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[Show] Unfiltered w/ ChanmanV and Destiny - Page 17

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 15 16 17 18 19 33 Next All
ChanmanV
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1156 Posts
July 24 2013 16:22 GMT
#321
VOD from yesterdays episode

Pt 1


Pt 2


Pt 3
Fishriot
Profile Joined May 2010
United States621 Posts
July 30 2013 13:32 GMT
#322
Love the show Chanman, I really enjoy how you guys just sort of talk about things you find interesting instead of just sticking to rigid segments/schedules.
Zax19
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Czech Republic1136 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-30 14:33:53
July 30 2013 14:30 GMT
#323
Oh boy, I hope Destiny trolls the shit out of Tara :D
EDIT: BTW you could have invited Ms Spite instead, then you could have an actual serious discussion
Really Blizz, really? - Darnell
ChanmanV
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1156 Posts
July 30 2013 17:39 GMT
#324
On July 30 2013 23:30 Zax19 wrote:
Oh boy, I hope Destiny trolls the shit out of Tara :D
EDIT: BTW you could have invited Ms Spite instead, then you could have an actual serious discussion


True and Im going to see if spyte will call in but Tara's video is what started the convo recently so was the logical choice.
ChanmanV
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1156 Posts
July 30 2013 17:42 GMT
#325
Tara Babcock and LiquidSheth on the show today.
Facultyadjutant
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
Sweden1876 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-30 22:21:08
July 30 2013 22:11 GMT
#326
Regarding Kennigit

Female gamers make out a huge proportion of the total gamer base, even if just starcraft 2 is heavily skewed to male (if that is even true) then that is completely irrelevant because we are trying to BROADEN esport.

So how to get the real amount of procentual women into starcraft2 esports? Well having women in meaningful position maybe?



A lot of men are on teams ''undeservingly'' only because of PR and is kennigit meaning that they should be dropped?


Who can say that - regardless if it's a woman or not - maddelisk hasn't marketed herself good? Just like Geoff markets EG brilliantly; Maddelisk is doing great work personally in millenium.

#1 FAN OF TERRY THE INTERN - NONY AND IDRA NUMBER #1, EVERY DAY. AXIOM MANOR - Axiom: Ryung, Alicia, Heart and Crank under the Don TotalBiscuit and the Donnesa Genna Bain- Join the family http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=396090#2
Erik.TheRed
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1655 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-30 22:31:08
July 30 2013 22:19 GMT
#327
IMO Kennigit's argument is flawed here, it isn't any team's obligation to recruit players purely based on skill. It's overly idealistic to think that teams need to recruit the best players and give them a stable career but there are so many other variables involved in maintaining a company (ALL teams are companies). If a team manager thinks that a random pick-up is worth the cost, then so be it. Esports isn't a charity that guarantees every ladder try-hard a salary.

If a team wants to recruit only girls, or only college students, or only Americans, then why shouldn't they be able to? If it's truly a bad move, then they will go under. Let the market decide and not some ideal that only the "most skilled" deserve any potential. In some cases, the ends justify the means especially if it means that up-and-coming female gamers will have people to look up to and it fosters better female players in the future (even if that's 5+ years down the line)
"See you space cowboy"
Zax19
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Czech Republic1136 Posts
July 30 2013 22:40 GMT
#328
The way I understood Kennigit was that if we want "equality" then it should start at the top level. It's impossible to be respectful to all women and not objectify them when teams hire them exactly because the viewers objectify them, thus reinforcing the problem.
Really Blizz, really? - Darnell
Erik.TheRed
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1655 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-30 23:33:46
July 30 2013 23:29 GMT
#329
On July 31 2013 07:40 Zax19 wrote:
The way I understood Kennigit was that if we want "equality" then it should start at the top level. It's impossible to be respectful to all women and not objectify them when teams hire them exactly because the viewers objectify them, thus reinforcing the problem.


I wasn't aware that teams were picking up female players in order for people to objectify them. And just because some people do disrespect them after the fact doesn't mean that the team had insincere intentions for picking them up in the first place.

It's honestly bullshit to think that teams are not supposed to recruit players for reasons other than pure skill. First of all, there's no good metric to skill or potential besides a lot of tournament results -- and the few players with that sort of repertoire are already the ones making good money. The root of this argument really has nothing to do with female gamers not being "skilled enough", because if we dig deep enough we can find plenty of other cases where male players were given preferential treatment for one reason or another. Just like in the "real world", recruitment might come down to something as arbitrary as friendship or charisma.

It's not even like you can claim that teams are falsely advertising the female pickups either. From what I've seen in the announcements nobody is promising a GSL champion when adding a new member to the roster. The recent trend of most NA teams starting academies should be more evidence that our community values diversity and player growth. Unless you're also willing to argue that it's "disrespectful" for teams to hire b-teamers, I just don't see how you can actually argue for this purely skill-based equity environment.


