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What you have put quotes around and claimed I said, is not a quote and is just your own fabrication. However when I quoted him, it was a direct quote.
His claim that it would take weeks to even make a blog post is nonsensical and supported by nothing. That was an example of someone "talking out their ass".
My point that not only can they approve significant changes, they can actually implement them in a week, is supported by real world patches.
As I have already said, I am a programmer. But claims like that are not relevant. Feel free to talk to me in programming terms.
Claiming it would take over a week for them to even get these photoshops and development goals put together for their blog post isn't really related to programming anyways. It's just pure idiotic fantasy driven by your desperate desire to argue with me for some reason. I guess because I offended EG and their fanboys or something?
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On October 26 2012 11:58 Portlandian wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 11:43 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 11:33 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 11:26 corpuscle wrote:On October 26 2012 11:23 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 11:11 corpuscle wrote:
People saying that the new HotS updates are just some graphic designer dicking around in Photoshop to make a mockup to appease the masses: no, you are wrong, read more carefully. The XP system which was just previewed is something that's coming in the next beta patch, and that definitely took longer than a week for the dev team to throw together. Fucking read the information that's available to you before you run around smearing shit everywhere, this is getting really annoying. In other words, it's not out yet and all they have shown us is a couple mockups and a blog posts. See the post above you, you're being really dumb. Anyone that knows anything about programming and/or software engineering would 100% tell you that adding something like the XP system is a major underhauling that takes a long time, and has certainly been in the works since before the #savehots shitstorm. Major underhauling? No, it's just adding an XP field to a database, deciding what numbers the levels and portrait rewards are at, and assigning an XP value to each unit killed/produced. This is an incredibly simple change. I am a programmer myself. I don't think you are. lol, this guy. With a statement like that you are either a terrible programmer or you never actually worked on a project but by being a programmer you mean that you have written textbook console applications in c#. Please, elaborate. What step of this incredibly complicated process of adding xp to their database and rewarding xp for each kill did I miss? It's really, really, really simple. I actually have a hard time thinking of a more easy and superficial change than adding xp values to units killed/produced.
Logically sure it may be not be that complicated to actually code it, but a company as big as blizzard surely has a whole process or processes when releasing changes no matter how minor. Not to mention the strategic deadlines of releasing public info or patches. I am quite sure any programmer who works in a relatively big corporation knows the restrictions of all the processes involved and the decisions from the higher ups.
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On October 26 2012 13:21 Portlandian wrote:
What you have put quotes around and claimed I said, is not a quote and is just your own fabrication. However when I quoted him, it was a direct quote.
His claim that it would take weeks to even make a blog post is nonsensical and supported by nothing. That was an example of someone "talking out their ass".
My point that not only can they approve significant changes, they can actually implement them in a week, is supported by real world patches.
As I have already said, I am a programmer. But claims like that are not relevant. Feel free to talk to me in programming terms.
Claiming it would take over a week for them to even get these photoshops and development goals put together for their blog post isn't really related to programming anyways. It's just pure idiotic fantasy driven by your desperate desire to argue with me for some reason. I guess because I offended EG and their fanboys or something?
I am not sure I would like to know what kind of programmer is this ignorant to how team based productions work. I am not talking out of my ass, I work as a game developer. I studied game design at Luleå Technical University and I work full time for Arrowhead Game Studios in Stockholm. But as you said that is not really relevant. I don't need credentials to point out why you are wrong because anyone who reads what I have said can use common sense to deduce why you are so obviously wrong.
If you are actually a programmer, I suggest keeping the notions you have brought up here to yourself at your next job interview.
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On October 26 2012 13:21 Portlandian wrote:
What you have put quotes around and claimed I said, is not a quote and is just your own fabrication. However when I quoted him, it was a direct quote.
His claim that it would take weeks to even make a blog post is nonsensical and supported by nothing. That was an example of someone "talking out their ass".
My point that not only can they approve significant changes, they can actually implement them in a week, is supported by real world patches.
As I have already said, I am a programmer. But claims like that are not relevant. Feel free to talk to me in programming terms.
Claiming it would take over a week for them to even get these photoshops and development goals put together for their blog post isn't really related to programming anyways. It's just pure idiotic fantasy driven by your desperate desire to argue with me for some reason. I guess because I offended EG and their fanboys or something?
Yeah, you're a troll. Glad I didn't get sucked into it beyond one post lol.
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On October 26 2012 13:16 VanGarde wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 12:33 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 12:23 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 12:15 Portlandian wrote:
These two patches are only a week apart, but in that time from concept to patch they completely changed the widow mine from the previous iterations.
Basically you are claiming that to even release the mockup and blog post took more preparation and work than the entire widow mine changes done between these patches. That is just so absurd I don't know what to say.
