EPTApart from that, don't care what the Satouri guy says: he was stupid enough to says it on internet, if you want privacy, it's not the good place. If it was a joke, he has asks for trouble. If not, well... He deserves more than a suspension. But i can't say whether or not, so i don't care. Other peoples handles that.
Stephano suspended by Evil Geniuses - Page 129
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DuckNuked
France60 Posts
Apart from that, don't care what the Satouri guy says: he was stupid enough to says it on internet, if you want privacy, it's not the good place. If it was a joke, he has asks for trouble. If not, well... He deserves more than a suspension. But i can't say whether or not, so i don't care. Other peoples handles that. | ||
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Big-t
Austria1350 Posts
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oBlade
United States5581 Posts
On October 15 2012 17:17 Lightspeaker wrote: The fact that people defend this kind of conduct is the reason esports will never become truly mainstream... This kind of thing is unacceptable from a professional acting in a public role and representing a company. Until everyone understands that and gets on board with that principle we're not going to get anywhere. Bluntly your personal opinion on what he said doesn't matter, nor does my personal opinion, neither does the legal standpoint that people are debating. What matters is that sponsors absolutely will not tolerate people who represent them doing this kind of thing and neither will the general public. Thats why it should matter to everyone here, too; because this kind of behaviour without punishment WILL scare sponsors away since they won't want to risk being presented in a bad light by the teams they sponsor letting people get away with things that will put the public off. As people have mentioned previously, most Korean players by and large behave impeccably professionally, many without being flat personalities like everyone seems to be scared of (see MC for an example). If everyone could follow their example then we'd all be a lot better off. I don't know what "truly mainstream" means, and I think it's something that people specifically avoid defining so they can convince people through emotion instead of reason. I also don't know why you take it for granted that whatever "truly mainstream" is, it's something that this scene should aspire to. If you take a look at competitive gaming in say 1999 and then now, you should notice it's a lot different (mainly just in the sense of more people, more content, more money). If you just take a gander at the TL sidebar, you can see there is a lot of shit going on. Not to mention all the stuff that's not listed (events for other games, people playing casually online). Now it's hard for me to believe that this huge and diverse group of people making different kinds of content is suddenly not going to "get anywhere" because of your poorly defined notions of professionalism. Let me use an analogy. Probably in the 50s, people weren't sure what would happen to television, if it was just a fad (it after all didn't compare to the big screen) or something that would stick around. Despite that we haven't figured out what "mainstream" means yet, I think it's safe to say television would fit under whatever definition we chose. Now would you say something like HBO or MTV are standing in the way of television becoming mainstream? A Clockwork Orange or The Moon is Blue were stopping film from becoming mainstream? Too offensive? You know you're growing precisely when you have such a huge variety of content to pick from that groups of people (groups who don't even follow your gaming scene) are getting pissed off, which is not to say I endorse the petty vendettas of SRS. There are over 60 streams going. There's more content than I could consume if I spent all my time watching it. And that spawns all kinds of sites to post recaps, interviews, etc... which is just more stuff I don't personally have time to watch. And you know what I do if I come across something I find objectionable? I stuff it in the "I physically don't have time for this" pile and move on. Competitive gaming is so big that it can survive the retirement of games, even its most successful ones. I don't think Stephano talking to a guy on battle.net is holding it back! Maybe SRS is doing their best to, though. | ||
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Blacktion
United Kingdom1148 Posts
On October 15 2012 17:56 Big-t wrote: Welcome to the Internet: One wrong sentence and you are fucked >< Obviously someone whos well known with internet communities are going to get busted for saying questionable things on the internet. Its like a normal celebrity saying something stupid within earshot of a "reporter" from one of those trashy womens magazines, its gonna end up plastered all over the place. In fact its worse on the internet, because anyone can screencap as proof anything that appears on their screen with the press of a button. Bottom line is, i can say what i want on the net, because no one gives a fuck about me, but stephano, with his reputation and the reputation of his team and sponsors on the line, shouldve been more careful. | ||
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BobGray
Australia3 Posts
I'm pretty sure Kiedis claimed that the girl looked like a fully developed woman, and he only found out after the act was already done that she was only 14, maybe the same thing happened to stephano (if in fact he wasn't joking in the first place) Say for example a mature looking attractive mid teen girl is in a club with a fake id. (happens) You're drinking and having a good time, and you end up going home with her. Are you going to demand to see 100 points of id? No you're not. If had unlimited resources, one of the many things I would do would be to support a team, and let them joke about whatever they wanted and not have to answer to sponsors, or to the community. | ||
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DirtyDuck
Belgium11 Posts
