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Puma leaves TSL for EG - Page 36

Forum Index > SC2 General
7189 CommentsPost a Reply
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Mortal
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
2943 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#701
On July 21 2011 15:55 Mayor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:53 mango_destroyer wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:49 Nicodemusher wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:47 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:46 Shewklad wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:43 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:41 Shewklad wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:35 babylon wrote:
What the fuck is going on?

Fucking hell. Firstly, this is horrible press for foreign teams. Absolutely shitty. Secondly, going behind management? Dodgy at best. Thirdly, Puma, I know money is great, but you just got 50k USD, and at the very least you could, y'know, wait until your contract expired?

Goddammit, what the hell is wrong with having a little professionalism in SC2?



Everything this man just wrote.


EG must be one of the most unprofessional teams there is. And I'm pretty sure that Puma will get bored when Incontrol, Idra and machine are "hitting the gym" - While Puma acctualy wants to improve in sc2.

Yes, because SC 2 players literally practice so much they can't do anything ever not involved with SC 2.



If you used your brain you would understand that what I ment is that Puma is used to practice SO much more then the rest of those guys, and I don't think it will be fitting at all for Puma.

Unless Puma played broodwar (I've no idea) as a pro in Korea I'd assume he's never practiced as much as Idra consistently in the same atmosphere. No need to use insults so aggressively kiddo.

Puma's a top-rated BW player, man.

This is huge...damn.


Lol Define top rated BW player. I don`t think he was.


He practiced with Flash. ^^


he was top rated in terms of skill not achievements. He's always had nerve issues, and clearly they are not enough of an issue to deter him from winning a major tournament.
The universe created an audience for itself.
bounca
Profile Joined June 2011
140 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#702
--waits for tyler to make a comment--
red4ce
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States7313 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#703
On July 21 2011 15:53 namste wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:51 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:
Well EG is rumored to be building a team house so if they get their stuff together and start really pushing it, they could be quite formidable. Also, If puma stays in Korea, I think playing alone would be pretty bad for his skills, I would think he would have to travel to EG's house. no? If thats the case, who will translate? or can he speak english? Idra The Translator? For a Terran?



Well living together with Incontrol or someone like Machine, doesn't help him improve either tbh. EG should make a deal with some team like let's say Startale so Puma could live and practice in their team house or something similar to that.


Calling the end of PuMas career here, wont winning anything major ever again, thanks to lack of practice environment.


If you read the post-game interviews of Koreans you'll notice that most players practice with people outside of their team also. Even if Puma burned his bridges with TSL by doing this he'll still have lots of other practice partners, especially since he was an ex-bw pro.
Angelbelow
Profile Joined September 2010
United States3728 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#704
On July 21 2011 15:53 DystopiaX wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:51 Halcyondaze wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:47 ckolev wrote:
Dislike - Bypassing the coach is something really bad. Like for professional sports players, I think that this is unacceptable. There should be some kind of rule, that this should be forbidden. I mean if the player wants to leave, its OK, but first and most importantly it should be contacting the current team coach/manager and discussing it with them. EG just lost my respect for that team, sorry


This is not professional sports you moron. There are not contracts, these players are free game and have free roam to do whatever they want. If TSL is paying him next to nothing, I'm surprised he hasn't left yet, it's clear he was looking for a foreign team. And he will be paid better and treated better. You are a joke, ignorant opinion #1281. Get a fucking clue

I like how you call people ignorant when there are tons of things wrong with your post. 1. there are contracts, which is why Puma had to be released. It's not like these are loose organizations, there is an Sc2 players association and most pros are contracted. TSL was the first team to give players actual salaries, and Puma got one. He wasn't "looking" for a team, EG contacted him first. I don't know exatly how much money he was making but if they gave FD 30k and Tester 27k then I'm sure he got a comparable amound cause he's at least as good if not better. If you wanna tell me that EG has over half of an NASL grand prize money to throw on one player you better be able to back it up with facts, but I'm almost sure you can't.


