Finally able to unveil some stuff the MLG_Adam (@MrMLGAdam) and I have been working on with a bunch of other folks on the MLG team and the community.
Orlando will feature a couple of significant stream improvements:
1) Less Downtime, More games on Red and Blue channels.
A lot goes into getting a match onstream, both technically and in terms of scheduling. It isn’t possible to eliminate all downtime, but starting in Orlando we will be implementing changes that will significantly minimize it.
We have added matches to the schedule of Friday and Saturday’s Main Stage matches
Two extra computers have been added to the Main Stage[LC] to reduce setup time.
Match start times have been staggered based on the Station at which they’re going to take place
2) 2 MORE Starcraft Streams featuring Community Casters and Open AND Championship bracket matches. Cast right from the tournament floor, there's now even more action that you won't be missing!
This is a beta. For now, the two beta streams will be available only to Gold and Silver Members ( http://majorleaguegaming.com/membership ) and those who have purchased an MLG Orlando HQ Pass.
All matches on these streams will be solo-cast by community casters Adebisi (@adebisiSC), Nerski (@VPnerski), Tumba (@TumbaSC), and Robin (@Robintivo).
The casters will choose matches on the fly over the weekend, based on what’s happening in the bracket.
For this Beta, the two streams will be available only in Medium and Ultra qualities in the MLG player.
These streams will air all weekend long, exactly as the Red and Blue streams do.
The Red and Blue streams will work the same way as they always have: available to everyone, with HQ available only for Members and those with HQ passes.
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Awesome! Definitely going to be higher expectations for the stream at Orlando, and I'm thinking they'll deliver. The only real problem I ever had with the MLG stream viewer experience was the downtime, and now that'll be fixed ;D
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
I assume the other casters are not actually casting for the crowd, so it shouldn't be necessary. From what I understood, it will work like an online tournament, the casters will be able to join tournament games of their choice as an observer and cast them like they would from their home.
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
I assume the other casters are not actually casting for the crowd, so it shouldn't be necessary. From what I understood, it will work like an online tournament, the casters will be able to join tournament games of their choice as an observer and cast them like they would from their home.
I know, but the GSL for example has 4 booths so they can jump from one match to the next and because Lee said they were adding 2 more comps for the "On Deck" players I was curious if they were in booths similar to the GSL because it's meant to make for more smooth transitions for each mainstage match.
Great improvements for Orlando, can't wait for it!
Good job mlg always listens and delivers, fix the way your points system works next season and i that will fix all my issues with mlg, thanks for delivering a great product.
The 4 community casters on the +2 Beta streams will be casting from backstage from matches that are happening out on the tournament floor. Not from mainstage. So at any given point and time, there could be FOUR different matches for you to watch.
The +2 beta streams will be focusing on matches on the tournament floor in open and champ bracket which are NOT on red/blue. So we have the chance to follow White-ra or whoever in open.
On September 30 2011 04:58 MLG_Lee wrote: The 4 community casters on the +2 Beta streams will be casting from backstage from matches that are happening out on the tournament floor. Not from mainstage. So at any given point and time, there could be FOUR different matches for you to watch.
The +2 beta streams will be focusing on matches on the tournament floor in open and champ bracket which are NOT on red/blue. So we have the chance to follow White-ra or whoever in open.
Will there be some sort of clear up-to-date info on which matches and casters are being shown on which streams? I suspect TL will hack something together to do this, but a clear, official one from MLG would be really nice. Keeping 2 streams open is annoying, but 4 would be pushing reasonable...
I look forward to stream hoping and seeing some of my favorite players battle it out against Koreans or other top competitors. GO MLG I have been loving you since tourny 1.
On September 30 2011 04:58 MLG_Lee wrote: The 4 community casters on the +2 Beta streams will be casting from backstage from matches that are happening out on the tournament floor. Not from mainstage. So at any given point and time, there could be FOUR different matches for you to watch.
The +2 beta streams will be focusing on matches on the tournament floor in open and champ bracket which are NOT on red/blue. So we have the chance to follow White-ra or whoever in open.
Would be awesome if those streams if they pick a game up would be announced in the mlg live blog beside the official streams.
On September 30 2011 04:58 MLG_Lee wrote: The 4 community casters on the +2 Beta streams will be casting from backstage from matches that are happening out on the tournament floor. Not from mainstage. So at any given point and time, there could be FOUR different matches for you to watch.
The +2 beta streams will be focusing on matches on the tournament floor in open and champ bracket which are NOT on red/blue. So we have the chance to follow White-ra or whoever in open.
Will there be some sort of clear up-to-date info on which matches and casters are being shown on which streams? I suspect TL will hack something together to do this, but a clear, official one from MLG would be really nice. Keeping 2 streams open is annoying, but 4 would be pushing reasonable...
Great question. We're working on a system to do this easily, but regardless, there will be a way to see what's playing where on the schedule
This is unacceptable. More streams and less downtime. How am I supposed to have enough bandwidth to watch this all? I demand to be given less and to pay more for it.
Really great to hear can not wait to take in all the games gonna have to get a pass for this one! could you maybe talk a bit more about how the open bracket stream is going to work. Will they just jump into games and cast/stream them live and then move onto another game after that one finishes.
Orgasmatic is the word I believe. MLG just gets better and better and better. Anyone remember Dallas? Because I surely can't remember anymore, with all this awesome on the way!
Will there be some sort of clear up-to-date info on which matches and casters are being shown on which streams? I suspect TL will hack something together to do this, but a clear, official one from MLG would be really nice. Keeping 2 streams open is annoying, but 4 would be pushing reasonable...
The matches that are being streamed on the two beta streams will be announced in the liveblog and there will be a schedule of all four streams up on the site throughout the tournament. Red and Blue stream schedules will be available a bit sooner than the schedules from the beta streams, since they're deciding those on the fly, but it'll all go up as soon as it's available.
