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On November 02 2011 04:03 FairForever wrote:Has anyone noticed how messed up the ladder is? It seems to have taken mid-masters players while excluding some huge names (eg. dde, Idra, Kiwikaki, OstojiY... all of them are known as ladder beasts in terms of being near the top). http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/ladder/grandmasterSome standard names there (eg. oGsVines, Sheth) but then you have some ppl such as this guy... http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/2131911/1/somefeelrain/Am I imagining things? Or is there a potential issue? So far no resolution has been reached, I know a few people who are clearly frustrated that they weren't included in the GM league even though they definitely have the results/MMR to be there (strong > 50% win rate this season + GM last season).
It sounds like you're glasses raining on his parade.
Did Artosis finally make GM?
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Wow, so many bad players in GM. I wish I was awake when it was open, I could have gotten a spot...
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i'm a 0-1 gm
i played my first game of the season and lost my placement and it gave me gm. Last season i had a high mmr + a reasonable amount of points (1700) though. I just didn't play any games after reset until today.
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On November 02 2011 04:33 FairForever wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 04:31 EdSlyB wrote:
I don't why people get so worried about who's or who's not in GM. I don't see the 'pros' going: "This is madness!! BS Bnet system!!!"
They don't give a shit about if they are in GM or not because its not the ladder that gives players the ultimate skill indicator. Many of the pros have smurfs for laddering and such. Get over thatbecause at the end ladder has little relevance in measuring a player's skill. StrifeCro is here. Attero (I believe) has complained. Pokebunny also commented on another thread (but I guess he's busy laddering now). So there are some pros. I doubt players like Idra care, but for those middle-of-the-road pros, a GM rank can add a lot more credibility (seeing as there are a lot of pros who don't even have the MMR to be in the GM league).
I don't care that much about getting GM, just curious about the mathematical system they used lol. kinda like a puzzle. But it is a negative sum game when 2 high players played each other last season. I lost like 20 points for losing to DDE rank 1 once and I'm sure he didn't gain 20, probably 4-5, which would explain the MMR cap. Example if our MMR is both capped at 1200, but I'm at 1500 points hes at 1650 or something then if we played each other forever, we would slowly both drop down to 1200 if we went 50/50.
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On November 02 2011 04:35 StrifeCro wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 04:31 Excalibur_Z wrote:On November 02 2011 04:25 StrifeCro wrote:On November 02 2011 04:19 Holcan wrote:On November 02 2011 04:12 StrifeCro wrote:
its definitely glitched. GM ladder has never filled up b4 people even wake up in the morning with all 200 slots. there have to be some people who slept longer than that and had top 200 MMR. I mean dde was rank 1 last season with 6/1 ratio or something and isn't there lol.
edit : just seems to have took the first 200 people who had decently high mmrs that played a game lol Well, I think the cap for MMR is reached, which would be the GM league. Plenty of players are able to create a new account and artificially inflate their MMR over their old account. Players are finally realizing that its more beneficial to get a smurf, with a clean slate MMR to GM, rather than pushing their stabilized MMR account into GM. So, what I am saying is, the intelligence of people to get new accounts with blank MMR, and the MMR cap which has already been reached by more than 200 people (probably around 400) all have an equal shot for GM. This just goes to show that Ascends GM show should be based of quality players, rather than who actually is in GM at any given time. Where did you read that there was an MMR cap? That doesn't really make sense at all. David Kim allegedly told some pro players in private conversations that an MMR cap exists. I can see this being true because points get harder and harder to earn the higher up in GM you get, which means your MMR has peaked (edit: and you're also playing against other people with peaked MMRs) but your points continue to rise above it. As for this particular GM league issue, it does appear to be a bug of some kind. You can only get promoted after a win, and GM league requires a promotion, not initial placement, and yet there are players with 0-1 records in GM which should be impossible. Probably something to do with people all at the MMR cap then, because It would explain lasts seasons behavior of why people all got very low points per win after a certain point and it never fixed itself like it does usually when peoples MMR increased again. I'm guessing the cap is pretty low and that there are way more than 200 people at it so it just became a race of who could wake up earliest lol. Don't know how people got promoted still with 0-1, maybe that is another change they made separately, where losses could give promotions because there's no inherent reason why only wins should promote you to GM, only for the other 5 ladders.
I doubt it. This would only happen if there were like 600 - 800 people at the MMR cap, which seems unbelievable to me.
Going back... I can definitely see how this might happen. I ran into top pros quite a bit last season (and I am definitely nowhere near their skill level). But I'm pretty sure I wasn't hitting MMR cap (I was about top 300 Masters in NA, so about Top 500 NA) because I still tended to play more with people in my range (as opposed to some top pros).
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The best part about this is all the posts on reddit bragging about GM. Though, in the end it is just the ladder and shouldn't be taken seriously anyway. The only benefit is getting invited to Blizzard tournaments. Unless they invite some random over Idra or whoever, I Don't see it being a problem.
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You can't judge a person's skill by looking at points... They mean nothing. How do you know that he isn't as good as any other top gm player?
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On November 02 2011 04:39 StrifeCro wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 04:33 FairForever wrote:On November 02 2011 04:31 EdSlyB wrote:
I don't why people get so worried about who's or who's not in GM. I don't see the 'pros' going: "This is madness!! BS Bnet system!!!"
