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This is not the place to argue whether or not spades hacked, do that in the relevant thread please.
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On June 06 2012 05:39 Shiori wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2012 05:38 Dodgin wrote:On June 06 2012 05:34 crocodile wrote:
First Naniwa, then Orb, then Destiny, now Spades.
Hope you guys are happy. This community SUCKS. I want to punch my screen when I read shit like this. Hacking is a way bigger deal than any of the other " drama " that doesn't actually impact the integrity of the game and the competition itself. This is not a pointless witchhunt, this is an important issue. If he's a hacker which it looks like he is then people should be HAPPY that he was ousted. If he really is a hacker, then I'm glad he's gone (still not convinced he is). The process, though, is incredibly biased and shameful. This "trial by mob" stuff will not last just because we have too many people who over/under-react and/or have no clue what they're talking about. We need some sort of central body to judge things like this. Not random people giving their opinions and then a whole bunch of +1s on Reddit.
I completely agree with you, I was just giving my opinion on people who would group this situation with all the others when It's not the same at all.
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On June 06 2012 05:27 Geo.Rion wrote:
Btw guys, I just want to put this out there, around the beta, there was a qualifier for the Hungarian national lineup, and i won the finals 3-0, got accused of maphacking.
I said, it's complete bullshit, mods looked at the replays, there was no real evidence, case solved, the guy who accuse me after losing the finals disappeared.
Compare that to the recent situation. Spade came out and said u can believe whatever u want, and 1 day later he "retires" because his reputation has been dmged.
There is no dmg done by an unproven accusation, i went on the be part of the national lineup and win a national LAN at Budapest later on.
So I hope everyone gets why i say, he's guilty for sure, 100%, and everyone who still defends him is stupid
Cry about whichunts when people are punished severly for minor offences, not when a hacker gets exposed. GJ to whoever started it
1. who are you? you seem to have really high thougths of yourself as a player?
2. you are making a fool out of yourself using the god awful so called logic in your post. Nobody will get why you say that he is guilty for sure, 100%, because you don't make any sense. What have you brought to the table that makes Spades "for sure guilty, 100%"?
Pleaae elaborate.
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Either Spades wanted to lessen the collateral damage to WW. (Most likely)
Or WW confronted him about the situation, and Spades decided to cut his loses and leave respectfully.
Either way, this is pretty normal whenever there is a big controversy surrounding a player.
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Reading some of these posts made me wish death upon their families
User was banned for this post.
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On June 06 2012 05:35 pallad wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2012 05:34 crocodile wrote:
First Naniwa, then Orb, then Destiny, now Spades.
Hope you guys are happy. This community SUCKS. WHAT ?? are you dumb or something? Maby you wanna now all major tournaments invite Spades ... omg
I don't care about whether spades maphacked or not. It's the way you pieces of shit will gleefully ruin people's lives like you're doing the world some sort of good.
http://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman
User was warned for this post
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You know, I personally think Spades could've handled this MUCH differently.
From my POV until someone is proved guilty, they are innocent, but Spades' reputation wasn't ruined. I personally believe there is too much "circumstantial" evidence to consider him clean, but i don't think that means his reputation is ruined/definitive evidence (for now).
However, my resigning from his team and sounding defeatist, it doesn't exactly help out the innocent side.
Should've pulled a Palmeiro. Just in general, the more passionate you are about something, the more believable you are. Whether you're innocent or guilty, saying "gee well fuck this i'm innocent but i'll just quit everything basically because i'm innocent" doesn't really help your cause.
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It's very depressing to know that most people here were expecting some kind of confession. What's the point in confessing when you've already ran him out of town? If he is innocent, it just makes him feel even worse about himself. If he's guilty, so what? He's already fucking out, leave him the fuck alone.
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On June 06 2012 05:25 Pwnzer wrote:
It's funny to me to see how mad people get at TL moderators. It's specifically stated in their official rules that it's THEIR site and they can do whatever with the site that they please. I think it's pretty obvious that for the most part they try to as impartial as possible, however things like this are going to exist sometimes where there's a grey area open for discussion. It's not the TL moderators faults that Spades was accused of hacking, if you're gonna be mad why not choose between either Spades himself or at the accusers.
On topic: Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. I think if he is in fact guilty of hacking, considering his admitting to hacking previously in BW, than he should be black listed like so many people are suggesting.
Yes but we are allowed our opinions about how things should go down as long as they are stated politely. I think it is a horrible idea for the witch hunt to the the "jury" in any of these cases and believe Spades could have had a lot better shot at proving innocence/guilt if that thread wasn't allowed to exist and some simple statement was made that professionals of some sort would look into it.
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On June 06 2012 05:42 darthfoley wrote:
You know, I personally think Spades could've handled this MUCH differently.
From my POV until someone is proved guilty, they are innocent, but Spades' reputation wasn't ruined. I personally believe there is too much "circumstantial" evidence to consider him clean, but i don't think that means his reputation is ruined/definitive evidence (for now).
However, my resigning from his team and sounding defeatist, it doesn't exactly help out the innocent side.
Should've pulled a Palmeiro. Just in general, the more passionate you are about something, the more believable you are. Whether you're innocent or guilty, saying "gee well fuck this i'm innocent but i'll just quit everything basically because i'm innocent" doesn't really help your cause.
At this point it doesn't matter if he's innocent. His career is over.
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On June 06 2012 05:42 darthfoley wrote:
You know, I personally think Spades could've handled this MUCH differently.
