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On September 23 2010 23:02 Ender985 wrote:
It would be more useful to me if the clock displayed actual seconds and not this faster starcraft2-seconds that make no sense in the real world, so I could know if I've been in the game for 20 or 30 minutes without having to actively think about it.
I actually prefer game time because that's what the build order tab goes by, but I imagine it'd be easy to add in an option to choose between real time and game time.
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Instead of thinking about how noobs are gonna use the clock think about how you can improve using it. I didnt have a chance to use it yet but i imagine i could improve my build order timings with it. Like this time my starport was completed at 5:43 ..hhmmmm...lets see next time if i can do better. You can see these timings without watching the replay afterwards and try to improve.
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On September 22 2010 02:20 SnakeChomp wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2010 02:17 asianinvasian wrote:
its an optional tool. I hope this is not allowed at LAN Tournaments. Why would tournaments disallow a feature added to the game by Blizzard from being used? That's like tournaments banning reapers because they are just "so annoying." Maybe tournaments should cover up your food counts too? Or maybe they should hide the bottom right of your screen where the build icons are; pros only use hotkeys and don't need those buttons right?
I agree. No reason to ban timers. You can do the same thing with a watch after all. Yes I know SC2 on fastest is more like 1.5 seconds per second, but you can easily put it into a ratio.
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It can be useful for team games. Attack at 5:00. Sort of like the sun in WC3.
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I personally think it's a bad thing. In my mind, It's a crutch that helps lower skilled players... but if you take that away from them, they may encounter difficulties when they try to play. You shouldn't get used to using it, or start thinking "Oh hey at 4:00 i should expect this"
Instead of doing that, why not just scout?
Basically, I think it's not a good replacement for your natural sense for timings.
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I absolutely don't mind it because it helps refine build orders and it is just another tool to aid the competent commander. Anyways, in late game or high level play it will have negligible effect.
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It's awesome
I often play v AI just to practice my macro and see how much stuff can I have at certain time with some specific build
It was such a pain in the ass having to watch rep every single time to see how good was I doing
Now I use time as benchmark (x food at y time)
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As some of you migth know, the same thing happened in Quake3 back in the day. I think it was in one of the cpma Relases. It was also discussed alot if this would help to much. Having a ingame clock in quake made timing items pretty easy. But as someone who played lots and lots of games with and without a clock i can tell you the following. The clock was really helpful for someone new to the concept of timings. It also helped when adapting your play to a new map with different timings.
But in the long run it wasn´t that big, because if you play the game over and over again you just know your timings and how to adjust in certain situations. I don´t think it will be any different in SC2.
By the way the clock was eventually removed from Quake.
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On September 22 2010 02:16 cykalu wrote:
Help against timing pushes. Definitely. I think it's rather good for zerg as they want to spare as much time as possible on droning initially.
For non pros i think its the otherway around, it's not good for zerg. a normal zerg already knows how to defend stupid pushes and when they have to expect them. You already have to do near perfect timing to defend this crap sometimes.
So, with a ingame clock, all the Players who are just "good" because of using stupid pushes which are sowhat easy to execute but hard to defend, can now execute them perfectly with a ingame Clock. Could be very annoying as a Zerg imho.
greets
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On September 24 2010 00:37 nodq wrote:Show nested quote +On September 22 2010 02:16 cykalu wrote:
Help against timing pushes. Definitely. I think it's rather good for zerg as they want to spare as much time as possible on droning initially. For non pros i think its the otherway around, it's not good for zerg. a normal zerg already knows how to defend stupid pushes and when they have to expect them. You already have to do near perfect timing to defend this crap sometimes. So, with a ingame clock, all the Players who are just "good" because of using stupid pushes which are sowhat easy to execute but hard to defend, can now execute them perfectly with a ingame Clock. Could be very annoying as a Zerg imho. greets
On the other hand, now you will never miss a spawn larvae because every X seconds you know its time 
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What a great OP... not only is there no poll... there is basically no content... It states that there are pluses and minuses.. without going into detail about pluses or minuses... F for eFfort...
