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Alex is verbose, and you owe it to yourself (and the rest of us) to read the statement in its entirety. Remember, when making comments/claims to provide proper evidence, facts etc. Arguments based on incorrect assumptions, facts and straw men, will be dealt with swiftly. If in doubt, PM a mod or ask IRC. Do NOT spread misinformation, when in doubt, check your sources. In short, be smart. Alex comments on Idra: Orbs Statement: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=319038 Personal attacks against other posters in this thread will be met with a ban -- 14:20 KST | ||
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Aserrin
Uruguay231 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:43 Razuik wrote: The N----- has a lot more history to it than the word F----- When did this turn into a contest on which word is more offensive? People should avoid offending others no matter the words they use and that's it. | ||
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Janders
Mexico222 Posts
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Niyanyo
Mexico71 Posts
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ShatterZer0
United States1843 Posts
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MrDudeMan
Canada973 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:46 Zzoram wrote: I was actually hoping that the community would grow up after this, but you're probably right. The anonymity of the Internet brings out the worst in people, and it's about time that we stop tolerating it. This incident probably won't fix the community overnight, but I've always felt the racist/homophobic/sexist/generally disrespectful part of gaming culture that refuses to go away is the single biggest limiting factor on the growth of professional gaming. Really, I think trash talking has had the opposite impact of what you think on the gaming community. The fact that you can get into a game, be as competitive as you want, and even trash talk has made it an outlet for a large number of people. This should be pretty obvious as a large part of the competitive gaming culture trash talks (yes this includes prejudice terms). | ||
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mango_destroyer
Canada3914 Posts
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skatbone
United States1005 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:44 wats0n wrote: That's absurd. The word only has meaning as it exists in the vernacular. Words have undergone changes in meaning in English for hundreds of years. English itself is only a vernacular language of the common folk. To suggest a word should be frozen in time and given deference is only perpetuating racism and growing the thoughts associated. No word has meaning on its own in a vacuum. You can't say that word to somebody with zero English experience and expect that by its euphony the person will recognize the sounds as being racist. That's total ignorance. On top of that, black scholars have explained the use of that word by black people themselves as a means of them re-inventing the word and changing the meaning to something positive. It's not simply about words and meanings...it's about the act of the using the n-word as part of a broader attempt to express disgust toward someone else. Orb was obviously not using it in the sense of black scholars who have demonstrated the manner in which a word with a negative connotation can be re-worked into a positive verbal gesture. Yes, meanings change. However, in a climate like that of the contemporary U.S. where, as Alex patiently discusses, racism continues to exist in very subtle, yet still incapacitating ways, the burden is on us to be vigilant in trying to understand how we continue to perpetuate racial inequalities when we are supposedly a post-racial society. | ||
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matiK23
United States963 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:48 TheRhox wrote: The worst thing people could have done is contact EGs sponsors and complain about this, honestly I can't believe this "community" sometimes, we all want to try to grow esports and people do stupid shit like that.. Yea what better way to help e-sports grow in the public eye by letting them know we have immature casters slurring out racial slurs at will and whenever he's angry because he has no self-control. That's the plan, Stan. | ||
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biology]major
United States2253 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:42 Chill wrote: Don't worry everyone, in 2 days everyone will forget about this and move on to the next stupid drama. Jesus. this is the problem with this stupid community, and reddit. Need to grow up | ||
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WeavingHarp9
Sweden23 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:31 Utinni wrote: Name any professional sporting event where it is allowed for a sports caster or reporter to say such hateful terms or anything similar. Idra does not have free reign to do what he wants, Alex hhas openingly been against idra's choice of words and apparently has it under control. Well if youre gonna look at it that way Im sure plenty of casters/reports have used a ton of foul language outside of work(which is what orb did) Anyways Im taking no stand in this as I think both sides are overreacting, but that might just be me that like too have leeway on things. and yes, I understand that there's alot of baggage to the word but there's alot of words with alot of baggage out there as well for other races etc and you still find n**** to be way over the top from the rest? I mean, you either give everyone leeway or its all or nothing. I find it a bit iffy when you fire orb for 1 misminor when idra have repeatedly done it over and over again in the past, and that is one of the reasons he got such a big fanbase, they like his attitude, and obviously you wont fire him when he brings you more money than you lose from keeping him, if that makes any sense. But then again, I guess not even EG can say no to one of the biggest communities out there backing you up either, having all the pressure about firing him for saying a word(i believe everyone have said or thought at least once, or something equally bad) but yeah, everyone is just better then the one making the error. Bottomline: Dont throw rocks in glasshouses. p.s. faggot is just as fucking bad, maybe not to you, but to a hell of a lot of people out there that have been chased and murdered for being a homosexual. yet you let that slide with a little warning? over and over and over again until he finally stopped. double standards TT | ||
