EPTWhere is the big combined Teamleague? - Page 2
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revel8
United Kingdom3022 Posts
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Caladbolg
2855 Posts
On October 08 2012 23:16 revel8 wrote: SC2 is not really a team game though. It is an individual thing. Players prioritise GSL and other individual tournaments over team-leagues. The only way you can get them to prioritise a team-league would be to incentivise them with appearance money. Also I suspect Kespa will try and set up a seperate SC2 domestic scene to try and diminish GOM and GSL's importance. The amazing thing about proleague was that it was able to create such a prestigious climate that players would practice for it above and beyond individual leagues. And that was with a negligible prize pool! Basically that's what made BW such a huge deal, because people could follow teams and not just players. The game itself is played individually, but the excitement was in the team aspect (like, if your star player failed, and then suddenly one of your slumping players performs amazingly and gives your ace a chance to redeem himself in the ace match). I think this is the future. Unfortunately, I also things many teams will be sacrificed to reach this. I see a solid 6 surviving in KeSPA (SKT, KT, CJ, KHAN, STX, Stars - sorry T8 fans) and 4 in GSL/ESF (IM, ST, MVP, TSL - sorry Slayers fans) | ||
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Zer atai
United States691 Posts
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Evangelist
1246 Posts
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Aunvilgod
2653 Posts
On October 08 2012 21:25 X3GoldDot wrote: would create way too many teams thus way too many matches which takes up massive amounts of time imho, they should make qualifiers then a 10 or 12 team bracket if it were to merge You don´t NEED to see every game. | ||
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ShroudeD
Greece1333 Posts
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revel8
United Kingdom3022 Posts
On October 08 2012 23:32 Caladbolg wrote: The amazing thing about proleague was that it was able to create such a prestigious climate that players would practice for it above and beyond individual leagues. And that was with a negligible prize pool! Basically that's what made BW such a huge deal, because people could follow teams and not just players. The game itself is played individually, but the excitement was in the team aspect (like, if your star player failed, and then suddenly one of your slumping players performs amazingly and gives your ace a chance to redeem himself in the ace match). I think this is the future. Unfortunately, I also things many teams will be sacrificed to reach this. I see a solid 6 surviving in KeSPA (SKT, KT, CJ, KHAN, STX, Stars - sorry T8 fans) and 4 in GSL/ESF (IM, ST, MVP, TSL - sorry Slayers fans) Well I am not the person to talk about BW, however I think that the KESPA players were paid salary (at least the top players) so the actual prize money was not required as such. Kespa considers itself a bigger player than GOM, so I cannot see a situation where they will accept the status quo in SC2, where GSL is the number 1 SC2 tournament in Korea. GSL is what players want to win, Code S is where players want to qualify for and GSL is the tournament where Domestic and Foreign fans pay money to watch. Where does this leave Kespa SC2 tournaments? In the shade of GSL as it currently stands. I cannot see Kespa being happy to see GOM get all the prestige and attention that they get from GSL. I really think that Kespa will setup a rival tournament to GSL, maybe a revamped OSL or something new to compete. Kespa players will not play in GSL next year and only play in Kespa tournaments and possible a Foreign Tournament or two. The Korean domestic scene will be split in two. This is what I predict will happen once the Kespa pros are on par with eSF players. They seem to be getting there already, at least for some Kespa players. If this is indeed Kespa's aims for next year, then I cannot see a combined team-league occuring. I think a major factor in deciding the future of Korean SC2 scene is whether Kespa has managed to bring over the BW fans domestically to follow them in SC2. I don't know the viewing figues post transition, so cannot really see whether the Kespa model is sustainable or not in SC2. If it is, then I predict a split scene next year. This is just my speculation, so my fears may turn out unfounded. | ||
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MrMotionPicture
United States4327 Posts
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IMLyte
Canada714 Posts
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WindWolf
Sweden11767 Posts
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MyFirstProbe
Netherlands294 Posts
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supernovamaniac
United States3046 Posts
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vthree
Hong Kong8039 Posts
