EPTBlizzard's Official Post Regarding 1.3 Maps - Page 6
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
|
Speake
United States494 Posts
| ||
|
Salvarias
Denmark231 Posts
| ||
|
wimbowaia
Norway20 Posts
On March 03 2011 19:18 unSpeake wrote: Getting really tired of these natural bases with 2-3 wide ass entrances. Makes it really hard to get a legitimate game on them Thats another thing. They are actually doing that on purpose. Blizzard don't want naturals to be easily blocked off/defended. But at the same time they have mentioned that they want more macro maps and less all ins. Do they not understand that those 2 things are related? Naturals with huge undefendable entrances or even no entrance at all, just cause people to all in even more. But blizzard just don't understand this. It makes no sense at all, and proves once again that blizzard don't understand how the game works and therefor should not be the ones making maps for competitive play. Its ok that blizzard is just not good enough to make good maps, but its NOT ok to still force the community to play the terrible maps they make, when theres clearly better alternatives for maps available. It makes me so furious. | ||
|
The KY
United Kingdom6252 Posts
On March 03 2011 17:07 Xeteh wrote: Am I the only one that finds it amusing they said they wanted to remove "rush maps" yet they leave in Delta Quad and take out Shakuras? And please, please, can we have the GSL maps on ladder? I love those, they're an absolute blast. No, they said they wanted to cut down on rush maps. Not remove them. The reason they took out Shakuras is they thought it was a 'plain' macro map, and I totally agree. Whether they were right to replace it with Slag Pits...well I doubt that's a good choice. But I guess we'll see. Personally I've had nothing but macro games on all the new maps. I don't like Gulch, just the layout, the attack paths...I don't like it at all. That's my only problem, although I'd like to see at least a couple of GOM maps making it in to the ladder pool. But I think everyone enthusiastically Blizzard bashing is being really harsh; they're obviously trying, and I don't think these maps are as awful as everyone is making out. You can go on about destructible rocks and open naturals all you like, but in my opinion Slag Pits is the only map that could be considered objectively awful. And even that's questionable. | ||
|
Candles
United Kingdom103 Posts
On March 03 2011 19:16 kidleader wrote: I usually dislike all the Blizzard bashing, but removing Shakuras and keeping Delta and Scrap, and even Xelnaga. There's interesting and then there's not guaranteeing the better play will win. Isn't the better player the one with the better all round game? Not just better at Macro? It like Jinro said. You want to have a little bit of the "all in" or "rush" style in your play to mix it up (obviously Paraphrased). Being a 2Dimensional Macro player is a crutch, just like being a constant 1-baser is a crutch. Obviously if the races aren't balanced so Zerg always loses on close positions on a certain map then there is an issue, but that is with the race balance and not the maps surely? A lot of people seem to forget that Zerg aren't purely an expand early Macro race. They have 1 base Roach contain into expand, Baneling busts, Nydus and drop harass. Yes Idra's style of hanging on, building momentum for the late game and then overunning people is amazing and beautiful to watch, but it isn't the only high level style surely? Kyrix style anyone? | ||
|
ALPINA
3791 Posts
| ||
|
DominicxD
20 Posts
| ||
|
dvide
United Kingdom287 Posts
| ||
|
BeMannerDuPenner
Germany5638 Posts
sad considering they are so many talented people out there that do MUCh better job in their free time then those guys getting paid for it. btw my personal favourite is Backdoor Gulch has a familiar main to first expansion layout. Early gameplay on this map should feel familiar, and there probably aren't too many early-game threats or difficulties in terms of gimmicky strategies you need to worry about evrybody one base in blizzard world? | ||
|
ovion
United Kingdom74 Posts
anyway shakuras reason seems... strange. then again i guess blizzard wants to make the game as fun and balanced as possible and they didn't think shakuras was very fun it sounds like. good to get their reasons for the change tho | ||
|
Sqq
Norway2023 Posts
| ||
|
limonovich
England226 Posts
dunno why dq & scrap are still in map pool though and the reasoning behind shakuras removal is ridiculous >_> | ||
|
MavercK
Australia2181 Posts
i know sc2 isn't the same game. but whats wrong with this formula. it works wonders. as you get more units and greater tech the bases become more exposed and vulnerable. these huge wide open naturals blizzard makes are terrible. they aren't balanced according to what stage of the game the players are currently in. | ||
|
Roggay
Switzerland6320 Posts
| ||
|
Pajegetc
United States3158 Posts
Backwater Gulch? I think it's called to be very good macro maps. You can grab a pretty easy third if you break your own rocks. Only thing I would change is getting rid of the random "plateau areas" in front cause it leaves your possible third a very cramped for little room to micro. Typhoon Peaks is becoming my new favorite map cause of all the easy bases when it's cross positions. They only need to get rid of Delta and bring back Shakuras to make it a very good map pool imho. | ||
|
iGX
Australia414 Posts
yes, keep metalopolis and xelnaga caverns. as for delta and scrap...occasionally they can be quite one sided =\ | ||
|
eloist
United States1017 Posts
On March 03 2011 20:12 wimbowaia wrote: Thats another thing. They are actually doing that on purpose. Blizzard don't want naturals to be easily blocked off/defended. But at the same time they have mentioned that they want more macro maps and less all ins. Do they not understand that those 2 things are related? Naturals with huge undefendable entrances or even no entrance at all, just cause people to all in even more. But blizzard just don't understand this. It makes no sense at all, and proves once again that blizzard don't understand how the game works and therefor should not be the ones making maps for competitive play. Its ok that blizzard is just not good enough to make good maps, but its NOT ok to still force the community to play the terrible maps they make, when theres clearly better alternatives for maps available. It makes me so furious. I am going to argue that they understand this game better than you do and have more foresight. A narrow choke natural is never going to be balanced and Zerg will suffer the most from it in the long run and we are already seeing this develop. No one seems to have really found a reliable way to deal with forge fast expand into 1 stargate with phoenix void ray into colossus and this will not get any better. The only thing we've seen are do or die roach all ins which are a coin flip at best. Games coming from this will just get increasingly worse because the skill ceiling for defense is just higher than for offense and people will get better at it. The reason that they took out shakuras is not that it made for bad games but because it will make for increasingly stale games as we go forward and the game develops. The map just always plays out in at max one of three ways. Having played a few games on Typhon made me realize this because I effectively got owned because my opponents played the map way better than I did and it was immeditately obvious to me that this is what happened. And by this I don't mean doom push through rocks, I just got outmaneuvered. So I would give Blizz the benefit of the doubt here and see how these maps play out first. For me at least, it's clear that I need a few games on these to figure out how to play them best whereas shakuras it was just really straight forward. EDIT: Additional point is that a two base all in is not much different from a one base all in in terms of appeal of the resulting game and I wouldn't call those macro games. | ||
|
sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
Take cross positions. If players spawn bottom left and upper right it becomes a split map with each side controlling "their" xel naga watchtower. Though tanks are really annoying. But if players spawn upper left and bottom right, both towers don't really "belong" to a side, it's much more like on xel naga caverns where one tower is closer but both are easy to control once you get the upper hand. I don't like maps whose "image" changes depending on spawns because it's getting unpredictable when you want to choose maps in tournaments. | ||
|
FeyFey
Germany10114 Posts
Like the explaination why the removed lost temple, its still sad but correct and glad they made it because of the cliff drop, which is even for a zerg easy to defend. (or they simply didn't mentioned it to not make the people think they are right, because they could start to want more) | ||
|
Rialz
Brazil177 Posts
But it is a step in the right direction though, it's good to see they care and are trying to improve. | ||
| ||