From my POV until someone is proved guilty, they are innocent, but Spades' reputation wasn't ruined. I personally believe there is too much "circumstantial" evidence to consider him clean, but i don't think that means his reputation is ruined/definitive evidence (for now).
However, my resigning from his team and sounding defeatist, it doesn't exactly help out the innocent side.
Should've pulled a Palmeiro. Just in general, the more passionate you are about something, the more believable you are. Whether you're innocent or guilty, saying "gee well fuck this i'm innocent but i'll just quit everything basically because i'm innocent" doesn't really help your cause.
The team manager made a post part way through that thread the yesterday saying that they might not be able to keep him even if he is innocent now.
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On June 06 2012 05:41 sPitcraZy wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2012 05:37 IcedBacon wrote:On June 06 2012 05:32 sPitcraZy wrote:
1. Stop with the "DO IT AT LAN", according to your logic catz must also be a hacker till he does it at LAN or any other "pro" that has no tournament results. (No results you're all hackers in my eyes now (OH NOOOOOO!!!!!!))
2. Investigation of hacks with BIAS perspectives trying to find "conclusive" evidence with 90% assumptions (REAL SMART...)
3. I feel like there are so many people that lack any authority in their real lives, and finally get that opportunity online and they abuse it.
4. Does this mean a non name in the scene(myself included) can end anyone's career with a simple post (GAME ON!!!!) Go for it, lets see you try to ruin IdrA's or WhiteRa's career with a post. I'll give you till the end of today. Wait bro I must target smaller less known players that have no tournament results because it makes it that much easier...
Go try that too. PM me the thread once it's made mmkay?
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good riddance!
this is exactly when the pitchforks are justified.
map hacking is intolerable for a pro player - especially a 2nd time!
this isn't just ladder points, there's money on the line. He should be banned from all tournaments for life.
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EDIT: Read mod warning. Apologies.
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On June 06 2012 05:39 Shiori wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2012 05:38 Dodgin wrote:On June 06 2012 05:34 crocodile wrote:
First Naniwa, then Orb, then Destiny, now Spades.
Hope you guys are happy. This community SUCKS. I want to punch my screen when I read shit like this. Hacking is a way bigger deal than any of the other " drama " that doesn't actually impact the integrity of the game and the competition itself. This is not a pointless witchhunt, this is an important issue. If he's a hacker which it looks like he is then people should be HAPPY that he was ousted. If he really is a hacker, then I'm glad he's gone (still not convinced he is). The process, though, is incredibly biased and shameful. This "trial by mob" stuff will not last just because we have too many people who over/under-react and/or have no clue what they're talking about. We need some sort of central body to judge things like this. Not random people giving their opinions and then a whole bunch of +1s on Reddit.
thank you, couldn't have said it better myself. 100% what i am thinking 
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After seeing CatZ stream, and seeing the "perfect scans" in his game, I was convinced he was cheating from that alone. Everything else like army movement is just technically hearsay. But every scan in replays when he was accused of cheating show that he either had to do it from the minimap (Which he had never done before in replays we know he wasn't cheating in.) or he was cheating, because his auto camera lock won't let him shown be looking into the fog of war. Having said this, I'm glad this scumbag is gone. As Incontrol said in SotG yesterday, Burn the fucking cheaters and flush them out.
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On June 06 2012 05:44 CrugerDK wrote:
good riddance!
this is exactly when the pitchforks are justified.
map hacking is intolerable for a pro player - especially a 2nd time!
this isn't just ladder points, there's money on the line. He should be banned from all tournaments for life.
There is NO way that the pitch forks can ever give someone due process and a fair "trial". This witch hunt was a joke and shouldnt have happened.
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On June 06 2012 05:44 mrtomjones wrote:Show nested quote +On June 06 2012 05:42 darthfoley wrote:
You know, I personally think Spades could've handled this MUCH differently.
From my POV until someone is proved guilty, they are innocent, but Spades' reputation wasn't ruined. I personally believe there is too much "circumstantial" evidence to consider him clean, but i don't think that means his reputation is ruined/definitive evidence (for now).
However, my resigning from his team and sounding defeatist, it doesn't exactly help out the innocent side.
Should've pulled a Palmeiro. Just in general, the more passionate you are about something, the more believable you are. Whether you're innocent or guilty, saying "gee well fuck this i'm innocent but i'll just quit everything basically because i'm innocent" doesn't really help your cause. The team manager made a post part way through that thread the yesterday saying that they might not be able to keep him even if he is innocent now.
Oh, I wasn't aware of this. Mind giving me the page link?
Either way, i would've handled this differently if i were in his position. I think he hacks, but i'm no pro, so i won't preach it as gospel.
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So lets summarize this.
Spades maphacks in BW, denies it, then gets caught. He is under question for hacking again in SC2, yet we are supposed to believe his word (which was damamged before) despite a host of strange "coincidences" and circumstantial evidence. And now he decided to retire after many pros looking into his replays and believe he does hack. Well that certainly doesn't seem sketchy.
Say what you want about reputation, but if you really loved the game and knew you were innocent, you would probably strive to be as good as you wanted to be when you cheated originally in BW to prove people wrong. Look at TT1, he used to hack, wanted to get better and proved himself while being open about hacking. A lot of people respect TT1 because he earned the respect back after cheating.
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Disgusting community at times, at least take more time to consider AND re-consider your arguments and someone else's livelihood before that accusation. One day thread, BOOM. All this drama is really stupid. I wonder why I even read TL anymore aside for tournament results.
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EPT
