EPT[Resolved] Kespa, GOM, ESF dispute - Page 61
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zeratul_jf
United States808 Posts
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Qikz
United Kingdom12041 Posts
On August 27 2012 02:34 zeratul_jf wrote: Dude i wish Kespa would just let them play, I just wanna see the best starcraft possible and i think the Kespa players can make this happen, not only to their own skill but also motivating the GSL players to train harder and become better. This is basically my thoughts on the entire thing. I know I've made points about various things but it all comes down to Kespa just letting them play so we can all enjoy more great games. | ||
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naastyOne
491 Posts
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Myrddraal
Australia937 Posts
On August 27 2012 02:33 Sethronu wrote: As for KeSPA 'killing off Gom' stuff... again, KeSPA is NOT a broadcaster, they do NOT gain revenue from OSL streams or what have you. It doesn't matter much to KeSPA whether their teams' play is broadcasted by OGN or GomTV; they might prefer OGN as their primary broadcaster because they have a longer and, in the most recent days, more peaceful relationship with them, but considering that they already have the interest of OGN's viewers, while GSL fanbase is basically untapped potential for them, it makes no sense trying to stifle GomTV just for the sake of it at this point. KeSPA may not gain revenue directly from broadcasting, but popularity of OSL definitely benefits their teams and players. Like I said, the decision to stay out of GSL might not be to intentionally hurt Gom, but that's what it will do. | ||
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6NR
United States1472 Posts
On August 27 2012 02:53 naastyOne wrote: I there... :p | ||
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Yorbon
Netherlands4272 Posts
On August 27 2012 02:33 Sethronu wrote: I assume this post was a reaction to mine, but i'm not really sure, because none of it even makes sense as a reaction on my point. I was trying to explain, in a neutral way, the reason of esf's actions. Oh god, not the "KeSPA screwing with Gom in the past" nonsense again. Read the posts a few pages back, that shit was pretty much made up by GomTV because it's easier to blame 'the bad guys' rather than accepting that you made some bad decisions. As for KeSPA 'killing off Gom' stuff... again, KeSPA is NOT a broadcaster, they do NOT gain revenue from OSL streams or what have you. It doesn't matter much to KeSPA whether their teams' play is broadcasted by OGN or GomTV; they might prefer OGN as their primary broadcaster because they have a longer and, in the most recent days, more peaceful relationship with them, but considering that they already have the interest of OGN's viewers, while GSL fanbase is basically untapped potential for them, it makes no sense trying to stifle GomTV just for the sake of it at this point. And what makes you think KeSPA would want current eSF teams to follow through their pro license requirements etc? At this point in time, they don't even have a sponsor for one of their own teams, it's not very likely they could find the sponsors for another hundred players or more just like that; and having eSF players quit the scene doesn't do any good for KeSPA teams.They need the competition and the rivalry; unlike eSF, they don't rely on income from winning tournaments but rather for showing games - as long as they can prove they are on par or better than eSF, they want eSF to be around. And if their players turn out to be worse than eSF teams, they're basically screwed no matter how you look at it. But all right. First bolded part: Kespa organises osl, which is broadcast by ogn. (source again: liquipedia II: article on kespa) Of course it does in principle not matter what broadcaster is used. ogn only has tv access and a huge history with starcraft broadcast in korea. I hope you can see quite the difference there. Second bolded part: This is my entire point. The consequence of the lack of participation (of kespa in this case) is that the momentum of rivalry shifts to ogn instead of gom. Gsl fanbase will shift to ogn, because gsl tries to be highest level, but can't, because kespa does not allow it's players in gsl. At the same time, osl does have the highest level players, so gsl loses relevance. I'm not saying kespa tries to destroy gom. I'm saying the decision was very convenient from business perspective. It was kespa's gamble to not expect countermeasures from esf, because gom and esf are seperate entities, while osl and kespa less so, as explained in the above stated liquipedia article. Third bolded part: Exactly the same as last part. Kespa wants gsl fanbase to shift to osl, because they organise it. You're not going to tell me you think osl since the transition has an english stream because of equal english viewers? No, they anticipated growing english viewers due to the transition and the coming along of gsl players with this transition. Fourth bolded part: You're actually just agreeing with me. The kespa is organised is via sponsors. The sponsors need exposure. How to create exposure? By having the most relevant, hyped up tournament at this moment. They want esf to come along, but first to their garden. At least to have momentum. I agree with you at one point. Kespa will probably not like the outcome of this. But i think that is because they made a mistake, not because of the players not being ready or whatever reason they give. It's about momentum. I hope i made my point clear.  | ||
