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sharkie
Austria18337 Posts
- Denmark vs Slovenia was a horrible refereed game These are top off my head and many games had lots of bad minor calls (Orsato's for example). And just because 2002 was the worst refereed game of all time doesnt mean that this tournament wasnt one of the worst tournaments | ||
FlaShFTW
United States10094 Posts
On July 11 2024 17:19 Harris1st wrote: On to how Nunez was bareknuckle fighting Columbian fans. The Copa never disappoints He was protecting his family and his teammates family that were in that section that got mobbed by Colombian supporters. I'd say it was mostly justified. However, his attempted chair throw at the end was absolutely not. He might get a few months banned for his actions. | ||
Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51453 Posts
In all seriousness, i dislike Southgate and really think he holds the team back and baffled at the success...but the success, this is madness, back to back European championship finals, as an English team (yes players are amazing) is mad! We got to like 2 semi finals since 1966 and now are back to back finalists, that is quite an achievement! Hoping we can go one better on Sunday, i do think Spain is the perfect opponent for us, Jude and Foden as 10s, Saka making runs from wingback, will be a lot of counter spaces if we win the ball back from Spain as they go forward and leave themselves exposed, but again its a final. One game of 90 minutes (or maybe 120!), anything can happen, i just hope we can finally bring it home  | ||
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FlaShFTW
United States10094 Posts
On July 12 2024 04:48 Pandemona wrote: Its.....coming.......home.... In all seriousness, i dislike Southgate and really think he holds the team back and baffled at the success...but the success, this is madness, back to back European championship finals, as an English team (yes players are amazing) is mad! We got to like 2 semi finals since 1966 and now are back to back finalists, that is quite an achievement! Hoping we can go one better on Sunday, i do think Spain is the perfect opponent for us, Jude and Foden as 10s, Saka making runs from wingback, will be a lot of counter spaces if we win the ball back from Spain as they go forward and leave themselves exposed, but again its a final. One game of 90 minutes (or maybe 120!), anything can happen, i just hope we can finally bring it home I'm worried about Yamal running circles around your left sided defense. I sincerely hope that Southgate doesn't try to bring on an unfit Shaw to be the LWB defender against him. England definitely the underdog, but after yesterday's performance, I think they're closer to a 75:25 underdog than before when I had them at a 90:10 underdog if they had beaten Netherlands with the same stale play they had against their previous opponents. | ||
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Harris1st
Germany6802 Posts
On July 12 2024 04:48 Pandemona wrote: Its.....coming.......home.... In all seriousness, i dislike Southgate and really think he holds the team back and baffled at the success...but the success, this is madness, back to back European championship finals, as an English team (yes players are amazing) is mad! We got to like 2 semi finals since 1966 and now are back to back finalists, that is quite an achievement! Hoping we can go one better on Sunday, i do think Spain is the perfect opponent for us, Jude and Foden as 10s, Saka making runs from wingback, will be a lot of counter spaces if we win the ball back from Spain as they go forward and leave themselves exposed, but again its a final. One game of 90 minutes (or maybe 120!), anything can happen, i just hope we can finally bring it home There is no way Spain will let them have the midfield like Netherlands did for most of that game. If England gets that odd goal via one of of their stars early enough, I can see them actually winning. If not, Spain has got this. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24321 Posts
On July 12 2024 04:48 Pandemona wrote: Its.....coming.......home.... In all seriousness, i dislike Southgate and really think he holds the team back and baffled at the success...but the success, this is madness, back to back European championship finals, as an English team (yes players are amazing) is mad! We got to like 2 semi finals since 1966 and now are back to back finalists, that is quite an achievement! Hoping we can go one better on Sunday, i do think Spain is the perfect opponent for us, Jude and Foden as 10s, Saka making runs from wingback, will be a lot of counter spaces if we win the ball back from Spain as they go forward and leave themselves exposed, but again its a final. One game of 90 minutes (or maybe 120!), anything can happen, i just hope we can finally bring it home He’s a coach with flaws, but I feel people end up focus solely on those flaws versus what he has done very well. They don’t always sparkle but the camp is clearly unified and has a lot of self-belief, something many an England manager or other international teams don’t always have. They’ve generally maintained a good relationship and image with the media and wider public as well. And that’s a big, big part of international management that it’s difficult to overstate its importance, and Southgate has been good at that side for sure. Not just compared to past England sides, since Southgate England have been one of the top-performing tournament teams full-stop, results wise. You can’t really fluke it every time over such a span of years. France, Italy and Argentina have got their hands on the prizes over time, and you’d probably take actually winning a Euros and missing a World Cup like Italy did, but for consistent deep placement England are right up there. I favour Spain for sure, but England definitely have a shot. There’s been squad turnover ofc but England are the team with as much if not more high-stakes knockout football experience and finding a way through. Which is pretty much unheard of for an English side this deep! May not count for anything, it may. England will have to find a balance between neutering Yamal and Williams, and offering some threats on the counter on the flanks. I think it’s a huge game for Walker and Guehi as they’ll have to help the wing backs from time to time to let them do that. They’ll have to be a bit bold at times, or else park the bus and I think the latter puts you under huge pressure to keep it together for long, long periods. France had some (limited) joy on the counter in that match, they created some openings but frequently couldn’t capitalise because it was often a couple of players breaking dangerously, and nobody else coming up in support. | ||
