mouse.
Yeah. The game shouldn't be made any easier.
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i use it often because i am bad, it has its pros and cons: in an early game push i find it very useful but it messes up armies left on patrol in the main or units at watchtowers; most of all if i have a bio-tank composition hitting the SAAUB will highlight the siege ability of the tanks and in sudden engagement situations the fracion of a second it takes to hit tab and then stim the marines can cost you your whole army....
for this latter issue the only solution is to get used to separate control groups (although i would have to fuck up my hotkey placement that i am so used to now) but the idea to "flag out" single units that you want to stay put is really good!
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I think its great in certain situations, and pretty bad in others. As a zerg player, when im just trying to overrun someone with say, a roach max, this button is my friend. When im dealing with drops or anything tough, the button is an absolute no-go.
On a side note, life uses this button so its definatly not "only for noobs".
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On August 21 2013 18:32 lolfail9001 wrote:
May be introduce a AI playing instead of you? Your suggestions are the stuff, that is EASILY worked around (well, unless you are rallying units right into enemies' base :D) just by you know... using mouse.
Right, excellent point - you know, because creating a game that is user-friendly means that the user is doing absolutely nothing /sarcasm. You know, some of us would rather micro our main army during a fight instead of having to babysit rallied units that are being suicided into a clump of Mutas.
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On August 21 2013 05:33 kaluro wrote:
The suggestion
What I would love to see is a way to un-flag army units, as army units. So that they will no longer be selectable by the SAAUB button, this will create a much smoother experience for those using that button.
Imagine the smoothness of being able to unflag that zergling at the watch tower and the overseers above your bases, while happily using that button for some serious management.
Kaluro
Yes please!
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I use it when I mess up my hotkeys..
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I have on occasion used it. My most recent example being after a large bout of multitasking at several bases and eventually deciding to just screw it and try to "bop" the guy by a-moving all my shit to the back of his base. Surprisingly, this worked.
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This button became my curse.... It actually does more harm than good.. When it gets to mid-late game it has potential to fuck everything up.. mainly the positioning of the obses or HTs that are spread out.. Im trying to learn using it only in early-game where i find it useful... However my advice is dont start with it unless you know you have an iron will to stop
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I love it, especially to make control groups for like Vikings or Ghosts. It means less scrolling and clicking and you´re sure to get it all right.
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I used it during the campaign and it translated into my MP games aswell. It's not always useful, because sometimes I accidently press it instead of my army hotkeys and my obses go out of position.
It helps me focus on other things though... I'm so slow :D
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I had forgotten that that key existed :D hmm might find it some use in monobattles expesially with none abillity using units
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I just it in late, late game!
Or sometimes I use it for an all-in of some kind. The big thing is - as you say - That it adds overseers, observers, units at watchtowers, ect. Which makes it really anoying to use properly.
Flod
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Nop, I always have my stuff hotkeyed and if i dont, I hotkey before engagements.
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Only for the campaign when I'm pretty sure that my opponent won't actually attack me while I'm attacking them.
Generally I keep some units around to defend my bases (like maybe a bunker here and there, some mines, etc etc) while my main army's attacking stuff.
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please remove this worthless button . it serves no purpose at higher level with its current flaws.
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as protoss i do it to often ^^ its normaly my PANIC button BUT, well i have put it from F2 to ^ because 1-0 and ^ left of it is free ... its PERFECT but ... when i use it all my placed observers also move there ... i would love if it NOT select observers xD
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On August 22 2013 00:12 bGr.MetHiX wrote:
please remove this worthless button . it serves no purpose at higher level with its current flaws.
I am using this sometimes so what higher level are you talking about?
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Yeah I use it because I'm bad at the game and would love to have an unflag feature. So many times I'd leave a marine at a watch tower or at a scouting location, or units at a base to defend only to realize at a key moment later they are now in my army.
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I use it for those "Shit hit the fan moments", there's nothing like finding a 200 mech supply army rolling into your 2nd or 3rd un scouted hehe. My scouting leaves a lot to be desired sometimes !!!
