• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 09:26
CEST 15:26
KST 22:26
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview24Code S RO12 Preview: GuMiho, Bunny, SHIN, ByuN3The Memories We Share - Facing the Final(?) GSL46Code S RO12 Preview: Cure, Zoun, Solar, Creator4[ASL19] Finals Preview: Daunting Task30
Community News
[BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates6GSL Ro4 and Finals moved to Sunday June 15th12Weekly Cups (May 27-June 1): ByuN goes back-to-back0EWC 2025 Regional Qualifier Results26Code S RO12 Results + RO8 Groups (2025 Season 2)3
StarCraft 2
General
The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation Magnus Carlsen and Fabi review Clem's chess game. BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview Buy driving license without exam for over 41 count Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing
Tourneys
Bellum Gens Elite: Stara Zagora 2025 SOOPer7s Showmatches 2025 Cheeseadelphia 2025 - Open Bracket LAN! $25,000+ WardiTV 2025 Series Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance Mutation # 473 Cold is the Void
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Will foreigners ever be able to challenge Koreans? BGH auto balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ [BSL20] ProLeague: Bracket Stage & Dates I made an ASL quiz
Tourneys
[BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 2 [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 1 [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET [ASL19] Grand Finals
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Mechabellum Monster Hunter Wilds
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
LiquidLegends to reintegrate into TL.net
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0 Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Vape Nation Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
Maru Fan Club Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Cleaning My Mechanical Keyboard
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Cognitive styles x game perf…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Poker
Nebuchad
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 18990 users

[MLG Dallas] American vs. Korean eSports Events - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 Next All
Logo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States7542 Posts
November 11 2010 06:24 GMT
#21
Great post; I hope the adjust the stage around for 2011. I wonder if it's like it is at all because of Halo. Is the Halo stage setup the same way? If so do you think it's intentionally done differently due to being primarily a team and console game?
Logo
mOnion
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States5657 Posts
November 11 2010 06:26 GMT
#22
i'm sure their budget will go way up after seeing the static vs actual revenues, hopefully we'll see a lot bigger of a setup when I'm on the big stage ^_^
☆★☆ 7486!!! Join the Ban mOnion Anti-Trolling Initiative! - Caller | "on a scale of machine to 10, how bad is that Zerg?" - LZgamer | you are the new tl.net bonjwa monion, congrats - Rekrul | "Cheeseburgers dynamite lilacs" - Chill
QuothTheRaven
Profile Joined December 2008
United States5524 Posts
November 11 2010 06:34 GMT
#23
Excellent post, and clear, concise explanation of not just what the problem is but why it's a problem.

Hopefully MLG will be able to reorganize for the 2011 season!
. . . nevermore
aksfjh
Profile Joined November 2010
United States4853 Posts
November 11 2010 06:42 GMT
#24
On some level, I agree with you 100%. SC2 has some excellent commentary and casting makes some boring matches worth watching. The Korean/Blizzcon setup is very professional and brings focus to the match.

On the other hand, I believe the MLG setup is excellent in letting the players and spectators feel like they're both part of the event equally. At the end of the match, the competitors and casters don't walk off the side of the stage, as if they're avoiding the fans. The setup feels much more personal.
Bosu
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States3247 Posts
November 11 2010 06:51 GMT
#25
On November 11 2010 15:42 aksfjh wrote:
On some level, I agree with you 100%. SC2 has some excellent commentary and casting makes some boring matches worth watching. The Korean/Blizzcon setup is very professional and brings focus to the match.

On the other hand, I believe the MLG setup is excellent in letting the players and spectators feel like they're both part of the event equally. At the end of the match, the competitors and casters don't walk off the side of the stage, as if they're avoiding the fans. The setup feels much more personal.


I feel the same way as you. Also, I know some of the players liked that the way the player area was settup they didn't have to look into an audience while playing. Makes it easier to concentrate on the game which I think is good.
#1 Kwanro Fan
PH
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States6173 Posts
November 11 2010 06:51 GMT
#26
I actually like the way the players were set up at MLG. It's kind of bad when players can be tipped off to audience cheering and whatnot.
Hello
Ghad
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Norway2551 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-11 07:28:09
November 11 2010 07:24 GMT
#27
Great post, could be very valuable input to any competition organizer!

