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I've always wondered how top players manage to use all of them with the standard layout. Anyone have any ideas? I've heard some use the F1-F4 keys for 7-0. I also use the ` key remapped to CG 10 which I think is pretty common. Anyone know the hotkeys of the pros?
It seems to be a fairly closed door subject and after lots of googling I just found CG suggestions. Not actual optimized standard hotkey layouts and tweaks. I know the first suggestion to this topic is use what's comfortable. The problem I'm running into is I'm running out of keys for my army. Pretty much my CG's as of now are
1-2 units
3 cc's
4-6 production
7-9 not used
0 upgrades
F1-F5 Camera locations
When I look at top terrans most of them use all of the CG's. I've tried putting all my CC's on 7 and it has gone fairly well but it just seems far away and awkward for macro cycles.
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2 control groups for units seems pretty unlikely. it tends to be 3-4.
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I have caps lock for 0 (that's why I sometimes shout during games  .
And yeah, I'm a total noob and even I need 4 CGs for units.
M
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
I think there is no reason to use all groups, except to look like a Pro clicking on all 10 buttons. Here are my groups:
1 - core army
2 - secondary army (corruptors, mutas, casters, etc)
3 - artillery or casters (siege mushrooms, etc)
4 - overseers
5 - nydus or overlords for drops
Scroll-wheel turn to left - 9 - queens
Scroll-wheel turn to right - 0 - hatcheries
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Most of the players who used to play broodwar, are simply used to moving their hand around the entire keyboard.
As a result, they simply use 1-0 as they are, and f1+ as they are.
with enough practice, you get used to just moving your whole hand around, it simply takes longer to acclimate to the increased movement involved.
A lot of the reason many things are not comfortable, is simply too little time using them. At worst, you can also set up shift or control or alt modifiers, so some keys can be alt+f, or alt+1.
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I'm not really looking for CG suggestions more hotkey suggestions. I'm wondering how the pro's use all the CG groups effectively. After CG 7 the usability of the keys becomes increasingly difficult.
@Verator
Yeah that's what I thought it was but how do they re assign control groups like 7-9. I find reaching ctrl+8 very difficult.
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depends which race you play i think
but i just use 1 to 6 with every and f1 to f6 camera locations
terran:
1 and 2 army
3 barracks
4 factory
5 starport
6 all cc
zerg:
1 to 4 army
5 queens
6 all hatches
protoss:
1 to 3 army
4 robo
5 stargate
6 all nexus
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Guys in Brood War F1 wasn't used for anything...
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I use all but one of them:
`123 for army, 4 for CCs + ebays + armory, 567 for production, (8 is rebound to `), 0 I use for ghost academies.
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my control groups are weird to most people....i play terran btw
1-cc's
2-barracks
3-factories
4-starports
5-bio army
6-upgrades
7-9-ghosts/medivacs/vikings
0-armory
f1-f8 camera locations
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Anyone want to share exactly how you use all 10 cg's? How do you re-assign control groups 7-0. or go about just using them in general?
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1/ Army
2/ Vikings
3/ Ghosts
4/ CC's
5/ Barracks
6/ Factory
7/ Starport
8/ Ebay
9/ CC's
0/ CC's
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On July 01 2013 06:32 Existor wrote:
I think there is no reason to use all groups, except to look like a Pro clicking on all 10 buttons. Here are my groups:
1 - core army
2 - secondary army (corruptors, mutas, casters, etc)
3 - artillery or casters (siege mushrooms, etc)
4 - overseers
5 - nydus or overlords for drops
Scroll-wheel turn to left - 9 - queens
Scroll-wheel turn to right - 0 - hatcheries
From now on i want this to be the official name of the unit. Siege mushrooms imba.
OT: There used to be "standard" layout in Broodwar because of the limitation of the control groups and the way the keyboard shortcuts were laid out and not customizable, you could say there was a definite way or two to use it. I think Artosis wrote a nice blog about that.
But in SC2, the most important thing is to use what you are most comfortable with. A few example :
- MarineKingPrime only uses one control group for all productions building and is VERY fast a launching a full production cycle on 3 different types of building with different addons.
- Stephano has always only used two control groups for his army and is/was regarded the most drop-proof zerg in the game ( remember when he had this rivalry with Polt and Polt said that droping Stephano was useless because he was so good at defending it )
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For protoss I try to use:
1 Army
2 Army
3 Gateways
4 All nexus
5 Robo
6 Stargate
7 Forge
8 Cybernetics Core
9 Obs/Prism
0 Mscore
Camera hotkeys F1-F4
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i do
123 army
4 ccs
5 raxes
6 factories
7 starports
and i play terran
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Personally I remap 8-0 to F2-F4 , and put the map keys on RFV
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On July 01 2013 06:39 sixilli wrote:
Anyone want to share exactly how you use all 10 cg's? How do you re-assign control groups 7-0. or go about just using them in general?
I just leave everything as it is and with practice i just got used to it. I only adjusted the camera keys to F2 and onwards to keep it similar to broodwar
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On July 01 2013 06:41 Thunderflesh wrote:If you want a layout with more CGs that are easily accessible, try using TheCore.
I actually have been using the core but I feel kind cramped around the home keys. I'm just seeing if I can have the best of both worlds. x]
My core skills are just around plat atm.
Also please stop posting your personal CG. I feel like it isn't helping the topic on actually using them. That's what I'm more interested in.
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1/ Nexi
2/ Gateways
3/ Robo, Stargate
4/ Core Army
5/ Casters,Phoenixes,Harass Squad
6/ Warp Prism
7/ Forges, CyberCore
8-0/ Observers
I'm nowhere near pro, but I feel like I got all the bases covered like that.
