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On August 24 2012 00:05 Elroi wrote:
what you guys dont understand is that PL>all for these players/teams. if they went to all the random tournaments they wouldn't be able to play on such a high level.
Which is the saddest part of it all, considering PL's current stupid system.
It's like a huge comedic tradegy.
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On August 24 2012 00:07 Rustug wrote:Show nested quote +On August 23 2012 23:47 StarStruck wrote:On August 23 2012 23:41 DrakeFZX3 wrote:On August 23 2012 23:24 floor exercise wrote:On August 23 2012 23:21 Pimpmuckl wrote:
So basically:
GomTV lets their players play in the "KeSPA"-Tournaments. No problem here.
But KeSPA doesn't allow their players to even try out for GSL? I have _no_ idea why the hell would anyone say this is even remoty "good". The BW Legends stepped up their game SO much and i would have loved to see them compete at a GSL format.
Fuck this shit, why the hell would KeSPA do that, i'm really getting mad now. Because everyone is going crazy for Kespa players and no one gives a shit about Gom players. It's really that simple. There's nowhere that follows SC2 that isn't going crazy for Kespa players in the past few months. The only way a Gom player gets mentioned is if he loses to a Kespa player. So why would they just hand them out? They are in huge demand, a competitor simply says "okay same game give us your players" what would anyone say to that? Probably the dumbest post of the thread. People do go ape shit for guys like MC, DRG, MKP with all the exposure they receive and wins. At the last MLG with the KeSPA tournament people were pretty infatuated with the new kids on the block and when given the stage you could see a difference between your run of the mill Korean and them. They're performers. They understand that and likewise they give the crowd what they want. This is nothing really new to them either. Other than that yeah what floor said is really off the mark lol. The way I see it... People are going apeshit about KeSPA players and GOM player who do well or those who are great characters/entertainers. Nobody give a shit about under-performing GOM and KeSPA players. Hasn't this alway the case.. The winners and the characters/entertainers get the glory, the rest are in the shadows until they have a break-out/memorable moment.
Indeed, after all the KeSPA players that attended were the franchise players of their respectful teams.
They get a ton of exposure.
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On August 24 2012 00:02 opterown wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:01 ShadeR wrote:On August 23 2012 23:49 TheDougler wrote:On August 23 2012 23:33 ShadeR wrote:
Are people seriously inferring that Blizzard can MAKE them play??? LOL No but according to the TOS Blizzard can take away their ability to play SC2 if need be. IE, your players won't enter our tournament? They get blacklisted. It probably won't come to that, blizzard will likely say they're monitoring the situation carefully but if they don't enter te GSL soon they could take discretionary measures. You don't see anything wrong with. "Hey if you don't play in this tourney you get punished" Blizzard's vice grip around your balls is incredible. I admire this achievement. similarly though it's "hey we know you want to play in this tourney, but you can't" from kespa
And teams do not have the right to dictate where their players play?
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I can't understand what Kespa gets out of this. How do they benefit in every way? Doesn't this hurt all of the Kespa players??
This is one of those things that makes no sense to me. Do some of the higher-ups just have something against the GSL?
I'm so confused.
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On August 24 2012 00:03 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:01 RvB wrote:On August 23 2012 23:53 StarStruck wrote:On August 23 2012 23:45 naastyOne wrote:On August 23 2012 23:29 StarStruck wrote:On August 23 2012 23:28 naastyOne wrote:On August 23 2012 23:23 StarStruck wrote:As if Blizzard should have a say on the matter. Here's the thing they need to understand and guys like MLG. KeSPA sticks to it's own schedule. They were up in arms about the GOM Classic prior as they thought it was too much with the PL/OSL/MSL. On August 23 2012 23:22 Condor Hero wrote:On August 23 2012 23:08 bo1b wrote:
It's actually mind boggling how far people are going to defend kespa as some sort of good guy, anyone remember leta getting dq'd?