Still a little sceptical of what final product will be like but great idea from MLG. Always impressed with their commitment to make things better and better
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
Why not just do the GSL-style and have another pair of booths?
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
I like the idea of all those streams. Glad I picked up a gold a while back. Thanks MLG!
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
Ok gotcha. So the guy on deck will be messing around right next to the booth during the match though? I guess that's better than downtime by quite a bit still.
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
Why not just do the GSL-style and have another pair of booths?
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
Ok gotcha. So the guy on deck will be messing around right next to the booth during the match though? I guess that's better than downtime by quite a bit still.
Off to the side of the stage we'll have our techs working with the on deck players to make sure their machines are configured correctly. Once the main stage match ends, we swap wires, players swap, and the new match can start quicker.
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
Ok gotcha. So the guy on deck will be messing around right next to the booth during the match though? I guess that's better than downtime by quite a bit still.
Off to the side of the stage we'll have our techs working with the on deck players to make sure their machines are configured correctly. Once the main stage match ends, we swap wires, players swap, and the new match can start quicker.
Cool. Thanks so much for the quick and direct feedback. You guys at MLG are really doing a great job. Keep up the good work.
Will any of the sc2 streams have more entertaining downtime? Just wondering if it will ever be like the reach stream where the crowd camera moves around and zooms in on people and has a variety of music instead of the one guitar looping. The reach stream has also had fun things like the "kiss cam" and other fun things.
Will that ever make it to a sc2 stream? even if its just the Red stream or something?
Awesome, and I think it's great to provide additional content to your gold/silver members ( yeah i've got a gold membership, maybe I'm biased ^^). I think it's also a great opportunity for smaller caster to reach the public. <3 MLG
On September 30 2011 04:49 zaii wrote: You guys should notice that the 2 extra streams will only be available to league members Gold/Silver.
You're actually going to complain about having to pay money for a THIRD and FOURTH stream? MLG is going so far out of the way to provide as much content as they possibly can. How much do you expect people to give stuff out for free? You're already getting two streams for nothing if you choose not to pay it. Give me a break, some people are never happy with anything.
Good work MLG, Orlando is going to be some serious SC2 overload.
On September 30 2011 05:55 Whiplash wrote: Constant innovation, it seems like this is what MLG is becoming known for. Great stuff guys, can't wait for more
If this is for this year, can you picture how great next year is going to be!?!?!?!?!?! :D
On September 30 2011 05:47 BrettDeL wrote: This is awesome Lee/Adam! Question though..
Will any of the sc2 streams have more entertaining downtime? Just wondering if it will ever be like the reach stream where the crowd camera moves around and zooms in on people and has a variety of music instead of the one guitar looping. The reach stream has also had fun things like the "kiss cam" and other fun things.
Will that ever make it to a sc2 stream? even if its just the Red stream or something?
We actually do this already pretty frequently, but not all the time.
Are these community casters any good? I know Abedisi and Nerski. Also, thank God for this community caster idea. No more waiting an hour until the next match when we're missing great other matches!
Check in the article for a big sample of work from all four of these casters- they've cast unstreamed matches from Raleigh and Anaheim for us. There's also a bunch more of their stuff on mlg.tv that you can find by searching for their names.
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
So the computer is outside the booth and only the monitor is inside? I see that makes a good bit of sense. Not as time efficient as the GSL method, but absolutely easier to set up, cheaper, and more space efficient.
Cool news, very excited for the quad streams. Any chance for a sick PiP feature in the future? Like that warp prism site for player streams
Seriously I can't wait for 2012. MLG is already incredible now. I really think in 2012 everyone will be looking at MLG as the worlds best tournaments and the ones you can NOT miss.
I'm really happy that MLG is continuing to work on their tournaments. They don't just say "Meh, it's good enough." They constantly look for feedback, and care about their audiences
So glad to see continuous improvement from you guys. You've come quite a long way from Dallas last year, or even the start of this year. Although I'm not quite sure how (other than bigger prize pools ) I can't wait to see what else you guys continue to do to improve the events. Not only for those there, but for those back at home too. Thanks!
pretty sure this will be overred or just not interest anyone, but i would just prefer just 1 stream with non-stop action, swapping from 1 game ending to another one already started. 100% sc2 =)
Im trying really hard to find a reason to put off buying Gold or Silver membership because but im starting to run out of them haha. I might see how the beta goes and what people say of it before I dive right in but damn.. mlg is shaping up well
On September 30 2011 06:24 BigLighthouse wrote: Im trying really hard to find a reason to put off buying Gold or Silver membership because but im starting to run out of them haha. I might see how the beta goes and what people say of it before I dive right in but damn.. mlg is shaping up well
you can just get mlg HQ pass, for 9.99. it also gives access to the 2 extra streams
On September 30 2011 04:44 eNtitY~ wrote: Is there going to be 4 sound proof booths now on Mainstage?
No, just 2 booths, but we're doubling up on tournament machines there so the "on deck" players will be able to set up before the previous match is over. Reduces the 15-20mins of set up time between matches.
Maybe I'm just missing something here, but does this mean 2 computers aren't in booths? How does this help at all?
The computers are not currently in the booth as is...too much heat. We'll just be doing cable swaps once the 'on deck' player enters the booth.
Why not just do the GSL-style and have another pair of booths?
Could be a cost / maintenance issue. GSL sits in one spot, MLG has to move and reassemble stuff.
I'm assuming we'll be able to access VODs of the community casters after the fact? Or is this not a good assumption? (As I mentioned in previous post, I do have a gold membership).
I really hope that the casters don't end up killing their voices tho. Day[9] really gets into the matches and already is hoarse by the end, so I am just hoping that more games don't totally kill his voice.
Less downtime is amazing; but as you have said you cannot avoid downtime, is it possible to get some indication of when something will be starting rather than random shots of the crowd or "coming soon"?
Also the 2 new streams is an awesome initiative - the community casters and grabbing games as they are happening, as long as they don't get tired :p
Some really great ideas! Looking forward to this MLG!