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Unbound
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use it constantly. people like to pretend that they are constantly doing 5 drops at a time in gold league but the reality is you rarely use more than 2 army groups unless you are a professional level player. i find it pretty much replaces my general army key these days unless you are leaving your reinforcements at home for a specific reason.
and honestly you save so many actions not having to constantly find your reinforcement train or alter your rally point that you can do more while using it, imo unless you are a pro its useful to use it a lot.
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TLADT24920 Posts
I don't use this at all. It select the whole army which can be detrimental if I left some army at home etc... I guess I can see it being helpful to find lost units but I don't see why one can't just look around the map to try and find those.
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On August 22 2013 00:22 Nerchio wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2013 00:12 bGr.MetHiX wrote:
please remove this worthless button . it serves no purpose at higher level with its current flaws. I am using this sometimes so what higher level are you talking about?
you could focus more on the "with its current flaws" part of my post instead of boasting how incredibly high ur level is , mr nerchio :D:D:D rofl
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I used to use that ability loads in C&C:Red Alert 3, had a little more use in that game due to the fact that ever unit had a spell/transform ability I'd hotkey each individual unit type and use select all when I wanted to a-move to victory.
When I switched to SC2 I remembered being frustrated that such a button didn't exist, but eventually I got used to it. Ironic thing is when it was finally introduced it's hotkey was conflicting so I just rebound it to the edge of my keyboard and have never since touched it. May start giving it a go.
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When the function of using F2 to select all your army units came out I used it for a while, but as of late I've forgotten about it.
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On August 22 2013 00:22 Nerchio wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2013 00:12 bGr.MetHiX wrote:
please remove this worthless button . it serves no purpose at higher level with its current flaws. I am using this sometimes so what higher level are you talking about?
GOGO NERCHIO LOL
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On August 22 2013 00:22 Nerchio wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2013 00:12 bGr.MetHiX wrote:
please remove this worthless button . it serves no purpose at higher level with its current flaws. I am using this sometimes so what higher level are you talking about?
Loooooool
In all seriousness though I use it occasionally, as snute said earlier, to find units. Sometimes I lose track of medivacs or tech units like ghosts, which can get spread out around the battlefield, so hitting the select all army then ctrl clicking them to find them is super helpful.
The one thing I never use it for is as a means to control combat units.
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On August 21 2013 06:04 Liquid`Snute wrote:
Yes. It's great for finding high-tech units, especially 'lost' vipers and overseers -
Another great use is for basetrade-situations where you need a complete overview of your army.
Also it's good to use with ctrl-click to double-check that you have all your mutas in the control group, for example.
That is the only reason I use it, sometimes i miss the egg hotkeying. I don't have it bound so I can't rely on it more than that though.
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I never use it even though I usually have all of my army on one hotkey. It's just way more convenient to hit 1 instead of F1.
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On August 22 2013 01:24 bGr.MetHiX wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2013 00:22 Nerchio wrote:On August 22 2013 00:12 bGr.MetHiX wrote:
please remove this worthless button . it serves no purpose at higher level with its current flaws. I am using this sometimes so what higher level are you talking about? you could focus more on the "with its current flaws" part of my post instead of boasting how incredibly high ur level is , mr nerchio :D:D:D rofl
What are the flaws mr MetHiX?
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On August 22 2013 03:40 Ettick wrote:
I never use it even though I usually have all of my army on one hotkey. It's just way more convenient to hit 1 instead of F1.
I rebound it to "~". That's part of the problem for me, in that it's simply too convenient to use. It's just another hotkey on the row now.
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"What I would love to see is a way to un-flag army units, as army units. So that they will no longer be selectable by the SAAUB button, this will create a much smoother experience for those using that button.
Imagine the smoothness of being able to unflag that zergling at the watch tower and the overseers above your bases, while happily using that button for some serious management."