Having said that people jumping the gun before any real information has been released is equally questionable. Leta broke the rules, so Leta got DQ'd. It was a dumbass rule indeed but how was that worse than GSL taking Nani's Code S spot or backing out of their MLG obligations by changing the wording? Yeah, let's just nitpick at each individual thing we don't agree with. -_- On August 23 2012 23:22 TheButtonmen wrote:
First MLG, now GSL.
I won't be watching OGN, I've got no desire to support Kespa if they are going back to their old isolastionic ways and there is plenty of competition for my eye balls. They want to continue being the Premiere League in Korea. They have the network and they want to push their brand. Considering everyone needs Blizard approval to run SC2 tournaments, Blizard kinda has a lot of weight, to throw in the metter. Yeah good luck on that. You've already seen what happened when Blizzard tried to argue the IP rights. Blizzard is counting on KeSPA to give the game more exposure in Korea. Their options are limited whereas KeSPA. Well, they have plenty of options. Blisard can deny them the right to run any tournament. Kespa can still do whatever BS they want, just without any broadcasting and such, and hence, zero profits. On August 23 2012 23:31 Forikorder wrote:On August 23 2012 23:29 StarStruck wrote:On August 23 2012 23:28 naastyOne wrote:On August 23 2012 23:23 StarStruck wrote:As if Blizzard should have a say on the matter. Here's the thing they need to understand and guys like MLG. KeSPA sticks to it's own schedule. They were up in arms about the GOM Classic prior as they thought it was too much with the PL/OSL/MSL. On August 23 2012 23:22 Condor Hero wrote:On August 23 2012 23:08 bo1b wrote:
It's actually mind boggling how far people are going to defend kespa as some sort of good guy, anyone remember leta getting dq'd?
Having said that people jumping the gun before any real information has been released is equally questionable. Leta broke the rules, so Leta got DQ'd. It was a dumbass rule indeed but how was that worse than GSL taking Nani's Code S spot or backing out of their MLG obligations by changing the wording? Yeah, let's just nitpick at each individual thing we don't agree with. -_- On August 23 2012 23:22 TheButtonmen wrote:
First MLG, now GSL.
I won't be watching OGN, I've got no desire to support Kespa if they are going back to their old isolastionic ways and there is plenty of competition for my eye balls. They want to continue being the Premiere League in Korea. They have the network and they want to push their brand. Considering everyone needs Blizard approval to run SC2 tournaments, Blizard kinda has a lot of weight, to throw in the metter. Yeah good luck on that. You've already seen what happened when Blizzard tried to argue the IP rights. they dont have to argue anything, if they press a button KeSPA cant paly SC2 thats a fact Not just that. Considering Korea is, supposed to take US IP pretty seriously, the entire idea that goverment institution can infringe copyright just like that, wwould do terrible damage to Korea`s international relations. I'm sorry but you guys don't have a clue on what you're talking about and missed what I said entirely. KeSPA doesn't need Blizzard. Even if Blizzard could stop them from playing SC2. KeSPA would just bank on their other properties and give SC2 the backdoor. As we've seen before Blizzard believes they need KeSPA to pick up the slack in the Korean market. This is no different from the IP rights from before. In summary, even if Blizzard won the argument and no SC2 for KeSPA they would push their other tournaments and SC2 would hit another big wall in Korea. Not good for business. That's not to say the big guns retire/withdraw from their KeSPA teams and join other teams in SC2. The thing is you still lose exposure and the other developers along with KeSPA would do everything in their power to block SC2. Blizzard doesn't need Kespa either, the sc2 scene has been growing without them and will be without them. It's just that with Kespa involved it will probably go a lot faster like you said. And really Kespa isn't going to pull out now when they've invested so much money and effort into it already you don't just switch to a different game like it's nothing. From everything Blizzard has done over the last couple of years? You can say they don't need them, but here's the catch. Blizzard wants them. They are under the belief that KeSPA can speed up the process with their network.
Logical, KeSPA owns Teams with sponsors, GOM doesn't have teams the are a broadcasting organization.
But I think Blizzard would rather see KeSPA and GOM play nice and have both.