I met Lee at MLG D.C. 2010, and while it's probably hyperbole to say that 'there are few people with more passion for SC2 competitions than him', well... I believe it anyway
I love how overwhelming SC2's presence became in MLG's 2010 Pro Circuit; I love that the community did that. I love that MLG responded favorably and has embraced the game. We all know about technical difficulties, growing pains, etc. that have happened, but MLG has been trying, and doing a far cry better than many could manage, certainly. And here now we have more evidence that they're continuing to improve (yay!).
MLG has a membership sale from me, that's for sure. It was awesome to watch SeleCT from just a few feet away (right outside the crowd-control barrier) while the bench crowd chanted "Show the game!" and prompted HuK's mothership play, but traveling to every Pro Circuit stop would get prohibitively expensive for me More streams and match coverage is going to be awesome!
Match start times have been staggered based on the Station at which they’re going to take place
Does that mean red and blue won't have pauses at the same time and start matches at the same time? This is at least a couple of events too late. MLG is very slow, but at least it's steady improvement. Nicely done.
On September 30 2011 06:56 bkrow wrote: Less downtime is amazing; but as you have said you cannot avoid downtime, is it possible to get some indication of when something will be starting rather than random shots of the crowd or "coming soon"?
Also the 2 new streams is an awesome initiative - the community casters and grabbing games as they are happening, as long as they don't get tired :p
Some really great ideas! Looking forward to this MLG!
The SC2 Red/Blue schedule is always published. So unless there's an issue with a player not showing up for their match or a technical problem, matches always start as scheduled.
Very nice, much looking forward to these improvements. I felt like Raleigh was really lacking in streamed games, this should be great. Nice work, MLG, keep it up. Will continue to purchase the stream.
Go MLG! How have those community casters been chosen? 4 streams is better than 2 of course and less downtime is always nice, even though it didn't bother me before. You earned my gold membership twice over with this kind of commitment to improving!
I presume a tighter schedule means the players brackets will be stacked even more or is there some kind of big break for the attendees? Just asking because a lot of the players were complaining about the hard schedule (concerning downtimes) of last MLG, especially in the open bracket on saturday.
Cannot believe they allowed Tumba to cast a tournament that matters. Good luck to all who choose to watch that stream, I would handcuff myself before you turn it on though so when you want to blow your brains out you won't be able to.
Really though, will we be using 3 or 4 LR threads now?
Still feel like keeping it tied in one thread is the best idea. People can LR from different stream if they feel like it, and give each other's suggestion's as to what to watch.
Seriously, comparing MLG Dallas at the start of this season to MLG Columbus -> Anahiem -> Raleigh -> Orlando isn't like comparing Apples to Oranges, its like comparing Apples to Elephants on Porches blasting 80's hair metal while fixing its vintage monocle.
Extraordinary work guys. At this rate Korea might have to start taking tips from MLG when it comes to broadcasting SC2 games.
give us lowely regular viewers the beta streams PLEASE!!! the idea of watching live open bracket play has caused me to change my underwear thrice in the past 10 minutes!
everything else looks awesome, you guys are making ellie the esports elephant so happy!
Have you considered having an observer in a couple of the more high profile games and just setting it to follow one players pov? It would be good for the open bracket games that run too late to get cast.
Really though, will we be using 3 or 4 LR threads now?
We all know this is whats gunna happen. They're gunna make 4 LR threads. 2 will be completely abandoned. 1 will be a mini-LR thread, not much on here. and the last one will be a clusterfuck of flaming and balance whine, and the occasional actual live report.
Looking forward to working with the MLG crew and working my butt off leading up to orlando to provide the best casting possible to everyone in the community.
On September 30 2011 08:00 Nerski wrote: Looking forward to working with the MLG crew and working my butt off leading up to orlando to provide the best casting possible to everyone in the community.
Not mentioned a lot in this thread, but this is also great for the casters as well - it will draw in a lot of new people to listen to their casts that might not have otherwise and get them some exposure .
On September 30 2011 07:38 hoepie wrote: give us lowely regular viewers the beta streams PLEASE!!! the idea of watching live open bracket play has caused me to change my underwear thrice in the past 10 minutes!
everything else looks awesome, you guys are making ellie the esports elephant so happy!
To be quite honest, there's no better deal in ESPORTS. Just buy the membership and support MLG. MLG is what ESPORTS needs to become great and they are doing all the right things.
This is awesome, MLG just gets better and better. The beta streams should definitely stay subscriber only in my opinion, its a really good price considering the content.
So much Starcraft X3 MLG, despite some of the faults you have displayed in the past, at very minimum you are showing that you guys want to make your viewers happy =D
are we able to watch multiple streams simultaneously in HQ? i remember not being able to do that at either the last MLG or the one before. but i was able to for events prior to those.
awww I just realized that the 2 extra streams will be available only to league members. But you know what, you gotta make money, and this is a GREAT way to do it! So rock on, guys! I still REALLY appreciate the reduced downtime, that's freaking awesome!
great news, mlg just keeps improving, its the best sc2 tourney for me to watch, always watch it all 3 days normally every single match. keep improving mlg
On September 30 2011 05:12 Clues wrote: This is unacceptable. More streams and less downtime. How am I supposed to have enough bandwidth to watch this all? I demand to be given less and to pay more for it.
On September 30 2011 10:40 FlamingTurd wrote: Omg I can't wait for MLG Orlando, I'm actually going and have been looking forward to this for so long now.
Why is something in Beta testing only available to the silver and gold memberships? I understand you are giving something to those who pay for it, but if you are trying to pull more people into your product you probably want to get mass feedback to figure out if it is a worthwhile investment. I mean in all fairness game betas are free even though I guarantee if you charged 5$ per Diablo III beta key everyone would pay it. I am not complaining about what they are trying to do, but I really don't understand why they add something new but only those who pay for it get access to it.
I am glad they are listening to the people who watch and endorse their product and are always trying to improve the tournament. Although they do some questionable things from time to time...