I totally agree with this. Also being able to add units or types to it - for example, being able to manually add queens, , and in the options menu, being able to make it so queens are automatically added to it.
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Selects the observer as well, so no I never use it.
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Nope and I'd rather hang myself than doing so. That button is such a disgrace, anyone who ever spent time playing zerg in bw will understand. I hate using all army on one control, I can't micro like that at all.
@nerchio: U using 3 control groups and winning is the biggest joke in all of esports.
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On August 22 2013 04:14 Lorch wrote:
Nope and I'd rather hang myself than doing so. That button is such a disgrace, anyone who ever spent time playing zerg in bw will understand. I hate using all army on one control, I can't micro like that at all.
@nerchio: U using 3 control groups and winning is the biggest joke in all of esports.
I feel you have misread the main post.
as I said I use it as an alternative to egg-hotkeying, selecting all zerg/banelings/overseers and putting them on 1, selecting all mutalisks, putting them on 2 etc.
I don't use that button as a control group by itself at all, putting all my units in 1 control group.
Either you have not read the OP, or you misread it ^_=.
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I tended to use it quite a bit as it came out but have the feeling it hurts more than it does good for Protoss at least.
I found for me that I started to rely on it more getting a bit sloppier with properly setting up my hotkeys. Also the option of having it sometimes hurt me by using all army in response to a drop and moving there with everything instead of just a control group.
Also losing position on observers constantly because it get's selected was horrible.
It's useful if used with care, just for hotkeying all units of a kind etc. For zerg especially I feel it's useful. It's also fine for just having an all army button to retreat or advance like the typical 1-a move but for protoss it sucks that you select observers, for zerg overseers (though that is generally not too bad).
It would be very handy if you could tweak it, for example remove overseers or observers from the selection. For terran I like it quite a bit though, not really anything you can select you don't want to, your mines for example are stuck anyway.
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On August 22 2013 05:36 kaluro wrote:Show nested quote +On August 22 2013 04:14 Lorch wrote:
Nope and I'd rather hang myself than doing so. That button is such a disgrace, anyone who ever spent time playing zerg in bw will understand. I hate using all army on one control, I can't micro like that at all.
@nerchio: U using 3 control groups and winning is the biggest joke in all of esports. I feel you have misread the main post. as I said I use it as an alternative to egg-hotkeying, selecting all zerg/banelings/overseers and putting them on 1, selecting all mutalisks, putting them on 2 etc. I don't use that button as a control group by itself at all, putting all my units in 1 control group. Either you have not read the OP, or you misread it ^_=.
I did read it and I understood what you do (though it sounds about 500 times harder than ctrl clicking eggs), but I still feel like such a buttom shouldn't exist. Now the the second sentence was more towards using it as a control group substitute like some people do and not towards what you are doing, I should have made that clearer.
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I use it all the time to find observers and ctrl-click to group tech units. I do tend to hit it in panic situations as well though, and that's something I need to get away from.
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On August 22 2013 04:14 Lorch wrote:
Nope and I'd rather hang myself than doing so. That button is such a disgrace, anyone who ever spent time playing zerg in bw will understand. I hate using all army on one control, I can't micro like that at all.
@nerchio: U using 3 control groups and winning is the biggest joke in all of esports.
You're just mad, it's not Starcraft1 anymore and this button is very useful
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I'm a masters Terran and I use it from time to time to grab units that just came out of production/ in reinforcement pile/ manage units being rallied. I think it's more useful for Terran than Zerg or Protoss due to them having to leave units around at bases more than Terran does.
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I dont use it but ive seen forGG use it in tvp when he's rallying units to the front to try and smash a protoss in an extended fight. Units get there 2/3 hp but much faster then normal since they've been stimmed twice.
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When playing terran you can spam F2 and T for quick reinforcements at the front! 
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It's very useful for Monobattles.
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Wow, a staggering 52% thus far, does NOT use the button at all.
But you still see Nerchio and Snute using the button occassionally, for certain things.