Apart from that, I have to say that there are definite pros and cons to both setups.
forgottendreams: One underage girl, two drunk guys, one gogo dancer and starcraft 2. Apparently just another day in Europe.
pinke
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States56 Posts
November 11 2010 07:32 GMT
#28
Was anyone at IEM at ComicCon? I really liked the set up they had going there. It was the screen, a space in the middle and competitors on either side with extra monitors in front of their computers showing what they saw on their screen and the big screen showed the caster's screen. The caster's were off to the side, you couldn't really see them. It would've been cooler if the casters were in the space in the middle maybe. I really like being able to see the competitors and the casters though. Especially with someone as animated as Day9, it's fun to watch him.
but then I think that rain is wet, so who am I to judge?
Peanutsc
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States277 Posts
November 11 2010 07:37 GMT
#29
On November 11 2010 15:24 Logo wrote:
Great post; I hope the adjust the stage around for 2011. I wonder if it's like it is at all because of Halo. Is the Halo stage setup the same way? If so do you think it's intentionally done differently due to being primarily a team and console game?


I didn't actually check out the Halo tournament at all. Did anybody else see it?

About the pros for players in the MLG tournament - I agree that the MLG setup brings players and spectators closer together, but there is a definite cost in terms of spectator-commentary engagement. I'd personally rather hang out with the players between games or before/after the day's events, but different strokes for different folks.

I personally don't think the player booths add all that much to the experience. It's nice to see who's actually playing, but it's not as if you get any extra game insight from watching them look at a monitor through a glass pane.

There's definitely room for innovation in SC venue layout - these two examples are only two of many possible setups. Perhaps sometime we'll find a happy medium where players and spectators can feel closer together without sacrificing salience of commentary.
"You only get one life on this earth, Tasteless, and if you're not spending the majority of it playing StarCraft, I would argue that it might be wasted." "I couldn't agree more, Artosis."
SpartanFrog
Profile Joined September 2010
United States22 Posts
November 11 2010 07:48 GMT
#30
Note: I really like the Blizzcon/Korean way better

I think though that Korean way really hinges off having the sound proof booths though as we have seen with in korea that is it possible to cheat or accidently hear the crowd while mlg works somewhat the other way. Yea the crowd is respectfully but stupid things happen that can't be controlled.

We don't know what MLG has prepared for '11. Can they afford booths? Do they want booths? We have heard that they will kinda be a main stage in '11 but what also does that entail? Will we see their whole mlg.tv expanded for us?

The result is that audience members are less likely to give the commentary their full attention and instead dissolve into personal commentary and theorycrafting with their neighbors, which can interfere with the experience of the people who want to just listen to the professional commentary. At BlizzCon, the audience tended to be silent along the lines of an audience at a theatrical play as opposed to a professional sporting event, and it seems to me that this was a direct effect of the commentators' proximity to the audience.
This quote really interests me. I don't think it distracts at all. When your at a baseball game you don't really have a commentator unless you bring a small radio along or maybe have a luxury seat w/ a TV. Why can't people talk amongst themselves and listen I know I can. Also maybe you were at Blizzcon but it seems more to me and to some extend during GSL(during non-finals/season1 opener) that the mics aren't picking up the crowd as good? MLG wasn't much better or better at all but from everyone is saying that MLG was having huge crowds watching being so far away may have to do with that.

Conclusion: Lets let MLG show what they kinda want to do first and then hopefully they let us somewhat tweak it so new can join in and old will have a great time.
Peanutsc
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States277 Posts
November 11 2010 17:59 GMT
#31
On November 11 2010 16:48 Grevious wrote:
Note: I really like the Blizzcon/Korean way better

I think though that Korean way really hinges off having the sound proof booths though as we have seen with in korea that is it possible to cheat or accidently hear the crowd while mlg works somewhat the other way. Yea the crowd is respectfully but stupid things happen that can't be controlled.

We don't know what MLG has prepared for '11. Can they afford booths? Do they want booths? We have heard that they will kinda be a main stage in '11 but what also does that entail? Will we see their whole mlg.tv expanded for us?

Show nested quote +
The result is that audience members are less likely to give the commentary their full attention and instead dissolve into personal commentary and theorycrafting with their neighbors, which can interfere with the experience of the people who want to just listen to the professional commentary. At BlizzCon, the audience tended to be silent along the lines of an audience at a theatrical play as opposed to a professional sporting event, and it seems to me that this was a direct effect of the commentators' proximity to the audience.
This quote really interests me. I don't think it distracts at all. When your at a baseball game you don't really have a commentator unless you bring a small radio along or maybe have a luxury seat w/ a TV. Why can't people talk amongst themselves and listen I know I can. Also maybe you were at Blizzcon but it seems more to me and to some extend during GSL(during non-finals/season1 opener) that the mics aren't picking up the crowd as good? MLG wasn't much better or better at all but from everyone is saying that MLG was having huge crowds watching being so far away may have to do with that.