On October 15 2012 17:59 oBlade wrote: I don't know what "truly mainstream" means, and I think it's something that people specifically avoid defining so they can convince people through emotion instead of reason. I also don't know why you take it for granted that whatever "truly mainstream" is, it's something that this scene should aspire to. If you take a look at competitive gaming in say 1999 and then now, you should notice it's a lot different (mainly just in the sense of more people, more content, more money). If you just take a gander at the TL sidebar, you can see there is a lot of shit going on. Not to mention all the stuff that's not listed (events for other games, people playing casually online). Now it's hard for me to believe that this huge and diverse group of people making different kinds of content is suddenly not going to "get anywhere" because of your poorly defined notions of professionalism. Let me use an analogy. Probably in the 50s, people weren't sure what would happen to television, if it was just a fad (it after all didn't compare to the big screen) or something that would stick around. Despite that we haven't figured out what "mainstream" means yet, I think it's safe to say television would fit under whatever definition we chose. Now would you say something like HBO or MTV are standing in the way of television becoming mainstream? A Clockwork Orange or The Moon is Blue were stopping film from becoming mainstream? Too offensive? You know you're growing precisely when you have such a huge variety of content to pick from that groups of people (groups who don't even follow your gaming scene) are getting pissed off, which is not to say I endorse the petty vendettas of SRS. There are over 60 streams going. There's more content than I could consume if I spent all my time watching it. And that spawns all kinds of sites to post recaps, interviews, etc... which is just more stuff I don't personally have time to watch. And you know what I do if I come across something I find objectionable? I stuff it in the "I physically don't have time for this" pile and move on. Competitive gaming is so big that it can survive the retirement of games, even its most successful ones. I don't think Stephano talking to a guy on battle.net is holding it back! Maybe SRS is doing their best to, though. The thing is that you need to compare the right things: 1) We are talking sports here, not TV. 2) It is not the content that fucked up, but an actor of the content I think when he meant mainstream, he ment accepted by the mainstream like any other sport, soccer, tennis, horse riding, etc etc...That progamers get a status that is recognized by society, not an self proclaimed title of athlete, that it is broadcasted alongside other sport shows, that legal standarts grow, that the progamers get salary based upon a scheme like every other normal job, etc... To compare Stephano's comment alongside a romanced fictional history like Clockwork Orange or let's say even more violent, the Millenium books, this is absolutely not comparable. You try to put on a same level a fiction (even if it is based on real events) to a real life statement. The first one, you know, that it is a history with a specific goal, the other one is a down to earth sentence by a real living human being. The thing is, that you really need to distinguish (again) between the right things: There are different things going on here, on the one hand public image and its representation and on the other hand a personal feel of what moral standarts are. The second one is subjective and really a thinking process that is personal to everyone of us. As for the first one, it is an objective standart: no company, even joke or not, does not want to have such representation - be it EG or sponsors - neither does the general public want to think that these companies are represented by such people/comments. Really, Stephano may have a good RTS game sense, he definitelly is not smart at ALL. He is a public person, his FB is followed 10K+ people, he needs to take care of what he shows of his attitude or not. I am not saying he cannot do this or this, I am saying he needs to take care how and when. Come on, he owned nearly 200k US $ this year, did he really think that it would come without somekind of backlash? If so he is just plain dumb, him being 19 or not. This is just how life is. What concerns me though, is what all this shows about his mental balance. I wonder if it is something all progamers encounter or if it is him just being desperate. Someone with a normal sexlife wouldn't need to feel the need to brag with a friend over such things. It is not the age of the girl that is relevant, it is the fact that he said 'abuse' a 14 year old girl. I mean, he is 19, it is more or less normal to have intercourse with 14-15-16 year olds (boy or girl :-) ), but to have this view on it of abusing, is in my opinion not normal and sick. | ||
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pOnarreT
155 Posts
On October 15 2012 18:36 BobGray wrote: Anthony Kiedis Admitted to having sex with a 14 year old in his auto biography scar tissue (he was an adult at the time and the girl turned out to be some chief of police's daughter) Nothing happened to him because of it... I'm pretty sure Kiedis claimed that the girl looked like a fully developed woman, and he only found out after the act was already done that she was only 14, maybe the same thing happened to stephano (if in fact he wasn't joking in the first place) Say for example a mature looking attractive mid teen girl is in a club with a fake id. (happens) You're drinking and having a good time, and you end up going home with her. Are you going to demand to see 100 points of id? No you're not. If had unlimited resources, one of the many things I would do would be to support a team, and let them joke about whatever they wanted and not have to answer to sponsors, or to the community. No, you probably won't ask for ID but you still did an illegal thing. And he was dumb enough to mention it on the internet. If he was joking, then he should say so to the community and not apologize, but the apology of the individual and the team didn't even mention anything about a joke or even just try to cover it as a joke. | ||
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Assirra
Belgium4169 Posts
On October 15 2012 18:36 BobGray wrote: Anthony Kiedis Admitted to having sex with a 14 year old in his auto biography scar tissue (he was an adult at the time and the girl turned out to be some chief of police's daughter) Nothing happened to him because of it... I'm pretty sure Kiedis claimed that the girl looked like a fully developed woman, and he only found out after the act was already done that she was only 14, maybe the same thing happened to stephano (if in fact he wasn't joking in the first place) Say for example a mature looking attractive mid teen girl is in a club with a fake id. (happens) You're drinking and having a good time, and you end up going home with her. Are you going to demand to see 100 points of id? No you're not. If had unlimited resources, one of the many things I would do would be to support a team, and let them joke about whatever they wanted and not have to answer to sponsors, or to the community. Who has unlimited resources lol. You want bill gates or something to sponsor a SC2 team? In case you didn't noticed. The sponsors is the money of the teams so they can't just not answer it. | ||
