• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:37
CEST 20:37
KST 03:37
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy4Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic7Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru3BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview27
Community News
Classic & herO RO8 Interviews: "I think it’s time to teach [Rogue] a lesson."2Rogue & GuMiho RO8 interviews: "Lifting that trophy would be a testament to all I’ve had to overcome over the years and how far I’ve come on this journey.8Code S RO8 Results + RO4 Bracket (2025 Season 2)14BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack2Weekly Cups (June 2-8): herO doubles down1
StarCraft 2
General
Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing How herO can make history in the Code S S2 finals Rogue & GuMiho RO8 interviews: "Lifting that trophy would be a testament to all I’ve had to overcome over the years and how far I’ve come on this journey. Code S RO8 Results + RO4 Bracket (2025 Season 2) Classic & herO RO8 Interviews: "I think it’s time to teach [Rogue] a lesson."
Tourneys
[GSL 2025] Code S: Season 2 - Semi Finals & Finals WardiTV Mondays Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $3,500 WardiTV European League 2025 Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target Mutation # 474 Futile Resistance
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL20 Preliminary Maps BW General Discussion Recent recommended BW games FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 4
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason What do you want from future RTS games?
Dota 2
Best crypto recovery experts in the world Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread UK Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NHL Playoffs 2024 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
A Better Routine For Progame…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 32953 users

Balancing Starcraft 2 around Blizzard maps - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
DarkspearTribe
Profile Joined August 2010
568 Posts
September 25 2010 09:36 GMT
#41
On September 25 2010 18:35 Tef wrote:
They should balance the game around Python, it was the most balanced map in BW. [image loading]


reapers
Tef
Profile Joined April 2008
Sweden443 Posts
September 25 2010 09:40 GMT
#42
On September 25 2010 18:36 DarkspearTribe wrote:
reapers


Yeah, I guess they would have to make some water in between the islands, but it's the openess that I miss.
Dont fuck up, dont fuck yourself
terrOne
Profile Joined September 2009
Italy172 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-25 09:53:42
September 25 2010 09:53 GMT
#43
python was NOT the most balanced map in bw.

From liquipedia:
The map layout of Python is similar to the previously popular map, Lost Temple, but is known to fix various imbalances. Statistically, the map favors Terran. Python has become the default 1v1 map on Battle.net and is easily the most popular map on iCCup to the point that many people complain about it being overplayed



http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/korean/maps/147_Python_1.3

Do some research before saying bullshit.
HeLL yeah!
illumination
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)248 Posts
September 25 2010 10:06 GMT
#44
On September 25 2010 18:32 DarkspearTribe wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 25 2010 18:19 illumination wrote:
You know you guys keep bitching about blizzard and the maps but you never doing anything about it. There are a ton of high quality ICCUP maps out there and no1 plays them. Instead your playing the Blizzard maps which only makes the problem worse. If everyone here would just play the iccup maps (which are more balanced and definitely more fun) then Blizzard would be doing something. If i were Blizzard i wouldn't be following some whines on the internet, i would be watching to see what works, and since these maps are largely unplayed they can't justify using them.

Problems:
a) hard to find games on those games
b) no matchmaking
c) those maps are standard in tournaments so pros must practice on them

The problem can be fixed in any of the spots. If pros play them then players will want to see the games, caster can get players interested in these maps but if the maps get played by ordinary players like us then it raises on the custom games list. Lost temple is like the third most popular map and these maps outclass LT easily. This what makes your posts simple whining cuz your not playing them. If you would wait in the lobby for a iccup game while you browse the forums like i do then you would actually be improving things instead of making your useless post.
Welcome to TL - Where Terran have been teaching the Zerg / Toss pros how to play since Patch 11
Rodiel
Profile Joined August 2006
France573 Posts
September 25 2010 10:16 GMT
#45
largermap is so so needed
CONFIG
Profile Joined May 2010
Romania99 Posts
September 25 2010 10:20 GMT
#46
Good point but I doubout blizzard will do anything about it. The community should.
Numy
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
South Africa35471 Posts
September 25 2010 10:37 GMT
#47
The game should never be balanced around maps. Maps should help balance the game. Not the other way around.
GoDannY
Profile Joined August 2006
Germany442 Posts
September 25 2010 10:38 GMT
#48
I wish they would cooperate with some professional dedicated map makers for their ladder-pool (why not paying a small fee to them (in blizzard terms) and raise the quality of the whole game with seasonly new maps endlessly?!).
Team LifeStyle - it's more than a game
Grond
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
599 Posts
September 25 2010 11:58 GMT
#49
Maps are only one of many issues and a relatively small one. There is no need to even worry about maps until they get things in the right ballpark. I do agree a couple more maps would be nice so tournaments could just not use the maps that almost always get removed but its way too early to think about fine tuning balance with maps.
Arco
Profile Joined September 2009
United States2090 Posts
September 25 2010 12:00 GMT
#50
Crossfire would be in the right direction, but they really need some more solid maps.