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On July 01 2013 06:33 sixilli wrote:
@Verator
Yeah that's what I thought it was but how do they re assign control groups like 7-9. I find reaching ctrl+8 very difficult.
Have you thought about using the second ctrl key? The one on the right? :p
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On July 01 2013 06:36 YouthSC wrote:
Guys in Brood War F1 wasn't used for anything...
unless you changed it in the settings? keycraft
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I use 1234567 for camera
Qwertyghbn control groups
Qwe drops and obs and stuff
Rty army
Gh macro
B all town halls n upgrades
Tilda warp gates, f1 all army f2 idle
Fvc main abilities
Zx for morph archon etc
D for hold position
A attack, s stop
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On July 01 2013 06:33 sixilli wrote:
I'm not really looking for CG suggestions more hotkey suggestions. I'm wondering how the pro's use all the CG groups effectively. After CG 7 the usability of the keys becomes increasingly difficult.
@Verator
Yeah that's what I thought it was but how do they re assign control groups like 7-9. I find reaching ctrl+8 very difficult.
There is a control on the right side of the keyboard too 
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On July 01 2013 06:44 Bongy wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2013 06:33 sixilli wrote:
@Verator
Yeah that's what I thought it was but how do they re assign control groups like 7-9. I find reaching ctrl+8 very difficult. Have you thought about using the second ctrl key? The one on the right? :p
I have thought of it but it seems a bit slow. I'm just looking for some more suggestions on how people actually go about it.
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You say you are running out of keys for army. I had the same problem. During wings of liberty when Protoss was able to bunch everything together I actually only used 1 for army and then 2 warp gates and 3 nexus. Above that I used 4 for templar if it got to that stage of the game and rarely I'd used 5 for an observer. The problem now is that with hots is that Protoss has alot of manage (Warp Prisms, Army, Sentries, Blink Stalkers, Colossus, MSC, Templar, Oracles, Tempest) So due to this I made radical alterations which really helped me play the game comfortable.
I use:
1: Army (zealot, sentry, archon, stalker, colossus)
2: Stalkers
3: Colossus (or Tempest)
4: MSC
Q(9): Warp Prism/Phoenix/Oracle
W(10): Templar
5: Nexus
6: Gateways
7: Robo
8: Stargate
F1-6 as Bases
Tab: Warp in location
Space: Upgrades
I took the rebindings from Artosis's guide on hotkeys. I don't use the W for warp gates for the same reasons he chooses not to. I like to be able to hotkey un transformed gateways with my warp gates as well so that if you just glance down you can quickly see that you need to transform them.
Also, by rebinding 9-10 as Q and W it allows you to keep all 6 army hotkeys in the same portion of the keyboard so you only need to radically shift your hands position in order to macro/rally units.
Also how I distribute my army hotkey's allows me to keep all spells castable from 1 hotkey group. FF from 1, Blink from 2, colo micro from 3, MSC spells from 4, WP transforming/harass from Q and storm/feedback from W. I really hate tabbing and it is the least efficient way to quickly access a spell if it is more than one tab away.
I do wish that the W default for selecting Warp Gates would select gateways and warp gates on cooldown as well so that I could have an extra hotkey for observers/halluc for early/mid game or vs swarm host play. But right now I ussually make do by using W as an observer key until templar are out.
Really take the time to just completely suck for a week or two and adjust to new hotkeys. The biggest thing is to move your CC's hotkey as far to the right of the keyboard as possible so that your army hotkeys can be grouped together. You don't want to take the risk of putting something across the keyboard. If you are in an intense situation you don't want to be jumping for a key like 8-10. Personally I didn't move the nexus to 6 because I really like having each of my production facilities on a separate key allows me to double tap them too in order to chrono boost mid/late game. My setup also works pretty well with Terran as you can put CC's on 5, Rax on 6, Factories on 7 and Starport on 8. Then you still have 6 hotkeys left for your army so Main army/vikings/tanks/widowmines/harassment/ghosts can all easily fit.
Edit:
I have tried to play zerg with this setup as well but I don't feel like it is the best. Taking the Q away from queen really messes with my mind. But I really like using F1-6 for injects on bases. You can cycle through bases really quickly just selecting with the mouse each queen. The camera locations also allow you to transfer workers from base to base really easily so that you always have proper saturation. You can also use the Tab/Space location hotkeys for creep tumor locations however I am not sure if this is really the most effective way to use your time.
Hope this was a little helpful.
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1284 that was the most helpful post thus far thank ya :D
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I mean, I know advocates of TheCore are like zerglings swarming over to attack everyone's mineral lines, but seriously, just one of the many features of TheCore is that all ten control groups are at MOST 2 keys away from your hand's natural resting position. Including your two most important groups, CCs and production buildings, literally right under your index and middle fingers. All the rest are completely available for army, scouting, harass, etc. I recommend looking into it.
Note: I'm talking about Terran and Protoss here, Zerg is in a way even more extremely optimized and I don't know anything about it.
Edit: oh I see you're already using it. Cool
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I'm glad I could be of help! If you have any other questions or anything feel free to PM me.
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You don't need more hotkeys. I never understand this obsession to copy some pro. They all have VERY different key setups and different reasons for it, which shows that it doesn't matter. Some pro's only have 1 army hotkey, some have 3. Some hotkey their upgrade buildings, some don't. Some hotkey them separately, some together with the rax/factory so you can see if they're working, etc. Another example: a lot of Korean Terrans still have marine production on M, which is ridiculous if you think about it, but it's what they've gotten used to. The people that do use 7-0 are just used to it, there is no magic trick, they just move their hands quickly. If you desperately want an extra hotkey on the left side you can remap 0 to `, a lot of my friends use this, but pro's don't.
