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On May 12 2012 07:13 Femari wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 07:07 JimmiC wrote:
Dream Hack won by Terran
MLG spring arena won by Zerg
Ironsquid won by Terran
MLG winter 2012 won by Terran
IPL 4 won by Terran
IEM Season VI Protoss
GSL season 1 Terran
Assembly 2012 Terran
IEM Sao Paulo Zerg
IEM Kiev Terran
Homestory IV Protoss
AOL King Of Kongs Zerg
Don't ACTUAL results matter? If Flash wins every single event does that mean Terran is OP? Nope means he's the best player.
Told ya!!!!!!
On May 12 2012 07:07 JimmiC wrote:
Dream Hack won by Terran
MLG spring arena won by Zerg
Ironsquid won by Terran
MLG winter 2012 won by Terran
IPL 4 won by Terran
IEM Season VI Protoss
GSL season 1 Terran
Assembly 2012 Terran
IEM Sao Paulo Zerg
IEM Kiev Terran
Homestory IV Protoss
AOL King Of Kongs Zerg
Don't ACTUAL results matter?
Those are all a result of skill, excpet for the few Protoss wins, those were totally because of how incredibly OP Protoss is.
That _actually_ is the belief of almost all Terran/Zerg players.
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On May 12 2012 07:08 smallerk wrote:
Because i play protoss no one is alowed to say protoss is overpowered, i find it outrageous.
The most reasonable defense I have seen in this thread yet.
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On May 12 2012 07:00 rEalGuapo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:58 parduebob11 wrote:
Flash just like Boxer and July will become a decent sc2 pro.He will not become bonjwa again that is for sure but I would not be surprised to see him in the upper stages of a GSL.Flash vs Nestea or Jaedong vs MVP are some nice phantasy games. Why would a incredibly talented young player never be able to be better than an old player that is way past his maximum potential?
Can you backup your claims about that Boxers skills actually got worse instead that just better players entered in the scene?
Its almoust certain that there has been no pro gamer whos career was shut down because of deterioration of their skills.
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On May 12 2012 07:02 rEalGuapo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 07:01 BrandFilt wrote:On May 12 2012 06:57 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 06:55 BrandFilt wrote:On May 12 2012 06:51 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 06:47 BrandFilt wrote:On May 12 2012 06:06 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 06:04 beg wrote:On May 12 2012 05:56 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 05:46 Tippecanoe wrote:
[quote]
Implying hes the only pro to say that protoss was a bit too strong. Demuslim talked about it on his stream for about 5-10 minutes or so and he had really good points with real evidence. He said that Colossus tech is cheap compared to the Vikings you had to get. He stated that for 2 Colossi you need about 8 Vikings and that eats too much into your Bio. 8 Vikings = 600 Gas. 2 Colossi = 800 Gas, yeah so cheap.... you obviously need the range upgrade, or you will not force Vikings. After I heard him say that 2 Colossi cost less Gas then 6-8 Vikings I shut down the stream in anger. So I could not care less about his opinion, that is like IdrA saying Vortex is imbalanced while he INTENTIONALLY moves his entire army into one only to prove his point instead of having spread his units in the first place. collossi cost 300/200 though. sorry, but lol. yes but you need robbotics bay and the range upgrade 200 gas each, I do not count the starport that you have anyway same as Robo itself sorry but think. Wow, really terrible logic. Have you even considered that vikings need seperate upgrades? Can you even comprehend how much it will cost to get my vikings to 3-3 so they can go up against your 3-3 army? I can't, so I just have to do with 3-0 vikings to fight an army with 3 attack and 3 armor. Now how's that for fair? I think Protoss have the better end whatever a robotics bay and/or what thermal lance costs. A collosi switch can only be benefitial since: 1. Vikings suck. Period. They don't share upgrades with your main army and they are no good in a stratight up fight except for dealing with collosi. 2. They take up your starport so you can't make medivacs. 3. It will kill you if you are not prepared or at the very least cripple you. I can't see why a protoss would not go collosi but I can see several reason why Terran really wouldn't want to get vikings if it weren't for the fact that we are forced to make them in order to survive the ultimate 1-a unit. This is just getting redicilous so I will leave. But just so you know I can make statements like yours too. Get 2 Ravens, get 4 Vikings, get a ton of Banshees. Snipe the Observers and win. Honestly you do not think things through at all so I won't either. Such a lame answer. Fair enough. Here is your statement: Vikings SUCK vs Protoss except vs Colossi. A unit that can only attack 5 different units of one race sucks vs said race when they do not build any of those 5 units. Since Void Rays, Phoenix, Carrier and Mothership are useless vs Terran. you can only get 1 of those 5 Units being Colossi Congratz for your enlightenment. That didn't make any sense. exactly.. Which is why I at first did not want to comment. Also the statement in itself makes perfect sence, it is just useless.