Wow. This is awesome. MLG always delivers in terms of bringing top talents around the world and giving the viewers exactly what they want. You guys are definitely an organization I will support (By buying a gold pass and peer pressuring my friends to do the same)!
Downtime was only a problem at the last event mainly due to the fact that it had the exact same promos as the event previous to it. So are we going to be getting new promos this time around to play between the games? There's only so many times I can listen to the same few songs and watch the same promos over the course of a weekend .
But yeah, keep on improving, MLG is becoming more and more awesome each event.
This was definately the next logical step for MLG in terms of development really happy they finally decided to offer this. Now hopefully we can have a lag free event and Orlando should be legendary :D
ADEBISI!!!! finally! you are the shit dude, im so happy you're getting this gig, i know you wont let us down, and hope you get some more fans, cause right now, you probably the smartest caster ive heard beside Artosis! GG GL
sigh. every MLG weekend I find myself in trouble with the misses. she used to watch with me, but she is 7 months prego and has no desire even staying up past 8:30 pm. guess im sleeping on the couch yet again.
On September 30 2011 15:31 Koshi wrote: MLG why so awesome? I am sad that I am still a gold member for the next 12 months, I can't trow more money at you.
Nice one, especially if the downtime is lower this will improve MLG a ton.
But do i see this correct:
The MAIN change is that you have "on the fly" casters... Which in simple words means: "Casters that join games and cast it?"
Which requires: Running SC2. Internet connection (lagless). Microphone. Someone willing to cast (which plenty of people would do for free, and probably are doing).
Hm... Yeah, groundbreaking changes! . It's not like every fucking dayli/weekly tournament manages this since 1.0?
And you make people pay for this? Brilliant... All these other big events must feel retarded to not milk the cow like you do... Or probably they just don't feel as greedy/srs business/corporate interest as MLG...
Bad day Velr? MLG is cheap as hell, I don't remember exactly what I paid but I think it was a bit more than 20€ for 14 months gold membership.
They fly over Tastosis, Day[9], Wheat, Husky and JP the bringer of sandwiches. They have consistently the best playerbase besides the GSL. Only because all foreigners want to compete in the MLG.
They now have more games on Red, Blue. They now have an additional 2 streams. They now have an additional 3 casters.
On September 30 2011 16:10 Velr wrote: Nice one, especially if the downtime is lower this will improve MLG a ton.
But do i see this correct:
The MAIN change is that you have "on the fly" casters... Which in simple words means: "Casters that join games and cast it?"
Which requires: Running SC2. Internet connection (lagless). Microphone. Someone willing to cast (which plenty of people would do for free, and probably are doing).
Hm... Yeah, groundbreaking changes! . It's not like every fucking dayli/weekly tournament manages this since 1.0?
And you make people pay for this? Brilliant... All these other big events must feel retarded to not milk the cow like you do... Or probably they just don't feel as greedy/srs business/corporate interest as MLG...
Or we could not have it, that will show em whos boss.
Big congratulations to the casters bagging the gig! Should be a great event.
Especially big grats to Robin and Tumba who always put in a lot of effort when it comes to SC2 in general! Now if only I didn't live in Finland so I could try my hand haha xD <3
It's nice to have it and it's for sure an improvement.
I just think It's kinda ridiculous that it: A: Took so long and should have been there from the start. B: They charge you for something that costs them basically nothing. ("community casters?" just call them amateurs - i never heard of them and i follow A LOT of foreign SC2...). C: Other events deliver this/similar things since like... Well.. Since they exist for free.
I'm more stoked for less downtime/improved red/blue streams .
Oh and:
They fly over Tastosis, Day[9], Wheat, Husky and JP the bringer of sandwiches. They have consistently the best playerbase besides the GSL.
They fly in Koreans in which make the MLG playerbase "good". Whiteout them the lineup of most MLG's isn't in any way better than that of any other big events (sometimes it's clearly worse --> Raleigh). As for the Casters... Yeah, theire nice... But i don't see how theire better than Rotterdam/Mr.Bitter or TotalBiscuit/Apollo... But i actually have a huge personal dislike of DjWheats casting and get tired of Day9 after like 10 minutes... So i'm not really the one to judge this .
Only because all foreigners want to compete in the MLG.
WTF? All MLG has goign for it, is that you get an "easy" Code A/S. Do you really think only 3-4 Europeans and/or european teams can "afford" to get some players to an MLG? If it would be oh so important we would see way more but for most it's just not worth it.
On September 30 2011 16:10 Velr wrote: Nice one, especially if the downtime is lower this will improve MLG a ton.
But do i see this correct:
The MAIN change is that you have "on the fly" casters... Which in simple words means: "Casters that join games and cast it?"
Which requires: Running SC2. Internet connection (lagless). Microphone. Someone willing to cast (which plenty of people would do for free, and probably are doing).
Hm... Yeah, groundbreaking changes! . It's not like every fucking dayli/weekly tournament manages this since 1.0?
And you make people pay for this? Brilliant... All these other big events must feel retarded to not milk the cow like you do... Or probably they just don't feel as greedy/srs business/corporate interest as MLG...
Wow, when every daily/weekly tournament is in a lan setting check back here to complain. But since they aren't i don't think they are all that relevant. Setting up two additional sets in the back area to stream out of likely isn't as free as you think. These casters aren't casting out of their moms basement. As far as i can tell they will be setting up two more casting booths in the back for them.
The point was, that if a dayli/weekly kinda amateurish tournament could deliver this since fucking 1.0 (or even in Beta) than it should be like a given for "big" events.... Last time i checked Dreamhack/Assembly and i'm unsure about IEM delivered this since the get go?
AND there is no "Lan" setting when it comes to this kind of casting... All is run thru Bnet (no Lan feelign), the caster does not even need to be "physically" there if he's not commentating for the crowd... So where is MLG any diffrent from an online cup in this regard when it comes to these "new" casters?