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On July 01 2013 06:41 Marou wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2013 06:32 Existor wrote:
I think there is no reason to use all groups, except to look like a Pro clicking on all 10 buttons. Here are my groups:
1 - core army
2 - secondary army (corruptors, mutas, casters, etc)
3 - artillery or casters (siege mushrooms, etc)
4 - overseers
5 - nydus or overlords for drops
Scroll-wheel turn to left - 9 - queens
Scroll-wheel turn to right - 0 - hatcheries From now on i want this to be the official name of the unit. Siege mushrooms imba. OT: There used to be "standard" layout in Broodwar because of the limitation of the control groups and the way the keyboard shortcuts were laid out and not customizable, you could say there was a definite way or two to use it. I think Artosis wrote a nice blog about that. But in SC2, the most important thing is to use what you are most comfortable with. A few example : - MarineKingPrime only uses one control group for all productions building and is VERY fast a launching a full production cycle on 3 different types of building with different addons. - Stephano has always only used two control groups for his army and is/was regarded the most drop-proof zerg in the game ( remember when he had this rivalry with Polt and Polt said that droping Stephano was useless because he was so good at defending it )
this 100%
too many people think they aren't macro-ing well is due to hotkey control group, but it definitly is just an excuse for forgetting rather than not pressing fast enough
just like marine split method.
not even all pros using camera hotkey as well
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I've gotten pretty comfortable with the following:
1-3 - army
4 - variable (used for dropships or squads of units I split off from my main force)
5 - CCs
6 - barracks
7 - factories
8 - starports
9 - ebays
0 - armories
I've never been very comfortable with tabbing through multiple production building types on one hotkey because I find I mess up and queue the wrong unit during times when I'm busy elsewhere and need to throw down another production cycle in a hurry.
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I could try getting use to the tab method. I've never really used it could free up some space. The only negative side to it is you can't set separate rally points as fast.
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You don't really need to use 10 control groups. Most pros only use 5-7 control groups.
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Haha, I only use 4, 1-2 Army, 3-CC 4 prod facilities. :o
I don't think adding more will improve my skill. Maybe adding a 3rd group for army but more is useless imho.
Stephano is one of the best zerg out there and he only use 4 groups as well.
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On July 01 2013 07:12 Faust852 wrote:
Haha, I only use 4, 1-2 Army, 3-CC 4 prod facilities. :o
I don't think adding more will improve my skill. Maybe adding a 3rd group for army but more is useless imho.
Stephano is one of the best zerg out there and he only use 4 groups as well.
imo zerg is the only race that can get away with the least control groups. Depending on the inject method.
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On July 01 2013 06:36 YouthSC wrote:
Guys in Brood War F1 wasn't used for anything...
yes it was, it was a button that popped up a useless window if you accidentally hit it instead of f2. 
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I play protoss at high master level, and use 9-10 hotkeys in most macro games as well as camera hotkeys for my first 4 expansions. I have my mouse 4 button set to my main base, and then f1-f4 for expansions.
I use 1-3 for army/scouting purposes, 4 for my nexi, 5 for robotics, 6 for gateways until WG is done (usually rebind for stargates if i'm building them), 7 for observer, 8 is unused although I could potentially bind a second obs or forges to this one. I can't really reach comfortably past 7 with my left index finger so I bound 9 to q (which is used for warp prism) and 0 to tilde (which is for mothership core). I also use w as the warp gate hotkey.
All of this might sound like overkill but I find that it's really useful to have everything hotkeyed like this (ESPECIALLY mothership core and observers) because a lot of people will either not hotkey them or just group them with their main army and then they get lost in the middle of a battle when you need them most. You can always set your MSC to follow a bulky unit like a colossus which makes a-moving a bit easier, and then when the time comes you can hit tilde to access its spells.
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I tend to use all of them, actually. I prefer it to too much mouse usage. With Protoss, I used them all as well, but with Zerg I didn't use quite so many, due to Zerg only having one production building. I play Terran now.
Mouse button 4 - army
Mouse button 5 - other army type, or a drop. I don't use this one often
1 - tanks
2- barracks
3 - CC
4 - Factory
5 - Starport
6 - Engi bays
~ - Widow mines
Q - Scouting unit or vikings
I also use camera hotkeys for bases and the point where my units are rallied.
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Yeah I agree more hotkeys is usually better. It's really nice to have something just a button away. I'll have to try the q,w remap.
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Is it not possible to have more than 10 control groups?
I currently have:
0: Forges/Cybercore
9: Stargate
8: Robotics Facility
7: Gateways
6: Nexus
5: Observer
4: Warp Prism/Oracle/DT, other harass
3: Split army; Phoenix/Blinkstalker
2: Sentry
1: Main army
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1 core army
2, 3 support (ghosts, vikings etc)
4 CC's
5 rax
6 fact
7 port
8, 9 drops, stray units/hitsquads, armory
0 ebays/armories
And I click the minimap instead of using camera hotkeys
(Also, why would you keep hotkeying gateways when WG is done o.O)
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It just occurred to me that I can use my thumb to assign control groups past 7 . . . . Just thought I would share that useful information with you guys. haha
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I don't know if you know, but if you rebind a control group it still appears as his former number on the CG bar (IE I replaced 8 with ² to bind my factories, but they still appear as on 8). So if you see a pro using 7/8/9/0 CGs on his streams, he's not necessarily using the 7/8/9/0 keys.
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When I changed my control groups to using all 10 keys I had to change my hand position. My hand is now more-so placed closer to the middle of the keyboard so I can hit 8 9 0 easier. It will also take at least a week or so to start getting used to it.