But you did comment. So you, at a fundamental level, don't make sense.
I just wanted to point out that the guy that started saying that collosi are expensive by comparing the cost of collosi, their tech structures and upgrades to only the cost of vikings themself was really dumb.
And I wanted to point out that it's unfair that protosses can tech switch to something which already have the most time consuming upgrades whereas the terran's forced response doesn't. And to top it off can't be used effectivly against any other unit so they are very gimmicky.
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On May 12 2012 03:50 StarStruck wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 03:49 Chenz wrote:On May 12 2012 03:45 grush57 wrote:On May 12 2012 03:40 zSnowy wrote:
Inb4 terran whining idiots. Flash is a whining idiot? Whining about balance when he's not close to being a high level player (yet) isn't a very smart move. All of his game knowledge from BW doesn't translate to SC2, he'd do good by waiting with comments about balance until he has experienced playing at the very top. It's only his first thoughts on the game. Relax.
And top masters IS "high level." Maybe not GSL level but still higher level than most.
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Top masters in Korea mind you.
Protoss is OP, he just has fast insight.
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On May 12 2012 07:00 rEalGuapo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:58 parduebob11 wrote:
Flash just like Boxer and July will become a decent sc2 pro.He will not become bonjwa again that is for sure but I would not be surprised to see him in the upper stages of a GSL.Flash vs Nestea or Jaedong vs MVP are some nice phantasy games. Why would a incredibly talented young player never be able to be better than an old player that is way past his maximum potential?
I do not understand your post.Who is the talented young player?If it is FLash yes he is young and talented but also the phenomenon of plateauing must also come to mind.He was number 1 in bw for a very long time so he is mostly very satisfied with his past performance.Sc2 is extraordinarily different from brood warYou also have to take into consideration that when the likes of Boxer and July came into sc2 they were supposed to revolutionize the tactical side just like they did in bw and although they did manage a couple of good GSL games they were nowhere near theyr peak in bw.
Flash,just like most bw legends is in the unfortunate situation of being exposed to high expectactions and posibly even overrated(I say this in a positive way) by the hordes of bw fanatics who think that bw is the mother and father of esports and if you`re good at broodwar you will most likely steamroll everyone in sc2,dota2,lol etc.From my perspective.Bw and sc2 are like boxing and mma.they have many elements in common but when pros transition from one sport to the other we know the result.
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On May 12 2012 07:08 avilo wrote:
I'm glad flash has been saying what i've been saying all along. Now people have to listen right? It's flash.
I fear even Flash is not prepared for the TL backlash whenever someone mentions imbalance.
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So, a trash random master player (that's what he is in SC2, might you be biased or not) says protoss is OP:
Is welcomed with "AH! I TOLD YOU!" circlejerk just because it's Flash.
Hilarious
User was banned for this post.
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On May 12 2012 07:08 smallerk wrote:
Because i play protoss no one is alowed to say protoss is overpowered, i find it outrageous.
This is actually how I feel.
Plus I do a ton of research and calculations about this stuff.
Remember the Protoss Upgrade Buffs? Remember how the announcement of those changes created a thread with over 200 Pages of anti Protoss hate.
I did this this to comment on the buff.
Still people said Protoss will never lose a single game after that patch.
(Scroll to the end of OP for the summary)
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On May 12 2012 07:09 Mongolbonjwa wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 07:00 rEalGuapo wrote:On May 12 2012 06:58 parduebob11 wrote:
Flash just like Boxer and July will become a decent sc2 pro.He will not become bonjwa again that is for sure but I would not be surprised to see him in the upper stages of a GSL.Flash vs Nestea or Jaedong vs MVP are some nice phantasy games. Why would a incredibly talented young player never be able to be better than an old player that is way past his maximum potential? Can you backup your claims about that Boxers skills actually got worse instead that just better players entered in the scene? Its almoust certain that there has been no pro gamer whos career was shut down because of deterioration of their skills.
Boxer didn't get worse. Everyone just got better. Still a legend though.