Lol youre calling people out for saying wrong things but unless you work for TSL, you dont know what they were paying puma. You dont know whether he was looking for a team or not. Puma is not a machine, if he had any emotional attachment to TSL this wouldnt have been easy. And I suspect that its not as simple and as straight forward as coach Lee saying he was stolen. We heard one side of the story but there are many more, EGs perspective and Puma's perspective.
You may delay, but time will not. Current Music obsession: Opeth
EnderCraft
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1746 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#705
Lets face it, western teams have so much more to offer than any Korean team. Not only that, the only tourney to play in Korea is the GSL! One. Single. Tournament.

Guys I can finally state this without a doubt in my mind. The western Starcraft 2 scene has finally eclipsed the Korean scene in over a year and it's only going to get bigger.

The GSL finals being held at blizzcon is only the preview for what is truly to come. I don't think a foreign GSL finals is going become a once a year thing as most people are assuming. GOM is investing A LOT into the foreign scene, and I think they recognize how much faster our scene is outgrowing the homegrown Korean eSports scene.

I wouldn't be surprised if half of the Korean teams we see today disappear by the end of 2012. The western scene is where it's at baby. And the GSL is most likely going to follow suit. I wouldn't be surprised at all if GOM expands to have a studio outside of Korea in the next year. Like I said, the GSL finals at blizzcon is just the beginning....
SC:BW has a higher skill ceiling than SC2? SC 64 is where it's at brah.
zoLo
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States5896 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#706
On July 21 2011 15:55 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:52 zoLo wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:51 Torpedo.Vegas wrote:
Well EG is rumored to be building a team house so if they get their stuff together and start really pushing it, they could be quite formidable. Also, If puma stays in Korea, I think playing alone would be pretty bad for his skills, I would think he would have to travel to EG's house. no? If thats the case, who will translate? or can he speak english? Idra The Translator? For a Terran?


NO. Why do people think that if you do not have a team, you will be a shitty player? He probably has a good list of people that are good. Do you guys not remember all the interviews of the Korean players who give credit to players for helping them practice? Most of the time they mention players OUTSIDE their team.


Yeah, but I was thinking that based off the sort of culture you see from the SlayerSJessica thing, this could impact him socially over there. I don't know what other players think of this but at least the fans are going to give him crap.



I doubt it. You act like his teammates are his only friends. For all we know, some of TSL are happy for him and some aren't.
FryktSkyene
Profile Joined December 2010
United States1327 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#707
On July 21 2011 15:55 Mayor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:53 mango_destroyer wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:49 Nicodemusher wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:47 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:46 Shewklad wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:43 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:41 Shewklad wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:35 babylon wrote:
What the fuck is going on?

Fucking hell. Firstly, this is horrible press for foreign teams. Absolutely shitty. Secondly, going behind management? Dodgy at best. Thirdly, Puma, I know money is great, but you just got 50k USD, and at the very least you could, y'know, wait until your contract expired?

Goddammit, what the hell is wrong with having a little professionalism in SC2?



Everything this man just wrote.


EG must be one of the most unprofessional teams there is. And I'm pretty sure that Puma will get bored when Incontrol, Idra and machine are "hitting the gym" - While Puma acctualy wants to improve in sc2.

Yes, because SC 2 players literally practice so much they can't do anything ever not involved with SC 2.



If you used your brain you would understand that what I ment is that Puma is used to practice SO much more then the rest of those guys, and I don't think it will be fitting at all for Puma.

Unless Puma played broodwar (I've no idea) as a pro in Korea I'd assume he's never practiced as much as Idra consistently in the same atmosphere. No need to use insults so aggressively kiddo.

Puma's a top-rated BW player, man.

This is huge...damn.


Lol Define top rated BW player. I don`t think he was.


He practiced with Flash. ^^



And he did shitty in tournys and important matches.