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On July 01 2013 08:35 Nimix wrote:
I don't know if you know, but if you rebind a control group it still appears as his former number on the CG bar (IE I replaced 8 with ² to bind my factories, but they still appear as on 8). So if you see a pro using 7/8/9/0 CGs on his streams, he's not necessarily using the 7/8/9/0 keys.
Yeah I know this. It's specifically why I was asking for particular hotkey setups and not control groups. Which people still posted anyways. None the less I can say this thread was worth making I learned a few tricks!
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On July 01 2013 08:38 RacerX wrote:
When I changed my control groups to using all 10 keys I had to change my hand position. My hand is now more-so placed closer to the middle of the keyboard so I can hit 8 9 0 easier. It will also take at least a week or so to start getting used to it.
You could change the control group positions to be closer to the rest of the keys  Less hand movement helps make you play faster in my opinion.
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As Zerg I use
1 : Main Army
2 : Casters, runbys etc
3 : Upgrades + all tech buildings + creep queens
4 : Hatcheries
5 : Inject Queens
6 : 1st overlord for scouting
then I reminded 7 to `~` and use that also for Muta harass, runbys, etc.
So I'd say just rebind stuff using shift or w.e
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On July 01 2013 06:52 slowbacontron wrote:I mean, I know advocates of TheCore are like zerglings swarming over to attack everyone's mineral lines, but seriously, just one of the many features of TheCore is that all ten control groups are at MOST 2 keys away from your hand's natural resting position. Including your two most important groups, CCs and production buildings, literally right under your index and middle fingers. All the rest are completely available for army, scouting, harass, etc. I recommend looking into it. Note: I'm talking about Terran and Protoss here, Zerg is in a way even more extremely optimized and I don't know anything about it. Edit: oh I see you're already using it. Cool
I think the Core is overly complicated and a waste of time to try and figure. No one should have to spend 100-300 games to figure out a hotkey method.
Personally I designed my setup around WASD because I played primarily shooters before I got into SC. I never liked moving my hand a whole lot and I wanted to keep it centered around WASD. This is for Terran.
F1: Idle Workers
F2-F9: Camera Hotkeys for Bases
1: Command Centers + Engineering Bays + Armories
2: Barracks
3: Factories
4: Starports
Q: Primary Army Hotkey
W: Secondary Army Hotkey
E: Tertiary Army Hotkey
~: Drop Hotkey 1
Front Mouse Button: Drop Hotkey 2
I also changed most of the ability hotkeys and building hotkeys that are displaced by my QWE on FDRTCV. I use F and D a lot of switching modes for siege tanks, widow mines, vikings, etc.
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1- Spellcasters/Tanks/Mines/Vikings
2- Main Army
3- Barracks
4- CCs
5- Starport
6- Factory
7- Spellcasters/Tanks/Mines/Vikings
8- N/A
9- N/A
0- Upgrades
Camera Hotkeys F1, F3, F4, F5.
1 and 7 and dependent on the match-up. My control groups may not be optimal, but they work for me
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interesting, since i played BW I do use all, 1-2 army 3 main 4-6 buildings 7 drops 8-9 expansions 0 all ccd
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I play Protoss at mid-high masters. My hotkeys are:
1- stalkers
2 -zlot/sentry/collu
3 - templar
4- nexuses
5- robo
6- stargate
7- (space) tech building (storm timing or range collu timing etc etc)
8- (tab) - mothership core
9- (q) - upgrades
0- (`) - harass unit (pylon block, warp prism, observer)
use camera hotkeys on all nexuses f2-fwhatever bases i get to
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On July 01 2013 08:53 BlackPanther wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2013 06:52 slowbacontron wrote:I mean, I know advocates of TheCore are like zerglings swarming over to attack everyone's mineral lines, but seriously, just one of the many features of TheCore is that all ten control groups are at MOST 2 keys away from your hand's natural resting position. Including your two most important groups, CCs and production buildings, literally right under your index and middle fingers. All the rest are completely available for army, scouting, harass, etc. I recommend looking into it. Note: I'm talking about Terran and Protoss here, Zerg is in a way even more extremely optimized and I don't know anything about it. Edit: oh I see you're already using it. Cool I think the Core is overly complicated and a waste of time to try and figure. No one should have to spend 100-300 games to figure out a hotkey method. Personally I designed my setup around WASD because I played primarily shooters before I got into SC. I never liked moving my hand a whole lot and I wanted to keep it centered around WASD. This is for Terran. F1: Idle Workers F2-F9: Camera Hotkeys for Bases 1: Command Centers + Engineering Bays + Armories 2: Barracks 3: Factories 4: Starports Q: Primary Army Hotkey W: Secondary Army Hotkey E: Tertiary Army Hotkey ~: Drop Hotkey 1 Front Mouse Button: Drop Hotkey 2 I also changed most of the ability hotkeys and building hotkeys that are displaced by my QWE on FDRTCV. I use F and D a lot of switching modes for siege tanks, widow mines, vikings, etc.
I would disagree with you on the point of TheCore. If done correctly and carefully, more research on a good hotkey layout will definitely improve its effectiveness and allow a player to play faster and more accurately. You could spend less time and make do with something that seems intuitively right, but luckily TheCore has been made and it's been worked on for over a year to bring the best benefits to one's gameplay it can.
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Guys, please stop listing what units you put on each group. It's not what the OP asked for xD
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I have rebound 9 and 0 to q and w, with 8 being the biggest stretch (but i only use 8 for ghost academy), and in a good TvP, I will use all 10 hotkeys, but I think that thats the kind of thing that doesnt really come naturally, its more of a forced thing (to use all 10).