Stop being silly. Omg those are balance patches. Really? You claim(read lie) that you are a programmer and you can't tell the difference between balance changes during a beta and implemented whole new features? The point of the whole beta is to test out units primarily which means they can be quite flexible with implementing test changes to see if they pan out. They don't "test" features by throwing them into the beta to then retract them a week later. I've already pointed out that it does not matter how fast you could write the code to add these features, even if you could do it in a day that is not how software development works. The majority of the time it would take for that thing to go from idea to being in the game lies on the design side, not programming. There is a design incentive to be able to quickly implement changes to unit mechanics in a beta because it is really hard to judge from the point of design what would fix a certain unit, if you know the mine is not working you might have good ideas for how to fix it but due to how complex the game is the efficient way to do it is to not waste the time of multiple designers to sit and brood over that for weeks only to still have the idea fail in tests. You just throw it in to get instant feedback. You don't need to do that for what is essentially a ui feature, there is no need to quickly throw that together and toss it into the beta so people can test out the ins and outs of looking at their xp screen in detail. Those things are essentially finalized by the time they go into the beta because designers can perfect those features without the need for external feedback. When you are close to the final product you still throw it into the beta to get additional feedback from users on subtle things. It has a new ability and changed design for the widow mine, not a simple numbers adjustment. To borrow your words: "this is not just a matter of herp derp lets add an integer variable called [unstable payload]". According to your timelines unstable payload would have taken "more than a week just between when someone got the idea for this, and before anyone actually starts working on it" (again, your words). I am using a real world example, as opposed to your ridiculous exaggerated fantasy. If they can come up with a new concept for the widow mine, create a new ability, approve it, and implement it in a week, surely they can make a blog post with some photoshops in less than a week. Since you are either intentionally dense or are having serious comprehension problems let me do this like how I would treat a 6 year old. Let me educate you into what a game designer does. A game designer at any level is not this guy who sits and thinks of cool ideas for a game and then have the team implement them. A game designer is someone who thinks of a cool idea for a game, then has to conceptualize it with sketches and descriptions which also require him to think through every stage of it. If it would be a cool idea to have xp in the game, what would that be like? How do you earn xp, do you earn it from various sources? Where is your collected xp viewed? Are there varying rates of xp depending on what you do? What can you get from the xp you have collected? How would this affect various kinds of players? Would this concept fit in with our current vision for the game? In a large team for an AAA+ production you now also have to iterate on the design with a team and people will have to trade ideas, compromise and agree on if this is a good idea and then adjust it based on what new ideas have come fourth. Now you can get to work, but still only the designer can get to work because now you have to go over every possible step of this, what pitfalls are there? If the xp from winning a game is x how many percentage lower must the xp for losing a game be without the incentive for winning be less? How much should the bonus be for the game of the day? Can this be abused? Can we really use this in a custom game or would people abuse it? How should all of this be implemented, should you be able to see your opponents level? Where should that be displayed, how should the xp screen be displayed, when do you view it? Once all of the possible loopholes have been solved and you have figured out how it should all be tied together, precisely which button will take you to which screen and which things give xp. THEN you can get programmers and artists involved. Now that the artists know exactly which buttons will be needed, which screens and where they can start drawing up production, the programmers can start implementing the system into the game. This takes a long time because the designer needs to figure out EVERYTHING. When you test units in a beta you are outsourcing most of the design process to the testers by skipping all of the finding loopholes and figuring out the correct numbers. In the case of changing a unit it is instigated by the feedback from the beta suggesting that there is a problem with a unit. In all likelihood you already have several ideas and concepts for how a unit should work on the drawing board because back when the units were designed for the first time you were brainstorming a lot of things. When it comes to changing how a unit works the first logical step is to go back to one of the choices that were not picked for the first implementation. But instead of now having a designer spend days to work out how that change would affect the game, "could a protoss defend a mine rush a this build time?" etc. Instead you throw it into the game asap to get players to test it in way more scenarios than you could test in the same amount of time. If it does not work there is no risk to it because no real time was invested in changing things up and you can change things again, it is the entire point with a beta.
I'm going to link you to their actual blog post, because your whole wall of text looks pretty silly compared to it:
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/7681240/Heart_of_the_Swarm_Preview_Leveling-10_25_2012
They don't have to figure out "EVERYTHING" (your caps word) to make a blog post like that. It's just a concept at this point, with few specifics. They admit very clearly in the post they are still working on concepts and that it will be changed and adjusted even after release. They give no specific numbers other than 20 levels, and it's not even out yet. Obviously they are still working on it.
You said a lot but nothing you said there is relevant to how long it takes to make this lousy blog post. The patch isn't out yet, buddy.
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On October 26 2012 13:26 VanGarde wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:21 Portlandian wrote:
What you have put quotes around and claimed I said, is not a quote and is just your own fabrication. However when I quoted him, it was a direct quote.
His claim that it would take weeks to even make a blog post is nonsensical and supported by nothing. That was an example of someone "talking out their ass".
My point that not only can they approve significant changes, they can actually implement them in a week, is supported by real world patches.
As I have already said, I am a programmer. But claims like that are not relevant. Feel free to talk to me in programming terms.
