Sunday night I came home from a glorious weekend at MLG Dallas. I was very happy I went, even if it took some time away from my quest to get to diamond league. This was my first MLG event and I noticed a lot of interesting differences between MLG's StarCraft tournament and similar events in Korea. I've been in the live audience of many eSports events, both in Korea and in the US, and so the article below looks at the MLG event in comparison to the Korean style based on those experiences.
StarCraft Live: Spectator Experiences at MLG Dallas vs. Korea
Walk into the Hilton Anatole convention center main room, and after about 30 steps you could turn left and see Day9 and djWHEAT's 10 feet high faces smiling at you from a huge projector screen, surrounded by faceless bodies in darkness closer to the ground. This was the StarCraft II tournament at the Major League Gaming national finals in Dallas, Texas.
If you'd ever been to a live StarCraft event of note, the fundamental participants of MLG's tournament would've been familiar to you - the SC2 competitors over in a gated section set up with tables and PCs, the commentators sitting at a podium with cameras and lights aimed at them, the fans and passerby watching the show from chairs, bleachers, floors, or mobbing the better-known players as they emerged from practice or play. There were also the familiar unexpected technical difficulities and other surprises that audiences have come to expect from most eSports events. But lurking right beneath these superficial similarities were huge differences between MLG and other events (namely, Korean events or Korean-style events like BlizzCon) in venue layout and tournament presentation which significantly affected the audience experience. I'd like to take some time to analyze these differences and discuss how they might be better understood by tournament organizers to improve on for future events.
Here is a diagram I've created (using Inkscape, which is a great open source SVG editor) comparing the layout of each venue from a birds' eye perspective.
If you put yourself in the shoes of someone in the audience at MLG vs. Korea/BlizzCon (the two are lumped together because the venue layout is basically the same), you'll notice some significant differences right away. For me, the biggest disparity was that, at MLG, there was no stage, and no way to watch the commentators and the game at the same time. The audience at MLG was essentially expected to watch the screen only, with glimpses of the competitors (or, farther away, the commentators) beyond the screen simply a side effect of venue space and physical convenience. In effect, from an official presentational standpoint, the experience of someone at the event and the experience of someone watching the HD stream at home were the same.
In Korean eSports stadiums (as of 2008) and at BlizzCon (2008 and 2010), the commentators are front and center (the players whose game is being casted are also visible via the player booths, but this is secondary). The game footage is visible from different perspectives on the screens behind the commentators, which is of course essential for the audience to understand what's going on visually, but it is clear that the commentators are the main focus presentationally. They are the live guides to the tournament's events, and if you're up near the front of the audience you can see every gesture and grimace they make. This layout difference also differentiates the live experience from the HD stream experience - the audience can switch their focus between the game footage and the commentators whenever they choose to, which is not an option if you're watching at home. The commentators are also much more aware of the reactions of the audience, which leads to more interaction between the two groups, and also makes fun stunts like the one below possible because of the short distance between the audience and the commentators' podium:
The MLG setup reminded me a lot of professional American sports events like baseball and basketball games. About a month ago I saw one of the division playoff games between the Minnesota Twins and the New York Yankees, and, like at MLG, it was much easier to see the actual players than any commentators or sportscasters. Since the baseball players were involved in their own activities and there were no visible people announcing the game and interacting with the audience, it was very easy to sit back among my friends and chat with them about the state of the game, what we'd eaten last night, etc. This kind of continual socializing during the game itself didn't really take anything away from the experience of watching the game, since it's pretty easy to see what's going on by just looking up and checking out the movements of the players. The same audience chatter effect happened more often than not at MLG - without having anyone physically in front of the audience interacting with us, many people on the bleachers continually commented on the game themselves or engaged in discussion of other topics.
While I think this setup complements baseball's event structure well, I don't think it's an ideal situation for StarCraft. StarCraft arguably has the most developed commentary scene within all of eSports - with individual commentators like Day9 often much more popular than all but the most recognizable pro players - and there's a good reason for that: it's hard to watch and enjoy high level StarCraft without commentary. StarCraft is a very complex and fast-paced game which is, as TorcH noted in his stint on CollegeHumor's Bleep Bloop, "like playing 6 games of speed chess at the same time." Without knowledgeable guides to engage the audience and explain the story of each game to us, the subtleties are often lost and the whole experience becomes less exciting. While it's great to have audio of the casters' commentary and even better to have gameplay footage synched to show you what they're talking about, there's something lost when the commentators themselves are not physically the focus of the audience. The result is that audience members are less likely to give the commentary their full attention and instead dissolve into personal commentary and theorycrafting with their neighbors, which can interfere with the experience of the people who want to just listen to the professional commentary. At BlizzCon, the audience tended to be silent along the lines of an audience at a theatrical play as opposed to a professional sporting event, and it seems to me that this was a direct effect of the commentators' proximity to the audience.