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Oukka
Finland1683 Posts
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sharkie
Austria18337 Posts
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Acrofales
Spain17900 Posts
On July 13 2024 20:16 sharkie wrote: But looking at the games actually is it really Southgate or is it just the quality of players he has? Hard to say, but Capello didn't manage with what was arguably a more talented squad. Nor has anybody else since 1966. So Southgate must be doing something right, even if it's only in teambuilding. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24321 Posts
On July 13 2024 19:42 Oukka wrote: Yeah for all the shite Southgate gets, the question is has (or more like, would?) any other manager do any better? England is consistently winning knock-out games: 2W-1L in 2018, 3W-1L in 2021, 1W-1L in 2022, and for now 3W-0L in 2024. I'd say that is pretty good for a nation that had last won a Euro knock-out game in 1996 and a World Cup knock-out game in 2006. Harry Kane also now has more knockout goals than any European player, which isn’t bad going! Not sure he’ll hold onto it too long with Mbappe only being 25, but I think it’s indicative of a very strong era for England that he holds such a stat for now | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9465 Posts
On July 13 2024 20:16 sharkie wrote: But looking at the games actually is it really Southgate or is it just the quality of players he has? Too much is made of the quality of players he has. Is the first team really better than: http://www.englandfootballonline.com/cmpwc/CmpWC2006Squad.html That one? We've probably got more top players now compared to 2006 but also more poor players in the first team. | ||
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sharkie
Austria18337 Posts
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RvB
Netherlands6195 Posts
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M3t4PhYzX
Poland4164 Posts
repeat the score from 2012 grand final, please!  | ||
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Jockmcplop
United Kingdom9465 Posts
On July 14 2024 02:18 RvB wrote: Most of the criticism against Southgate is for his boring playstyle. Deschamps gets the same criticism. And that criticism is deserved imo. There's more to football than winning. People also want to be entertained. There's really no good reason not to play more attractive football against the smaller nations at least. Quite clearly England is capable of doing so as we've seen in the first half against NL and every match where they're behind. Personally after 58 years of winning nothing I'd be perfectly happy winning ugly if Southgate can pull it off. On July 14 2024 02:14 sharkie wrote: But England 2006 lost to Portugal didnt they? They had a crazy good golden generation so that will always be a 50-50. I dont know top of my head but has England played against top (top at that time, not historically top) nations and beat them? Didnt Southgate always lose the first time they met a top nation in the tournament? We beat Germany, but they weren't the best version of Germany (FIFA rank 12th in the world at the time). I guess we'll find out the ultimate answer to this tomorrow | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24321 Posts
On July 14 2024 02:14 sharkie wrote: But England 2006 lost to Portugal didnt they? They had a crazy good golden generation so that will always be a 50-50. I dont know top of my head but has England played against top (top at that time, not historically top) nations and beat them? Didnt Southgate always lose the first time they met a top nation in the tournament? England’s 2018 team did, but people forget that actually wasn’t that good a squad. They lost to Belgium in groups, and in the 3rd/4th, and Croatia, two sides that were better than them in areas then 2020 they beat Germany, although maybe not the best German side, lost to Italy but could absolutely have won that. Same in 2022 with France I don’t think it’s an England thing especially, it’s pretty rare to have a tournament run where you beat 2/3 top, top teams and win the thing. Plus ultimately there can only be one winner, so most tournaments a lot of teams will drop out the first match they play a big boy. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland24321 Posts
On July 14 2024 02:18 RvB wrote: Most of the criticism against Southgate is for his boring playstyle. Deschamps gets the same criticism. And that criticism is deserved imo. There's more to football than winning. People also want to be entertained. There's really no good reason not to play more attractive football against the smaller nations at least. Quite clearly England is capable of doing so as we've seen in the first half against NL and every match where they're behind. I’d rather see more entertaining football, but England could play like Brazil 82 and if they didn’t get the results they’d be slaughtered. I’m sure the fan/media culture is pretty similar in other nations with big expectations. I think there is a good reason not to play too differently against lesser opposition, which is that you’re using your limited, limited game time to play in a different way to what you might need in the business end of the tournament. | ||
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51453 Posts
You either die a hero or live long enough to become the villain. That is where Southgate is, he needs to go out after this cup, if not he will be sacked/forced out like he was nearly this tourney lol. He deserves to go out with his head held high, win or lose tomorrow and he will be respected and should go off into the sunset. The FA will be silly to keep him on, not because he is "bad" but because it will all end very badly at some point. Not saying this England team could play like prime spain in 2008, but boy there should be a bit of a shake up in our style with how our players are. | ||
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gTank
Austria2550 Posts
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51453 Posts
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