Like OP said. Define top rated.

top rated = solid player SOMETIMES?
or
top rated = solid player ALWAYS?
Snitches get stiches
Mars.DreaM
Profile Joined June 2011
United States24 Posts
July 21 2011 06:56 GMT
#708
hmmmmm....great move by EG to get PuMa and even though we still don't know exactly what happened after the SotG and ITG thing its soo easy to just blame EG solely.
MaestrO_
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States591 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#709
This is very interesting, i like seeing the new influx of Korean's into foreign teams, but the method in which PuMa left seems fishy. At least from the information i gathered. But hopefully this can be another bridge for more foreign-korean interaction
Sacro
Profile Joined April 2010
Norway237 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#710
I looked at this then looked away before realising what i have just read, this is huge! I don't care one bit that EG went directly to puma. It's his choice and there should not be a system which prevents foreign teams from stealing koreans.

Koreans get better practice being on korean teams, and better opertunities to leave korea and play elsewhere by being on a foreign team.

I am very excited about how the scene is evolving and seeing how there will just become better and better players a long with more players as they switch from sc1 in korea and others that just practice and becomes good, i see a very bright future for the competetive scene of SC2! =)
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#711
On July 21 2011 15:51 SiCkO_ wrote:
The biggest issue was that EG started talking up another player while he was participating for another team away from most of his teammates and coaches. And while Puma was certainly able to say no, I imagine that EG would not even bring it up if they weren't 100% sure that they could make an offer that was better than anything TSL could have offered (Korean SC2 teams are not as well off because all the big bucks go to the Brood War players who are already well known and in the spotlight a lot more).

What would you think if your girlfriend went to another state/city/country to go to a conference with people who knew she was going out with you, and yet some rich guy there stole her anyway. It's not the fact that they got Puma as much as it was basically EG flipping the bird to the entire team and to a lesser extent, all of korea, by saying "hey, so most of our players aren't as good are yours, whatever, we can just buy your players up even though you have them contracted because we have tons more money than you".

TSL's staff and coaches spent time, energy and capital to make sure their players could succeed and do well. Their result? A player poached before he can even pay off, by a time that failed to even get a SINGLE PLAYER into the top 16 of the competition he was competing in.

The reaction? I wouldn't be surprised to see teams keep their players (at least their top ones) in korea (with the exception of FXO) to simply safeguard their talent pools. EG in my opinion, has not only cemented the old Brood War concept that Koreans are simply the best, but they have also set back many of the ties that had been building as a result of cooperation between various organizations (TL-oGs, FXO/fOu, Dreamhack, GSL/MLG). This is bigger than one player, it is the precedent that Foreign teams can poach their top talent.

I wish PuMa the best of luck, but EG's move is in my opinion, inconsiderate, exploitative, and a damaging blow to Korean/Foreign relations in SC2. Poor Show

I agree with this 100%.
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
Halcyondaze
Profile Joined January 2011
United States509 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#712
On July 21 2011 15:55 Dodgin wrote:
I would like to remind everyone that Liquid is the only foreign team with a player in Code S. This by definition makes them the #1 foreign team.


They are also the only team with a player in korea with the ability to compete in Code S. Aside from FXO
IceSlipper
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Australia1028 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#713
On July 21 2011 15:54 brum wrote:
That's why you make your players sign contracts and stuff? Not just have them around and make them play willy-nilly.

It sounds like he was under contract? They released him, why wouldn't they if he no longer had any interest in being on the team (contracted or not) and wanted to go elsewhere.. TSL don't seem to have a say in this..
MrDudeMan
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada973 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#714
On July 21 2011 15:53 Olinim wrote:

mouz is still way stronger than EG.


I wouldn't say so. Puma and Idra are definitely better then everyone on mouz except perhaps thorzain.
N.geNuity
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States5112 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#715
On July 21 2011 15:55 Mayor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:53 mango_destroyer wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:49 Nicodemusher wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:47 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:46 Shewklad wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:43 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:41 Shewklad wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:35 babylon wrote:
What the fuck is going on?

Fucking hell. Firstly, this is horrible press for foreign teams. Absolutely shitty. Secondly, going behind management? Dodgy at best. Thirdly, Puma, I know money is great, but you just got 50k USD, and at the very least you could, y'know, wait until your contract expired?