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MateShade
Australia736 Posts
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BobGray
Australia3 Posts
On October 15 2012 19:02 Assirra wrote: Who has unlimited resources lol. You want bill gates or something to sponsor a SC2 team? In case you didn't noticed. The sponsors is the money of the teams so they can't just not answer it. It's amazing how many people haven't ever heard of a hypothetical or a hyperbole If I "hypothetically" had unlimited resources (Hyperbole) I would do what I said above. In my hypothetical scenario, my team would have no need for external sponsors, as I would be their sponsor, as such they would still have to answer to a sponsor, but they would be able to get away with saying just about anything... I'm sure I there would be some kind of boundary, but I wouldn't care about this whole debacle for example as I'm more of a relaxed individual. Get it? On October 15 2012 18:57 pOnarreT wrote: No, you probably won't ask for ID but you still did an illegal thing. And he was dumb enough to mention it on the internet. If he was joking, then he should say so to the community and not apologize, but the apology of the individual and the team didn't even mention anything about a joke or even just try to cover it as a joke. But you as an individual could empathize outside of what the law says right? Regaurdless of what the bloke did or didn't do, surely in such a scenario you would have done something similar at 19 years of age. You show me an adult that says they've never stepped outside of the law once in their life (intentionally or not) then I will show you a liar. I could get into a big spiel as to how complex the law is and all of that, but it's a different debate (although it does somewhat pertain to this) As for the apology, it's obviously forced. His personal opinion probably differs somewhat to the words that he choked out. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 15 2012 19:08 MateShade wrote: Why is this thread 129 pages... Because people need to argue whether they can't comprehend that sponsors DO NOT want to be affiliated with someone who says things like that. Hope my wording was right. | ||
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Snusmumriken
Sweden1717 Posts
And regarding double-standards. Imagine if it was Naniwa who was caught on stream saying shit like this, or any of the other bs Stephano says... lastly, TL is certainly NOT the place to discuss the age of consent. | ||
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Zocat
Germany2229 Posts
On October 15 2012 18:57 pOnarreT wrote: No, you probably won't ask for ID but you still did an illegal thing. And he was dumb enough to mention it on the internet. If he was joking, then he should say so to the community and not apologize, but the apology of the individual and the team didn't even mention anything about a joke or even just try to cover it as a joke. He said it was a joke on his twitter. Of course the official apology will not contain the explanation "it was a joke", since a lot of people would see it as an excuse. And some would probably be like: "YOU DONT JOKE ABOUT SUCH THINGS!! PUNISH HIM HARDER!". | ||
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schaf
Germany1326 Posts
On October 15 2012 18:36 BobGray wrote: Anthony Kiedis Admitted to having sex with a 14 year old in his auto biography scar tissue (he was an adult at the time and the girl turned out to be some chief of police's daughter) Nothing happened to him because of it... I'm pretty sure Kiedis claimed that the girl looked like a fully developed woman, and he only found out after the act was already done that she was only 14, maybe the same thing happened to stephano (if in fact he wasn't joking in the first place) Say for example a mature looking attractive mid teen girl is in a club with a fake id. (happens) You're drinking and having a good time, and you end up going home with her. Are you going to demand to see 100 points of id? No you're not. If had unlimited resources, one of the many things I would do would be to support a team, and let them joke about whatever they wanted and not have to answer to sponsors, or to the community. dude, this is not about him having sex with a 14yo. It's about him making fun of abuse... | ||
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BoBiNoU
France181 Posts
On October 15 2012 21:26 schaf wrote: dude, this is not about him having sex with a 14yo. It's about him making fun of abuse... dude I agree with you joking should be forbidden | ||
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ddrddrddrddr
1344 Posts
On October 15 2012 21:26 schaf wrote: dude, this is not about him having sex with a 14yo. It's about him making fun of abuse... BDSM is totally valid for relationships where normal sex has become mundane and stale. Nothing wrong with abuse with safe words between two consenting people. Now we just need to make sure the girl in question is in a secret but stable relationship with him. And we need to keep on with the supposition that this is not about the 14 yo thing. Or if he was totally joking of course. Maybe he was actually talking about an older woman and only exaggerate the age... Hey you know what? We actually don't know shit about Stephano. What's the point of this thread again? | ||
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schaf
Germany1326 Posts
On October 15 2012 21:28 BoBiNoU wrote: dude I agree with you joking should be forbidden of course not I was making a point that the whole *if he did it, blablabla*-talk leads nowhere, because that is not what was punished. | ||
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jexxto
United Kingdom284 Posts
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echobong
Canada92 Posts
I'm not defending his actions. I'm just saying this shit happens. One of my teachers lost his job and side photography business because he made out with a girl at a party that turned out to be underage. He was lied to by the girl at the time but it didn't matter, his life was ruined. Let's not do the same to Steph. | ||
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GohgamX
Canada1096 Posts
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