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Alex is verbose, and you owe it to yourself (and the rest of us) to read the statement in its entirety. Remember, when making comments/claims to provide proper evidence, facts etc. Arguments based on incorrect assumptions, facts and straw men, will be dealt with swiftly. If in doubt, PM a mod or ask IRC. Do NOT spread misinformation, when in doubt, check your sources. In short, be smart. Alex comments on Idra: Orbs Statement: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319038 Personal attacks against other posters in this thread will be met with a ban -- 14:20 KST | ||
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ScumScan
United States3 Posts
I'm not black, so I really can't take orb's side too much in that regard. But given the context and how it was done before Orb even worked for EG, I don't see how it would be grounds for dismissal. Pressure from sponsors blah blah blah blsakslfkj SHUT UP. (joking, that was my psystarcraft impersonation). Anyways, something is to be gained from listening to Louis C.K. or Trey Parker and Matt Stone about this. | ||
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Grohg
United States243 Posts
As mentioned before...I don't care if he was "just raging" and BM'd over something because they were on tilt. I also don't care that someone is trolling. These have been two of the dumbest excuses that have popped up recently. BM and trolling are telling signs of stupidity and flat out disregard for other people. In a vacuum, Orb's comments still carry weight and the intent is still there. Under no circumstance is any form of watered down racism even acceptable. "It was just a word," is no different than someone spitting on you and saying "I was just mad, you'll get over it." It's equally pathetic in either case and although no physical harm comes of either, the malice is more than evident. There are some things that are stupid to rile people up over but this isn't one of them. If any derogatory remark is making its way onto your screen, hold backspace and just quit. If spouting garbage with the intent to harm makes you feel better about yourself, you need to reevaluate your social skills. | ||
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branflakes14
2082 Posts
I read it, and what I said undermines everything written in it. Go ahead, call me a honkey and call England a country of violent, colonial, tea drinking brutes. I won't bat an eyelash, I promise. | ||
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NeonFox
2373 Posts
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MercilessMonkey
Canada150 Posts
No  My point is that the only people with detailed knowledge of his contract are people involved with it, and hence other people bringing it up is silly | ||
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Lann555
Netherlands5173 Posts
On March 09 2012 16:21 jester- wrote: I never said it wasn't wrong. It is wrong, but it's not wrong to the extent where tens of thousands of community members should be up in arms with a full fledged head hunt about it. If you take the logic from your first sentence and apply it to the second last sentence, you will see that he isn't trying to demean anyone, he's just essentially yelling bullshit at someone who pissed him off. Like I said before and what you verified in your first sentence, the use of the word nigger here, from ORBS point of view, is no different than him calling someone an asshole (or similar). If he doesn't have the intelligence to see that the word 'nigger' has a far far bigger impact and social stigma then 'asshole' then he lacks the base-intelligence to be the face of a company. I can understand EG not wanting to get involved with someone who doesn't get simple stuff like that. If I heard one of my employees use such language, because they are pissed off, I'd fire them on the spot. Orb has shown himself to be a liability and now pays the price for it Our community should have at least some standards of decency. Just because it's online and losing on ladder is frustrating, doesn't suddenly make it ok to yell the most vile insults you can come up with at the time. In any other setting this stuff has severe consequences. You'd get your ass kicked, or lose your job, or get sued. Maybe it's political correctness, but it's how the world has worked for quite some time and Orb had...23 (I think) years to figure that out. He failed to notice the complete obvious and now paid the price for his own ignorance | ||
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blizzind
United States642 Posts
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Kare
Norway786 Posts
But hey, if E-sports is gonna be taken seriously in the future, I guess things like this is called for. | ||
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ZessiM
United Kingdom232 Posts
On March 09 2012 16:44 branflakes14 wrote: I've heard people insult my mother in front of me and to be honest I just felt sorry for them that they felt as though they needed to stoop down to the level of slinging insults. Ok but no one is impervious to humiliation, there is a way that someone could push your buttons if they tried hard enough. Being offended by its very definition is 'offensive' - humiliation, anger, hurt feelings - all of these are offensive emotions that people can inflict upon you, people making you feel in a way you don't wish to. You shouldn't judge people as immature or weak minded or whatever just because they are offended by words | ||
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Jebusrocks
Canada62 Posts
I'm not sure if he'll be successful though, its really hard to tackle social norms such as this (other being the whole sexist jokes) and expect ppl to understand but kudos to alex! | ||
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Douillos
France3195 Posts
I read it, and what I said undermines everything written in it. Go ahead, call me a honkey and call England a country of violent, colonial, tea drinking brutes. I won't bat an eyelash, I promise. Tea drinking brutes. Made my day! | ||
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ceaRshaf
Romania4926 Posts
And Orb fired because of that is way too much. His career is almost over with the punishment and exaggeration he received. Sometimes I hate being in this immature community. Nigger, faggot, nazi are all words that have no meaning and value if we start letting go to the past. | ||
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branflakes14