Claiming it would take over a week for them to even get these photoshops and development goals put together for their blog post isn't really related to programming anyways. It's just pure idiotic fantasy driven by your desperate desire to argue with me for some reason. I guess because I offended EG and their fanboys or something? I am not sure I would like to know what kind of programmer is this ignorant to how team based productions work. I am not talking out of my ass, I work as a game developer. I studied game design at Luleå Technical University and I work full time for Arrowhead Game Studios in Stockholm. But as you said that is not really relevant. I don't need credentials to point out why you are wrong because anyone who reads what I have said can use common sense to deduce why you are so obviously wrong. If you are actually a programmer, I suggest keeping the notions you have brought up here to yourself at your next job interview.
Well I hope they don't have you in charge of the company blog. They should hire someone who can get a single low content blog post out in under a week.
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On October 26 2012 13:32 Portlandian wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:16 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 12:33 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 12:23 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 12:15 Portlandian wrote:
These two patches are only a week apart, but in that time from concept to patch they completely changed the widow mine from the previous iterations.
Basically you are claiming that to even release the mockup and blog post took more preparation and work than the entire widow mine changes done between these patches. That is just so absurd I don't know what to say.
Stop being silly. Omg those are balance patches. Really? You claim(read lie) that you are a programmer and you can't tell the difference between balance changes during a beta and implemented whole new features? The point of the whole beta is to test out units primarily which means they can be quite flexible with implementing test changes to see if they pan out. They don't "test" features by throwing them into the beta to then retract them a week later. I've already pointed out that it does not matter how fast you could write the code to add these features, even if you could do it in a day that is not how software development works. The majority of the time it would take for that thing to go from idea to being in the game lies on the design side, not programming. There is a design incentive to be able to quickly implement changes to unit mechanics in a beta because it is really hard to judge from the point of design what would fix a certain unit, if you know the mine is not working you might have good ideas for how to fix it but due to how complex the game is the efficient way to do it is to not waste the time of multiple designers to sit and brood over that for weeks only to still have the idea fail in tests. You just throw it in to get instant feedback. You don't need to do that for what is essentially a ui feature, there is no need to quickly throw that together and toss it into the beta so people can test out the ins and outs of looking at their xp screen in detail. Those things are essentially finalized by the time they go into the beta because designers can perfect those features without the need for external feedback. When you are close to the final product you still throw it into the beta to get additional feedback from users on subtle things. It has a new ability and changed design for the widow mine, not a simple numbers adjustment. To borrow your words: "this is not just a matter of herp derp lets add an integer variable called [unstable payload]". According to your timelines unstable payload would have taken "more than a week just between when someone got the idea for this, and before anyone actually starts working on it" (again, your words). I am using a real world example, as opposed to your ridiculous exaggerated fantasy. If they can come up with a new concept for the widow mine, create a new ability, approve it, and implement it in a week, surely they can make a blog post with some photoshops in less than a week. Since you are either intentionally dense or are having serious comprehension problems let me do this like how I would treat a 6 year old. Let me educate you into what a game designer does. A game designer at any level is not this guy who sits and thinks of cool ideas for a game and then have the team implement them. A game designer is someone who thinks of a cool idea for a game, then has to conceptualize it with sketches and descriptions which also require him to think through every stage of it. If it would be a cool idea to have xp in the game, what would that be like? How do you earn xp, do you earn it from various sources? Where is your collected xp viewed? Are there varying rates of xp depending on what you do? What can you get from the xp you have collected? How would this affect various kinds of players? Would this concept fit in with our current vision for the game? In a large team for an AAA+ production you now also have to iterate on the design with a team and people will have to trade ideas, compromise and agree on if this is a good idea and then adjust it based on what new ideas have come fourth. Now you can get to work, but still only the designer can get to work because now you have to go over every possible step of this, what pitfalls are there? If the xp from winning a game is x how many percentage lower must the xp for losing a game be without the incentive for winning be less? How much should the bonus be for the game of the day? Can this be abused? Can we really use this in a custom game or would people abuse it? How should all of this be implemented, should you be able to see your opponents level? Where should that be displayed, how should the xp screen be displayed, when do you view it? Once all of the possible loopholes have been solved and you have figured out how it should all be tied together, precisely which button will take you to which screen and which things give xp. THEN you can get programmers and artists involved. Now that the artists know exactly which buttons will be needed, which screens and where they can start drawing up production, the programmers can start implementing the system into the game. This takes a long time because the designer needs to figure out EVERYTHING. When you test units in a beta you are outsourcing most of the design process to the testers by skipping all of the finding loopholes and figuring out the correct numbers. In the case of changing a unit it is instigated by the feedback from the beta suggesting that there is a problem with a unit. In all likelihood you already have several ideas and concepts for how a unit should work on the drawing board because back when the units were designed for the first time you were brainstorming a lot of things. When it comes to changing how a unit works the first logical step is to go back to one of the choices that were not picked for the first implementation. But instead of now having a designer spend days to work out how that change would affect the game, "could a protoss defend a mine rush a this build time?" etc. Instead you throw it into the game asap to get players to test it in way more scenarios than you could test in the same amount of time. If it does not work there is no risk to it because no real time was invested in changing things up and you can change things again, it is the entire point with a beta. I'm going to link you to their actual blog post, because your whole wall of text looks pretty silly compared to it: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/7681240/Heart_of_the_Swarm_Preview_Leveling-10_25_2012They don't have to figure out "EVERYTHING" (your caps word) to make a blog post like that. It's just a concept at this point, with few specifics. They admit very clearly in the post they are still working on concepts and that it will be changed and adjusted even after release. They give no specific numbers other than 20 levels, and it's not even out yet. Obviously they are still working on it. You said a lot but nothing you said there is relevant to how long it takes to make this lousy blog post. The patch isn't out yet, buddy.