Not sure what to think of this :-)!
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I find it not only useless, but outright dangerous for 1v1, because it can mess up all the positions of individual units I have cleverly created before and forgot about ...
On the other hand, I find it pretty usefull in 4v4 - I off-race in 4v4s and thus I can't really do more than just macro and send units for someone to micro, so I may as well just send them all and they will sort them out. Also, it was perfect in the campaign I just finished (I know...) with all the heros and revived zerglings and whatever just to make sure the all a-move in the right general direction (which is, sadly, the winning startegy on Brutal).
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This sounds maybe a bit strange, but i use it to find my observers.
Sometimes the rally of by robo is off, and when in panic mode (a DT in your base) it's very handy
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A lot of rudeness in this thread.
I think Nerchio (and Snute although he isn't being singled out by anyone here) deserve more respect when it comes to in game knowledge.
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I use it when I play P since I have pylons around the map for scouting, usually during late-game. I don't use it for T since I use Marines to scout around the map and usually have drops going around.
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I think it takes away control. It makes me feel really awkward. I've unbound it for that reason. I prefer just a really diverse hotkey setup that allows me to control everything I want or need to.
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On August 21 2013 05:33 kaluro wrote:
If anyone has any advice in regards to army control with (or without?) that button, please do join in.
I am currently curious about who uses the SAAUB button, and why and when, and who doesn't. whether it's a large or just a minor part of the community, keep the votes coming.
I use this button way too often. So the scoutlings which were sent to check for expansion running back 
I am still not sure if I should change my scouting methods (for example use overlords) or if I should use the button less often.
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I think this option is the best buff terran could hope for (is it makes it imba? ofc not).
The simple reason is that terran units are most hard to hotkey since terrans cant hotkey eggs or warpins as they get created, they make a unit, wait a while, and only then they can hotkey it.
Plus, in TvZ for example, thats another reason how terrans can really put alot of pressure, rally to the zerg 4th, and while the pressure is on going - Select all army + stim, and the pressure on the zerg is really constant. Another great example of usage is when terrans losing the battle, while their rally point was pointed to aggresion, instead of now looking on the mini map and wasting alot of APM on control the bad rally bio (that is rallying into his death), just select all army and retreat. 2 simple clicks.
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Master T here, I use that button all the time. It's actually a thing that changes the game for me since Hots... it just feels more comfortable.
The only problem I have right now using it, is when I have marines spread on the map to scout, and when I press space (select all) during a battle all the marines gather to the battle.
But it's just because I am lazy. One solution I have is to use scvs instead to scout the map.
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Nope, only when I panic
the problem with select all army is that it puts specific units out of position. ie, zealots in the back without a way of charging forward, sentries where they cant ff, colossus in the front etc
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I rebound it to ctrl+A. How intuitive!
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I play Zerg and I don't use this button as I just add all my eggs to my control groups and rally them from there. This is also laziness because I simply don't want to override muscle memory from WoL to make use of this marginally useful button.
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The only thing I dislike about it is that it selects my medivacs that are currently on the map dropping... so sometimes they are halfway across the map then start coming back to join up with my army :/
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it can be super useful, but be very careful when using it, unless you are protoss, all you need is everything on the same hotkey anyways ㅜㅜ
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Just played. Just used it. Quite useful imo
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I used it far more than i should, it's great for having all you forces commited in a big battle and even flanking the enemy withouth losing precious time with other control groups, but it has some drawbacks as well (moving lings away from towers/expansions for example). Still, a great tool to have at your disposal!
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I use it a lot everygame, I just have take care of my medivac when I drop, but it's an awesome feature in lategame when you attack continuisly, I don't have to change my rally (I like having my prod in front of my bases) but i also don't have to go back to my base to add the army in my controls, so I don't risk failing en engagement because I wasn't watching my main army.
So, for me, the only problem is managing medivacs (only when they're not unloaded).
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I use with waaaay too much. I actually like the button, but it's annyoing that units at watchtower are coming back aswell.