BlizzCon: from the front row of the audience at the RTS stage.
There is certainly no doubt that the quality of commentary and presentational media at MLG were top notch - Day9 and djWHEAT were very informative and entertaining, and it was a pleasure to watch the pros take StarCraft to new levels on the projector screen. However, as a dedicated StarCraft fan, I personally enjoyed my experiences in Korea and at BlizzCon more than at MLG because there was more high quality commentator interaction with the audience and, by extension, a different feel to the event in comparison with those watching from home. I would highly recommend that MLG take these presentational differences and their effects on the audience experience into consideration when planning future events. But, in the end, it was great live StarCraft, and I was not disappointed.
Nice diagrams and post man. I definitely agree with you that the Korea/Blizzcon style is the best.
I think MLG understands that what I'll call the Korean booth style is superior in a number of different ways. I think it's vital to allow the audience to see the players playing in the flesh, and we all know why soundproof booths are a must. It's a matter of how much trouble and expense they are willing to go through, and I believe in the future we may very well see this setup.
I would actually change the set-up from the Blizzcon style to be more Korean, in that the entire focus is on the booths and the screen above them. That means putting the commentators behind (or to the side of) the audience. I think this allows commentators to be much more comfortable and deliver better commentary without getting tired quickly.
Also, I think the players in the booths should face one another. This way it's harder to accidentally peek at the audience (although this can presumably be controlled with lighting), and the audience can get a better look at the players from the side without a monitor in the way.
Anyways this is a great post and I wish you did it in SC2 general where it can get more attention.
MLG has had SC2 for (correct me if I am wrong) 3 events. SC2 is still new, I have no doubt in my mind once it grows in popularity and shows itself as something that can attract the big crowd at MLG, then MLG will change the accomodations they currently provide.
Dang... your point is very simple but the sheer quality and organization of the presentation in this blog is mind-boggling, at the very least compared to the standard level of OPs on TL. I'm convinced, but maybe you should refer to this article in the MLG Ultimate Feedback thread if you want more eyes and discussion on it.
Peanut definitely brings up some great points, and I think part of MLG's process is... "what has worked for us in the past". Having also been a part of the BlizzCon casting for 4-5 years I can also state that from a commentator's POV, you can feel that energy and excitement from the crowd when you are front and center on stage. This typically results in an even more energetic and exciting broadcast from the commentators themselves. The audience feeds off them, and the casters feed off the audience.
The good news is the MLG Staff are very aware, open, and eager to improve upon the already great job they have done. And I really believe in 2011 they will take many of the suggestions given by fans, the community, and even the staff to heart and really showcase StarCraft 2 in a major way!
great post i hate when at DC sean would describe his posture, like his jaw hanging open or his hands clenched up near his shoulders. i much rather would have seen it, him sitting between us and the screen. for the internet viewers, it's not a big deal, but for those in person it's huge
On November 11 2010 07:14 EchOne wrote: Dang... your point is very simple but the sheer quality and organization of the presentation in this blog is mind-boggling, at the very least compared to the standard level of OPs on TL. I'm convinced, but maybe you should refer to this article in the MLG Ultimate Feedback thread if you want more eyes and discussion on it.
I think peanut actually studied journalism and graduated from Harvard. The large majority of TL never learned how to write properly or spend the time on every little detail that peanut does.
I know for myself that I am a math major and cringe whenever I needed to write a paper more than 10 pages.
Thanks everyone for the feedback, and I'm glad I explained things well. I'll PM a mod and see if it's appropriate to have this moved to SC2 general. I've also posted in the MLG SC2 feedback thread with a link to this post.
Honestly, every MLG event has had a different stage or event set-up - expect different and better things in the future.
Plus the production values of blizzcon vs. MLG is a bit different, considering Blizzcon has used the same StarCraft stage for the last few years with the same booths, considering they modeled it after Korean StarCraft tournaments makes it obvious.
I definitely would love to see a Blizzcon/Korea style setup for the televised matches while the rest are played at the "side tables".
That's what they do with their Halo setup as well, in which they have the two teams front-and-centre with the crowd directly in front of them (although their commentators are in a booth above.. not that they commentate that much sadly).