Yeah except if you have the slightest level of intelligence you realize that if you go back and look at the process I outlined for how it goes from initial idea to production. The team still needs to agree that this is going to be implemented before anyone is authorized to make a blog post. So you can't make the post at the initial idea because no one has that authority over the process. The earliest you could in theory make an announcement is when you have brought the idea up to the team they could then decide to announce it before going through the painstaking process of ironing out if this will be good or not. But any sensible company would obviously not do that BEFORE they have gone through the process and evaluated if they are going with it because if you get to the later steps and realize that you don't want this feature in, then you have fucked up by announcing something that did not get past the design process.
I am done with you, I never had any intention of convincing you because you are clearly either retarded or intentionally trolling. My responses are for the benefits of people who actually wonder if there is any way you could be right. Now those posts are there for the benefits of anyone who wants to see for themselves.
On October 26 2012 13:32 Portlandian wrote:
Well I hope they don't have you in charge of the company blog. They should hire someone who can get a single low content blog post out in under a week.
We are not stupid enough to ever announce a feature that is not close to finalized because of how fucking dumb we would look when we have to retract it later. So rest assured that problem will not arise.
User was warned for this post
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^He's a troll man. No need to give him more attention.
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On October 26 2012 13:35 Portlandian wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:26 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 13:21 Portlandian wrote:
What you have put quotes around and claimed I said, is not a quote and is just your own fabrication. However when I quoted him, it was a direct quote.
His claim that it would take weeks to even make a blog post is nonsensical and supported by nothing. That was an example of someone "talking out their ass".
My point that not only can they approve significant changes, they can actually implement them in a week, is supported by real world patches.
As I have already said, I am a programmer. But claims like that are not relevant. Feel free to talk to me in programming terms.
Claiming it would take over a week for them to even get these photoshops and development goals put together for their blog post isn't really related to programming anyways. It's just pure idiotic fantasy driven by your desperate desire to argue with me for some reason. I guess because I offended EG and their fanboys or something? I am not sure I would like to know what kind of programmer is this ignorant to how team based productions work. I am not talking out of my ass, I work as a game developer. I studied game design at Luleå Technical University and I work full time for Arrowhead Game Studios in Stockholm. But as you said that is not really relevant. I don't need credentials to point out why you are wrong because anyone who reads what I have said can use common sense to deduce why you are so obviously wrong. If you are actually a programmer, I suggest keeping the notions you have brought up here to yourself at your next job interview. Well I hope they don't have you in charge of the company blog. They should hire someone who can get a single low content blog post out in under a week.
dis just a bad post. I'm so and so and I think a blog post is writen by a programmer at blizzard. I also think that blog posting is hard. but programming on the other hand, not hard, and can be done in a week.
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On October 26 2012 11:18 Portlandian wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 11:10 Plansix wrote:On October 26 2012 09:36 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:31 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 09:28 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:17 dAPhREAk wrote:On October 26 2012 09:13 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:06 fuzzylogic44 wrote:
Yeah they redesigned the UI in a week in response to a twitter hashtag campaign. These changes have been in the works for months because people have been complaining about the UI since day 1. They didn't redesign the UI, they just released a couple mockups and a writeup saying their intentions. Isn't it a bit daft to claim these changes have been in the works for months? Just a few months ago they released the 1.5 patch, which they intended to settle the UI issues. You think after releasing the patch which they intended to fix the UI, they immediately started work on another new UI? Do you have any evidence they were working on those mockups and writeup for months? do you have any evidence that they are in any way related to #savehots and destiny? no. Yes. The timing makes it obvious. Just ask anyone who knows anything about game development and I can tell you there is no fucking way they did any of these changes as a result of a bunch of whining retards on reddit. Not because of how stupid it would be for them to do that just based on that, but because it is not physically possible for them to change things that fast. They didn't make any changes.They released a couple mockups that would take a few hours at most, and a blog post. That's it. Joystiq.com proves you incorrect:From the article: Blizzard has plans for XP bonuses as well, either for specific awards like your first win of the day, or for more general happenings like XP bonus weekends and other special events. The leveling system is being added to the beta in the next patch (and will likely be reset a few times during testing), and will eventually be available in Heart of the Swarm when it's released. That proves me correct, as it is discussing a future patch. That is to say, these changes haven't been made. It's discussing the future. As I said before, I will repeat this simple and 100% accurate fact you seem to be avoiding: They didn't make any changes.They released a couple mockups that would take a few hours at most, and a blog post. That's it. This argument is getting extremely silly. Don't be so ridiculously defensive that you can't admit simple facts like the fact Blizzard didn't release a patch, they released a blog post that would take a couple hours of work from one person at most. And their hasty blog post was an obvious reaction to the negative publicity being generated.