They shoulda copied Fighting Spirit.
Lobotomist
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1541 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-25 12:17:59
September 25 2010 12:16 GMT
#51
I definitely feel that they would have done a good job making more BW knockoff maps. Yeah, we could keep most of the new maps, but making a few more big maps would have been nice.

Edit: Python is pretty solid as far as a balance standard goes. "Statistically" it's Terran favored, but "statistically" it's nothing compared to Kulas or somesuch.
Teching to hive too quickly isn't just a risk: it's an ultrarisk
Perscienter
Profile Joined June 2010
957 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-25 12:32:16
September 25 2010 12:31 GMT
#52
We need:

1. Sufficient data about the 3 matchups being published.

2. A means to reform the ladder map pool.

How are we supposed to do that? Do we have to found a software company first, become successful at that and invest our capital to write sophisticated data-mining software?

Lack of map stats is one of the biggest issue. Only Blizzard can pull it off. Most games are played on the ladder.


e: I also prefered Fighting Spirit and Tau Cross.
junkacc
Profile Joined July 2010
99 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-25 12:55:29
September 25 2010 12:34 GMT
#53
Hardware limitations people, hardware limitations. Can't have maps like that and expect everyone to run it smoothly.

This whole 3D business is all hype anyway. You don't need 3D in RTS. How often do people take advantage of rotate and zoom. Tasteless and Artosis use it for LOLs occasionally but that's it. It's just there so Blizzard can say:

"Hey look! SC2 is in 3D! Give us your money NAO!"

Because of hardware limitations we are stuck with small maps and the 200 unit limit.

It's not even real 3D. It doesn't accurately portray how line-of-sight would be obscured by cliffs and whatnot. Nor does it take into account obstruction of hitscan (straight line) weapons vs lobbed weapons. They just put the same mechanic as BW... if it's on a cliff you automatically can't see it.

Nice you all fell for the marketing gimmick though. I think Dustin Browden would say: "3D is keeeeeewl!!!"

.
http://filesmelt.com/dl/1284595498849.gif
junkacc
Profile Joined July 2010
99 Posts
September 25 2010 12:37 GMT
#54
Another thing about Blizzard maps is they try to over-emphasize the 3D-ness of it. It's like when Valve released HL2 they put over the top physics to hype the physics engine, and how 3D TV keeps thrusting things at the camera (uselessly).

IT'S ALL ABOUT THE HYPE
http://filesmelt.com/dl/1284595498849.gif
ArmyOfDix
Profile Joined September 2010
13 Posts
September 25 2010 14:03 GMT
#55
I'm miffed at how many maps aren't used in ladder, Crossfire being a PRIME example.
Qzy
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Denmark1121 Posts
September 25 2010 16:14 GMT
#56
When it takes less than .05 sec to drop a nexus with a few marauders, i really doubt big maps will bring terran nerf... No matter where i position my army, a few marauders can be dropped in one of my bases and it's gg. Small maps = less distance to where they are dropping marauders.
TG Sambo... Intel classic! Life of lively to live to life of full life thx to shield battery
Half
Profile Joined March 2010
United States2554 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-09-25 16:18:39
September 25 2010 16:18 GMT
#57
On September 25 2010 21:34 junkacc wrote:
Hardware limitations people, hardware limitations. Can't have maps like that and expect everyone to run it smoothly.

This whole 3D business is all hype anyway. You don't need 3D in RTS. How often do people take advantage of rotate and zoom. Tasteless and Artosis use it for LOLs occasionally but that's it. It's just there so Blizzard can say:

"Hey look! SC2 is in 3D! Give us your money NAO!"

Because of hardware limitations we are stuck with small maps and the 200 unit limit.

It's not even real 3D. It doesn't accurately portray how line-of-sight would be obscured by cliffs and whatnot. Nor does it take into account obstruction of hitscan (straight line) weapons vs lobbed weapons. They just put the same mechanic as BW... if it's on a cliff you automatically can't see it.

Nice you all fell for the marketing gimmick though. I think Dustin Browden would say: "3D is keeeeeewl!!!"

.



....

lawl.

No your completely wrong lol, and have no idea what your talking about. Note the existence of 2v2, 3v3, and 4v4.
Too Busy to Troll!
Bagi
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6799 Posts
September 25 2010 16:28 GMT
#58
On September 25 2010 21:34 junkacc wrote:
Hardware limitations people, hardware limitations. Can't have maps like that and expect everyone to run it smoothly.