On September 30 2011 16:48 Velr wrote: WTF? All MLG has goign for it, is that you get an "easy" Code A/S. Do you really think only 3-4 Europeans and/or european teams can "afford" to get some players to an MLG? If it would be oh so important we would see way more but for most it's just not worth it.
That's clearly the most valuable prize available, but players were attending before the league exchange program. Teams send players for more than the prize money. They want the publicity for their brand and their sponsors.
On September 30 2011 16:48 Velr wrote: WTF? All MLG has goign for it, is that you get an "easy" Code A/S. Do you really think only 3-4 Europeans and/or european teams can "afford" to get some players to an MLG? If it would be oh so important we would see way more but for most it's just not worth it.
That's clearly the most valuable prize available, but players were attending before the league exchange program. Teams send players for more than the prize money. They want the publicity for their brand and their sponsors.
Ok, i end this after this.
But if the publicity would be so important... Then why aren't we seeing more foreigners? :p.
We see NA Teams + TL (which is very global)... Other teams seem not to be to interested to show up in force... PROBABLY because it's just not worth it .
I like MLG and i'm stoked for this... I just get annoyed by how overhyped it is and how much people are "taken by the hype".
On September 30 2011 16:48 Velr wrote: WTF? All MLG has goign for it, is that you get an "easy" Code A/S. Do you really think only 3-4 Europeans and/or european teams can "afford" to get some players to an MLG? If it would be oh so important we would see way more but for most it's just not worth it.
That's clearly the most valuable prize available, but players were attending before the league exchange program. Teams send players for more than the prize money. They want the publicity for their brand and their sponsors.
Ok, i end this after this.
But if the publicity would be so important... Then why aren't we seeing more foreigners? :p.
We see NA Teams + TL (which is very global)... Other teams seem not to be to interested to show up in force... PROBABLY because it's just not worth it .
I like MLG and i'm stoked for this... I just get annoyed by how overhyped it is and how much people are "taken by the hype".
MLG has Koreans playing in it. And the Koreans love coming to MLG and interacting with the foreign fans and we in turn enjoy their high level play. Simple as that.
Holy shit Velr, you're seriously complaining about this? You must have gigantic issues... I'm not gonna adress most of your points, but the reason we only see a bunch of europeans is that they would have to go through the open bracket which a) is incredibly hard and b) doesn't guarantee you a spot in the groups next MLG because we're so late in the season. I would be shocked to see less than 8 top notch europeans to attend the early MLGs next year.
Still, I do not understand why you do not simply alternate the streaming schedule for red and blue, so that for example game one on red starts at 10:00, game one on blue 10:30, game two on red 11:00, game two on blue 11:30, etc.. This should reduce downtimes _a lot_ and give us the chance to see more without swapping between streams (or watching multiple ones at the same time).
I can see that this might lead to problems in the later rounds, when one player would have to wait for another, but for most of the tournament, this should be fine.
On September 30 2011 17:51 Artrey wrote: Great news.
Still, I do not understand why you do not simply alternate the streaming schedule for red and blue, so that for example game one on red starts at 10:00, game one on blue 10:30, game two on red 11:00, game two on blue 11:30, etc.. This should reduce downtimes _a lot_ and give us the chance to see more without swapping between streams (or watching multiple ones at the same time).
I can see that this might lead to problems in the later rounds, when one player would have to wait for another, but for most of the tournament, this should be fine.
MLG would also have to scatter the game starting times also, then. This could mean some players have 30 minutes more to prepare for their matches, than other players. Would this be fair?
Awesome. Already silver member. Can't afford to give away more money at the moment even though its not much, just not possible at the moment. I will definately update as soon as money allows it :-)
On September 30 2011 17:51 Artrey wrote: Great news.
Still, I do not understand why you do not simply alternate the streaming schedule for red and blue, so that for example game one on red starts at 10:00, game one on blue 10:30, game two on red 11:00, game two on blue 11:30, etc.. This should reduce downtimes _a lot_ and give us the chance to see more without swapping between streams (or watching multiple ones at the same time).
I can see that this might lead to problems in the later rounds, when one player would have to wait for another, but for most of the tournament, this should be fine.
MLG would also have to scatter the game starting times also, then. This could mean some players have 30 minutes more to prepare for their matches, than other players. Would this be fair?
I don't think it matters that much. Not at all in the group phase (which is like more than half of the tournament) for sure. And later on, it is not totally balanced either anyway.
On September 30 2011 16:48 Velr wrote: WTF? All MLG has goign for it, is that you get an "easy" Code A/S. Do you really think only 3-4 Europeans and/or european teams can "afford" to get some players to an MLG? If it would be oh so important we would see way more but for most it's just not worth it.
That's clearly the most valuable prize available, but players were attending before the league exchange program. Teams send players for more than the prize money. They want the publicity for their brand and their sponsors.
Ok, i end this after this.
But if the publicity would be so important... Then why aren't we seeing more foreigners? :p.
We see NA Teams + TL (which is very global)... Other teams seem not to be to interested to show up in force... PROBABLY because it's just not worth it .
I like MLG and i'm stoked for this... I just get annoyed by how overhyped it is and how much people are "taken by the hype".
MLG has Koreans playing in it. And the Koreans love coming to MLG and interacting with the foreign fans and we in turn enjoy their high level play. Simple as that.
It's not worth it to send players with such a small prize pool. Especially so late in the season when only the select few are invited to the national championship based on previous results. The Koreans that play are there because they are invited and MLG pays for it - or Koreans are sent there by Foreign teams (such as Complexity, TL, SK, FXO).
I am one of the people who hype up MLG because the competition is amazing - but it's pretty silly to say it's worth it for the teams to send players. The prize pool is laughably low for how much hype it gets - they already said they were changing the system next year so that's good.
MLG really making it up for the past disaster occasions. After they hit the bottom regarding viewer pleasure, everything went incline and for them, they are amazing now.