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I barely ever look at it even though I have turned it on. (1250-1300 diamond for relevance). Doesn't seem overly useful to me other than comparing one build order to another while practicing.
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On September 24 2010 02:24 Wr3k wrote:
I barely ever look at it even though I have turned it on. (1250-1300 diamond for relevance). Doesn't seem overly useful to me other than comparing one build order to another while practicing.
The same applies to me as well. I turn the feature on expecting for it to be of some use only to never once glance at it in-game even though I stare at the minimap most of the game.
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I turned it on for about 5 games and it was like impossible for me to look at or use. I would force myself to look at it, and it would only cause me to get confused and distracted.
So yeah, I don't mind having the option for it at all. If it helps newer players, then that is great. If you can focus on that clock and the game then good for you but it was completely disorienting for me 
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I fail to see how this affects anyone other than the player who chooses to use it. If people misuse it and it causes them to lose, why does anyone else care? They will come to rely on food and resources like the rest of us. If it is a more or complimentary tool to food and resource counts then we'll all use it and how could that be a bad thing?
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Wow... 18 pages...
I'm sorry but it is obviously a good add...
You always had the option to play with a clock next to your pc anyway.
So now instead of giving an edge to players who use a clock you give everybody the same fair option...
This being added is as normal and fair as removing the 7% harvester efficiency...
Without this new ingame option you can still use a clock next to your pc... so what's the problem?
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On September 23 2010 22:26 sleepingdog wrote:Show nested quote +On September 23 2010 08:23 RedSword wrote:
Allow it in custom... but in melee ?!?!? wtf !! Less gamesense requirement plz !
SC2 should be more competitive, not more noob-friendly ! yeah while we are add it, let's remove the supply-count so you have to count all your probes/units all the time and have to "guess" when you'll need additional pylons/etc.; also let's remove the building-time-line, so people will have to constantly check when their units will gonna pop out; also there shouldn't be really an indicator that shows how much minterals and gas you have, as a competitive player you should be able to constantly calculate and keep track of your income
Yeah I guess you're right. Let's, instead, just remove all mechanical aspects altogether. Let's have an "autobuild" command that keeps building a specified unit until specified otherwise. Actually, forget that: let's have a build order menu, yep, that's a lot better than just several little things. Make it so that, before the start of the game, players can basically fill a form and pick what units/buildings they want and in what order too. When everyone's ready, have a "start game" button and let the game occur. Then every X minutes, let every player adjust their plans depending on what's happening. This way better players will always win because of their greater strategic senses, no shitty mechanical spamming bullshit.
Cause after all, stategy's what's important in strategy games, right?
See, I also can make up stupid extreme examples that make absolutely no point at all.
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On September 24 2010 02:40 Rotemetoot wrote:
Wow... 18 pages...
I'm sorry but it is obviously a good add...
You always had the option to play with a clock next to your pc anyway.
So now instead of giving an edge to players who use a clock you give everybody the same fair option...
This being added is as normal and fair as removing the 7% harvester efficiency...
Without this new ingame option you can still use a clock next to your pc... so what's the problem?
Please read the thread. This has been brought up many times already. Thanks.
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i kinda think the timer is bad if allowed in tournament matches.
its possible to derive alot of information about the opponent's build if you see the exact timing when you see them place or finish a building. or when u run into their scout, you can determine their location and possibly their build.
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On September 23 2010 08:23 RedSword wrote:
Allow it in custom... but in melee ?!?!? wtf !! Less gamesense requirement plz !
SC2 should be more competitive, not more noob-friendly !
Ya man I agree.
So last night I'm taking my finance test. I'm studying, getting my shit ready. Sit down in the class, looking around at all the other scrubs taking the test. Test is passed out, I'm feeling pretty good about it. The TA says "sup 2 hours on this test." I look up and what do I see? A fucking clock. Immediately I go up to the TA. I say "WTF man, a clock? I can't even take this shit seriously." I tell him that it takes away from the pros like me who use internal instinct instead of a fuckin crutch. He looks at me confused. I throw my test at him and walk out yelling "fucking scrub gold league test takers."
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EPT