This whole 3D business is all hype anyway. You don't need 3D in RTS. How often do people take advantage of rotate and zoom. Tasteless and Artosis use it for LOLs occasionally but that's it. It's just there so Blizzard can say:

"Hey look! SC2 is in 3D! Give us your money NAO!"

Because of hardware limitations we are stuck with small maps and the 200 unit limit.

It's not even real 3D. It doesn't accurately portray how line-of-sight would be obscured by cliffs and whatnot. Nor does it take into account obstruction of hitscan (straight line) weapons vs lobbed weapons. They just put the same mechanic as BW... if it's on a cliff you automatically can't see it.

Nice you all fell for the marketing gimmick though. I think Dustin Browden would say: "3D is keeeeeewl!!!"

.

Look at how smart this guy is.

We're all so stupid for playing SC2. You got us there.
junkacc
Profile Joined July 2010
99 Posts
September 25 2010 18:03 GMT
#59
On September 26 2010 01:28 Bagi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 25 2010 21:34 junkacc wrote:
Hardware limitations people, hardware limitations. Can't have maps like that and expect everyone to run it smoothly.

This whole 3D business is all hype anyway. You don't need 3D in RTS. How often do people take advantage of rotate and zoom. Tasteless and Artosis use it for LOLs occasionally but that's it. It's just there so Blizzard can say:

"Hey look! SC2 is in 3D! Give us your money NAO!"

Because of hardware limitations we are stuck with small maps and the 200 unit limit.

It's not even real 3D. It doesn't accurately portray how line-of-sight would be obscured by cliffs and whatnot. Nor does it take into account obstruction of hitscan (straight line) weapons vs lobbed weapons. They just put the same mechanic as BW... if it's on a cliff you automatically can't see it.

Nice you all fell for the marketing gimmick though. I think Dustin Browden would say: "3D is keeeeeewl!!!"

.

Look at how smart this guy is.

We're all so stupid for playing SC2. You got us there.


Yeah, enjoy paying 180 bucks for the whole thing. Dustin Browden would say: "Money is keeeeeewl!!!"

User was banned for this post.
http://filesmelt.com/dl/1284595498849.gif
Rev0lution
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
United States1805 Posts
September 25 2010 18:12 GMT
#60
Why can't blizzard just hire the iccup mapmakers? They would have one to three mapmakers who can publish high quality tournament maps and never have to worry about making maps again.

One thing they truly suck at is making maps. Just look at the Brood War maps and WC3 maps!

I'm getting sick and tired of having a Xel Naga tower and a destructible rock on every single fucking map. Does every map need to have a DESTRUCTIBLE ROCK? What the fuck is wrong with Blizzard?

Oh, let's have a Xel Naga Watch tower and a destructible rock on every ladder map. They sure are very original and bring a lot of deep strategy to the game!
My dealer is my best friend, and we don't even chill.
Prev 1 2 3 4 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
BSL: ProLeague
18:00
Bracket Stage - Day 4
Bonyth vs Dewalt
Cross vs Doodle
MadiNho vs Dragon
ZZZero.O311
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ZombieGrub374
mouzHeroMarine 276
IndyStarCraft 165
BRAT_OK 92
MindelVK 11
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4329
Rain 2709
Horang2 1258
ZZZero.O 311
BeSt 156
Sacsri 57
sSak 35
Hyun 29
Killer 15
Terrorterran 9
Dota 2
Gorgc7775
League of Legends
Dendi2075
JimRising 436
Counter-Strike
fl0m5448
Foxcn360
flusha110
rGuardiaN58
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King194
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor798
Other Games
tarik_tv43322
gofns22123
FrodaN3510
summit1g3103
B2W.Neo950
C9.Mang0655
Beastyqt561
KnowMe195
TKL 133
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream13921
Other Games
EGCTV1326
gamesdonequick969
BasetradeTV17
angryscii14
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• HeavenSC 52
• 3DClanTV 50
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Migwel
• intothetv
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Kozan
StarCraft: Brood War
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV508
• Ler126
League of Legends
• Jankos3071
Other Games
• imaqtpie1346
• Shiphtur276
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
5h 23m
Wardi Open
16h 23m
Replay Cast
1d 5h
Replay Cast
1d 15h
RSL Revival
1d 15h
Cure vs Percival
ByuN vs Spirit
RSL Revival
2 days
herO vs sOs
Zoun vs Clem
Replay Cast
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Serral vs SHIN
Solar vs Cham
Replay Cast
4 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
4 days
Reynor vs Scarlett
ShoWTimE vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
SC Evo League
5 days
Circuito Brasileiro de…
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-06-11
BGE Stara Zagora 2025
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025

Upcoming

Copa Latinoamericana 4
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
BLAST Open Fall 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.