Goddammit, what the hell is wrong with having a little professionalism in SC2?



Everything this man just wrote.


EG must be one of the most unprofessional teams there is. And I'm pretty sure that Puma will get bored when Incontrol, Idra and machine are "hitting the gym" - While Puma acctualy wants to improve in sc2.

Yes, because SC 2 players literally practice so much they can't do anything ever not involved with SC 2.



If you used your brain you would understand that what I ment is that Puma is used to practice SO much more then the rest of those guys, and I don't think it will be fitting at all for Puma.

Unless Puma played broodwar (I've no idea) as a pro in Korea I'd assume he's never practiced as much as Idra consistently in the same atmosphere. No need to use insults so aggressively kiddo.

Puma's a top-rated BW player, man.

This is huge...damn.


Lol Define top rated BW player. I don`t think he was.


He practiced with Flash. ^^

why do people keep saying that? He was on estro then hite sparkyz.
iu, seungah, yura, taeyeon, hyosung, lizzy, suji, sojin, jia, ji eun, eunji, soya, younha, jiyeon, fiestar, sinb, jung myung hoon godtier. BW FOREVERR
yeint
Profile Joined May 2011
Estonia2329 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#716
On July 21 2011 15:55 Dodgin wrote:
I would like to remind everyone that Liquid is the only foreign team with a player in Code S. This by definition makes them the #1 foreign team.


No it doesn't. It makes them the #1 foreign team that is currently fielding players to the GSL.
Not supporting teams who take robber baron money.
BFCrimson
Profile Joined August 2010
United States176 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#717
On July 21 2011 15:55 DystopiaX wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:52 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:50 DystopiaX wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:49 Serpico wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:48 Keype wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:45 wats0n wrote:
Why weren't Korean netizens outraged when Startale picked up Trickster? Gimme a break.

it was a complete different reasons, they didnt have the same plans for the future and tsl were going through changes etc.
to topic : ye it will be hard to cheer on eg and more to cheer on puma in the future:/ Poor tsl.

Lol the amount of emotion you're putting into this move is comical. It's not really a big deal and not having players under contract is naive, if you dont have the money to pay them then someone else will.

They were salaried. And quite well.

Define "quite well", because I guarantee you the players will always go for more. Quite well becomes "not enough" pretty quickly when someone else with more money comes knocking.

30k for FD, 27k for Tester, and since he's better than both I'm assuming comparable money, and certainly more than EG can afford.


A large assumption, if he had any sort of contract I doubt they would scale his salary in real time as his play progressed, how are we to know if he was even getting payed at all as he has risen quite rapidly
GMonster
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
686 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#718
On July 21 2011 15:50 sigoly wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 21 2011 15:46 Itsmedudeman wrote:
On July 21 2011 15:46 sigoly wrote:
idra
demuslim
puma

that looks respectable.

time to kick out the dead wood in incontrol, machine, axslav, strifcro and lz and employ more poaching shenanigans.

demuslim isn't even close to those 2 lol...

you're right, but the poor bastard broke his arm. he's just settling, or about to settle back into a good practice environment.

before the arm break he was one of the top terrans in europe and there's no reason he can't regain his top form again.


iNcontroL getting top 4 @ mlg... yeah im sure EG is going to cut him... idiot. Have you even watched Axslav play... my god i will be surprised if you last another day on tl.
GrandMaster Terran NA Server / Mod @ justin.tv/incontrol
A Wet Shamwow
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1590 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#719
Somewhere Tyler is shaking his head knowingly.
“Life is a gamble, at terrible odds. If it were a bet you wouldn’t take it.”
moopie
Profile Joined July 2009
12605 Posts
July 21 2011 06:57 GMT
#720
On July 21 2011 15:40 EnderCraft wrote:
My mind is completely blown. Flashes former personal practice partner joins EG... CONGRATULATIONS!

lol I am really amused that you guys think of Puma as Flash's personal practice partner.
I'm going to sleep, let me get some of that carpet.
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