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On August 24 2012 00:04 niteReloaded wrote:
If Kespa continues with this policy, and let's say even forbids its players participation in international tournaments, I can see a massive exodus from Kespa teams to international teams. Maybe law cases, terminations of contracts etc. There should be a measure on how much you can limit someone's freedom.
Yeah, these guys who practiced with their teams together for years and received salaries that are higher than tournament winnings for all but the very few top SC2 pros are surely going to jump ship at the first opportunity. Where the hell are you getting this kind of nonsense from, really.
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On August 24 2012 00:04 niteReloaded wrote:
If Kespa continues with this policy, and let's say even forbids its players participation in international tournaments, I can see a massive exodus from Kespa teams to international teams. Maybe law cases, terminations of contracts etc. There should be a measure on how much you can limit someone's freedom.
The exodus you're talking about already happened. Just after the SC2 release, when all the players who couldn't cope with the pro team environment or thought they don't have a future in the team decided to make the switch.
The remaining players have a different attitude. While some of the declining players might move abroad to milk some foreign money for a year or so before he retires, nobody who's serious about their career will leave - simply because there's nowhere (good) to go.
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On August 24 2012 00:08 JustPassingBy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:05 Elroi wrote:
what you guys dont understand is that PL>all for these players/teams. if they went to all the random tournaments they wouldn't be able to play on such a high level. Which is the saddest part of it all, considering PL's current stupid system. It's like a huge comedic tradegy.
Well after this season it will be only SC2.
However, I agree. This season as a whole is a huge comedic strategy.
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On August 24 2012 00:08 JustPassingBy wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:05 Elroi wrote:
what you guys dont understand is that PL>all for these players/teams. if they went to all the random tournaments they wouldn't be able to play on such a high level. Which is the saddest part of it all, considering PL's current stupid system. It's like a huge comedic tradegy.
No argument there.
I wasn't the only one lambcasting the sheer idiocy of the new format. They were only banking on one thing too. Transition period. -_-
At least it ends soon.
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On August 24 2012 00:05 Elroi wrote:
what you guys dont understand is that PL>all for these players/teams. if they went to all the random tournaments they wouldn't be able to play on such a high level.
After all the coaches and players interviewed expressed a wish for players to particpate in the qualifiers, this is still a shitty decision. There is absolutely no reason that t8 decides not to go to the qualifiers because they're practicing for the spl, but ultimately that should be the teams decision.
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On August 24 2012 00:11 bo1b wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:05 Elroi wrote:
what you guys dont understand is that PL>all for these players/teams. if they went to all the random tournaments they wouldn't be able to play on such a high level. After all the coaches and players interviewed expressed a wish for players to particpate in the qualifiers, this is still a shitty decision. There is absolutely no reason that t8 decides not to go to the qualifiers because they're practicing for the spl, but ultimately that should be the teams decision.
See this is what you aren't getting.
It was the team's decision. KeSPA are the teams.
It's the players who have little say.
You're picking at the wrong bone.
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well its clear to me , that they are doing this because they are scared of GOM. They cant use the reason that their players arent ready because Gom players are in the Starleague. This is clearly a business descision designed to get all / only attention on the Kespa tournaments while gom bites the dust.
Considering Blizzard is one of the sponsors of Gom, they definately wont be to happy about this. I expect to see some fireworks. Popcorn is ready.
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On August 24 2012 00:10 Talin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:04 niteReloaded wrote:
If Kespa continues with this policy, and let's say even forbids its players participation in international tournaments, I can see a massive exodus from Kespa teams to international teams. Maybe law cases, terminations of contracts etc. There should be a measure on how much you can limit someone's freedom. The exodus you're talking about already happened. Just after the SC2 release, when all the players who couldn't cope with the pro team environment or thought they don't have a future in the team decided to make the switch. The remaining players have a different attitude. While some of the declining players might move abroad to milk some foreign money for a year or so before he retires, nobody who's serious about their career will leave.
Yup, look at where MC is today!