So lately I have been using drones/scv's at watchtower, so bad :D
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I only use it in emergencies where I'm in really bad shape. The button is in general annoying as it takes away scouting lings and units on watch towers/expansions.
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I don't personally understand this idea that like, you should gravitate toward not using this button. I can understand that there are times when you don't want to use it (scouts at watchtower for example) and I can also understand that some people just might not like it. But if you're like me and you find that it helps you to corral and control your army, I don't see any reason why you should attempt to stay away from it.
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I got into the habbit of using it after the campaign in HotS. Always playing without the feature in WoL and now using it a lot it sort of feels like my control has degenerated a little since it can really mess up your army control when you try to drop or banshee harass etc while trying to manage your main army.
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I am a bad Gold player and use it a lot. Sometimes I rally to a unit during a push and the rally points get broken if that unit dies, even if I reset the rally some units get stranded or forgotten at various bases. This is especially bad if they are high value units like Ultras. There are a number of disadvantages like pulling scouts from towers, isolated groups of units that you might want for drop defense and including flying units that you might want separate, but overall I feel it helps me a lot more than it hurts at my scrub level.
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the worst is when you play Rain' style PvT. You have 5 obs correctly positioned, then you accidentally press SAAUB and press a, and now need to spend another 30 sec to set them up.
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It was scary how fast i become addicted to this shit. Have a hard time to train myself to not use this shit. It´s bad.
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I find this whole debate fascinating.
I like strategy games because of the strategy.
But it seems like most Starcraft players like it because of the mechanical demands of pressing buttons.
Yet they complain when there isn't enough strategy in professional games.
I have to admit to being confused. Personally, I think that anything that makes control and decision making easier, without reducing the amount of decisions to be made, to be a positive thing. But I would imagine that if you're a skilled player with some crisp builds, then the idea of making the game easier to control pretty much undermines everything you've worked towards.
Ultimately, until you are at the top of Masters/GM or indeed any RTS, the game is about clicking stuff, not having an IQ above room temperature. Which is a shame, since it makes the bar to entry so high.
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This one is my own personal trick with the select all unit feature, It goes like this:
You know how terran has to select unit ALL the time back into their control group ?
Zergs get to add eggs to their control groups, making it way easier to hotkey units, less unit selections required do to.
Well my trick is based on this principle using the "Select All Units" feature.
Alright this is how it works:
Ghost(or Raven) are number 1 priority on the unit selected board.
(Terran's unit priority for the select units board: http://imgur.com/FTKw0Yf )
Knowing this fact, one can:
1. Use the select all units hotkey to quickly gather all of his ghosts on the unit selected board;
2. then control click on the ghost, (just like zerg's control click eggs into a control a group);
3. then add to control group desired.
(* I basically trained myself to do these 3 steps every time I hear "Ghost reporting !" or when I rearrange my 1,2,3 unit control group)
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On August 26 2013 07:49 NSGrendel wrote:
I find this whole debate fascinating.
I like strategy games because of the strategy.
But it seems like most Starcraft players like it because of the mechanical demands of pressing buttons.
Yet they complain when there isn't enough strategy in professional games.
I have to admit to being confused. Personally, I think that anything that makes control and decision making easier, without reducing the amount of decisions to be made, to be a positive thing. But I would imagine that if you're a skilled player with some crisp builds, then the idea of making the game easier to control pretty much undermines everything you've worked towards.
Ultimately, until you are at the top of Masters/GM or indeed any RTS, the game is about clicking stuff, not having an IQ above room temperature. Which is a shame, since it makes the bar to entry so high.
The more developed and figured out the game becomes the strategies become all known and only mechanics (and balance and luck(not only random countering but also players mental and physical condition, enviroment and ect.) decides who wins.
Strategies become important when new units and balance patches come so the old stuff doesn't work anymore and people must start using their brains again :D and those are the moments that are most fun to watch.