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iloveAthene
186 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:45 OctoPuSs wrote: That can be said for about any friendly slur. I think it's sad how touchy this 'mature' community is becoming. True, but the thing here is Orb wasn't using the slur in a friendly way. That caused people to complain to sponsors and resulted in his firing. | ||
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huameng
United States1133 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:45 OctoPuSs wrote: That can be said for about any friendly slur. I think it's sad how touchy this 'mature' community is becoming. What, exactly, is less touchy (without not caring about anything) than drawing the line at being outraged when someone says "nigger"? That seems like just about the least you can care about if you care about anything at all. | ||
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disgruntled187
8 Posts
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Serpico
4285 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:48 compucomp wrote: For the people who don't think what orb said was bad, doubt how strong the term nigger still is, or think this is some silly witch hunt, think about Rush Limbaugh. He has called Democrats just about any derogatory name he can think of. He just called a woman a slut for advocating a policy position he disagrees with. But I can recall no instance when he said nigger on the record, even though he's said many things that are, shall we say, not positive towards black people. If Rush Limbaugh believes that he can't say nigger and get away with it, this word must be really quite bad. Orb needed to fall on his sword quite hard to get out of this, and he didn't. So now Rush Limbaugh is the precedent setter of what we can and cannot say? | ||
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Silvertine
United States509 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:47 Chill wrote: As I've said before - keep burning your volunteers and soon you're going to find that you don't have any more. As long as they're not all racists I think we'll be OK. On March 09 2012 13:49 Aserrin wrote: When did this turn into a contest on which word is more offensive? There is no contest, nigger is the far more offensive term. How there are still people who don't understand that is a mystery to me. | ||
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Defacer
Canada5052 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:07 Liquid`NonY wrote: People really have no idea how often opportunities are missed and doors closed without them knowing. Because not only does the internet operate in funny ways, so do people in the real world. It's always best to be your best at all times. Those of us who sometimes allow ourselves to act worse do it at our own risk. The difference in attitude here is what often sets apart people who hit a plateau in life and people who miraculously, seemingly luckily, succeed. I just wanted to repost this, for the benefit of all the naive, younger members that think how you behave, on the internet or even own your own time, is somehow irrelevant and has no impact on your life. | ||
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Gheed
United States972 Posts
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Razuik
United States409 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:49 Aserrin wrote: When did this turn into a contest on which word is more offensive? People should avoid offending others no matter the words they use and that's it. Oh, I completely agree, man. I don't think either should be used at all. They both attack (in context or out of context) a group of people. I was simply responding to the guy above my post. | ||
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TheRhox
Canada868 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:49 matiK23 wrote: Yea what better way to help e-sports grow in the public eye by letting them know we have immature casters slurring out racial slurs at will and whenever he's angry because he has no self-control. That's the plan, Stan. Maybe if he said that kind of stuff on a public EG stream, not his own damn channel. | ||
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Thorantham
United States221 Posts
On March 09 2012 13:47 motbob wrote: Let me use a counter- counter-example, a real world example. Way back in beta, Orb was defeatured for saying the word "nigger" while streaming, if I recall correctly. Yet that has never happened for people who've used the word "faggot" to my knowledge, nor do I recall that option ever being discussed. There is a double-standard there. The two words are not equivalent in the public eye. In addition, Orb and Idra are at different levels of being a "public figure." You used the example of a sports broadcaster. Obviously if a sports commentator used either the n-word or f-word, they would be fired immediately. If an NFL player used the word "faggot," what would happen to him? Would he be fired? wait, wait, so you've got a ban hammer, your saying that TL believes the use of and calling people "faggot" is acceptable? | ||
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