2082 Posts
On March 09 2012 16:50 ZessiM wrote: Ok but no one is impervious to humiliation, there is a way that someone could push your buttons if they tried hard enough. Being offended by its very definition is 'offensive' - humiliation, anger, hurt feelings - all of these are offensive emotions that people can inflict upon you, people making you feel in a way you don't wish to. You shouldn't judge people as immature or weak minded or whatever just because they are offended by words I'm actually interested now as to whether any black people who claim to be genuinely offended by what Orb said have contacted EG, or if this is just another case of white guilt. | ||
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XRaDiiX
Canada1730 Posts
On March 09 2012 15:42 mute20 wrote: Not going to lie I didn't really like him in the beta broadcasting. He just always seemed to have this snide kind of douche personality. Not entirely surprised he is super bm, but not to this extent. Idra might be seen as a stand out player for his personality, but you know he is professional about it. He only talks about the game itself other than personal encounters he would judge you only on how he feels you play. I've always noticed it during all the times he casts and that's why i never liked his casting he had a snide way about going about his casting and it bothered me. It showed that he thought he knew it all when he rage on ladder because he thought he was better than everyone else i suppose that's usually what causes rage in us. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
There's the example of the CS players who pretended to be African-Americans. I don't know the background, but from what I read, that's something that could easily have been done in good spirit. It's like any racial "jokes", even when done with absolutely no racist intentions, are still frowned upon. When SC2 came out, I played a game where 3 friends and we all picked a black guy as our profile pictures. Keep in mind, we're all on "the left", and we're all strong proponents of equal rights. We strongly despise anything remotely resembling WNs. We've all used really strong language toward racist people, both during drunk and sober times. We all use every fucking derogatory label we can think of, including the "n-word", when we're together, we also mock people of all over the world, I would say especially ourselves (lol white people). There are plenty of great things about this community. So many things to be proud of. Smart people, talented people. Canned up rage against a word isn't something to be proud of. Canned rage from people who have lost track of what it is to be human. What of common sense? What of taking a person's words for what they truly mean to them - and not for what they remind you of? The "n-word" is no more offensive than the word "teacup" when it's used in such a way that it is devoid of its history. It may seem strange, but it really isn't - and once people grow up, we'll stop with these god damn inquisitions and witch hunts. The real assholes, racist people are out there, they're not the ones who use "the n-word" and "cunt" interchangeably without ever thinking about black people or vaginas. You people gave Orb the electric chair to soothe your conscience. This is overplayed and cheesy, but "the racists have won". They've managed to convince us that skin pigmentation somehow should be put on a pedestal, and is something we shouldn't joke about. But it's just the most visible difference between us all. If this kind of behavior wasn't so deeply ingrained in people, I think many of you would agree with me when I say that this is nothing short of childish. | ||
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nalgene
Canada2153 Posts
On March 09 2012 15:38 iloveAthene wrote: "nigger" and "nigga" are different words with different meanings It's just a word to replace "my "brother" " and " my "dawg" " to " my "N _ _ _ _ " " Everyone is not white in this video and their frequent use of N _ _ _ _ doesn't make them racist. " stop playin' N _ _ _ _ " " f _ _ _ that s _ _ _ N _ _ _ _ " They use all of those in that video but there's no caucasian in it though. Words change over time. That word has friendly connotations nowadays. It's not the 1500s to 1800s anymore. | ||
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justsayinbro
307 Posts
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iloveAthene
186 Posts
On March 09 2012 16:47 branflakes14 wrote: I read it, and what I said undermines everything written in it. Go ahead, call me a honkey and call England a country of violent, colonial, tea drinking brutes. I won't bat an eyelash, I promise. "Tea drinking brute" is the absolute lamest insult I've ever heard in my life. I guarantee I could find something I could say that would offend you but this thread cant devolve into that | ||
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Spykiller
Norway87 Posts
There is a word that we still hold taboo A word with a terrible history of being used to abuse oppress and subdue Just six seemingly harmless letters arranged in a way will form a word With more power than the pieces of metal that are forged to make swords A couple of G's an R and an E an I and an N Just six little letters all jumbled together have caused damage that we may never mend And it's important that we all respect that if these people should happen to choose to reclaim the word as their own it doesn't mean the rest of you have a right to its use So never underestimate The power that language imparts Sticks and stones may break your bones but words can break hearts A couple of G's G's unless you've had to live it an R and an E Even I am careful with it An I and an N, in the end it will only offend, don't want to have to spell it out again | ||
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Deleted User 137586
7859 Posts
On March 09 2012 16:34 fYlddnaHturtDyaWdmAi wrote: If orb is smart, he'd review the contract right now. I see at least 2 things here: discrimination or outright breach of contract. That's such a terrible attitude to take. I think Orb has a legitimate chance of using the klout from this drama to bounce back as a caster, but only if he 100% accepts the comments and changes his ways. Challenging this dismissal would undermine that and give very little reward. There is not much compensation from a poorly paying short-term contract. | ||
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