Also unless I'm missing something, doesn't MLG have a huge need for soundproofing/ booths. I understand that many players claim with their headset volume and them being "in-the-zone" they don't often notice it, but it feels silly at times when someone is going for a proxy and all of a sudden the commentators are whispering.
MLG has been so focused around games like Halo forever, so they're finally starting to come around to games like SC2. I'm sure next season of MLG they will have multiple streams and screens to watch them on instead of just the "one game per round streamed" thing they have been doing. They metal benches were also pretty fucking uncomfortable.. I kind of expected them to at least grab a few chairs.. either way, it was an awesome weekend.
I think there are a number of things MLG can improve upon. The whole setup just seems to lack the professionalism in Korea right now. But they have been focused on SC for many years and I think MLG will catch up.
From watching the online stream, I really hope they figure out a way to fix their camera work. There were so many times where I'd want to see the expression of a player after they lost or won a game, and all you see is the back of their dimly lit head. Maybe they don't have enough cameras or maybe the position of the players being on a giant table prevents the cameras to be placed where they are needed.
I would imagine the set up is the way it is though because you have to handle a bunch of matches at once because the MLG SC tournament takes place for only a few days where as the GSL, for example, is held over the course of several weeks. Even still, I feel that once it gets down to the final matches, they should be in booths and on some sort of main stage. It would just make everyone, both the participants and the audience feel more excited. The game would feel like the intense sport that it is.
Yeah Monkies put it right. Before SC2, MLG had focused almost fully on Halo and their setup for that is great. The audience can see both the players and the game. SC2 is new to MLG and they aren't going to pull out all the stops in the beginning. If it continues to grow popular with MLG then we may see them transition it into a bigger event.
I can't imagine those soundproof booths being too terribly hard to transport given the amount of equipment I saw for the Halo event. pretty much just adding those will naturally increase the quality like 10fold
Great post; I hope the adjust the stage around for 2011. I wonder if it's like it is at all because of Halo. Is the Halo stage setup the same way? If so do you think it's intentionally done differently due to being primarily a team and console game?
i'm sure their budget will go way up after seeing the static vs actual revenues, hopefully we'll see a lot bigger of a setup when I'm on the big stage ^_^
On some level, I agree with you 100%. SC2 has some excellent commentary and casting makes some boring matches worth watching. The Korean/Blizzcon setup is very professional and brings focus to the match.
On the other hand, I believe the MLG setup is excellent in letting the players and spectators feel like they're both part of the event equally. At the end of the match, the competitors and casters don't walk off the side of the stage, as if they're avoiding the fans. The setup feels much more personal.
On November 11 2010 15:42 aksfjh wrote: On some level, I agree with you 100%. SC2 has some excellent commentary and casting makes some boring matches worth watching. The Korean/Blizzcon setup is very professional and brings focus to the match.
On the other hand, I believe the MLG setup is excellent in letting the players and spectators feel like they're both part of the event equally. At the end of the match, the competitors and casters don't walk off the side of the stage, as if they're avoiding the fans. The setup feels much more personal.
I feel the same way as you. Also, I know some of the players liked that the way the player area was settup they didn't have to look into an audience while playing. Makes it easier to concentrate on the game which I think is good.
Was anyone at IEM at ComicCon? I really liked the set up they had going there. It was the screen, a space in the middle and competitors on either side with extra monitors in front of their computers showing what they saw on their screen and the big screen showed the caster's screen. The caster's were off to the side, you couldn't really see them. It would've been cooler if the casters were in the space in the middle maybe. I really like being able to see the competitors and the casters though. Especially with someone as animated as Day9, it's fun to watch him.
On November 11 2010 15:24 Logo wrote: Great post; I hope the adjust the stage around for 2011. I wonder if it's like it is at all because of Halo. Is the Halo stage setup the same way? If so do you think it's intentionally done differently due to being primarily a team and console game?
I didn't actually check out the Halo tournament at all. Did anybody else see it?
About the pros for players in the MLG tournament - I agree that the MLG setup brings players and spectators closer together, but there is a definite cost in terms of spectator-commentary engagement. I'd personally rather hang out with the players between games or before/after the day's events, but different strokes for different folks.
I personally don't think the player booths add all that much to the experience. It's nice to see who's actually playing, but it's not as if you get any extra game insight from watching them look at a monitor through a glass pane.