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I like how people still talk shit about this button when pros like Nerchio and Snute use it. It's obviously useful, and if you like to make your life hard then go ahead.
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this button is really bad if you play terran, especially in TvP.
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On August 26 2013 07:49 NSGrendel wrote:
I find this whole debate fascinating.
I like strategy games because of the strategy.
But it seems like most Starcraft players like it because of the mechanical demands of pressing buttons.
Yet they complain when there isn't enough strategy in professional games.
I have to admit to being confused. Personally, I think that anything that makes control and decision making easier, without reducing the amount of decisions to be made, to be a positive thing. But I would imagine that if you're a skilled player with some crisp builds, then the idea of making the game easier to control pretty much undermines everything you've worked towards.
Ultimately, until you are at the top of Masters/GM or indeed any RTS, the game is about clicking stuff, not having an IQ above room temperature. Which is a shame, since it makes the bar to entry so high.
"Clicking on stuff..." is what makes StarCraft the game it is. If you want a purely cerebral game go play chess...the mechanical aspect of the game is one which not only places limitations on player competition but enhances it. There are feats within the game which when seen, even someone who is not a player can recognize as being difficult. Decreasingly few, sadly...all brought about by people who do not recognize or appreciate the mechanical component of the game.
Following your line of reasoning, we would end up with a game much like Command and Conquer, where workers are built for us, production built and managed for us beyond what type we choose...units which split for us, since you know, that is just another "control" sort of thing.
On top of that...no more micro! That's a mechanical aspect of the game. Got to take that away - it's mindless clicking and not cerebral enough. Injecting really fast? No, it takes away from choosing whether to build ultras or broodlords. Better make injects automatic.
If you fail to appreciate why mechanics matter and why they are integral to making this game what it is then you are either a very low level player or, truly, one of the rare, rare few who might have chosen the wrong game.
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As Terran and Protoss I can kinda see a reason to use this button, but as Zerg you can easily add units to your army hotkey. No need to implement anything like a army flag sytem.
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I use it in late PvT in the panic moment the terran snipes all the observers in your army and you need the one spotting drops fast withouth searching for it on the minimap and just finding pylons.
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I notice during 6 pools and 10 pools, or premedivac all ins, sometimes a Zerg wont have his rallied units immediately attacking the front or mineral line, and in a way, spamming the army attack button can help you make sure your rallied units are in action ASAP.
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I'm bronze and I don't make army control groups anymore now that this button is available.
// edit : except for high templars (I play random btw).
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I use it to find lost units.
Early game reaper whose control group got overwritten; medivac that flew off into the airspace after a drop with 10 hp left; widow mine that got left behind after a fight in a now-irrelevant part of the map; etc. 'Select all' finds them more quickly than scanning the minimap does.
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I developed a bad habbit of turning to this button to add newly built collosus/voids to my control group. It interrupts templar i have positioned for drops or zealots in chokes or watch towers. I feel like you can use it if you aren't doing things like that or in the beginning of the game but while useful it ends up being a crutch that causes issues.
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I use it but then I realize I lose control of watch towers lol so I stopped using it.
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It's on my ~ button right next to 1. I use it a lot. It's mostly for controlling my zerglings which I don't like to hotkey after mid game because there's sooo many of them it takes a lot of time to hotkey all the eggs. My ultra/muta/hydra/roach will go on 1, infestors on 2, vipers on 4. Anything that I want to stay put is burrowed.
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I use it but I always regret using it, it would probably be a good idea just to learn how to select all of my units manually.
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Losing battle as terran - retreat.
Has 8 different rallys of units streaming across map.
<3 this button.
Alternatively - as zerg:
Accidentally pulls mutas through enemy base, and all units off watchtower
h8 this button.
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I actually started using it. It helps a ton I feel
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I am now trying to just hotkey eggs once again.
I only use this button for a full out retreat if needed, or if I want to select all of my mutalisks.
Orr, when I'm going in for the killing blow, sometimes.
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EPT