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Terran Hotkeys
1 - All army units Or Bio only if you have ghosts.
2 - Ghosts, Tanks, Medivacs, Mines
3 - Ghosts, Tanks, Medivacs, Mines
4 - CC
5 - Barracks, Factorys, Starports (I use the tab method)
6 - Engineering Bay, Armory
Im also using a fully custom plus very compact hotkey setup i made. I have small hands so i can only stretch so far. 6 is a big stretch for me.
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1 army
2 tanks/vikings/WM
3 CCs / ghosts
4 Marines
5 production
6 EBays
7-9 CCs
0 lol?
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On July 01 2013 09:34 slowbacontron wrote:
Guys, please stop listing what units you put on each group. It's not what the OP asked for xD
2nd time on the same page lol
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1 - main army
2 - warp prism/caster/phoenix/mcore
3 - warpgate until I need it free, same as 2
4 - nexus'
5 - robo > stargate
6 - stargate
7 - upgrades
8- rebound to `, used for mothership core when I have to use 2 or 3
9-0 is unused
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1 - main army
2 - aux army (often stalkers)
3 - tech army (often hts, voids, colo)
4 - nexus
5 - robos
6 - stargates
7 - upgrades (forge or twilight or core)
8 (mouse button 3) - single units (prisms, obs, dts, hts, scouting probes, mscore, or harassing phoenixes)
9 (mb4) - single units
0 (mb5) - single units
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I tend to use most of my keyboard. Some of it might be excessive, but hey, it works for me.
As Terran (my main race):
1- main army (bio, thors, medivacs, etc)
2- support units (tanks in tvt, mines in tvz, ghosts in tvp)
3- Vikings and ravens
4- a tech lab that's researching, or another control group for units
5- CC's (rebound later on for a drop or if I need another control group for units)
6- Rax/Fact/Port
7- Ebay/armories
8 and 9- ghost academies
0- All CC's
As Zerg:
1- Auxillary queens
2- Main army
3- Mutas or infestors
4- Something that's researching (Pool researching speed, spire, etc.)
5- Hatches
6 through 9- individual queens (although, past that many queens, I put them all on 6 and do the backspace trick)
0- I don't know what to put there
Protoss:
1- Main army
2- Templar
3- Mothership core
4- cyber core/forges
5- nexii
6- Robo or Stargate
7- Whatever isn't on 6
8 through 0- warp gates
I use f2-f8 for camera hotkeys and ` to cycle between bases.
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1,2,3 army, kinda depends on what my comp. is
4 all hatches
5678 individual hatches, for upgrades and building out of specific hatches
fkeys for base locations for injecting
i don't need all 10, though i'm definitely not claiming my setup is super pro. i think for me, it's enough. I can just box units or whatever, sometimes it's easier for me to do that than to have every single unit type on a different key.
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I play Terran and I do my hot keys a little different.
1 army
2 army
3 army
4 barracks
5 factory
` starport
Q command centers
I can't consistently hit 6-0 very well so I just changed 6 to ` and 7 to Q. I don't use 8 9 0 for anything. And since I just put all CCs on 1 hot key I use F1-F5 to jump from base to base.
After reading other posts I guess ` and Q isn't actually that different from most people. Guess I'm not the only smart one .
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1- CCs
2- Raxes and Facts
3- Ports
4- Ebays and Armory
5 and 6 - Army/Casters
7- ghost academies
8, 9, 0- depot building scv(s)
7-0 i dont use much so thats why i have them set as such
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I remember progamers like Flash suffering from injuries (torn skin + bleeding) on their hand in the area between the index and thumb. The reason was because they had to constantly stretch their fingers doing ctrl + 9 or ctrl + 0 using the pinkie and the thumb. I don't remember if it was a Terran player thing because 9 and 0 were commonly used as hotkeys for scans.
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1- main army
2-spell casters or tanks
3-barracks (or late game ghosts or vikings)
4-barracks in the late game
5-cc
6-engineering bay
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On July 01 2013 09:34 slowbacontron wrote:
Guys, please stop listing what units you put on each group. It's not what the OP asked for xD
Quoting myself again ^^ OP, maybe using the word "accessing" all 10 groups would have yielded better results.
There are some points about using ` as a control group, but not a lot of new ideas I feel.
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I found it nice to make a custom grid.
12345 for army control 6 idle work 7 army
qwert for control groups 6 7 8 9 0
moved hold and patrol to z x
can fit most spells on d f g c v b.
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Jevity: I think that's pretty good! Reminds me a bit of the "Chameleon" layout I use. You put some functions on "a" and "s", right? Those keys are important just because of how easy they are to press.
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On July 01 2013 06:28 sixilli wrote:
I've always wondered how top players manage to use all of them with the standard layout. Anyone have any ideas? I've heard some use the F1-F4 keys for 7-0. I also use the ` key remapped to CG 10 which I think is pretty common. Anyone know the hotkeys of the pros?
It seems to be a fairly closed door subject and after lots of googling I just found CG suggestions. Not actual optimized standard hotkey layouts and tweaks.
To answer the OP's question, in lategame broodwar you were almost required to have 1-5 to 7 bound to your army (some decided to use the majority of their keybinds for production and relied on their mouse control to use their entire army.). That being the case the broodwar pros are used to having to use all of the hotkeys. For instance as protoss since probes were built with the hotkey "P" many toss players bind their nexi to 0,9,8. I remember seeing Hero streaming and he still has his nexi bound to 0 9 8 and may have changed the probe hotkey to P just because he used that hotkey setup for so long. I would expect that a lot of other old broodwar pros do the same thing, they just have their hotkeys roughly the same as they would have in BW just because they already have the muscle memory for it.