My wittle boy is all grown-up. BD
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On August 24 2012 00:10 Salazarz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:04 niteReloaded wrote:
If Kespa continues with this policy, and let's say even forbids its players participation in international tournaments, I can see a massive exodus from Kespa teams to international teams. Maybe law cases, terminations of contracts etc. There should be a measure on how much you can limit someone's freedom. Yeah, these guys who practiced with their teams together for years and received salaries that are higher than tournament winnings for all but the very few top SC2 pros are surely going to jump ship at the first opportunity. Where the hell are you getting this kind of nonsense from, really.
Didn't hiya say he got like 35k a year or something on his stream? That doesn't seem like a very large amount of money to be honest, especially since that's absolutely going to be more then a practice partner.
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On August 24 2012 00:14 bo1b wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:10 Salazarz wrote:On August 24 2012 00:04 niteReloaded wrote:
If Kespa continues with this policy, and let's say even forbids its players participation in international tournaments, I can see a massive exodus from Kespa teams to international teams. Maybe law cases, terminations of contracts etc. There should be a measure on how much you can limit someone's freedom. Yeah, these guys who practiced with their teams together for years and received salaries that are higher than tournament winnings for all but the very few top SC2 pros are surely going to jump ship at the first opportunity. Where the hell are you getting this kind of nonsense from, really. Didn't hiya say he got like 35k a year or something on his stream? That doesn't seem like a very large amount of money to be honest, especially since that's absolutely going to be more then a practice partner.
Better than a lot of non-Kespa players, that's for sure.
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Everyone is bitching, but I totally expected this out of KeSPA (not that I like it.) They want their league to be the best most exclusive league, and ye they are being assholes about it. I hope it changes, but it doesn't look like it will.
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On August 24 2012 00:12 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:11 bo1b wrote:On August 24 2012 00:05 Elroi wrote:
what you guys dont understand is that PL>all for these players/teams. if they went to all the random tournaments they wouldn't be able to play on such a high level. After all the coaches and players interviewed expressed a wish for players to particpate in the qualifiers, this is still a shitty decision. There is absolutely no reason that t8 decides not to go to the qualifiers because they're practicing for the spl, but ultimately that should be the teams decision. See this is what you aren't getting. It was the team's decision. KeSPA are the teams. It's the players who have little say. You're picking at the wrong bone.
It just doesn't make sense for the lower ranked teams to decide that they don't want to play during this gsl season.
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I don't see the news value in this at all. It's been said that it was going to take a LONG time before kespa players join GSL.
there is no drama, there is no hype, there is no surprise.
Just freaking wait for it.. are we going to see news posts like this one by next season? and then the next after that?
i don't see them even trying to qualify for at least another 2 seasons
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On August 24 2012 00:10 Rustug wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:03 StarStruck wrote:On August 24 2012 00:01 RvB wrote:On August 23 2012 23:53 StarStruck wrote:On August 23 2012 23:45 naastyOne wrote:On August 23 2012 23:29 StarStruck wrote:On August 23 2012 23:28 naastyOne wrote:On August 23 2012 23:23 StarStruck wrote:As if Blizzard should have a say on the matter. Here's the thing they need to understand and guys like MLG. KeSPA sticks to it's own schedule. They were up in arms about the GOM Classic prior as they thought it was too much with the PL/OSL/MSL. On August 23 2012 23:22 Condor Hero wrote:On August 23 2012 23:08 bo1b wrote:
It's actually mind boggling how far people are going to defend kespa as some sort of good guy, anyone remember leta getting dq'd?
Having said that people jumping the gun before any real information has been released is equally questionable. Leta broke the rules, so Leta got DQ'd. It was a dumbass rule indeed but how was that worse than GSL taking Nani's Code S spot or backing out of their MLG obligations by changing the wording? Yeah, let's just nitpick at each individual thing we don't agree with. -_- On August 23 2012 23:22 TheButtonmen wrote:
First MLG, now GSL.
