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I would of done the same as morrow in his situation.
It's bullshit, and after the games VS dimaga i stoped watching. WTF 14 casters, players lagging like hell, can't micro, can't play, and the casters don't leave and are just happy to be in the game while the players are struggling to play.
It's not fun to watch laggy games, and not fun to watch games that stop because of lag from time to time and have freeze each time there is some action.
Really very bad organisation from EPS, banning a player for reacting to your bad organisation is even more stupid. He is right, it wasn't his place to try fixing it by his means, but since the probleme is half the fault of the organisation, he shouldn't get banned for it.
Anyway thanks morrow for reacting to this matter and forcing some change even if you get banned, because it. It was needed.
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On September 06 2010 04:43 iCCup.Diamond wrote:
Seriously it took an average of asking 4 times to get every non-KawaiiRice replay for the ITL Grand Prix, and some only arrived minutes before they were cast. Some players never actually sent them, but I got them from the other player.
Seriously it's a widespread and rampant problem.
The easiest solution would be to require the winner to upload all the replays immediately after completing the games otherwise he can't move on. Make it known ahead of time in bold size 48 font.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
Well, I gotta side with Morrow here. No matter what the rules are, I'm still on the side of players first. If he isn't able to micro, then the observers can go bugger off.
If he isn't able to perform at his highest level due to stuff like obs lagging the game, then that certainly isn't his fault at all. Totally understand his frustration.
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I watched some morrow's games he keeps whining over little things,so he had that coming :/
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I believe the end result of this is appropriate.
Morrow needs to stand up for himself, playing with lag due to 10 observers is not acceptable when there is money on the line.
ESL needs to show that players have to follow the rules, thus banning Morrow is appropriate, at least for a short period of time. However, they have shown with the intended rule change that they do care about the players, and about providing the highest quality of games possible (i.e. lag free.)
The games are still being streamed, so everyone can just restream off of that if certain fans prefer a certain commentator.
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I agree with what Morrow did, but it's a shame that it had to come to that.
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On September 06 2010 05:22 Astronaut wrote:
I believe the end result of this is appropriate.
Morrow needs to stand up for himself, playing with lag due to 10 observers is not acceptable when there is money on the line.
ESL needs to show that players have to follow the rules, thus banning Morrow is appropriate, at least for a short period of time. However, they have shown with the intended rule change that they do care about the players, and about providing the highest quality of games possible (i.e. lag free.)
The games are still being streamed, so everyone can just restream off of that if certain fans prefer a certain commentator.
Money that came from the sponsors who funded the tournament and the ones who are streaming on the line lol....
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It's extremely frustrating to play with lag and I totally understand MorroW. It's pretty sad that he got banned(even temporarily) in order for a rule change to be considered. It's very likely that the rules would've stayed the same, if it wasn't for his action.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On September 06 2010 05:35 AppleTart wrote:Show nested quote +On September 06 2010 05:22 Astronaut wrote:
I believe the end result of this is appropriate.
Morrow needs to stand up for himself, playing with lag due to 10 observers is not acceptable when there is money on the line.
ESL needs to show that players have to follow the rules, thus banning Morrow is appropriate, at least for a short period of time. However, they have shown with the intended rule change that they do care about the players, and about providing the highest quality of games possible (i.e. lag free.)
The games are still being streamed, so everyone can just restream off of that if certain fans prefer a certain commentator. Money that came from the sponsors who funded the tournament and the ones who are streaming on the line lol....
What he did was wrong. No doubt about that. But when a player can't perform to his highest ability due to stuff like lag thanks to a ton of observers or whatnot, then it's understandable that he's gonna get pissed.
Yes, I know it's ESL's tourney and it's their rules, but in tournaments with money on the line, it should always be players first.
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imagine how athletes would respond if you have them fucked up equipment or something like that.
players need to stand up for themselves and morrow\idra are doing that.
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The tunnel vision from the casters > players camp is getting really tired, and really only two or three posters keep saying the same stuff over and over again. Sorry but we don't agree. Unfortunately, the reason this thread is 18 pages is b/c they think reptetition is going to change our minds - hah. They can claim, oh well the organizes/sponsors (and hence casters) need to get paid. Ok no problem. When they realize that a tournament requires willing players to be involved, maybe they will get their priorities in line.
Shawngood made a post on Page14 indicating something will be done...eh I am still reserving judgement. If Morrow is not truly banned, as he claimed, then I will be relieved, but I wouldn't be surprised if they leave him out to dry - as a power move.
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On September 06 2010 01:07 DorN wrote:
No Stream => No Premium Viewers => No Money for the ESL => No Pricemoney => No Cup
Have fun with the Ban Morrow.
This is all that needs to be said.
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On September 06 2010 05:55 ShaperofDreams wrote:
imagine how athletes would respond if you have them fucked up equipment or something like that.
players need to stand up for themselves and morrow\idra are doing that.
Seriously, I mean a from the tournament runners perspective having a cast is great, it does feel like they did go to an extreme ( 14 fucking casters? ) and really I think the players needs, especially when it's something that can be severe like lag, should be put first.
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Why the hell does a tournament need 14 casters/obs anyway?? So there's like a gazillion channels broadcasting?
Any competent promoter would limit it to a few casters/streamers at most. This way there's control and you can brand your tournament, advertise or do whatever with it.
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I can't imagine a need for more than maybe 5-6 observers in a game MAX. Organizers of tournaments need to get their act together and preselect a group of streamers that will serve the audience's language needs. There is really no reason to have two streams in the same language in the same game.
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holy shit, 14 casters? and they banned him for solid reasoning?
you should drop the tournament morrow. they don't deserve to have a player of your skill level after that.
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Finland33997 Posts
On September 06 2010 01:42 Mannerheim wrote:Show nested quote +On September 06 2010 01:01 AmaZing wrote:
but seriously if a fucking player does not want you in the freaking game, he doesnt want you in the FREAKING GAME! So bm these ppl. I know BigT wasnt at fault and i didnt think he was at fault the last time either but WOW wtf. because a caster "WANTED TO JOIN", STFU and join one of the other 31 games... ffs Organized tournaments and leagues are not the players' personal playgrounds where they can do whatever they want. If following rules is too difficult, don't sign up. Totally with ESL on this one.
That's just completely retarded though. For like 10 years it's always been "if lag -> obs out". ESL being unable to adapt is just really childish and unprofessional. The players need to be able to play. If those were the rules, well fuck awful rulesets then.
EDIT: And that'd be even if all the casters were bearable. However, only about 2 of the casters are listenable. How does it make sense to have 12 extra, useless casters no one wants to listen to?
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It´s not like ESL went around and begged all of thoose guys to stream their tournement. Of course it somewhat promotes them but their bigges success is if it gets them more premium viewers that view the ESL.tv.
But esltv is only in german as far as I know thus they are happy if they have some more streamers in other languages.
All that aside playing with lag sucks and they already mentioned that they are going to change the rules to probably reduce the amout of observers and hopefully get rid of the lags.
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On September 06 2010 06:00 jumanji69 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 06 2010 01:07 DorN wrote:
No Stream => No Premium Viewers => No Money for the ESL => No Pricemoney => No Cup
Have fun with the Ban Morrow. This is all that needs to be said.
I find it kind of funny how this statement assumes that everything revolves around - and originates from - the cup, when it is in fact the (big name) players that draws the crowd. Not the other way around. If the players can't play, then they won't play. There won't be a money-driven tournament without the "cash cow" participants.
It's all about getting the priorities straight, and balancing the interests on both sides. Especially now, when there are a gazillion different tournaments with similar layouts and prizes.
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EPT