Now as far as your optimization question goes I would argue that a lot of pros use un-optimized hotkey layouts because of their broodwar muscle memory. Having 0 9 8 as nexi and P for probes is not optimal anymore because you can change your keybinds but they're used to it and do it so fast anyways that it doesn't matter.
If you're looking for actual optimized keybinds you can try searching for "The Core". Keep in mind though at least for that "optimal" keyboard layout it takes a lot of learning for the muscle memory to take effect. I tried it myself with bad results. I normally play at a mid-high masters level on NA/EU but with that hotkey setup I had such a hard time controlling and even building my army that I was playing gold/plat players on unranked.
Honestly I would recommend that you find a keyboard layout that works for you. If you want to make use of those 7-0 CGs without having to reach to 7 to 0 I would advise changing other keys to control groups. For instance if you're only going to play terran you can make Q a hotkey for a control group as Q is only used for Zerg's queen (I think). Also consider other keys like Tilde or capslock.
TL;DR: A lot of pros use sub-optimal keybind setups because they wanted to keep the same ones they had in BW (Which was not optimized). If you want a well thought out optimal keyboard setup search for "The Core". Lastly, if you aren't interested in the core consider using alternate keys for the 7-0 keys, Q,Tilde, and capslock are examples.
GL
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Terran player here
I go 1 Ground, 2 Seigetanks 3 Air Army control,
4 is production and i tab between rax fac starport
5 is CC
6 is upgrades
Use all of them regulary, i sometimes use more for things like drops, but i mainly just control them manually
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On July 01 2013 12:16 slowbacontron wrote:
Jevity: I think that's pretty good! Reminds me a bit of the "Chameleon" layout I use. You put some functions on "a" and "s", right? Those keys are important just because of how easy they are to press.
Yea A is still attack and S is stop
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Why is everyone posting their hotkeys, none of which use all 10 hotkeys like the op is asking about?
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As a High Master Zerg:
1 Usually Mutas
2 Main Army
3 Reinforcements
4 Proxy Hatcheries / Hiddenbases
5 Offensive Queens
6 Creep Queens
7 Upgrades
8/Y Nydus
9/§ Inject Queens
10/W Hatcheries
All in all i use 1-3 for army 4 and 10 for Hatcheries 5,6 and 9 for Queens and 7 / 8 for buildings
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My hotkeys when I played SC2 :
1 : MMM
2 : Siege tanks or vikings (main CC in early game)
3 : ghosts or other casters (CC at natural in early game)
4 : barax
5 : factories
6 : starport
7 : ebays and armories
8-9 : drops
0 : Orbitals
I'm amazed how some players can do well with 3 hotkeys.
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On July 01 2013 09:34 slowbacontron wrote:
Guys, please stop listing what units you put on each group. It's not what the OP asked for xD
Heh. I think I just love hearing myself talk. I'll stop quoting myself in case it accidentally violates a TL rule or something...
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I dont like tabbing the production as terran since in most games you need all 3 kinds. so i set them on a CG each.
I guess since it´s mostly necessary to create depots with a new unit cylce you should not bind production and rather build them as compact as possible and ctrl-click the structures.
saves CGs
also you can bind CGs 7890 to mousebuttons.
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1 CC
2 Army
3 Barrack
4 Factory
5 Starport
Mouse control only.
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Russian Federation4295 Posts
On July 01 2013 20:48 kill619 wrote:
Why is everyone posting their hotkeys, none of which use all 10 hotkeys like the op is asking about?
Because no reason to use all 10 hotkeys except to look like a pro?
For example I use hotkey with number 7 for ingame menu.
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Well As long as you want to have refineries in hotkey, don't have to use all!
ROFLed when I saw that in bronze league heros!!!
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Terran ( standart hotkeys)
1 Spellcaster
2 Main army
3 support ( tanks or viking) ( at the beginning 1st cc)
4 rax
5 fabric
6 startport
7 all cc ( + upgrade buildings)
8 2nd cc
9 3rd cc
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Protoss (grid hotkeys)
1 nexus
2 army
3 alternate army (i re hotkey this several times in a game depending on situations)
4 robo
5 stargate
rest is too far away from my fingers... can reach 6 sometimes if i have an oracle or an observer i dont wanna lose track of... otherwise the keys are too far away and i dont wanna lift my hand to press buttons it seems to be slower and less accurate...
i'm high master btw
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Personally I have a Roccat Isku (Pic) and remapped top half of my control groups (6-0) to the macro keys at the left. (Not that I come close to using 10 control groups, but I like it with number keys for my buildings, and macro keys for units).
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Zerg here, the only real difference I have 0 remapped to ` since it's closer. I just about never get close to using all 10 keys though. My layout is:
` Upgrade Buildings, cycle with tab
1 Army unit 1
2 Army unit 2
3 Queens
4 All Hatch
5 Casters
6-9 Usually just scouting, but i don't always use them.
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hmm i play a little odd but as a zerg i
1 - melee units which you can just a move
2 - banes or units you may have to have control
3 - these days SH or infesters
4, flying units - this is an issue atm cos i can group broods corrs , vips and mutas all in one grounp and i can lose stuff so need to controll click a lot of the time (yes this needs improvement i feel)
5 - hatch1
6hatch2
7hatch3
8hatch4
9 - rebound where i put all hatches and then 0 is for special things like scouts, nidus and other tidbits
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1-3 army
4 stargates/robos
5 nexii and forges
6-7 observers
F2 to F4 for other stuff but have to improve using those, maybe starting using camera hotkeys but don't see too much use in them.