"See you space cowboy"
nucLeaRTV
Profile Joined May 2011
Romania822 Posts
July 30 2013 23:56 GMT
#330
Tonight's show is one of the best I've heard in the last time. So many good points brought up.

Destiny, TB, Kenngit, Sheth, Tara.

I also just found out about Quantic Katilyn,
"Having your own haters means you are famous"
Zax19
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Czech Republic1136 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-31 00:33:48
July 31 2013 00:31 GMT
#331
On July 31 2013 08:29 Erik.TheRed wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 31 2013 07:40 Zax19 wrote:
The way I understood Kennigit was that if we want "equality" then it should start at the top level. It's impossible to be respectful to all women and not objectify them when teams hire them exactly because the viewers objectify them, thus reinforcing the problem.


I wasn't aware that teams were picking up female players in order for people to objectify them. And just because some people do disrespect them after the fact doesn't mean that the team had insincere intentions for picking them up in the first place.

It's honestly bullshit to think that teams are not supposed to recruit players for reasons other than pure skill. First of all, there's no good metric to skill or potential besides a lot of tournament results -- and the few players with that sort of repertoire are already the ones making good money. The root of this argument really has nothing to do with female gamers not being "skilled enough", because if we dig deep enough we can find plenty of other cases where male players were given preferential treatment for one reason or another. Just like in the "real world", recruitment might come down to something as arbitrary as friendship or charisma.

It's not even like you can claim that teams are falsely advertising the female pickups either. From what I've seen in the announcements nobody is promising a GSL champion when adding a new member to the roster. The recent trend of most NA teams starting academies should be more evidence that our community values diversity and player growth. Unless you're also willing to argue that it's "disrespectful" for teams to hire b-teamers, I just don't see how you can actually argue for this purely skill-based equity environment.

I’ll try to put it this way – if there is a smaller portion of females picked up by teams for their skill than males then it’s difficult to expect the community not to bash females because their skill matters less. There is both demand and supply of attractive females in esports. Most of the time the argument is that the community should change their approach (lesser demand) but the organisations still fuel these arguments by hiring females on this pretext. Both sides should try to change it but the demand side of things gets attacked despite being the more difficult to change.
Really Blizz, really? - Darnell
NightOfTheDead
Profile Joined August 2009
Lithuania1711 Posts
July 31 2013 06:18 GMT
#332
Great episode, some real in-depth discussion going on for almost 3 hours, wow.
Zax19
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Czech Republic1136 Posts
July 31 2013 10:09 GMT
#333
BTW simple example of a good female only tournament - Before an MLG you advertise that any female in the open bracket will have the chance to enter a female bracket too. I can’t really imagine an easy verification process online so they’d have to risk not knowing the number of players in advance. Then you ask every female upon checking in, play the games on the side (probably similarly to the American invitational) and depending on the turn-out you put some of them on the stream or cast them from replays. In other words, I’d definitely run them alongside some other tournament and preferably offline. I know it’s a big constriction but it’s the only way to prevent cheating. On the bright side, almost any local LAN can do a female only bracket on the side, it shouldn’t take much more effort considering the number of female players…
Really Blizz, really? - Darnell
Gonzo103
Profile Joined July 2011
Germany220 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-07-31 10:26:09
July 31 2013 10:23 GMT
#334
Hy Chanmann,

gratz to yesterdays show. It was a really good in-depth discussion with amazing guests. Enjoyed it a lot!
Please keep on doing your great work!

Oh and i really like sheth as a guest in the show! Would even consider bringing him in as a second co-host - it´s like good vs. evil together with destiny. :D
ChanmanV
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1156 Posts
August 01 2013 00:09 GMT
#335
VODs from yesterday

Part 1


Part 2


Part 3
DrAbuse
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany209 Posts
September 03 2013 19:34 GMT
#336
No show today?? :´{
eu.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/186292/1/DrAbuse/
Jawra
Profile Joined June 2011
Sweden146 Posts
September 04 2013 15:55 GMT
#337
Where is mr. Chan? :'////
Zax19
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Czech Republic1136 Posts
September 04 2013 18:14 GMT
#338
Really Blizz, really? - Darnell
ChanmanV
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1156 Posts
September 10 2013 19:17 GMT
#339
Show today 5pm EDT w/ guest Trump
Zelniq
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
United States7166 Posts
September 10 2013 20:29 GMT
#340
What game is this listed under on Twitch? Sc2? Because the android twitch app is only able to browse, not search, for channels.
ModeratorBlame yourself or God
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