They don't give a shit about if they are in GM or not because its not the ladder that gives players the ultimate skill indicator. Many of the pros have smurfs for laddering and such. Get over thatbecause at the end ladder has little relevance in measuring a player's skill. StrifeCro is here. Attero (I believe) has complained. Pokebunny also commented on another thread (but I guess he's busy laddering now). So there are some pros. I doubt players like Idra care, but for those middle-of-the-road pros, a GM rank can add a lot more credibility (seeing as there are a lot of pros who don't even have the MMR to be in the GM league). I don't care that much about getting GM, just curious about the mathematical system they used lol. kinda like a puzzle. But it is a negative sum game when 2 high players played each other last season. I lost like 20 points for losing to DDE rank 1 once and I'm sure he didn't gain 20, probably 4-5, which would explain the MMR cap. Example if our MMR is both capped at 1200, but I'm at 1500 points hes at 1650 or something then if we played each other forever, we would slowly both drop down to 1200 if we went 50/50.
That's just ridiculous then, because this MMR cap works contrary to the bonus pool.
It's not a huge deal but it is something that should be fixed. It would probably be better if Blizzard simply allowed players near the top of the MMR chain to have a wider range of possible opponents as opposed to capping it.
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wow I should've had a spot reserved in GM, but I didn't play this morning and now I miss out ? lol good work blizzard
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On November 02 2011 04:39 TheSwamp wrote:
The best part about this is all the posts on reddit bragging about GM. Though, in the end it is just the ladder and shouldn't be taken seriously anyway. The only benefit is getting invited to Blizzard tournaments. Unless they invite some random over Idra or whoever, I Don't see it being a problem.
I noticed that too, all the "my hard work finally paid off!" but it's actually completely broken hahaha
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This is a joke, there's people in that i beat 2 or 3 times yesterday (been matched as "Teams even" and even me being "slightly favored" and just because i dont wake up the second the season starts i miss out?
Lol.
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On November 02 2011 04:41 coL.drewbie wrote:
wow I should've had a spot reserved in GM, but I didn't play this morning and now I miss out ? lol good work blizzard
^ This... I feel sorry for the hardworking pro's who deserve to be GM and deserve the chance to be shown off to the NA Ladder system as the TRUE top 200 players in NA. If nothing is fixed, this problem is only going to get worse as we will have players artificially boosting their MMR at the end of a ladder season then camping out on reset day to be the first few lucky players that win the GM lottery.
GM Should be based on tournament / ELO and not on the luck of pulling a winning lottery ticket.
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On November 02 2011 04:41 coL.drewbie wrote:
wow I should've had a spot reserved in GM, but I didn't play this morning and now I miss out ? lol good work blizzard
You guys need to calm down hehe ^__^ If players that did not deserve Grandmaster spots, they will continue to lose a lot of games and will discourage them to ladder anyways. ^^ . at any rate, good luck to all players who made GM today ^___^
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i just got home forgot it was today t.t, hopefully spots will open midseason and since the seasons are so short it doesn't matter really
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On November 02 2011 04:08 Yip12343 wrote:
desrow has 2 accounts in top 200 lol.
And some of these i dont even know.. but if you have heard idra,minigun etc, they all say that GM on NA means nothing, so they're not worried.
my VTdesRow account was in top10 of master league last season (top10 overall) my desrow account was at 62% before reset. My MMR's are high enough to be in GM. Just like my EU account was facing top50 GM on EU at 53%winratio will probably get GM tomorrow as well.
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It's just so funny to compare the Top200 people on ladder as of last night, and people who are currently in GM.
There's so much discrepancy~
and now we can't say CombatEX is a Grand Master level cheeser anymore 
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On November 02 2011 04:41 coL.drewbie wrote:
wow I should've had a spot reserved in GM, but I didn't play this morning and now I miss out ? lol good work blizzard
GM is only a league... it is kinda sad that after three seasons of GM that blizzard could find a way to mess up this season... However... doesn't change the fact that pros are still pros and are much better than these guys in GM.. it could of been much much worse...
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GM is certainly fucked up right now, Blizzard messed something about the MMR's up. Too bad for those who were trying to get into GM, or those who got really excited when they were placed in GM.
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Countless players in the top 100 of Grandmaster last season didn't even get put into the whole top 200 Grandmaster this season. That's a joke. They should guarantee Grandmaster spots in the next season based on your last season's performance (for ex. top 50 get reserved slots next time).
I know for a fact ostogijy, lalush, idra, and slush are one of the best zerg players out there.
Even CombatEX and PiQLiQ as protoss played more games than anybody else, had a decent win ratio and still got nothing in return.
Pretty sure there's more than 200 players out there with a similar MMR and the first 200 to login got promoted. Everyone knows who the best players are anyway, it's not like it matters, but it's still a very flawed system.
When you watch a player like LiquidHerO go 50 and 3 as rank 1 master and wonder why he's not in Grandmaster because it's locked, it makes you laugh.
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On November 02 2011 04:19 Holcan wrote:Show nested quote +On November 02 2011 04:12 StrifeCro wrote:
its definitely glitched. GM ladder has never filled up b4 people even wake up in the morning with all 200 slots. there have to be some people who slept longer than that and had top 200 MMR. I mean dde was rank 1 last season with 6/1 ratio or something and isn't there lol.
edit : just seems to have took the first 200 people who had decently high mmrs that played a game lol Well, I think the cap for MMR is reached, which would be the GM league. Plenty of players are able to create a new account and artificially inflate their MMR over their old account. Players are finally realizing that its more beneficial to get a smurf, with a clean slate MMR to GM, rather than pushing their stabilized MMR account into GM. So, what I am saying is, the intelligence of people to get new accounts with blank MMR, and the MMR cap which has already been reached by more than 200 people (probably around 400) all have an equal shot for GM. This just goes to show that Ascends GM show should be based of quality players, rather than who actually is in GM at any given time.
That's exactly what I was thinking, we are at the point where MMR is capped blizzard would need to reset it to have a meaningful GM league.
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EPT