Using F1 as select entire army now but I'm starting to think using that is detrimental. It's nice for battles if you constantly want to send new warped units into battle and retreat with your entire army (saves you binding new units while in battle) but I HATE that it selects observer too, otherwise it would be great.
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I know white people love it, but I can't play the game with as little control groups as most foreign "progamers".
It's really obvious with each race too:
Z:
4 for armie as hots has added a lot (swarm host + festor + viper + any support easily needs 4, maybe even 5)
5 for main hatch/nat hatch etc. so you can build units where you need units and army where you need army, also saves drone traveling distance if you make them at the right hatch and if a timing comes you can have reinforcements pop where they need to pop
1 for all hatches, obv makes it easier to remax
P:
5 for armie (between mamaship core, the usuall split between zealot/sentry and stalker, colossi, templar and all the viable air units you can easily create armies that just need 5 to control properly)
3 for production, robo + stargate + warpgates, you obv need warpgates as it has many advantages hotkeying it vs using the build in one, but that should be known by now
1 for nexi
And that leaves 1 for whatever you want, sadly you can't have 1 group per nexus as parting has (thats why his immortal allin came so much earlier in wol, he just spent exactly the money he needed on probes) without sacrificing army control
T:
3 for armie should be enough unless you wanna always hotkey drops
3 for production, obviously
And then I tend to have my first 3 ccs on seperate keys to optimize worker production (many korean t que up the next scv in each cc just as the old one finishes to have even better makro, I feel like this is part of the reason why korean t's makro often looks so much better than white people makro), and then have 1 for all which obviously makes com satting/muling easier lategame.
And there you have it, imo zerg NEEDS 10 to work properly, protoss atleast 7 to be ok, and t 10 if you wanna do it right, atleast 7 if you don't. Now how you rebind them and which you use for what doesn't matter as long as you are comfortable with it. Personally I prefer to use the entire keyboard ( for example I make overlords on O and Marines on M, so I do use 1-0) as it just makes the game more fun to me, but you can obv also only use half the keyboard if that makes you happy.
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On July 01 2013 06:28 sixilli wrote:
I've always wondered how top players manage to use all of them with the standard layout. Anyone have any ideas? I've heard some use the F1-F4 keys for 7-0. I also use the ` key remapped to CG 10 which I think is pretty common. Anyone know the hotkeys of the pros?
It seems to be a fairly closed door subject and after lots of googling I just found CG suggestions. Not actual optimized standard hotkey layouts and tweaks. I know the first suggestion to this topic is use what's comfortable. The problem I'm running into is I'm running out of keys for my army. Pretty much my CG's as of now are
1-2 units
3 cc's
4-6 production
7-9 not used
0 upgrades
F1-F5 Camera locations
When I look at top terrans most of them use all of the CG's. I've tried putting all my CC's on 7 and it has gone fairly well but it just seems far away and awkward for macro cycles.
1-3 for units
4 CC
5 rax + engi/armory
6 fact
7 starport
8 engi+armory
9 ghost acads
0 is modified to ~ and is for units/drops but i dont really use it much
How the fuck are you surviving off 2 unit hotkeys only?
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In broodwar I would use my right hand to spam my hatcheries 5-0
0sd9sd8sd7sd6sd5sd real quick worked out well for me, but I doubt you'd ever see a pro doing it.
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More ain't always better. Just sayin'
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When i play as Terran i use this comination of hotkeys:
1 Army (standard mainarmy)
2 Army (spellcasters like ghost and raven)
3 Army (Vikings and Medievacs)
4 Army (Drops)
5 CC
6 All production buildings (Just hit tab to shift between rax, factory and starport)
7 Uppgrades (enginering bay, techlab and armory)
F1-F6 camera hotkeys
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The word is USE. You are USING all 10 control groups.
For Christ's sake...
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~ = Scout/mutas/ replacement for mutas
1 = army
2 = army
3 = hatch
4-6 = queens
9 = all structures (upgrades)
f1-f4 for camera locations
I need to use 7/8.
As T I do the same thing only
3 = CC
4 = rax
5 = fact
6 = starport
Same structure to it with P as well, but the extra spaces (7/8) are used for obs
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1 Nexi
2 Scout
3 Probe used for building
4 Gate
5 Robo/Stargate
into
1 Nexi
2 Army
3 Spellcaster/Colli
4 - 6 Production
F1 Main
F2 Natural
F3 Third
F4 Fourth
Ranked High Plat this season, last season was High Diamond
My apm average is 151, woot.
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On July 01 2013 06:30 da_head wrote:
2 control groups for units seems pretty unlikely. it tends to be 3-4.
In many VODs/replays of pros I saw they only use 2 control groups for army.
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1 - Main Army
2 - Secondary army/scout/casters
3 - ""
4 - ""
5 - Queens
6 - hatches
7 - upgrades
8,9,0 are all unused because I have small hands and I use grid hotkeys.