They aren't mock ups they are screen shots of a patch that is going in tomorrow
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On October 26 2012 13:37 VanGarde wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:32 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 13:16 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 12:33 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 12:23 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 12:15 Portlandian wrote:
These two patches are only a week apart, but in that time from concept to patch they completely changed the widow mine from the previous iterations.
Basically you are claiming that to even release the mockup and blog post took more preparation and work than the entire widow mine changes done between these patches. That is just so absurd I don't know what to say.
Stop being silly. Omg those are balance patches. Really? You claim(read lie) that you are a programmer and you can't tell the difference between balance changes during a beta and implemented whole new features? The point of the whole beta is to test out units primarily which means they can be quite flexible with implementing test changes to see if they pan out. They don't "test" features by throwing them into the beta to then retract them a week later. I've already pointed out that it does not matter how fast you could write the code to add these features, even if you could do it in a day that is not how software development works. The majority of the time it would take for that thing to go from idea to being in the game lies on the design side, not programming. There is a design incentive to be able to quickly implement changes to unit mechanics in a beta because it is really hard to judge from the point of design what would fix a certain unit, if you know the mine is not working you might have good ideas for how to fix it but due to how complex the game is the efficient way to do it is to not waste the time of multiple designers to sit and brood over that for weeks only to still have the idea fail in tests. You just throw it in to get instant feedback. You don't need to do that for what is essentially a ui feature, there is no need to quickly throw that together and toss it into the beta so people can test out the ins and outs of looking at their xp screen in detail. Those things are essentially finalized by the time they go into the beta because designers can perfect those features without the need for external feedback. When you are close to the final product you still throw it into the beta to get additional feedback from users on subtle things. It has a new ability and changed design for the widow mine, not a simple numbers adjustment. To borrow your words: "this is not just a matter of herp derp lets add an integer variable called [unstable payload]". According to your timelines unstable payload would have taken "more than a week just between when someone got the idea for this, and before anyone actually starts working on it" (again, your words). I am using a real world example, as opposed to your ridiculous exaggerated fantasy. If they can come up with a new concept for the widow mine, create a new ability, approve it, and implement it in a week, surely they can make a blog post with some photoshops in less than a week. Since you are either intentionally dense or are having serious comprehension problems let me do this like how I would treat a 6 year old. Let me educate you into what a game designer does. A game designer at any level is not this guy who sits and thinks of cool ideas for a game and then have the team implement them. A game designer is someone who thinks of a cool idea for a game, then has to conceptualize it with sketches and descriptions which also require him to think through every stage of it. If it would be a cool idea to have xp in the game, what would that be like? How do you earn xp, do you earn it from various sources? Where is your collected xp viewed? Are there varying rates of xp depending on what you do? What can you get from the xp you have collected? How would this affect various kinds of players? Would this concept fit in with our current vision for the game? In a large team for an AAA+ production you now also have to iterate on the design with a team and people will have to trade ideas, compromise and agree on if this is a good idea and then adjust it based on what new ideas have come fourth. Now you can get to work, but still only the designer can get to work because now you have to go over every possible step of this, what pitfalls are there? If the xp from winning a game is x how many percentage lower must the xp for losing a game be without the incentive for winning be less? How much should the bonus be for the game of the day? Can this be abused? Can we really use this in a custom game or would people abuse it? How should all of this be implemented, should you be able to see your opponents level? Where should that be displayed, how should the xp screen be displayed, when do you view it? Once all of the possible loopholes have been solved and you have figured out how it should all be tied together, precisely which button will take you to which screen and which things give xp. THEN you can get programmers and artists involved. Now that the artists know exactly which buttons will be needed, which screens and where they can start drawing up production, the programmers can start implementing the system into the game. This takes a long time because the designer needs to figure out EVERYTHING. When you test units in a beta you are outsourcing most of the design process to the testers by skipping all of the finding loopholes and figuring out the correct numbers. In the case of changing a unit it is instigated by the feedback from the beta suggesting that there is a problem with a unit. In all likelihood you already have several ideas and concepts for how a unit should work on the drawing board because back when the units were designed for the first time you were brainstorming a lot of things. When it comes to changing how a unit works the first logical step is to go back to one of the choices that were not picked for the first implementation. But instead of now having a designer spend days to work out how that change would affect the game, "could a protoss defend a mine rush a this build time?" etc. Instead you throw it into the game asap to get players to test it in way more scenarios than you could test in the same amount of time. If it does not work there is no risk to it because no real time was invested in changing things up and you can