EPTSpades retires from Western Wolves - Page 27
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This is not the place to argue whether or not spades hacked, do that in the relevant thread please. (this is in effect page 10 onward) | ||
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oxxo
988 Posts
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dmfg
United Kingdom591 Posts
On June 06 2012 08:26 windsupernova wrote: Good luck to Spades and Western Wolves. Hope Spades can do well in the WCS to show he is a skilled player and somewhat redeems himself in the eyes of the people doubting him Whether he gained any advantage from hacking is besides the point. If he did indeed hack, then the crime is in the hacking itself, not "gaining an advantage from hacking". | ||
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rd
United States2586 Posts
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starcraft911
Korea (South)1263 Posts
On June 06 2012 04:57 OzkanTheFlip wrote: Spades, no1 wants you quit, worst case scenario is you made a mistake and hopefully admit to it and grow some balls your still going to do well. As a fellow long time member of the BW community I've seen plenty of people exposed for hacking. Very few of the people caught hacking own up to it right away, most try to deny it before they give up and admit the truth. The SC community has always been very forgiving and once a hacker admits what they've done it seems like it's more or less universally forgiven. I mean... spades himself was caught hacking in bw and people looked past it in sc2. Anyways, I agree with you. Nobody wants him to quit, but I'm not entirely convinced he's good enough to be a top player without his hacks based on what Mirhi and giX had to say in the other thread. Either way people just want e-sports to be fair and clean. | ||
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rhs408
United States904 Posts
Ouch :/ Will WesternWolves try to recruit another SC2 player after this? I hope so. | ||
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Scisyhp
United States200 Posts
On June 06 2012 04:57 OzkanTheFlip wrote: Spades, no1 wants you quit, worst case scenario is you made a mistake and hopefully admit to it and grow some balls your still going to do well. I want him out. I'm tired of all this hacking. It's not even a question of a second chance. He already got that. At this point it's ridiculous, and he should get away from this scene and stay away. | ||
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Martijn
Netherlands1219 Posts
On June 06 2012 08:26 windsupernova wrote: Good luck to Spades and Western Wolves. Thanks. On June 06 2012 08:29 nath wrote: so naive. its standard PR practice to announce that a player, or any employee for that matter, has left an organization on his/her own volition when in fact they were simply let go/fired. this is more than likely what happened here, and more than likely what happened with Destiny when "he decided to leave Quantic to not tarnish their reputation" You're making this up as you go? We barely started contacting people for a third party review. Don't spout nonsense about how things really went when you have no idea. | ||
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Ewic
Canada121 Posts
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JazzNL
182 Posts
We humans (within good reason) regularly see what we want to, it's how human psychology works. I watched these replays hoping I would find incontrovertible evidence of his using maphack, I did not necessarily find that so I can't agree with most of the people here saying ''100% guilty!!''. That said, from a realistic point of view I do unfortunately have to come to the conclusion that he is indeed maphacking. We're not just talking about his ''perfect'' scouting, always (correctly) scouting when it's close position and not scouting when it's cross. Not just his blind countering of Lucy's build in both early build orders and midgame army composition. Not just that in over half the situations he's responding to drops not yet in his sight. Not just his sieging at perfect time and position (I found Entombed Valley to be extremely damning, particularly the engagement(s) on the far east choke). If you add up everything, including the fact that he has a history of hacking, I can only call you steadfast if you do not come to the same conclusion. I'd like to add that I do agree with the ''guilty until proven otherwise'' approach and in this case, I'd call him guilty. I understand certain people that want to refrain from making choices, considering this evidence to not be enough but if everyone were to have that attitude, nothing would get done in this world. | ||
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Kjellinn
Iceland2 Posts
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Martijn
Netherlands1219 Posts
On June 06 2012 08:47 rhs408 wrote: Ouch :/ Will WesternWolves try to recruit another SC2 player after this? I hope so. We might try to pick up 1 or 2 European players. We'll have to see obviously. | ||
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TeeTS
Germany2762 Posts
At first you deny any cheating. If this isn't possible anymore you jump onto the pity train to get enough supporters, that your case is reconsidered. And sooner or later, we will have a 100% evidence and everyone who kept defending him feels like a fool (or might just be one). I have no Idea how people can try to blandish maphacking and defend it beyong every reason. The evidences are there (in the other thread), and they are very clear. So just accept it. A growing proportion of cheaters is a real threat to the growth and stability of esports. So we have to fight Hacks and Cheats as hard as we can! | ||
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Excludos
Norway8123 Posts
On June 06 2012 08:58 Ewic wrote: It's times like this when I'm ashamed to be part of this community... Essentially witch-hunting. I'm really sad for Spades. There is a huge difference between this and the witch hunting that went down on Orb and Destiny. I have not educated myself enough to know whetever Spades really did hack or not. But the way he's been handling it is definitely mysterious. No one who gets wrongly accused of cheating suddenly decides to leave their team a day after, before anyone has a chance to figure out what is going on. In fact, most people would be pissed and bring out legitimate reasons as to why it wasn't cheating. But he hasn't even done that. "lots of random things happen in TvT so thats why I decided to play massively different then what I'm used to, get an insane stroke of luck, and have the camera stuck at the same place for longer period of times, and then somehow get 3-4 vs Lucifron" is not a legitimate answer. I'm not saying he's cheating. But if he isn't, he's doing a very good job at not addressing the issues. In fact he's probably done a lot worse than simply not saying anything. | ||
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Soma.bokforlag
Sweden448 Posts
if he really is the best in america, he really could have turned this around by playing offline tournaments and strongly monitored showmatches. | ||
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ritzia1
Canada95 Posts
On June 06 2012 08:58 Ewic wrote: It's times like this when I'm ashamed to be part of this community... Essentially witch-hunting. I'm really sad for Spades. Why? Perhaps he may or may not have hacked, but all the replays analyzed and especially people even coming out and verifying his past shows HEAVILY that towards the way of him possibly map hacking. Things like this shouldn't be taken lightly if this were true that he did map hack he cheated in a show match, this isn't some random ladder game. Not everything is THIS COMMUNITY SUCKS or I'M ASHAMED OF BEING APART OF THIS COMMUNITY, yes there are some stupid witch hunts that are uncalled for, but in this situation given the amount of proof and context that was given I'm glad we can stomp out hackers that ruin the spirit of competition. | ||
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fatalfirecrotch
13 Posts
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theBOOCH
United States832 Posts
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1a
Canada36 Posts
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NuKedUFirst
Canada3139 Posts
It's not like it was his first time though so there shouldnt be such a surprise really. | ||
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Sombre
United Kingdom86 Posts
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