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1,2,3 - army
4 - production( i just tab trough them)
5 - cc/nexus+upgrade buildings
6 - drops
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what i have done is rebound 0 to mouse forward button for my ccs and upgrades(ebays and armory) rebound 6 to w or w to 6 w.e. but i put all production on that and i just tab and use 1-3 unless i have ghost and raven in army then 1-4. the way it work is i dont have to move past y/h/n everything else to far and only need to worry about 5 CG or so instead of all ten its easier and faster and dont have to think as much. instead of pressing 5 make stuff 6 make stuff etc etc just hit w tab tab tab and worry about army ezpz my point is dont use all 10 to hard and doesnt help fix it to how you like rebound stuff make it easier for your self and dont worry about that pros cause all they did was make it ez for them.what might work for them might not work for you(hand size.left handed, so on)
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I have control group 10 bound to the ( ´ ) key, (the key to the left of key 1)
Terran:
1 - Main army
2 - Siege Tanks/WM/drops/ghosts
3 - Drops/ravens
4 - CC
5 - Rax
6 - Factory
7 - Starport
8 - Upgrades
9 -
0 - Banshees
Zerg:
1 - Main army (mostly melee)
2 - Secondary army (mostly ranged)
3 - Infestors/banelings
4 - Hatcheries
5 - Inject Queens
6 - Creep Queens
7 - Swarm Hosts
8 - Upgrades
9 - Overseer
0 - Vipers
Protoss:
1 - Main army
2 - MSC
3 - HT/Oracles
4 - Nexi
5 - Gateways
6 - Robo
7 - Stargate
8 - Upgrades
9 - Observer
0 - Phoenix
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I tend to use:
1-3: Units
4: Hatcheries
5: Queens
6: Random things (overlord, drone, etc)
I don't tend to use anything past 6 though because reaching that far is uncomfortable.
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I'm just gold but I use all of them. Sometimes 10 seems not enpugh because obviously I'm wasting most of them. I noticed some pros does not have a static mapping but change them depending on the situation. For example they put scouting probe on 1 at the start of the game, then they put 1 stalker there... and it continues.
1: nexii
2: main army
3: secondary army (ht or blinkstalker or colo)
4: air (phoenix or warp prism)
5: scouting probe
6: robo
7: stargate
8: main observer
9: observer in the army
0: observer at home or mscore or warp prism
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I can't use 10 of them my left hand can't handle it,dunno how you guys do (i guess playing piano would help)
I as a Terran use :
1.All orbitals
2.all barracks
3.all factories
4.all starports
5.Support unit (Mine,Tanks,Ghost) Bind to my mouse 5 (left button on the G500)
6.All Upgrades (Armory + Ebay ) bind to ²
7.Army 1,bind to F1
8.Army 2,Bind to F2
Those are pretty weird,people tend to look at me weirdly when they first see it.
But heh at least it works,i think anyone should just use whatever they feel comfortable with and not trying to fit in with such thing as hotkey layout (thecore ect...)
Hell if you want to use Q for your productions building just use Q...if you feel conformable with playing with a vertical keyboard just do it.
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I use 1 through 8 because I can reach them and 8, 9, 0 are all bound to my macro keys (along the left of the K/B). I suppose 8 control groups is enough, because I never really use the macro keys to bind 9 and 0.
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the most logical (for me, random user):
1. unit
2. unit
3. unit
4. cc/nexus/hatch
5. wg/rax/queen-main
6. robo/fac/queen-nat
7. star.g/star.p/queen-3rd
8. ebay/forge/queen-4th
9. armory/archive/citadel/cyber/evo
0. probe/pylon/overseer/observer/spire
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1 - Ghosts or Ravens
2 - Vikings or Dropping Medivacs, Siege if mech.
3 - Main Army
4 - Factory
5 - Barracks
6 - Starport
7 - CC
8 clear
9 - Armory
0 - Engi bay
I am able to hit all of these keys very easily up to 7 and only have to check 9-0 occasionally for upgrades progress.
These came from me originally playing Zerg and keeping my hatcheries on 5 and queens on 4. It works extremely well for me and hitting 7ss keeps my worker rhythm going strong. Units are easy enough to produce.
1-2 are basically focus units, so scouts in early game. Drops in mid-late, casters in late game.
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1 - Main Army
2 - Secondary Army
3 - Casters
4 - Drops
5 - CCs
6 - Production (Tab Rax/Fac/Star)
I don't use anything past 6.
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On July 01 2013 21:45 Existor wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2013 20:48 kill619 wrote:
Why is everyone posting their hotkeys, none of which use all 10 hotkeys like the op is asking about? Because no reason to use all 10 hotkeys except to look like a pro? For example I use hotkey with number 7 for ingame menu.
Right, but the point of the thread was to find a way to use/need all 10. You'd think that there be some time of discussion about hotkey usage, different senarios and compositions that may call for it, or maybe how you would have to position other hotkeys and your hand on your keyboard to make it work. But nope, people are just kinda listing there hotkey setup.
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On July 02 2013 06:49 kill619 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 01 2013 21:45 Existor wrote:On July 01 2013 20:48 kill619 wrote:
Why is everyone posting their hotkeys, none of which use all 10 hotkeys like the op is asking about? Because no reason to use all 10 hotkeys except to look like a pro? For example I use hotkey with number 7 for ingame menu. Right, but the point of the thread was to find a way to use/need all 10. You'd think that there be some time of discussion about hotkey usage, different senarios and compositions that may call for it, or maybe how you would have to position other hotkeys and your hand on your keyboard to make it work. But nope, people are just kinda listing there hotkey setup.
like using 8,9,0 for nexus in bw because of (P)robes?
everything is customizable in sc2...little need for tricks, only trick would be remapping the keys.
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I moved my hot-keys down to qwert being my control groups. I only use those five and tab through, although I think if I remember right alt+key is the other five groups.
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1- units
2- units
3- high priority units like SwH/Infestor/Muta
3- @ Hive Vipers
F3- additional units when needed
F4- additional units when needed
4- Queens (4v + shift + space + left click + space + left, etc)
5- Main base Hat (double tap works for nice camera location while a single tap lets me keep quick tabs on inject status)
6- All Hatcheries
7- Upgrades
8-0 Creep tumors
W-E-R: 2nd (always Lair/Hive), 3rd, and 4th base Camera locations
Mouse thumb button: 99% of time its my universal hatch rally point for units
F5- Outside enemy choke/base Camera location. If I include double tap 5 this gives me 6 locations which works fine for me.
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EPT