change things again, it is the entire point with a beta. I'm going to link you to their actual blog post, because your whole wall of text looks pretty silly compared to it: http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/7681240/Heart_of_the_Swarm_Preview_Leveling-10_25_2012They don't have to figure out "EVERYTHING" (your caps word) to make a blog post like that. It's just a concept at this point, with few specifics. They admit very clearly in the post they are still working on concepts and that it will be changed and adjusted even after release. They give no specific numbers other than 20 levels, and it's not even out yet. Obviously they are still working on it. You said a lot but nothing you said there is relevant to how long it takes to make this lousy blog post. The patch isn't out yet, buddy. Yeah except if you have the slightest level of intelligence you realize that if you go back and look at the process I outlined for how it goes from initial idea to production. The team still needs to agree that this is going to be implemented before anyone is authorized to make a blog post. So you can't make the post at the initial idea because no one has that authority over the process. The earliest you could in theory make an announcement is when you have brought the idea up to the team they could then decide to announce it before going through the painstaking process of ironing out if this will be good or not. But any sensible company would obviously not do that BEFORE they have gone through the process and evaluated if they are going with it because if you get to the later steps and realize that you don't want this feature in, then you have fucked up by announcing something that did not get past the design process. I am done with you, I never had any intention of convincing you because you are clearly either retarded or intentionally trolling. My responses are for the benefits of people who actually wonder if there is any way you could be right. Now those posts are there for the benefits of anyone who wants to see for themselves. Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:32 Portlandian wrote:
Well I hope they don't have you in charge of the company blog. They should hire someone who can get a single low content blog post out in under a week. We are not stupid enough to ever announce a feature that is not close to finalized because of how fucking dumb we would look when we have to retract it later. So rest assured that problem will not arise.
It's just a completely meaningless XP bar which affects the game in no way. All they announced was 20 levels, and portrait rewards. They say they are still working on concepts. It's not a "painstaking process" to get that far.
A couple days to get it sorted out at most, even faster if they are motivated by something... like you know, negative PR that is snowballing.
You are engaging in wild exaggeration based on absolutely nothing. It's good that you are going away as you obviously have no proof to support your long winded lies. It has been proven Blizzard can move from design concept to patch in a week, as they did with the widow mine.
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On October 26 2012 13:43 fuzzylogic44 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 11:18 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 11:10 Plansix wrote:On October 26 2012 09:36 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:31 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 09:28 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:17 dAPhREAk wrote:On October 26 2012 09:13 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:06 fuzzylogic44 wrote:
Yeah they redesigned the UI in a week in response to a twitter hashtag campaign. These changes have been in the works for months because people have been complaining about the UI since day 1. They didn't redesign the UI, they just released a couple mockups and a writeup saying their intentions. Isn't it a bit daft to claim these changes have been in the works for months? Just a few months ago they released the 1.5 patch, which they intended to settle the UI issues. You think after releasing the patch which they intended to fix the UI, they immediately started work on another new UI? Do you have any evidence they were working on those mockups and writeup for months? do you have any evidence that they are in any way related to #savehots and destiny? no. Yes. The timing makes it obvious. Just ask anyone who knows anything about game development and I can tell you there is no fucking way they did any of these changes as a result of a bunch of whining retards on reddit. Not because of how stupid it would be for them to do that just based on that, but because it is not physically possible for them to change things that fast. They didn't make any changes.They released a couple mockups that would take a few hours at most, and a blog post. That's it. Joystiq.com proves you incorrect:From the article: Blizzard has plans for XP bonuses as well, either for specific awards like your first win of the day, or for more general happenings like XP bonus weekends and other special events. The leveling system is being added to the beta in the next patch (and will likely be reset a few times during testing), and will eventually be available in Heart of the Swarm when it's released. That proves me correct, as it is discussing a future patch. That is to say, these changes haven't been made. It's discussing the future. As I said before, I will repeat this simple and 100% accurate fact you seem to be avoiding: They didn't make any changes.They released a couple mockups that would take a few hours at most, and a blog post. That's it. This argument is getting extremely silly. Don't be so ridiculously defensive that you can't admit simple facts like the fact Blizzard didn't release a patch, they released a blog post that would take a couple hours of work from one person at most. And their hasty blog post was an obvious reaction to the negative publicity being generated. They aren't mock ups they are screen shots of a patch that is going in tomorrow
Where does it say it will be released tomorrow?
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On October 26 2012 13:41 1handsomE wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:35 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 13:26 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 13:21 Portlandian wrote:
What you have put quotes around and claimed I said, is not a quote and is just your own fabrication. However when I quoted him, it was a direct quote.