There's definitely room for innovation in SC venue layout - these two examples are only two of many possible setups. Perhaps sometime we'll find a happy medium where players and spectators can feel closer together without sacrificing salience of commentary.
Note: I really like the Blizzcon/Korean way better
I think though that Korean way really hinges off having the sound proof booths though as we have seen with in korea that is it possible to cheat or accidently hear the crowd while mlg works somewhat the other way. Yea the crowd is respectfully but stupid things happen that can't be controlled.
We don't know what MLG has prepared for '11. Can they afford booths? Do they want booths? We have heard that they will kinda be a main stage in '11 but what also does that entail? Will we see their whole mlg.tv expanded for us?
The result is that audience members are less likely to give the commentary their full attention and instead dissolve into personal commentary and theorycrafting with their neighbors, which can interfere with the experience of the people who want to just listen to the professional commentary. At BlizzCon, the audience tended to be silent along the lines of an audience at a theatrical play as opposed to a professional sporting event, and it seems to me that this was a direct effect of the commentators' proximity to the audience.
This quote really interests me. I don't think it distracts at all. When your at a baseball game you don't really have a commentator unless you bring a small radio along or maybe have a luxury seat w/ a TV. Why can't people talk amongst themselves and listen I know I can. Also maybe you were at Blizzcon but it seems more to me and to some extend during GSL(during non-finals/season1 opener) that the mics aren't picking up the crowd as good? MLG wasn't much better or better at all but from everyone is saying that MLG was having huge crowds watching being so far away may have to do with that.
Conclusion: Lets let MLG show what they kinda want to do first and then hopefully they let us somewhat tweak it so new can join in and old will have a great time.
On November 11 2010 16:48 Grevious wrote: Note: I really like the Blizzcon/Korean way better
I think though that Korean way really hinges off having the sound proof booths though as we have seen with in korea that is it possible to cheat or accidently hear the crowd while mlg works somewhat the other way. Yea the crowd is respectfully but stupid things happen that can't be controlled.
We don't know what MLG has prepared for '11. Can they afford booths? Do they want booths? We have heard that they will kinda be a main stage in '11 but what also does that entail? Will we see their whole mlg.tv expanded for us?
The result is that audience members are less likely to give the commentary their full attention and instead dissolve into personal commentary and theorycrafting with their neighbors, which can interfere with the experience of the people who want to just listen to the professional commentary. At BlizzCon, the audience tended to be silent along the lines of an audience at a theatrical play as opposed to a professional sporting event, and it seems to me that this was a direct effect of the commentators' proximity to the audience.
This quote really interests me. I don't think it distracts at all. When your at a baseball game you don't really have a commentator unless you bring a small radio along or maybe have a luxury seat w/ a TV. Why can't people talk amongst themselves and listen I know I can. Also maybe you were at Blizzcon but it seems more to me and to some extend during GSL(during non-finals/season1 opener) that the mics aren't picking up the crowd as good? MLG wasn't much better or better at all but from everyone is saying that MLG was having huge crowds watching being so far away may have to do with that.
Conclusion: Lets let MLG show what they kinda want to do first and then hopefully they let us somewhat tweak it so new can join in and old will have a great time.
You're lucky to be able to talk and listen at the same time! Basically, the theory is that many people (myself included) can't talk and listen to the SC commentators at the same time because they often speak very quickly (due to SC's fast pace, color commentary, etc.). I personally get a lot more out of the audience experience when I can hear the commentary clearly, which was not always the case at MLG - there were several times when the audience yelled to the staff to turn up the speakers since we couldn't hear them well.
I'm not sure about the mics at MLG picking up the audience, but it would make sense to me that if the commentators were closer to the audience, it might be easier to have an integrated mic system that picks up their reactions more efficiently than if they're far away.
In general, GSL, WCG and BlizzCon's setups are nearly identical, with ESL following suit except they dont have soundproof booths. Out of all of these leagues/events, MLG is the only one to have an open entry/bracket tournament that isn't invites or qualifiers. GSL is too, but the broadcasting is stretched out over a month, not 3 days.
MLG's setup will be way different in 2011 than it was in 2010, more likely closer to the Halo stage, which is very similar to the previously mentioned leagues' setups for Starcraft.
On November 11 2010 15:24 Logo wrote: Great post; I hope the adjust the stage around for 2011. I wonder if it's like it is at all because of Halo. Is the Halo stage setup the same way? If so do you think it's intentionally done differently due to being primarily a team and console game?