On September 30 2011 16:48 Velr wrote: WTF? All MLG has goign for it, is that you get an "easy" Code A/S. Do you really think only 3-4 Europeans and/or european teams can "afford" to get some players to an MLG? If it would be oh so important we would see way more but for most it's just not worth it.
That's clearly the most valuable prize available, but players were attending before the league exchange program. Teams send players for more than the prize money. They want the publicity for their brand and their sponsors.
Ok, i end this after this.
But if the publicity would be so important... Then why aren't we seeing more foreigners? :p.
We see NA Teams + TL (which is very global)... Other teams seem not to be to interested to show up in force... PROBABLY because it's just not worth it .
I like MLG and i'm stoked for this... I just get annoyed by how overhyped it is and how much people are "taken by the hype".
What is IEM and Dreamhack doing wrong that their events aren't as hyped as MLG?
On September 30 2011 16:48 Velr wrote: WTF? All MLG has goign for it, is that you get an "easy" Code A/S. Do you really think only 3-4 Europeans and/or european teams can "afford" to get some players to an MLG? If it would be oh so important we would see way more but for most it's just not worth it.
That's clearly the most valuable prize available, but players were attending before the league exchange program. Teams send players for more than the prize money. They want the publicity for their brand and their sponsors.
Ok, i end this after this.
But if the publicity would be so important... Then why aren't we seeing more foreigners? :p.
We see NA Teams + TL (which is very global)... Other teams seem not to be to interested to show up in force... PROBABLY because it's just not worth it .
I like MLG and i'm stoked for this... I just get annoyed by how overhyped it is and how much people are "taken by the hype".
What about Dignitas? Sure they aren't going to Providence, but thats more because of having their players in Korea. They sent multiple guys from all over to every other MLG. FXO has done the same. Mouz has sent players to MLG and aTn has sent Socke to MLGs as well.
And when MLG changes their formats, I expect many more Europeans. And it won't have much to do with the larger prize pool, but rather that around a million people are watching.
I do to, i like the changes for next year and hope it will change how the playerlist looks .
Yes, there were some europeans there (mainly the ones that wanted to go to Korea which went there and never went again (because they got Code A or didn't like it enough to bother again?).
I really like that there are more casters/games shown (how couldn't i), i just don't get the big fuss/hype because well... The things they add now are like a given at most other big (and small) events since Day 1 (and they are free)? Thats my whole complaint ^^.
I'm really looking forward to next year and hope MLG will finally truly live up to the hype it generates
I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
Its the same with any global tournament really. Dreamhack and other European tournaments are loaded with European players, a couple of NA, and a few Korean invites. MLG and other NA tournaments are loaded with NA players, a couple of EU and a few Korean invites. GSL and other Korean tournaments are loaded with Koreans and a Canadian.
Travel costs are really starting dig into the teams pockets.
Wow, this news. Admittedly I've never heard of any of the community casters, but who cares? 4 streams is unbelievable. MLG just keeps outdoing itself with every event, such a far cry from the troubles of a year ago.
5:30pm: EGHuk vs StartaleJuly 6:00pm: STBomber vs LiquidSheth 7:00pm: oGsMC vs StartaleJuly 8:00pm: STBomber vs EGPuma 9:00pm: EGHuk vs oGsMC 10:00pm: FnaticRain vs HongUnPrime 11:00pm: EGIdra vs SlayersBoxer
Blue Stream 5:30 pm: LiquidHero vs oGsMC (with 59% of the vote) 6:00pm: Kiwikaki vs Puma (with 68% of the vote) 7:00pm: Huk vs Tyler (with 46% of the vote, narrowly edging out Idra vs Drewbie, which got 42%). 10:00pm: RGNSlush vs LiquidRet 11:00pm: LiquidTyler vs StartaleJuly
I'm really excited about the changes. They had a rocky start, but I feel as if they have made so much progress in creating a tournament that really caters to its viewers in a way that makes watching games get played fun and easy. I think that given some more time MLG will be a shinning example of how a professional tournament should be handled.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
Excellent post. Unfortunately, MLG decided to retain their system because apparently they think being consistently bad is better than mixing things up and fixing a huge mistake.
And for anyone who says MLG wanted to preserve the integrity of their system, OUT OF NOWHERE THEY DECIDED TO FLY OVER KOREANS AND SEED THEM INTO POOL PLAY.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
Excellent post. Unfortunately, MLG decided to retain their system because apparently they think being consistently bad is better than mixing things up and fixing a huge mistake.
And for anyone who says MLG wanted to preserve the integrity of their system, OUT OF NOWHERE THEY DECIDED TO FLY OVER KOREANS AND SEED THEM INTO POOL PLAY.
Because changing it halfway through the season would pretty much nullify the success of what the players have achieved at the beginning, even if you don't think that they are significant.
MLG knows they have a botched system and they do admit it. They probably have new seeding plans next year.
And what's wrong with the LXP? The Koreans they have invited thus far have never failed to disappoint, barring Trickster. The crowd loves them dearly.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
Excellent post. Unfortunately, MLG decided to retain their system because apparently they think being consistently bad is better than mixing things up and fixing a huge mistake.
And for anyone who says MLG wanted to preserve the integrity of their system, OUT OF NOWHERE THEY DECIDED TO FLY OVER KOREANS AND SEED THEM INTO POOL PLAY.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
Excellent post. Unfortunately, MLG decided to retain their system because apparently they think being consistently bad is better than mixing things up and fixing a huge mistake.
And for anyone who says MLG wanted to preserve the integrity of their system, OUT OF NOWHERE THEY DECIDED TO FLY OVER KOREANS AND SEED THEM INTO POOL PLAY.
this is a problem because?
Read the post of the person above you. People like him defend MLG's failure to fix their admittedly broken system mid season because they say it would undermine the system MLG set out at the beginning of the season.
However, in MLG Dallas, the first event of the SC2 season, MLG did not invite Koreans. The next event, they did. Moreover, they seeded the Koreans directly into pool play. Essentially, MLG recognized their tournament didn't have the best players in the world and they fixed the problem. I agree with you that this a good thing.