His claim that it would take weeks to even make a blog post is nonsensical and supported by nothing. That was an example of someone "talking out their ass".
My point that not only can they approve significant changes, they can actually implement them in a week, is supported by real world patches.
As I have already said, I am a programmer. But claims like that are not relevant. Feel free to talk to me in programming terms.
Claiming it would take over a week for them to even get these photoshops and development goals put together for their blog post isn't really related to programming anyways. It's just pure idiotic fantasy driven by your desperate desire to argue with me for some reason. I guess because I offended EG and their fanboys or something? I am not sure I would like to know what kind of programmer is this ignorant to how team based productions work. I am not talking out of my ass, I work as a game developer. I studied game design at Luleå Technical University and I work full time for Arrowhead Game Studios in Stockholm. But as you said that is not really relevant. I don't need credentials to point out why you are wrong because anyone who reads what I have said can use common sense to deduce why you are so obviously wrong. If you are actually a programmer, I suggest keeping the notions you have brought up here to yourself at your next job interview. Well I hope they don't have you in charge of the company blog. They should hire someone who can get a single low content blog post out in under a week. dis just a bad post. I'm so and so and I think a blog post is writen by a programmer at blizzard. I also think that blog posting is hard. but programming on the other hand, not hard, and can be done in a week.
No, I am the person pointing out that a blog post is easy. Other people are claiming that blog posts take more than a week because they don't want to admit Blizzard's blog posts were a reaction to the negative publicity they were getting.
But by the way you type there is something wrong with you, so don't worry about the misunderstanding.
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On October 26 2012 13:24 mango_destroyer wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 11:58 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 11:43 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 11:33 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 11:26 corpuscle wrote:On October 26 2012 11:23 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 11:11 corpuscle wrote:
People saying that the new HotS updates are just some graphic designer dicking around in Photoshop to make a mockup to appease the masses: no, you are wrong, read more carefully. The XP system which was just previewed is something that's coming in the next beta patch, and that definitely took longer than a week for the dev team to throw together. Fucking read the information that's available to you before you run around smearing shit everywhere, this is getting really annoying. In other words, it's not out yet and all they have shown us is a couple mockups and a blog posts. See the post above you, you're being really dumb. Anyone that knows anything about programming and/or software engineering would 100% tell you that adding something like the XP system is a major underhauling that takes a long time, and has certainly been in the works since before the #savehots shitstorm. Major underhauling? No, it's just adding an XP field to a database, deciding what numbers the levels and portrait rewards are at, and assigning an XP value to each unit killed/produced. This is an incredibly simple change. I am a programmer myself. I don't think you are. lol, this guy. With a statement like that you are either a terrible programmer or you never actually worked on a project but by being a programmer you mean that you have written textbook console applications in c#. Please, elaborate. What step of this incredibly complicated process of adding xp to their database and rewarding xp for each kill did I miss? It's really, really, really simple. I actually have a hard time thinking of a more easy and superficial change than adding xp values to units killed/produced. Logically sure it may be not be that complicated to actually code it, but a company as big as blizzard surely has a whole process or processes when releasing changes no matter how minor. Not to mention the strategic deadlines of releasing public info or patches. I am quite sure any programmer who works in a relatively big corporation knows the restrictions of all the processes involved and the decisions from the higher ups.
Just ignore him, he's just a troll. Dude thinks Obama was born in Kenya, for fuck's sake. Anyone with even a rudimentary knowledge of programming knows he's talking out of his ass.
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No he's not a troll. He's simply someone that can't see anything past his own nose. At least that's how it looks.
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On October 26 2012 14:16 Blade Fox wrote:
No he's not a troll. He's simply someone that can't see anything past his own nose. At least that's how it looks.
He's arguing for the sake of arguing. All his posts are annoyingly transparent. Even if he isn't, just stop feeding him please.
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On October 26 2012 13:49 Portlandian wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:43 fuzzylogic44 wrote:On October 26 2012 11:18 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 11:10 Plansix wrote:On October 26 2012 09:36 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:31 VanGarde wrote:On October 26 2012 09:28 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:17 dAPhREAk wrote:On October 26 2012 09:13 Portlandian wrote:On October 26 2012 09:06 fuzzylogic44 wrote:
Yeah they redesigned the UI in a week in response to a twitter hashtag campaign. These changes have been in the works for months because people have been complaining about the UI since day 1. They didn't redesign the UI, they just released a couple mockups and a writeup saying their intentions. Isn't it a bit daft to claim these changes have been in the works for months? Just a few months ago they released the 1.5 patch, which they intended to settle the UI issues. You think after releasing the patch which they intended to fix the UI, they immediately started work on another new UI? Do you have any evidence they were working on those mockups and writeup for months? do you have any evidence that they are in any way related to #savehots and destiny? no. Yes. The timing makes it obvious. Just ask anyone who knows anything about game development and I can tell you there is no fucking way they did any of these changes as a result of a bunch of whining retards on reddit. Not because of how stupid it would be for them to do that just based on that, but because it is not physically possible for them to change things that fast. They didn't make any changes.They released a couple mockups that would take a few hours at most, and a blog post. That's it. Joystiq.com proves you incorrect:From the article: Blizzard has plans for XP bonuses as well, either for specific awards like your first win of the day, or for more general happenings like XP bonus weekends and other special events. The leveling system is being added to the beta in the next patch (and will likely be reset a few times during testing), and will eventually be available in Heart of the Swarm when it's released. That proves me correct, as it is discussing a future patch. That is to say, these changes haven't been made. It's discussing the future. As I said before, I will repeat this simple and 100% accurate fact you seem to be avoiding: They didn't make any changes.They released a couple mockups that would take a few hours at most, and a blog post. That's it. This argument is getting extremely silly. Don't be so ridiculously defensive that you can't admit simple facts like the fact Blizzard didn't release a patch, they released a blog post that would take a couple hours of work from one person at most. And their hasty blog post was an obvious reaction to the negative publicity being generated. They aren't mock ups they are screen shots of a patch that is going in tomorrow Where does it say it will be released tomorrow?