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Myrddraal
Australia937 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:08 Yorbon wrote: I assume this post was a reaction to mine, but i'm not really sure, because none of it even makes sense as a reaction on my point. I was trying to explain, in a neutral way, the reason of esf's actions. I think it was a broad response to the five of us who responded to his questions/arguments. | ||
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xuanzue
Colombia1747 Posts
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BgSBendeR
Canada170 Posts
On August 27 2012 02:34 zeratul_jf wrote: Dude i wish Kespa would just let them play, I just wanna see the best starcraft possible and i think the Kespa players can make this happen, not only to their own skill but also motivating the GSL players to train harder and become better. Blame eSF, KeSPA was offering the best starcraft possible through OSL. eSF pulled out because GOM bribed them to do so. KeSPA = good guys, GOM/eSF = bad guys. | ||
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Zennith
United States795 Posts
On August 26 2012 10:36 LuckoftheIrish wrote: Nope, but you know what Kespa players don't have? Actual free agency. And they absolutely fucking should. Free Agency should be a right for every player. | ||
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Teddyman
Finland362 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:27 BgSBendeR wrote: Blame eSF, KeSPA was offering the best starcraft possible through OSL. eSF pulled out because GOM bribed them to do so. KeSPA = good guys, GOM/eSF = bad guys. What about the non-ESF players who pulled out? | ||
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LuckoftheIrish
United States4791 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:28 Zennith wrote: And they absolutely fucking should. Free Agency should be a right for every player. Totally agree. Kespa, of course, doesn't do business that way. | ||
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bo1b
Australia12814 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:31 Teddyman wrote: What about the non-ESF players who pulled out? They got bribed as well. | ||
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xBillehx
United States1289 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:31 Teddyman wrote: What about the non-ESF players who pulled out? Bribed them too obviously, with millions of esports dollars each. | ||
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BgSBendeR
Canada170 Posts
If KeSPA delays entry to GSL until Season 5, Kespa players will have fully transitioned to sc2 by then would be a lot better than the current sc2 pros since kespa players actually practice >.> At the moment, it's not an even playing field. People will watch the league with the best players. GOM wants to secure that spot which is why they're being dicks and bribing eSF to pull out of OSL. KeSPA is doing what any business would do. Protecting their brand. What' wrong with that. | ||
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bo1b
Australia12814 Posts
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BgSBendeR
Canada170 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:38 bo1b wrote: Its actually amazing how an unsuccessful company like Gom can afford to bribe 8 different teams. bribing doesn't necessary has to be with money.. | ||
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bo1b
Australia12814 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:40 BgSBendeR wrote: bribing doesn't necessary has to be with money.. What does gom have to offer the 8 players that chose to withdraw from the osl that kespa doesn't? | ||
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
you say every kespa player represence the whole organisation ? because they HAVE TO because kespa forced everything in what it is now, sure successfull but successfull slaves ... only the kespa team really represence the kespa ... the other teams just have contracts with them | ||
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Teddyman
Finland362 Posts
On August 27 2012 03:36 BgSBendeR wrote: The reason eSF wants KeSPA to participate in the GSL so badly is actually quite simple. They want to beat the KeSPA players now while they're still catching and declare themselves as the best in sc2... If KeSPA delays entry to GSL until Season 5, Kespa players will have fully transitioned to sc2 by then would be a lot better than the current sc2 pros since kespa players actually practice >.> At the moment, it's not an even playing field. People will watch the league with the best players. GOM wants to secure that spot which is why they're being dicks and bribing eSF to pull out of OSL. KeSPA is doing what any business would do. Protecting their brand. What' wrong with that. How about you post proof of this bribery? You accuse them of something on the level of match fixing. The root of the problem is that KeSPA said they wanted to cooperate but they aren't. If they wanted to cooperate they would treat GSL like the old MSL, not like the old GomTV Classic. Now it's basically "we'll play in your tournament if we happen to have some time left over." | ||
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