I won't be watching OGN, I've got no desire to support Kespa if they are going back to their old isolastionic ways and there is plenty of competition for my eye balls. They want to continue being the Premiere League in Korea. They have the network and they want to push their brand. Considering everyone needs Blizard approval to run SC2 tournaments, Blizard kinda has a lot of weight, to throw in the metter. Yeah good luck on that. You've already seen what happened when Blizzard tried to argue the IP rights. Blizzard is counting on KeSPA to give the game more exposure in Korea. Their options are limited whereas KeSPA. Well, they have plenty of options. Blisard can deny them the right to run any tournament. Kespa can still do whatever BS they want, just without any broadcasting and such, and hence, zero profits. On August 23 2012 23:31 Forikorder wrote:On August 23 2012 23:29 StarStruck wrote:On August 23 2012 23:28 naastyOne wrote:On August 23 2012 23:23 StarStruck wrote:As if Blizzard should have a say on the matter. Here's the thing they need to understand and guys like MLG. KeSPA sticks to it's own schedule. They were up in arms about the GOM Classic prior as they thought it was too much with the PL/OSL/MSL. On August 23 2012 23:22 Condor Hero wrote:
[quote]
Leta broke the rules, so Leta got DQ'd.
It was a dumbass rule indeed but how was that worse than GSL taking Nani's Code S spot or backing out of their MLG obligations by changing the wording? Yeah, let's just nitpick at each individual thing we don't agree with. -_- On August 23 2012 23:22 TheButtonmen wrote:
First MLG, now GSL.
I won't be watching OGN, I've got no desire to support Kespa if they are going back to their old isolastionic ways and there is plenty of competition for my eye balls. They want to continue being the Premiere League in Korea. They have the network and they want to push their brand. Considering everyone needs Blizard approval to run SC2 tournaments, Blizard kinda has a lot of weight, to throw in the metter. Yeah good luck on that. You've already seen what happened when Blizzard tried to argue the IP rights. they dont have to argue anything, if they press a button KeSPA cant paly SC2 thats a fact Not just that. Considering Korea is, supposed to take US IP pretty seriously, the entire idea that goverment institution can infringe copyright just like that, wwould do terrible damage to Korea`s international relations. I'm sorry but you guys don't have a clue on what you're talking about and missed what I said entirely. KeSPA doesn't need Blizzard. Even if Blizzard could stop them from playing SC2. KeSPA would just bank on their other properties and give SC2 the backdoor. As we've seen before Blizzard believes they need KeSPA to pick up the slack in the Korean market. This is no different from the IP rights from before. In summary, even if Blizzard won the argument and no SC2 for KeSPA they would push their other tournaments and SC2 would hit another big wall in Korea. Not good for business. That's not to say the big guns retire/withdraw from their KeSPA teams and join other teams in SC2. The thing is you still lose exposure and the other developers along with KeSPA would do everything in their power to block SC2. Blizzard doesn't need Kespa either, the sc2 scene has been growing without them and will be without them. It's just that with Kespa involved it will probably go a lot faster like you said. And really Kespa isn't going to pull out now when they've invested so much money and effort into it already you don't just switch to a different game like it's nothing. From everything Blizzard has done over the last couple of years? You can say they don't need them, but here's the catch. Blizzard wants them. They are under the belief that KeSPA can speed up the process with their network. Logical, KeSPA owns Teams with sponsors, GOM doesn't have teams the are a broadcasting organization. But I think Blizzard would rather see KeSPA and GOM play nice and have both.
That's the whole point they want both and that's why they're trying to step in and asking KeSPA what is the problem?
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On August 24 2012 00:10 Salazarz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 24 2012 00:04 niteReloaded wrote:
If Kespa continues with this policy, and let's say even forbids its players participation in international tournaments, I can see a massive exodus from Kespa teams to international teams. Maybe law cases, terminations of contracts etc. There should be a measure on how much you can limit someone's freedom. Yeah, these guys who practiced with their teams together for years and received salaries that are higher than tournament winnings for all but the very few top SC2 pros are surely going to jump ship at the first opportunity. Where the hell are you getting this kind of nonsense from, really.
Winning something like MLG would give a practice partner/b-teamer more money than they have ever made on KeSPA. With everything being SC2 now, I could see more and more lower-tier players leaving the KeSPA teams if isolationist policies continue to be in place.
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