They've been patching every friday the whole beta. Last friday there was no patch, and they said they were delaying a week to get this big patch with the UI changes, leveling, new oracle etc. in it. So it should come tomorrow assuming no more delays, definitively proving they've been working on all this for months.
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On October 26 2012 13:26 VanGarde wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 13:21 Portlandian wrote:
What you have put quotes around and claimed I said, is not a quote and is just your own fabrication. However when I quoted him, it was a direct quote.
His claim that it would take weeks to even make a blog post is nonsensical and supported by nothing. That was an example of someone "talking out their ass".
My point that not only can they approve significant changes, they can actually implement them in a week, is supported by real world patches.
As I have already said, I am a programmer. But claims like that are not relevant. Feel free to talk to me in programming terms.
Claiming it would take over a week for them to even get these photoshops and development goals put together for their blog post isn't really related to programming anyways. It's just pure idiotic fantasy driven by your desperate desire to argue with me for some reason. I guess because I offended EG and their fanboys or something? I am not sure I would like to know what kind of programmer is this ignorant to how team based productions work. I am not talking out of my ass, I work as a game developer. I studied game design at Luleå Technical University and I work full time for Arrowhead Game Studios in Stockholm. But as you said that is not really relevant. I don't need credentials to point out why you are wrong because anyone who reads what I have said can use common sense to deduce why you are so obviously wrong. If you are actually a programmer, I suggest keeping the notions you have brought up here to yourself at your next job interview.
I think you are probably right, but we have pretty much no insight on how Blizzard is run internally. You can't assume that your game company works the same as others do. And we can't assume how good the management is these days at Blizzard, it might have become very top-heavy with (mis)management pulling the dev team in every direction.
What we have seen on the Diablo 3 team for example is that major features can be in for years and then killed on a whim, that they have major features planned (Must have features) that don't make the deadline (PvP comes to mind). I see the same thing happening on SC2, a bit too much trial and error for my taste. In my experience this is not how we usually work in a (game)dev company, and sounds like a highly ineffective production pipeline in terms of how much content comes out. On the other hand, it could be Blizzards philosophy that this leads to less, but more fun content in the end, personally I am not too sure, it depends on if they actually compare the new features with the ones they tossed away.
If this is any indication of how the SC2 team/management works (again, teams are different, but I guess they are run by the same top management), then it could very well be that they shifted priorities because of something like reddit :/. But again, we are both speculating and we have not worked at Blizzard. Oh, by the way, I agree, a dev. company can't developed such large features in this timeframe, but it is also not normal to be adding features like this in beta, it should have been pretty much feature complete at this point.
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United States83 Posts
On October 26 2012 14:34 HackBenjamin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 26 2012 14:16 Blade Fox wrote:
No he's not a troll. He's simply someone that can't see anything past his own nose. At least that's how it looks. He's arguing for the sake of arguing. All his posts are annoyingly transparent. Even if he isn't, just stop feeding him please.
He's right, though.
It doesn't take that long to code in an experience system, take a few screenshots, and then write a blog that has less words on it than an essay you would write in high school. There are independent developers that get far more things done to their game in a week than Blizzard does. Remember that this is just a UI change and has nothing to do with the actual code for game play.
Honestly, it's a okay change that will probably excite some casual and maybe a few hardcore players. But, I see the system as meaningless as achievements. Eh, at least they're trying things to bring in the casuals.
EDIT: Also, they probably had this experience thing planned LONG before Destiny and the other pro players starting screaming at them. They have been working on the Starcraft: All Stars, and that is supposed to also have similar systems (experience, achievements, ladder, etc...).
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I don't know man, but we definitely got Blizzard's attention with all this "Sky falling down" movement. If you look in battle.net forums they started some community interaction and idea testings, new design propositions are showing up.
Haters gonna always hate, but I am pretty sure, last weeks rants really worked.
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EPT
