EPTAnti aliasing in Starcraft2 - Page 2
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Craton
United States17281 Posts
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Ikkath
United Kingdom54 Posts
On May 16 2010 03:41 baeracaed wrote: Actually there's no AA in SC2 because it uses deferred shading, which forces hardware anti-aliasing to take place before lighting is applied to geometry, which will not even come close to producing the desired effect. There are two common ways to get around it, one being a basic blur applied to edges of geometry that's utterly inferior to true anti-aliasing, and another using DirectX 10+. The latter being the only option for applying traditional anti-aliasing in engines using deferred shading/lighting. Since Blizzard chose not to utilize DirectX 10 and they have not implemented a custom "edge blurring" technique, we are essentially stuck with whatever hacks AMD/Nvidia are able to put into their drivers to achieve any type of anti-aliasing by forcing it through their respective control panels (Which always results in horrendous performance hits and/or results that are inferior to traditional multi-sample anti-aliasing) Anybody actually read this post? On July 16 2010 22:08 Craton wrote: Does anyone in the industry know what it takes to implement AA? I'm curious what kind of effort is required. Unless Blizzard add another set of shaders to fake AA (not too hard but could potentially be a huge performance hit on cards lacking in shaders ops/sec) there won't be any AA. Since they already have screen space ambient occlusion and other "naturally deferred" effects I fully expect them to have experiemented with shader AA. So they either didn't think it was worth the extra cycles or they couldn't get it working properly in all cases (highly likely) and held off on using it. The best naive way involves finding all the luminous edges in the scene (there are well defined filters for this) and then use that as a mask for the blur - so you don't affect the whole scene, only the edges. Its a pain that is alleviated with DX10 as there you have full dynamic hardware MSAA on multiple rendertargets that combine in the proper way so you can let the hardware "do the right thing". | ||
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DocSnyder
Germany137 Posts
On May 19 2010 08:43 PGHammer wrote: However, most HD-series (all except the worst of the HD2xxx, for all I know) support AA; even my Original Shrimp HD3450 (which has since been replaced by a Visiontek HD5450) supported AA (except in titles where no AMD GPU supported AA). The lack of AA support for AMD cards is why I backed down to merely High (from Ultra, and yes, the HD5450 can go that tall) for replays. (No AA and practically any detail High or greater cause a case of oversharpness, which is likely why some folks complained of a *plastic* look to the units and structures.) Medium is fine without AA; High or Ultra without AA is asking for eyeball pain. True definitely case of oversharpness, i can hardly play more than 4-5 match when my head starts pounding(1920x1080).....i can understand why pros town dawn theyre graphics setting.....like yesterday i went for a all-nighter 3v3 and 4v4s and went to bed with a headache.... Mind you its the games fault to,youre attenion is focused on so many places at ones,prolonged play with so many effects can be painful,however i dont get that when im just watching replays,as i imagine i wont when playing single player,its multyplayers unforgiving nature that forces you on your toes for every second.... Well theres gotta be something. Nvidia users are CAPABLE of doing it. I mean look at day 9's casts. Jeez i just want it to look like that. AM I ASKING FOR TOO MUCH? AM I? TELL ME MAN, PLEASE TELL ME, AM I ASKING FOR TOO MUCH SIR? Off course youre asking for to much,alot of people cant even run this game stable,thanks to Blizzards "wonderful" coding,ive never see shitier,this game can go from 120 in beginning to 30 or less late game,never experienced so much flux in any video game. Ive got a 295GTX and i can barely run this with stable frames 3v3 and 4v4 drop to 20 sometime in battle,i hardly think AA is going to help performance and stability..... | ||
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RainWhisper
United Arab Emirates333 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p277/MARWANbaki/1.jpg) ![[image loading]](http://i130.photobucket.com/albums/p277/MARWANbaki/2.jpg) | ||
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NExUS1g
United States254 Posts
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phuzi0n
United States308 Posts
On July 16 2010 20:56 MarwanBaki wrote: Well theres gotta be something. Nvidia users are CAPABLE of doing it. I mean look at day 9's casts. Jeez i just want it to look like that. AM I ASKING FOR TOO MUCH? AM I? TELL ME MAN, PLEASE TELL ME, AM I ASKING FOR TOO MUCH SIR? Day9's SC2 isn't anti-aliased, the video is downscaled which creates the same effect but loses resolution. The traditional super-sampling anti-aliasing method renders the image at an increased resolution and then downscale the image to your real resolution, hence the 2x, 4x, 8x, etc. which meant that the image was really being rendered at 2x, 4x, 8x, etc. of your actual resolution before being downscaled. | ||
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NukeTheBunnys
United States1004 Posts
On July 16 2010 22:43 MarwanBaki wrote: Look at how horrible this game looks like on MAX settings. Its all this fake lighting that only aa can fix. I really dont see what you are complaining about. Sure when you take some stills you can notice some minor jaggys, nothing all that bad even in stills. Now when we are talking video it looks great, and if you have enough time in the middle of a game to go zoom in and look for jaggys you are doing something wrong. | ||
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RainWhisper
United Arab Emirates333 Posts
[QUOTE]On July 16 2010 22:43 MarwanBaki wrote: Look at how horrible this game looks like on MAX settings. Its all this fake lighting that only aa can fix. I really dont see what you are complaining about. Sure when you take some stills you can notice some minor jaggys, nothing all that bad even in stills. Now when we are talking video it looks great, and if you have enough time in the middle of a game to go zoom in and look for jaggys you are doing something wrong. [/QUOTE] ACtually the images fix it, in reality it is so jagged and horrible and i hate it and i hate my life and i resent my parents and my partner in life. Also blizzard too. I hate and resent everyone, i neglect the things that truly matter.  I need AA man, you dont get it. Im seriously fed up with this. | ||
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MamiyaOtaru
United States1687 Posts
On July 16 2010 23:07 phuzi0n wrote: Day9's SC2 isn't anti-aliased, the video is downscaled which creates the same effect but loses resolution. The traditional super-sampling anti-aliasing method renders the image at an increased resolution and then downscale the image to your real resolution, hence the 2x, 4x, 8x, etc. which meant that the image was really being rendered at 2x, 4x, 8x, etc. of your actual resolution before being downscaled. yeah I'd be shocked if supersampling AA wasn't possible. It makes for a hefty FPS hit of course | ||
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Daxten
Germany127 Posts
I bet AA option will be added to release! | ||
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phuzi0n
United States308 Posts
On July 16 2010 23:32 MamiyaOtaru wrote: yeah I'd be shocked if supersampling AA wasn't possible. It makes for a hefty FPS hit of course See the early post about deferred shading... Super-sampling still won't work because it happens before all the shading is done. I was only explaining why low resolution videos (day9's cast) appear to be anti-aliased when really it's just due to downscaling. | ||
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Klumaster
United Kingdom36 Posts
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miracle.flame
Slovakia1 Post
All those jaggies and shimmering, I can't stand it... How can they even release this as OK? | ||
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Rosak
United States2 Posts
On vacation - but just got an email saying that Starcraft 2 AA is almost ready. Just getting tested now. Hotfix soon. Should solve everyone's problems no? And yes, i registered just to post this after lurking for like 5 years  | ||
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