MLG has been doing Halo events for almost a decade now (52 halo events total thus far), it's been their cash cow and they always manage to fill a 256 team bracket~ (most of the time even more teams) which includes 4 players per team minimum, the pro player line-ups, coaches, alternates, sponsors and console related booths, etc... More to the point, the Halo Franchise is to MLG as StarCraft 1 is to Korean eSports if I were to make it an easy analogy. (In actuality, Halo as an competitive video game probably has the 2nd biggest competitive market to StarCraft).
So basically expect SC2 to be given similar respect as Halo event has received at future events.
GSL is a bit different to the other korean setups because there are 4 booths so the next players can warmup before their games and the operation runs a bit smoother. I think that a 4 booth setup would be the best for an event like MLG where many games have to be played at the same time and there is a demand for constant streaming of games.
The bad part about mlg are those pathetic curtains they have for the booth. They are not gonna stop any sound.
On November 12 2010 03:10 Slasher wrote: In general, GSL, WCG and BlizzCon's setups are nearly identical, with ESL following suit except they dont have soundproof booths. Out of all of these leagues/events, MLG is the only one to have an open entry/bracket tournament that isn't invites or qualifiers. GSL is too, but the broadcasting is stretched out over a month, not 3 days.
MLG's setup will be way different in 2011 than it was in 2010, more likely closer to the Halo stage, which is very similar to the previously mentioned leagues' setups for Starcraft.
Thanks for the update, Slasher. I'm looking forward to seeing what MLG has in store for us next year.
I've been to several WCG events, but they've all been in the US, so I figured I didn't have a representative enough experience to include them in my article (actually, TorcH told me this).
The MLG Halo setup still had the commentators behind/above the audience though right? I hope they don't use that setup, as I agree with what I believe is Peanut's main point here: The commentators should be directly in front of the audience.
I have to agree with your assessment, the Korean/Blizzcon setup is much more engaging. I really enjoyed SC2 at Blizzcon this year and having the three commentors center stage created a great synergy with the audience that really elevated the event. It's essentially the difference between watching a replay of a game on your computer versus watching the same replay professionally commented in a video, even though it the exact same match there is a world of difference.
Great post. I'd just like to mention that in my opinion having the players on stage is even more important than the commentators. If SC (and Esports) is to become huge, the players have to be the heroes of the moment, in front of everyone's eyes. Not somewhere backstage and being shown on screens. Hopefully MLG's priority for next season will be installing booths.
Quite an excellent post. Front page material, in fact. Hopefully some of the people from MLG will see this and take this feedback and improve the spectator experience in the future. Maybe some people who know some MLG organizers could forward this great analysis along.
Excellent post Peanut, I would be very disappointing if MLG doesn't implement this next year in their SC events, it seems so... clean, easy, and optimized to do.
Very well articulated and thought out post Peanut. Commentator positioning and seating arrangements are some of the most important improvements they could make to MLG Dallas. I didn't really complain about it much at the event because I'm used to the poverty spectator arrangements from fighting game tournaments, but if Starcraft 2 is going to break into mainstream it needs to be addressed and I'm sure MLG can make it happen.
I'm not sure how it is in Korea, but in NA, casters like day9 and djwheat are a huge part of the presentation of the event. That's why every major NA tournament and some european tournaments have Day9 casting. I think giving them a spot at center stage along with the players would be awesome. So, I think the Korean model would work very well for MLG. And to be even more specific, the GSL model would work well. Have 4 booths and a casting desk in the middle with screens around the area. This would allow the most visibility to the players and the casters. Having 4 booths would allow the players playing in the next streamed game a chance to get set up and warm up before their match begins. This would also simplify the camera setup so that they don't have to change positions all the time.
It'll certainly be interesting to see what they will do with the setup for MLG in 2011. It sounds like they have some big plans, and I'm sure SC2 will play a much larger role in their events now that they've seen its popularity.
I agree on all your points and you are absolutely right.
One things I would note is that we are missing a big Europe event. Apart from different LAN events where you may also have SC2, there is no SC2 specific event and with big prizes, so I'd like to see some great European events as well.
I think it would be terrific if they just had 2 booths for the "featured" match that the commentators were following, and used a setup similar to Blizzcon/Korea for the presentation. This not only would add to the excitement, but would help with some of the "don't worry, that's just Halo" problems if they were actually sound-proofed well.
Great post! Totally agree on what you are saying here. It's kinda funny how I actually go to MLG but I all I do is just watch a giant screen, which I can actually do in my room. Commentators and Players exposed to the crowd is very important for the scene IMO.
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