Conclusion: Lets let MLG show what they kinda want to do first and then hopefully they let us somewhat tweak it so new can join in and old will have a great time.


You're lucky to be able to talk and listen at the same time! Basically, the theory is that many people (myself included) can't talk and listen to the SC commentators at the same time because they often speak very quickly (due to SC's fast pace, color commentary, etc.). I personally get a lot more out of the audience experience when I can hear the commentary clearly, which was not always the case at MLG - there were several times when the audience yelled to the staff to turn up the speakers since we couldn't hear them well.

I'm not sure about the mics at MLG picking up the audience, but it would make sense to me that if the commentators were closer to the audience, it might be easier to have an integrated mic system that picks up their reactions more efficiently than if they're far away.
"You only get one life on this earth, Tasteless, and if you're not spending the majority of it playing StarCraft, I would argue that it might be wasted." "I couldn't agree more, Artosis."
Slasher
Profile Joined September 2007
United States1095 Posts
November 11 2010 18:10 GMT
#32
In general, GSL, WCG and BlizzCon's setups are nearly identical, with ESL following suit except they dont have soundproof booths. Out of all of these leagues/events, MLG is the only one to have an open entry/bracket tournament that isn't invites or qualifiers. GSL is too, but the broadcasting is stretched out over a month, not 3 days.

MLG's setup will be way different in 2011 than it was in 2010, more likely closer to the Halo stage, which is very similar to the previously mentioned leagues' setups for Starcraft.
trancey
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States430 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-11 18:43:46
November 11 2010 18:42 GMT
#33
On November 11 2010 15:24 Logo wrote:
Great post; I hope the adjust the stage around for 2011. I wonder if it's like it is at all because of Halo. Is the Halo stage setup the same way? If so do you think it's intentionally done differently due to being primarily a team and console game?


MLG has been doing Halo events for almost a decade now (52 halo events total thus far), it's been their cash cow and they always manage to fill a 256 team bracket~ (most of the time even more teams) which includes 4 players per team minimum, the pro player line-ups, coaches, alternates, sponsors and console related booths, etc... More to the point, the Halo Franchise is to MLG as StarCraft 1 is to Korean eSports if I were to make it an easy analogy. (In actuality, Halo as an competitive video game probably has the 2nd biggest competitive market to StarCraft).

So basically expect SC2 to be given similar respect as Halo event has received at future events.
Snuggles
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1865 Posts
November 11 2010 18:54 GMT
#34
I hope to be pleasantly surprised by a Korean style Presentation in MLG 2011 =)
T0fuuu
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Australia2275 Posts
November 11 2010 19:14 GMT
#35
GSL is a bit different to the other korean setups because there are 4 booths so the next players can warmup before their games and the operation runs a bit smoother. I think that a 4 booth setup would be the best for an event like MLG where many games have to be played at the same time and there is a demand for constant streaming of games.

The bad part about mlg are those pathetic curtains they have for the booth. They are not gonna stop any sound.
Peanutsc
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States277 Posts
November 11 2010 19:51 GMT
#36
On November 12 2010 03:10 Slasher wrote:
In general, GSL, WCG and BlizzCon's setups are nearly identical, with ESL following suit except they dont have soundproof booths. Out of all of these leagues/events, MLG is the only one to have an open entry/bracket tournament that isn't invites or qualifiers. GSL is too, but the broadcasting is stretched out over a month, not 3 days.

MLG's setup will be way different in 2011 than it was in 2010, more likely closer to the Halo stage, which is very similar to the previously mentioned leagues' setups for Starcraft.


Thanks for the update, Slasher. I'm looking forward to seeing what MLG has in store for us next year.