On October 08 2012 23:32 Caladbolg wrote: The amazing thing about proleague was that it was able to create such a prestigious climate that players would practice for it above and beyond individual leagues. And that was with a negligible prize pool! Basically that's what made BW such a huge deal, because people could follow teams and not just players. The game itself is played individually, but the excitement was in the team aspect (like, if your star player failed, and then suddenly one of your slumping players performs amazingly and gives your ace a chance to redeem himself in the ace match). I think this is the future. Unfortunately, I also things many teams will be sacrificed to reach this. I see a solid 6 surviving in KeSPA (SKT, KT, CJ, KHAN, STX, Stars - sorry T8 fans) and 4 in GSL/ESF (IM, ST, MVP, TSL - sorry Slayers fans) Like someone pointed out earlier, the actual prize pool is fairly small compare to the salary some of these top players make. And I would think the salary is dependent a lot on team league performance as well. So it is not surprising some players focused on team leagues over individual leagues. Not saying that they are selfish or anything like that, but we cannot ignore this factor when discussing difference between PL and GSTL. I think some foreign fans might not like a joint league. Because it will at least be just as long and involve as many games as PL (Kespa/sponsors won't settle for anything less and they shouldn't since korea is still their main target audience). So we are looking like 3-3.5 months with most teams playing each weekend. Which means a lot of conflict with foreign tournaments. And since I don't see Kespa players choosing to play in foreigners events over PL, we get 2 scenarios 1) Some eSF players still come to foreign events and skip the team league. So say STX beats MVP (but Keen/DRG is at MLG). There will be questions as to whether it is a 'legit' win. 2) eSF don't come to foreign events during the 'season' Neither seem to be too appealing. Maybe they can schedule around the 'big' tournaments (which GSTL tries to do). But I am not sure you can schedule around MLG, IPL, Dreamhack, ASUS ROG, etc etc in a season which is already long. | ||
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Mackus
England1681 Posts
No one's picked up on that NASL takes longer than 3-4 months per event yet most people concern about how long a team league would last - The solution is obvious by using the NASL format, the only problem with that it being an online tournament is the Team Ace could easily imposter and play all the games for them. | ||
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vthree
Hong Kong8039 Posts
On October 09 2012 01:25 Mackus wrote: Too many analogies regarding with Football, it's not the same 1 is a National Sport, 1 is a eSport. No one's picked up on that NASL takes longer than 3-4 months per event yet most people concern about how long a team league would last - The solution is obvious by using the NASL format, the only problem with that it being an online tournament is the Team Ace could easily imposter and play all the games for them. No. Live offline team leagues is SO much better in terms of atmosphere and seeing player interactions. Which is the best thing about PL and GSTL. | ||
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Sjokola
Netherlands800 Posts
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Caladbolg
2855 Posts
On October 09 2012 00:48 vthree wrote: Like someone pointed out earlier, the actual prize pool is fairly small compare to the salary some of these top players make. And I would think the salary is dependent a lot on team league performance as well. So it is not surprising some players focused on team leagues over individual leagues. Not saying that they are selfish or anything like that, but we cannot ignore this factor when discussing difference between PL and GSTL. I think some foreign fans might not like a joint league. Because it will at least be just as long and involve as many games as PL (Kespa/sponsors won't settle for anything less and they shouldn't since korea is still their main target audience). So we are looking like 3-3.5 months with most teams playing each weekend. Which means a lot of conflict with foreign tournaments. And since I don't see Kespa players choosing to play in foreigners events over PL, we get 2 scenarios 1) Some eSF players still come to foreign events and skip the team league. So say STX beats MVP (but Keen/DRG is at MLG). There will be questions as to whether it is a 'legit' win. 2) eSF don't come to foreign events during the 'season' Neither seem to be too appealing. Maybe they can schedule around the 'big' tournaments (which GSTL tries to do). But I am not sure you can schedule around MLG, IPL, Dreamhack, ASUS ROG, etc etc in a season which is already long. The salary makes them comfortable, but it's the exposure that amped up proleague to great heights, due to their TV timeslot over the past few years. I think there will be problems with foreign tournaments though, but maybe the contraction will do everyone good, since teams now have a larger talent pool and can afford to send their aces to foreign tournaments without compromising the teamleague. | ||
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Mackus
England1681 Posts
On October 09 2012 01:53 vthree wrote: No. Live offline team leagues is SO much better in terms of atmosphere and seeing player interactions. Which is the best thing about PL and GSTL. It's too costly to fly teams about for Offline shows over an extreme long period | ||
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BAAEEMM
Germany412 Posts
On October 09 2012 03:09 Mackus wrote: It's too costly to fly teams about for Offline shows over an extreme long period Why fly? It's all in Seoul. Or did I misunderstand you? | ||
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GolemMadness
Canada11044 Posts
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