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Don´t forget that Flash has a much deeper insight about RTS in general than we all do. He for example did not mention any specific units being OP (HT, Colossus) but rather FFs, Warp in. It may very well be the case that he is forseeing imbalance yet to come once we reach the point of perfect mechanics.
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On May 12 2012 07:07 JimmiC wrote:
Dream Hack won by Terran
MLG spring arena won by Zerg
Ironsquid won by Terran
MLG winter 2012 won by Terran
IPL 4 won by Terran
IEM Season VI Protoss
GSL season 1 Terran
Assembly 2012 Terran
IEM Sao Paulo Zerg
IEM Kiev Terran
Homestory IV Protoss
AOL King Of Kongs Zerg
Don't ACTUAL results matter?
If Flash wins every single event does that mean Terran is OP?
Nope means he's the best player.
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On May 12 2012 07:12 Zealot Orgy wrote:
So, a trash random master player (that's what he is in SC2, might you be biased or not) says protoss is OP:
Is welcomed with "AH! I TOLD YOU!" circlejerk just because it's Flash.
Hilarious
Trash? What does that make pretty much any player on the NA and EU servers then? By the way, where do I find his stream at? Im assuming you know since you are privy to his skill level. Or maybe your his practice partner. Are you Flash's practice partner?
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I don't like the balance questions. It's silly to ask somone about balance who only has played the game for a short amount of time. And if he really thinks protoss and Zerg are so OP he should considere not to take terran...
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On May 12 2012 07:17 OrbitalPlane wrote:
I don't like the balance questions. It's silly to ask somone about balance who only has played the game for a short amount of time. And if he really thinks protoss and Zerg are so OP he should considere not to take terran...
He did consider Protoss. His coach told him it's a bad idea since they're still practicing both BW and SC2
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Canada11372 Posts
On May 12 2012 07:13 Aunvilgod wrote:
Don´t forget that Flash has a much deeper insight about RTS in general than we all do. He for example did not mention any specific units being OP (HT, Colossus) but rather FFs, Warp in. It may very well be the case that he is forseeing imbalance yet to come once we reach the point of perfect mechanics.
Well in that sense, it's not much different then what TL has batted around multiple times although more from a game design perspective than balance. Warp in's kill defenders advantage and FFs are like having stasis in the early game. Once FF's trap units, they can't be microed until it wears out or is broken by a thor.
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On May 12 2012 07:03 WolfintheSheep wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 06:59 SoniC_eu wrote:On May 12 2012 06:55 Youtakenocandle wrote:
I never followed sc1 and don't know much about Flash, but balance whining as a supposed sc1 legend is pretty lame. Flash was sharing his current opnion (which could change in the future mind you). He understands RTS games like no one else, so I find your comment rather interesting. Wrong. He understands SC:BW like no one else. I'd bet you everything I had that he knows jack-all about C&C, Age of Empires, or even WC3. To say he understands BW, so he automatically knows more than Code S players is complete bull.
Where in my comments did I write he knows more than Code S players? Where is it? Or maybe ur just adding ur own comments as to make my comment look extreme? I don't appreciate that...
here, let me help you...I wrote he has more right to complain than casual laddering non pro gamers about all aspects of sc2.
Yes because C&C and AoE are such huge Esports..? I'd bet everything I have that he would learn everything there is to know about other RTS games (including sc2) in a much shorter time frame, than you think. Why? because he has something fundamental that all RTS games need...Mechanics and strategy. Not game specific strategy, but overarching concepts of strategy.
Am i basing this on fact or fiction? Well the man made it to Masters on KR server in 4-5 days. KR Masters is considered to be GM in EU and NA. That shows that he has an incredible skill and understanding that has the potential to win Code S ONE day.
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On May 12 2012 07:13 Femari wrote:Show nested quote +On May 12 2012 07:07 JimmiC wrote:
Dream Hack won by Terran
MLG spring arena won by Zerg
Ironsquid won by Terran
MLG winter 2012 won by Terran
IPL 4 won by Terran
IEM Season VI Protoss
GSL season 1 Terran
Assembly 2012 Terran
IEM Sao Paulo Zerg
IEM Kiev Terran
Homestory IV Protoss
AOL King Of Kongs Zerg
Don't ACTUAL results matter? If Flash wins every single event does that mean Terran is OP? Nope means he's the best player.
Not if he chooses Protoss 
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EPT
