As Terran! I'm actually a huge noob and I have no idea if the other races can do this.
Inspired by watching a Reach(P) pro game a long time ago using an Archon targeting a Zealot to kill a Lurker
I made a quick video of this so you can see it in action:
WATCH IT IN 480P OR YOU WILL NOT BE ABLE TO SEE
Basically, since SC2 is a game running in a 3-D environment, cloaked units can be seen by panning your camera in and out. So you can easily tell (or just confirm) where an observer is by scrolling in and out. This is demonstrated in the first few seconds of the video.
Next, I order my Viking (Banshees are bad for this because of armor type) to park right on top of the Observer. Something interesting to watch, is that it also distorts the little green thing that point to where you order him to go, it is no longer a circle, but tuns into a big splotch, this is how you know you will be directly on top of it.
I then use my Thor (Air splash damage) to target the Viking, it takes to volleys to destroy the observer. Observe, the Observer, running away from the first volley, just watch the distortion and make your viking follow in its direction, you only need like half of the next volley to kill it off, so if you had 2 Thors it would be an instant Obs death.
If you have the right settings you don't need to pan your camera in and out to see cloaked units.
I don't really see this as practical. Just get a raven and save yourself a lot of health and time, or get missile turret if you're playing defensive. The only time I would recommend friend fire to take out a unit is ghosts or dark lots.
It isn't really suppose to be "pracitcal" I guess, not like you go around the whole map zooming in and out. If you see an obs, have a Thor and a Viking/Medivac, you can kill the obs without needing to waste the minerals on a turret that may not need to be there. The Thor doesn't even take the viking to half, so it can be quickly repaired.
IMO knocking out the Protoss map hacks for almost free is a good thing.
Also: (Duh) you could EMP it, but it would be best used on their Immortals/DTs and HTs.
You can use Hellions flame turret, park your unit above a creep tumour, attack your own unit, and it will kill the creep tumour. Same with banelings. Explode will damage a dark templar. All splash damage is like this.
Those setting would be at least medium, it makes it easier to see cloaked units. Even then it's not hard to point them out when you glancing across your screen. Especially when they are moving.
To the op the one killing thing here, you don't want observers even seeing anything. Hence you would want a missile or raven to kill it the instant it comes into range. Observers are really only expensive in the early stages.
It's a neat move if your really must kill it, but you would be served better by having proper detection, instead of doing something like this constantly.
To make it simple, please don't rely on this to get the job done.
More trouble than it's worth, and you should probably be using the time to macro or something. Or just get a turret/Raven. In any case, this is the wrong section. Moved to General.
This can be done by any race with splash units, and people who are saying its not worth it. It is worth it if you are a high apm player and can do it with out messing up your macro. Pros in BW have target fired thier buildings with tanks to kill Dts, I can see a pro doing this.
As for panning in and out, if your gosu you just see cloaked units
On August 12 2010 08:51 jamesr12 wrote: This can be done by any race with splash units, and people who are saying its not worth it. It is worth it if you are a high apm player and can do it with out messing up your macro. Pros in BW have target fired thier buildings with tanks to kill Dts, I can see a pro doing this.
As for panning in and out, if your gosu you just see cloaked units
Dark lots still need to get in melee range, you have time before they even start to do anything. This is the main problem with comparing this with dark lots; Once they get the information they where sent there for, they already have been paid for. Dark lots need to damage (not kill, but that would be nice), to get the other player to do what you want.
This is a reactive move to an observer already being there. Once they already have seen what you want, it's cool that they stick around for a little longer but if they don't so what? Point is, you need to have defense before they get to the location not after.
This could be important, but even in SC1, when pros have ebays up and turrets to prevent reaver drops, they don't put any turrets by their factories to hide their factory counts from observers... which I always thought was important to the Protoss to judge if the Terran is going for a timing push or a greedy expand build...
what about the arguing this is not worth it? of course its worth it, as long as you are able to do this on the fly without loosing focus on other stuff
Pros in BW have target fired thier buildings with tanks to kill Dts, I can see a pro doing this.
this is the same, just with a different unit.
What settings determines the affect of cloaked and burrowed units?
Just because it is a unit does not mean it accomplishes the same task as every other cloaked unit. This the key thing which makes this not worth it. Point is, I repeat the damage would already have been done and, you at that point should of already had a detector unit out. I mean you got to at least know that Protoss are going to get observers out. You would be gimping yourself if you rely on this trick.
On settings I really do not know. You can see cloaked units on the very lowest settings, but it's more easier to see them on medium and above settings. I don't know what exact settings work, and personally I can easily see the stupid suckers whenever they get around my field of vision. I guess it's more of a trained flicker you catch.
There's a reason why it was only really used on lurkers, and only in emergencies in BW. An enemy won't leave his banshee stationary for 6-10 seconds while you line up your thor and viking. If you don't have detectors and banshees are in your base or around your ground army, you're hosed.
On August 12 2010 08:51 jamesr12 wrote: This can be done by any race with splash units, and people who are saying its not worth it. It is worth it if you are a high apm player and can do it with out messing up your macro. Pros in BW have target fired thier buildings with tanks to kill Dts, I can see a pro doing this.
As for panning in and out, if your gosu you just see cloaked units
Unless if those same pros are smurfing in bronze/silver, their opponents would likely be similar level pros, who A) probably won't go for your buildings with DTs when there are tanks and workers present, and B) if he does go for buildings, he won't let himself get splashed to death while hammering on a supply depot or whatever.
How are people who have watched Brood War for years even capable of saying "it's not worth the effort, impractical" when Brood War has been CONSTANTLY proving that kind of thinking wrong? If it's something you can do in theory, someone will make it useful in a real game at some point. It may not happen consistently, but it will happen, in any video game
It has practical applications. When your helion harass is met with drones burrowing under ground. Snicker and shoot at the hatchery and watch the drones bake anyway.
mmhh? dont see the point. you can see cloaked units fine all the time... is it just me?
and ya it saved my ass more then once. when you kill dts by splashing em with your PF on your scvs you know you learned something from those countless hours of bw matches watchd.
On August 12 2010 10:20 Sanguinarius wrote: You can see the cloaked unit move - just like in sc1. Its probably harder on higher settings because there is more that just moves overall.
as said, can see evrything cloaked moving super fine and if you know there is a ob or whatever you mcan find it too. evrything on ultra settings that is.
Mmmm... is it effective to go viking/thors against protoss ??? i rather go marine, marauder, ghost, stim/slow early push and then see what is he going to do... and kill the observer with the emp. even if it cost me a lot of energy, it cost more to the protoss once you have enough ghosts.
Someone mentioned "once it is there, the damage is done." True, to an extent. Toss will often times position their Observer so they can see when you are moving out. They won't know if it is dead.
I really can't believe people are saying its not worth it. Not doing something like this when scan is down or you don't have a turret currently there, is just giving scouting information away for free "Hey I COULD kill your obs, but nah!"
Viking/Thor was mentioned as not really being a viable unit comp in TvP which could be true at the moment, but it also work with Ravens Medivacs and Banshees. Banshees are a bad target though because they are considered light units, which Thors pwn. Medivacs with your mm ball are quite common against Protoss.
I expect something like this to happen 1 out of every 1000 games, but its little tricks like this that made BW so fun to watch, and the more of these we find, the better!
EPT