That said, Sundance has been speaking out of both sides of his mouth. He himself has said changing the system mid season would be unfair to the players. Yet, he did it before regarding Korean invites, and it was great success.
It's hypocritical of MLG to refuse fix one thing because it would be 'unfair,' when they already took a drastic step by inviting Koreans. In fact, whatever changes they make to fix their embarrassing points system would likely be much less drastic then the step of inviting Koreans, because ever since they invited them Koreans have swept the podium.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
Excellent post. Unfortunately, MLG decided to retain their system because apparently they think being consistently bad is better than mixing things up and fixing a huge mistake.
And for anyone who says MLG wanted to preserve the integrity of their system, OUT OF NOWHERE THEY DECIDED TO FLY OVER KOREANS AND SEED THEM INTO POOL PLAY.
this is a problem because?
Read the post of the person above you. People like him defend MLG's failure to fix their admittedly broken system mid season because they say it would undermine the system MLG set out at the beginning of the season.
However, in MLG Dallas, the first event of the SC2 season, MLG did not invite Koreans. The next event, they did. Moreover, they seeded the Koreans directly into pool play. Essentially, MLG recognized their tournament didn't have the best players in the world and they fixed the problem. I agree with you that this a good thing.
That said, Sundance has been speaking out of both sides of his mouth. He himself has said changing the system mid season would be unfair to the players. Yet, he did it before regarding Korean invites, and it was great success.
It's hypocritical of MLG to refuse fix one thing because it would be 'unfair,' when they already took a drastic step by inviting Koreans. In fact, whatever changes they make to fix their embarrassing points system would likely be much less drastic then the step of inviting Koreans, because ever since they invited them Koreans have swept the podium.
I agree that the point system is pretty bad and needs changing but you really can't hate on MLG for getting the koreans involved in their tournaments I mean with foreigners going to Korea and Koreans joining foreigner teams left right and center you can't realistically claim to be hosting a legit world class tournament if you don't have the koreans playing in it.
Now I know europe's got amazing players and having the best europeans like stephano mana and thorzain playing in MLG's regularly would actually make it possible for a foreigner to take the win but you can't compare european stars to korean stars... If I had to choose I'd much rather see DRG, Bomber, MVP, Boxer, MMA, Losira, MC, etc than any group of europeans.
I think there's no simple solution for this but I think these changes would contribute:
1. MLG decides to reset/revamp their point system so that people who consistantly get crushed go back to the open bracket and the players who get through the bracket are actually rewarded at the next event.
2. Some people like foreigners, some people like koreans, some people simply like starcraft but it would definately be bad for MLG and the foreign scene if every single pool was filled with koreans, as such I think they should've added a pool or made pools larger when they started inviting koreans. The same could be done now for europeans, add a pool and an extra player in every pool and you can now invite 2-6 european stars to MLG, attracting a much larger audience and increasing the foreigner's chances (significantly).
3. The prize pool gets bigger, and not only for top finishers. By now alot of the best foreigners have made peace with the fact that winning MLG isn't what it was 4 months ago but if you were able to win a reasonnable amount of money (at least enough to cover tournament expenses and bring something home) just for making top 20/clearing the open bracket it would definately attract more pros from overseas. Obviously MLG can't just decide to triple their prize pool so this process will probably happen over time but I think it's essential.
4. The lack of coverage on games was the main (only) issue I ever had with MLG productions and I think they've made a great decision with their recent announcement but I hope they take it even further in the near future and start putting observers in every pool play match so that you can ALWAYS at least watch 1 game during the event, with or without commentary. In my opinion this would be essential if they did decide to expand their pools and increase the amount of players in pool play.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
Excellent post. Unfortunately, MLG decided to retain their system because apparently they think being consistently bad is better than mixing things up and fixing a huge mistake.
And for anyone who says MLG wanted to preserve the integrity of their system, OUT OF NOWHERE THEY DECIDED TO FLY OVER KOREANS AND SEED THEM INTO POOL PLAY.
MLG was smart to fly out koreans because it gave the tournament legitimacy. I don't think any tournament without koreans in it should be considered a high level tournament.
Guys, wait for next year. Points will be erased and (hopefully) the MLG seeding system will change to fit those Europeans in, as well as the risen prize money per tournament. The thing is: changing a system that is supposed to be used for the final "big" tournament mid-season is just wrong. Inconsistency is the word I believe. They want to remain consistent, even if it means maintaining bad players in pool play.
On October 01 2011 06:53 Zephirdd wrote: Guys, wait for next year. Points will be erased and (hopefully) the MLG seeding system will change to fit those Europeans in, as well as the risen prize money per tournament. The thing is: changing a system that is supposed to be used for the final "big" tournament mid-season is just wrong. Inconsistency is the word I believe. They want to remain consistent, even if it means maintaining bad players in pool play.
2012 will be THE year for MLG.
Did you read the big red letters that have been quoted several times?
On October 01 2011 06:53 Zephirdd wrote: Guys, wait for next year. Points will be erased and (hopefully) the MLG seeding system will change to fit those Europeans in, as well as the risen prize money per tournament. The thing is: changing a system that is supposed to be used for the final "big" tournament mid-season is just wrong. Inconsistency is the word I believe. They want to remain consistent, even if it means maintaining bad players in pool play.
2012 will be THE year for MLG.
Did you read the big red letters that have been quoted several times?
"out of nowhere" was probably a long and more-than-wanted drawn out discussion on whether it would be good or not for the koreans. Yes, the way it went was bad.
On October 01 2011 06:53 Zephirdd wrote: Guys, wait for next year. Points will be erased and (hopefully) the MLG seeding system will change to fit those Europeans in, as well as the risen prize money per tournament. The thing is: changing a system that is supposed to be used for the final "big" tournament mid-season is just wrong. Inconsistency is the word I believe. They want to remain consistent, even if it means maintaining bad players in pool play.