I've been to several WCG events, but they've all been in the US, so I figured I didn't have a representative enough experience to include them in my article (actually, TorcH told me this).
"You only get one life on this earth, Tasteless, and if you're not spending the majority of it playing StarCraft, I would argue that it might be wasted." "I couldn't agree more, Artosis."
PackofHighly
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States153 Posts
November 11 2010 21:38 GMT
#37
Next year THIS should be SC2

[image loading]
THIS was your PLAN?
okuraku
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States210 Posts
November 11 2010 22:09 GMT
#38
The MLG Halo setup still had the commentators behind/above the audience though right? I hope they don't use that setup, as I agree with what I believe is Peanut's main point here: The commentators should be directly in front of the audience.
http://twitch.tv/okuraku | Member of Team Legacy: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=148872
Morpheis
Profile Joined October 2010
United States3 Posts
November 11 2010 22:38 GMT
#39
I have to agree with your assessment, the Korean/Blizzcon setup is much more engaging. I really enjoyed SC2 at Blizzcon this year and having the three commentors center stage created a great synergy with the audience that really elevated the event. It's essentially the difference between watching a replay of a game on your computer versus watching the same replay professionally commented in a video, even though it the exact same match there is a world of difference.
yoplate
Profile Joined August 2010
United States332 Posts
November 11 2010 23:15 GMT
#40
Well said. Although I think MLG continues their style because of budget issues. I hope future MLG events can get inspiration from the korean tourneys.
Prev 1 2 3 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Invitational
11:00
WardiTV June Group B
Creator vs Jumy
ByuN vs Cure
Cure vs Jumy
ByuN vs Creator
Creator vs Cure
ByuN vs Jumy
WardiTV551
IntoTheiNu 29
LiquipediaDiscussion
Bellum Gens Elite
10:00
Stara Zagora 2025 Day 3
Serral vs ZounLIVE!
SKillous vs Krystianer
Harstem vs Lambo
Reynor vs Clem
ShoWTimE vs Ryung
Bellum Gens Elite2605
ComeBackTV 924
TaKeTV 428
IndyStarCraft 277
Rex179
3DClanTV 128
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Bellum Gens Elite2605
Lowko386
IndyStarCraft 277
Hui .264
Rex 179
CosmosSc2 110
EnDerr 15
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 59614
Shuttle 1997
Hyuk 1658
Light 1068
EffOrt 945
Jaedong 873
Mini 491
hero 441
BeSt 391
ToSsGirL 320
[ Show more ]
Stork 287
ZerO 241
TY 75
actioN 62
[sc1f]eonzerg 50
sas.Sziky 49
Mind 48
Barracks 46
sorry 45
sSak 42
JYJ38
soO 31
Backho 25
Yoon 22
Snow 15
ajuk12(nOOB) 15
GoRush 14
HiyA 13
SilentControl 8
Noble 7
zelot 2
Dota 2
XcaliburYe757
Fuzer 266
syndereN140
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1407
flusha274
markeloff133
edward0
Other Games
singsing2548
B2W.Neo1055
DeMusliM410
crisheroes392
elazer247
Mew2King178
ArmadaUGS141
XaKoH 64
QueenE37
ZerO(Twitch)12
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream8336
Other Games
BasetradeTV40
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 13 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis8347
• Jankos2651
• TFBlade878
Upcoming Events
BSL 2v2 ProLeague
5h 34m
Replay Cast
10h 34m
CranKy Ducklings
20h 34m
SC Evo League
22h 34m
Bellum Gens Elite
23h 4m
Fire Grow Cup
1d 1h
CSO Contender
1d 3h
BSL: ProLeague
1d 4h
StRyKeR vs MadiNho
Cross vs UltrA
TT1 vs JDConan
Bonyth vs Sziky
Replay Cast
1d 10h
SOOP Global
1d 13h
Creator vs Rogue
Cure vs Classic
[ Show More ]
SOOP
1d 19h
Classic vs GuMiho
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 20h
AllThingsProtoss
1d 21h
Fire Grow Cup
2 days
BSL: ProLeague
2 days
HBO vs Doodle
spx vs Tech
DragOn vs Hawk
Dewalt vs TerrOr
Replay Cast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
WardiTV Invitational
3 days
GSL Code S
4 days
Rogue vs GuMiho
Maru vs Solar
Replay Cast
5 days
GSL Code S
5 days
herO vs TBD
Classic vs TBD
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
GSL Code S
6 days
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL Season 17: Qualifier 1
DreamHack Dallas 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL Season 17: Qualifier 2
2025 GSL S2
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
ECL Season 49: Europe
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025
BLAST Open Spring 2025

Upcoming

CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
Murky Cup #2
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.