2012 will be THE year for MLG.
Did you read the big red letters that have been quoted several times?
Bringing in the Koreans didn't change the system or the way points work, its just made the tournament much harder.
On October 01 2011 06:53 Zephirdd wrote: Guys, wait for next year. Points will be erased and (hopefully) the MLG seeding system will change to fit those Europeans in, as well as the risen prize money per tournament. The thing is: changing a system that is supposed to be used for the final "big" tournament mid-season is just wrong. Inconsistency is the word I believe. They want to remain consistent, even if it means maintaining bad players in pool play.
2012 will be THE year for MLG.
Did you read the big red letters that have been quoted several times?
Bringing in the Koreans didn't change the system or the way points work, its just made the tournament much harder.
They seed Koreans into pool play who didn't earn their spots. Imagine Major League Soccer was having its playoffs. Then, without warning, management brought in Man U, Chelsea, and Arsenal who never played a MLS game. Are you telling me that wouldn't be changing the system?
Pools were changed from 5 players to 6 players. That isn't changing the system? I don't mean to be rude, and I do see what you mean, but I just agree with you.
First post :p I bought spectator passes this will be my MLG I physically attend, figures they would go ahead and add more streams now! Awesome job though guys, keep it up! I'll most likely end up streaming MLG while attending MLG.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
We are fixing that problem next year, I promise.
Good to hear. For me thats just an addition of awesomeness, because I already like your tournament and production and more European players just add to that. I don't know if you will change your system for seeds / pool play or if you are planning on international events, but I think even the hypocrites here and the negative comments realize how much work and effort you put into it.
So, keep your head up high and the production running :-)! GLHF~ So looking forward to Orlando
On October 01 2011 23:22 zeromajor01 wrote: its time to get BIGGER PRIZE POOLS. Take away from other tourneys if you have to (halo and cod). you guys are taking advantage using the GSL
Please do some research and reading before making posts like this, they have already stated MULTIPLE TIMES IN MULTIPLE OUTLETS that they will increase the prize pool for next season.
Awesome! Definitely going to buy an HD pass, time to run 4 streams across 2 sets of dual-monitors Hopefully eventually we can stream all of the streams in HD with 1 member pass.
On September 30 2011 19:12 mTw|NarutO wrote: I'm going to state my honest opinion about why not a lot of European foreigners are being sent to MLG and please don't take it as offence. I do love MLG, love watching and would always support them but for foreign progamers its the following:
MLG is a well run tournament with a decent prize pool and the chance to qualify for an even bigger event the MLG finals with amazing price pool. The thing is, that with the current system of the pool play and a really hard to pass open bracket and increasing number of Korean players, its just very unlikely or in no relation to costs to make a name for yourself or your team.
HasuObs is going to MLG Orlando because he won a qualifier now, but I doubt mouz would send him, MorroW etc to MLG just because the costs are so high and the chance for them, even though they are insanely good, is very slim to get into the prize zone.
a) it costs too much for foreign teams - no one is to blame b) the relation between costs/reward is too low - once again no one to blame c) more Koreans mean its even more unlikely to get some money out of the tournament
thus: we see more NA players and invited Koreans than EU foreign players. Obviously 'high class' foreigners with their own sponsor or really rich teams can send people to MLG... others teams could probably as well, but its just not worth it.
mouz and ALTERNATE could for sure send Socke, ClouD, MorroW, HasuObs... but for what reason (especially towards the end of the MLG qualifiers) when the chances actually decrease to get some value out of it.
There are plenty of tournaments in Europe which are open with not as much of a prize pool, but actually low to no costs and actually good chances of winning MORE than MLG even with a lesser prize pool.
I love MLG, I love their production, improvements and contact with the community, but thats just nothing they could do something about. Maybe they could change their system slightly so people actually have to qualify for pool play and have 1 invite for each group, but thats nothing I have to decide or want to think about.
To the person who said what Dreamhack & IEM are doing wrong: MLG has far more events per year and thus: a lot of viewers. :-)! I really enjoy all the tournaments, but people just have to realize its not always possible to have ALL players from all over the world attend at all tournaments.
We are fixing that problem next year, I promise.
See, this is why MLG is so awesome. Already running a great event? Fuck that, let's make it better. Made a great event even better. Eh, next year will be better still.
And you guys listen to strong, well thought-out feedback like what Naruto wrote. <3 <3 <3 MLG.
okay that makes me for the first time actually consider paying for it. in the past i always thought it was a waste of money because: yes u get a lot of good matches BUT(!) it wasn't like you could spend the evening watching just mlg without doing sth else in between matches. You would get bored out of your mind because of the downtimes and therefore it was actually the smarter thing, to go do something else, or just occasionally tune in for a very promising match.
Now the only thing that needs fixing in my opinion is the format (i dont know what would be best, but i know its not a very good format right now, and too many people are in the pools who don't really deserve it. No offense but no one can really argue that the system is kinda unfair that way)
Anyway now i am looking forward to it,so keep it up !
On October 02 2011 18:45 ReboundEU wrote: Streams look absolutely awesome specially now that we get up to 1080p HD on live streams. Really can't wait to check out MLG
Streams on ultra are 720p. Sorry no 1080p yet. Easy to do that home not so easy to do that in an MLG setting.
On October 03 2011 03:16 PepperoniPiZZa wrote: That's awesome but you still have auto-renew on paypal enabled for your memberships which prevents me from giving you my money.
Can't you cancel immediately after signing up to disable the auto renewal?
This sounds fantastic! More matches cast, and especially the casters getting to decide what to cast on the fly... should stop those situations where everyone in the LR thread is going on about this epic match that's being played while both streams show audience cams!
EPT
Definitely going to be higher expectations for the stream at Orlando, and I'm thinking they'll deliver. The only real problem I ever had with the MLG stream viewer experience was the downtime, and now that'll be fixed ;D
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glad I got a Gold pass.
